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Reply #92: That is the key question. [View All]

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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-14-10 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #88
92. That is the key question.
I think that this thread documents that there is a variety of opinions on the issue of if President Obama and/or his administration is "liberal." (I do not think that anyone would say that he and/or anyone in the administration is a "progressive," though there could be some debate on if the Michelle is.)

My central point in writing the OP was two-fold: first, to indicate that the variety of opinions includes a number of valid viewpoints -- the differences do not make some of us "good" or "bad" democrats; and second, that dispite those differences of opinion on the topic of the President and his administration, we must still find the common ground that provides us the potential to promote the values of the democratic left.

Let's look at an example, health care reform. Good people can have very different opinions on what President Obama's goals really were. However, what cannot be debated is that Barack Obama decided to push the issue in his first year, against the advice of virtually everyone around him (including Biden, Rahm, etc). His approach in pushing it belongs to him, alone. The results of his effort belong to a much larger group, though I doubt that many people would say he did everything correctly (considering that he recognizes that he did not). So, we ended up with something closer to "insurance reform" than the "health care reform" that even the President campaigned on and advocated in that first year.

Many democrats view the results as an important victory that can be built upon; others see it as far too little. The common ground is that we need to do more, and that there is a large force opposed to greater reform; the split is if we concentrate on our different opinions on the process the reform took. One option provides us with an on-going, extremely tough fight; the other offers certain defeat.

I wish that I had "the answer." Obviously, I don't. No one person does. What I can say is that my experiences in life have convinced me that combining a "right now" and a "long-term" approach works best. I think that grass roots activism/ community organizing offers our best chance. I've talked about my plans to run for a local school board seat. Small stuff, I know, but if on this itty-bitty level, only the viewpoints of conservative republicans are voiced, it means the foundation of a democratic society is crumbling. My "right now" goal isn't to have the board be restricted to the democratic left -- but rather, to have everyone seated, and everyone to enjoy having a say. The "long-term" goal will be to use this experience to move up in county and state government (and, though I may be delusional, I would like to eventually consider another step up.)

