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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-10 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #7
32. I agree completely
I was excoriated for posting a thread with the title "Pragmatic means practical". Seemed like an obvious statement to make, but it really got under the skin of a lot of people.

In the weeks that followed, I read numerous posts where people who had roundly criticized me suddenly were espousing the virtues of 'pragmatism' on the left. It was enough to make my head spin. It really comes down to who's ox is being gored and not much else. All the talk of principal is just another method of saying "my guy's better than yours - nah nah nah nah nah!" When I step back and realize that highly intelligent adults are behind this behavior, I start to get that sick feeling in my stomach - similar to that feeling you get when you find out a good friend was backstabbing you.

We need to get beyond this.
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  -Principles or Pragmatism? Who's Doing What? MineralMan  Aug-29-10 09:27 AM   #0 
  - K&R  NJmaverick   Aug-29-10 09:34 AM   #1 
  - I will not comment on the wisdom of them building it at that location.  VMI Dem   Aug-29-10 09:37 AM   #2 
  - Indeed. It actually could be a bad idea to build it there,  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 09:39 AM   #4 
     - I will not comment on Dr. Deans approach. He had the right to say what he did.  VMI Dem   Aug-29-10 09:40 AM   #5 
        - Of course he did. And his supporters have the right to praise  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 09:48 AM   #10 
  - Interesting observation  HughMoran   Aug-29-10 09:37 AM   #3 
  - That may demonstrate that everyone's pragmatic when it  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 09:47 AM   #7 
  - I agree completely  HughMoran   Aug-29-10 12:03 PM   #32 
  - k an r for that comment  DonCoquixote   Aug-29-10 10:36 AM   #21 
  - I have not defended it and I have seen many others who are  sabrina 1   Aug-29-10 03:56 PM   #48 
     - Yes, Dean was wrong.  HughMoran   Aug-29-10 08:25 PM   #52 
  - He did "make bones" about it though--  OrwellwasRight   Aug-29-10 09:44 AM   #6 
  - Of course he did...and most people know that.  VMI Dem   Aug-29-10 09:48 AM   #9 
  - He is a strong advocate of the Constitutional right for people  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 09:56 AM   #14 
  - He shouldn't be advocating anything except what is Constitutionally required.  Arkana   Aug-29-10 10:19 AM   #17 
  - how could ne NOT comment?  DonCoquixote   Aug-29-10 10:38 AM   #22 
     - He could easily have kept silent as he has done on many other issues.  OrwellwasRight   Aug-29-10 10:43 AM   #24 
        - Every politician must know when to keep silent,  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 10:47 AM   #26 
           - As President, his job is to use his position to improve the country.  OrwellwasRight   Aug-29-10 12:03 PM   #31 
  - What principles? In regards to Obama's position, you are presenting facts not in evidence.  Luminous Animal   Aug-29-10 09:48 AM   #8 
  - "I will not comment on the wisdom". Anyone knows what that means.  VMI Dem   Aug-29-10 09:49 AM   #11 
  - And there you go putting words in Obama's mouth.  Arkana   Aug-29-10 10:20 AM   #18 
  - It is not for the President to comment on the wisdom of  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 09:53 AM   #12 
     - Dean affirmed the right, also. So, on that count, they both stand on principle...  Luminous Animal   Aug-29-10 09:56 AM   #13 
        - And the dreidel spins and spins.  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 09:59 AM   #15 
        - Obama stopped where he should have stopped--at standing firm  Arkana   Aug-29-10 10:21 AM   #20 
        - Exactly.  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 10:48 AM   #27 
        - If you state the obvious, are you actually doing anything? nt  EFerrari   Aug-29-10 12:22 PM   #34 
           - Well, given the criticism from the right of what he said, I'd say that he was  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 12:26 PM   #35 
           - "It's a local issue" is exactly the position politicians took to stay out of  EFerrari   Aug-29-10 12:32 PM   #36 
              - And that is why it became a federal issue. Because the issue  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 12:38 PM   #38 
                 - That doesn't even make sense.  EFerrari   Aug-30-10 02:21 AM   #53 
           - Yes, you're stating the obvious and showing that you have an actual regard for the First Amendment  Arkana   Aug-29-10 04:10 PM   #49 
        - Exactly. And Dean was acting on ethics, not pragmatism anyway.  EFerrari   Aug-29-10 12:20 PM   #33 
  - I believe that Dr. Dean will in the future look back and regret his words on this subject  grantcart   Aug-29-10 10:14 AM   #16 
  - I believe you are right.  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 10:20 AM   #19 
  - very astute observation...  Peacetrain   Aug-29-10 10:41 AM   #23 
  - Thanks very much.  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 10:43 AM   #25 
  - Well, there are actual principled people like me...  Kurt_and_Hunter   Aug-29-10 10:51 AM   #28 
  - A lot? I'm not sure what that means, in terms of DU.  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 10:59 AM   #29 
  - BTW, I'm not criticizing Dr. Dean in this post. He's a fine man  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 11:55 AM   #30 
  - Principles and pragmatism are not mutually exclusive. nt  VioletLake   Aug-29-10 12:32 PM   #37 
  - True. They never have least not in our political  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 12:39 PM   #39 
  - Then what's the point of your topic?  VioletLake   Aug-29-10 12:54 PM   #40 
     - My point is that some people criticize President Obama, but praise  MineralMan   Aug-29-10 01:10 PM   #41 
        - Pragmatic and principled (or at least appear to be).  VioletLake   Aug-29-10 01:49 PM   #44 
  - Right, and they never should be.  Arkana   Aug-29-10 04:12 PM   #50 
  - I'm so glad that he finally gives a crap about our rights  txlibdem   Aug-29-10 01:15 PM   #42 
  - You call 99 weeks of unemployment benefits nothing? Really?..  Kahuna   Aug-29-10 03:50 PM   #47 
     - Propping up the banks helped nobody but the banks  txlibdem   Aug-29-10 06:16 PM   #51 
  - Oh yeah, Dean is pragmatic..  Cha   Aug-29-10 01:18 PM   #43 
  - Dr Dean is a good Democratic Party soldier.  bvar22   Aug-29-10 01:52 PM   #45 
  - Indeed. Seems it's okay to ignore THOSE people THEIR  Kahuna   Aug-29-10 03:45 PM   #46 

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