What others do interests me, though I would not think it my place to tell them what to do. I'm always happy to add my two scents as far as helping others consider the options for reaching whatever goal they may have. In that vein, I think it is important that liberals and progressives recognize that we can't afford to let differences of opinion divide us. We need to be invested in the idea that we should all be doing work at whatever level we are most effective, coordinating and supporting each other to the extent possible, and respecting each other even when we strongly disagree.
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  -Message to the Democratic Left H2O Man  Sep-12-10 03:32 PM   #0 
  - niggling, but vital, observation:  MisterP   Sep-12-10 03:47 PM   #1 
  - We need to have Obama's back.  sansatman   Sep-12-10 05:53 PM   #22 
  - If, in my opinion,  LWolf   Sep-12-10 06:35 PM   #28 
     - +1  Individualist   Sep-12-10 09:10 PM   #36 
     - Ah, the civil war. When Obama has 85% approval among liberal Democrats, and a Democratic approval  BzaDem   Sep-12-10 10:21 PM   #47 
     - That's one way to keep yourself amused as the ranks dwindle.  Usrename   Sep-13-10 01:22 AM   #51 
     - +100  derby378   Sep-13-10 11:10 AM   #74 
     - It's only hilarious to DLC hogwash dispensers who get paid five bucks an hour to see it that way.  Jim Sagle   Sep-13-10 11:49 AM   #76 
     - The only somebody that did better were Bush 1 and Bush 2....  Stellar   Sep-13-10 03:42 PM   #82 
     - Yes I am a liberal Democrat  ooglymoogly   Sep-13-10 11:59 AM   #77 
     - +1........nt  Enthusiast   Sep-13-10 04:04 AM   #53 
     - Well said n/t  MissDeeds   Sep-13-10 09:53 AM   #68 
     - I agree 100%. The DLC (including Obama) works to serve the interests of the corporations  Erose999   Sep-14-10 08:13 AM   #90 
  - One of the problems  H2O Man   Sep-12-10 08:33 PM   #32 
     - I think much of the anger and frustration  LWolf   Sep-14-10 07:35 AM   #88 
        - That is the key question.  H2O Man   Sep-14-10 09:45 AM   #92 
           - I think it's a great idea to run for a school board seat.  LWolf   Sep-14-10 08:24 PM   #93 
  - Highly Recommend!!! n/t  RKP5637   Sep-12-10 03:51 PM   #2 
  - Thank you.  H2O Man   Sep-12-10 08:33 PM   #33 
  - Not shocking to me what you read in "The Blueprint"  customerserviceguy   Sep-12-10 03:52 PM   #3 
  - The Dishonor of Militarism...  L0oniX   Sep-12-10 03:56 PM   #4 
  - Here's what I don't understand  Capitalocracy   Sep-12-10 03:59 PM   #5 
  - I have seen many posts here advocating NOT voting.  rosesaylavee   Sep-13-10 07:32 AM   #56 
     - They Are Trolls and  Mr. Mustard   Sep-13-10 09:01 AM   #64 
     - I have seen very few, and those were from some very frustrated  LWolf   Sep-14-10 07:31 AM   #87 
        - I would say I am too among the disaffected...  rosesaylavee   Sep-14-10 07:46 AM   #89 
  - Observations  Kalun D   Sep-12-10 04:00 PM   #6 
  - and Jones  robdogbucky   Sep-12-10 04:20 PM   #10 
  - Thank you.  bobbolink   Sep-12-10 06:20 PM   #25 
  - Yep, it's makes me often wonder where my party and my country went and who  RKP5637   Sep-12-10 09:08 PM   #35 
  - Oh for God's sake  Recursion   Sep-13-10 09:38 AM   #66 
  - if you think Obama's Admin. has made very few liberal moves you're not paying attention  KittyWampus   Sep-13-10 10:12 AM   #70 
  - Rec number 21.  panader0   Sep-12-10 04:09 PM   #7 
  - I went to see Dr John last night and he's not letting it go either  suffragette   Sep-12-10 04:12 PM   #8 
  - WooHoo, love the Dr. John.  Mimosa   Sep-12-10 04:22 PM   #11 
     - He was fired up!  suffragette   Sep-12-10 04:32 PM   #13 
     - He has a new CD out  proud2BlibKansan   Sep-12-10 04:52 PM   #17 
        - He played some songs from it last night  suffragette   Sep-12-10 06:35 PM   #27 
  - Does Blackwell specify how Obama is supposedly subverting  bleever   Sep-12-10 04:13 PM   #9 
  - Yes and no.  H2O Man   Sep-12-10 04:49 PM   #15 
     - isn't blackwell supposed to be in prison?  barbtries   Sep-12-10 06:24 PM   #26 
        - If we had justice in this country absolutely, along with kkkarl,  mod mom   Sep-13-10 11:07 AM   #73 
  - k&r  another saigon   Sep-12-10 04:28 PM   #12 
  - The wingnuts took out Acorn, but Pres Obama won by some 9 million votes.  AtomicKitten   Sep-12-10 04:33 PM   #14 
  - So, yes. Let's make "Blackwell & Klukowski's nightmare" a reality.  NYC_SKP   Sep-12-10 04:51 PM   #16 
  - One of the most satisfying times I spent on DU is exposing  blondeatlast   Sep-12-10 04:57 PM   #18 
  - K & R and a recommendation.  Chan790   Sep-12-10 05:16 PM   #19 
  - Imagine.  mmonk   Sep-12-10 05:33 PM   #20 
  - kick and rec'd  lunatica   Sep-12-10 05:48 PM   #21 
  - Peace to you, H20 Man and bless you for what you stand for.  democrank   Sep-12-10 05:58 PM   #23 
  - "Getting control of our own message.." Remember Lakoff and "Framing Training?" in 2003?  KoKo   Sep-13-10 07:54 AM   #58 
     - Vey good.  H2O Man   Sep-13-10 08:12 AM   #59 
  - you're right, you're right  barbtries   Sep-12-10 06:18 PM   #24 
  - K & R  veganlush   Sep-12-10 07:06 PM   #29 
  - Thanks.  Joanne98   Sep-12-10 07:09 PM   #30 
  - The Real Problem The Military Faces Isn't Obama  Me.   Sep-12-10 07:20 PM   #31 
  - War is very profitable for the MIC. It's about all about profit and the powerful  RKP5637   Sep-12-10 09:16 PM   #38 
  - Marked so I can find this later.  BrklynLiberal   Sep-12-10 09:06 PM   #34 
  - Kick!  kgnu_fan   Sep-12-10 09:15 PM   #37 
  - K & R, H20 Man.  bertman   Sep-12-10 09:31 PM   #39 
  - k&r  spanone   Sep-12-10 09:32 PM   #40 
  - 10/2/10 - DC  rucky   Sep-12-10 09:36 PM   #41 
  - Here is what I think the left should do. Fight harder than ever.  rhett o rick   Sep-12-10 09:48 PM   #42 
  - +1  LongTomH   Sep-13-10 10:06 AM   #69 
  - Good post. I agree. n/t  YvonneCa   Sep-13-10 06:48 PM   #85 
  - Kick and Rec. As always, a thoughtful contribution from H20 Man  Hekate   Sep-12-10 09:49 PM   #43 
  - Alinsky - Read him and do it!  theFrankFactor   Sep-12-10 09:57 PM   #44 
  - Definitely.  H2O Man   Sep-13-10 08:19 AM   #61 
  - Here's one idea  bluescribbler   Sep-12-10 10:03 PM   #45 
  - Well said!  Spazito   Sep-12-10 10:14 PM   #46 
  - When someone is pushing some twisted,convoluted,backward  Jim_Shorts   Sep-12-10 11:30 PM   #48 
  - Right on target  HughMoran   Sep-12-10 11:43 PM   #49 
  - I must say that I admire that you seek out to read & understand opposing viewpoints.  elocs   Sep-12-10 11:54 PM   #50 
  - Excellent. I read 'The Promise', as well. I wish DU posters (& Journal writers) would read it, too.  Diane R   Sep-13-10 02:29 AM   #52 
  - I like to view  H2O Man   Sep-13-10 08:16 AM   #60 
  - KnR :o)  opihimoimoi   Sep-13-10 05:33 AM   #54 
  - Mississippi Freedom Democratic Party member -- I salute you!  Fly by night   Sep-13-10 06:28 AM   #55 
  - I think one of the problems is this president views Afghanistan through a political lens  bigtree   Sep-13-10 07:51 AM   #57 
  - K&R. //nt  Overseas   Sep-13-10 08:22 AM   #62 
  - There is a tendency to mistake reaction for action.  blindpig   Sep-13-10 08:38 AM   #63 
  - +1 n/t  Dona Ferentez   Sep-13-10 03:47 PM   #83 
  - K & R!  NJmaverick   Sep-13-10 09:02 AM   #65 
  - Kicked and recommended.  Uncle Joe   Sep-13-10 09:48 AM   #67 
  - K&R...  Peacetrain   Sep-13-10 10:16 AM   #71 
  - K & R People need to be made aware of this. n/t  RoccoR5955   Sep-13-10 10:18 AM   #72 
  - Nice photo! And agree wholeheartedly that we need to continue to discuss and disrupt and focus so  earcandle   Sep-13-10 11:27 AM   #75 
  - Thank you for a sober but positive message  PBass   Sep-13-10 12:45 PM   #78 
  - Problem is that Obama has not listened to, much less relied on Democratic community organizers.  JDPriestly   Sep-13-10 12:46 PM   #79 
  - It's Rahm,  BEZERKO   Sep-13-10 01:43 PM   #80 
  - If he were really the problem he would have "went" already. Same with Gibbs etc. Obama has shown  Erose999   Sep-14-10 08:23 AM   #91 
  - It's not simply Obama they are against . . .  h9socialist   Sep-13-10 02:06 PM   #81 
  - very true  NJmaverick   Sep-13-10 06:36 PM   #84 
  - kick for a very good post. nt  2 Much Tribulation   Sep-13-10 07:52 PM   #86 

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