| 202. Cool story, bro. n/t |
| -Demands from the left - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 01:11 PM |
#0 |
 -
Pretty hard core list, much of which is unachievable under our current system of government. |
ProgressiveProfessor |
Aug-07-10 01:16 PM |
#1 |
 -
Does that mean we shouldn't make demands? |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 01:34 PM |
#5 |
 -
We need goals. This is a starting point. And I would argue |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 01:38 PM |
#7 |
| -
hear, hear, nt. |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 01:51 PM |
#16 |
| -
Which are unachievable? |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 01:42 PM |
#9 |
| -
Virtually none of your proposals are feasible in the United States. |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 01:19 PM |
#2 |
| -
Which make no sense? |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 01:20 PM |
#3 |
| -
8) Elimination Of Rent/Mortgage |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 01:42 PM |
#8 |
| -
Yes, private property should be the first thing to go. |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 01:43 PM |
#10 |
| -
You're funny. They tried that in the Soviet Union. Didn't work out |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 01:47 PM |
#13 |
| -
The reason it didn't work out is because it was predicated on a totalitarian government. Anyone who |
AlabamaLibrul |
Aug-07-10 04:48 PM |
#62 |
| -
Thanks for the rec - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 05:22 PM |
#71 |
| -
China Vietnam Cambodia Poland Hungary East Germany Albania Romania ... |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 01:20 PM |
#166 |
| -
"private property should be the first thing to go." |
proteus_lives |
Aug-07-10 04:45 PM |
#60 |
| -
Currently in the US I believe we're at least 65% ownership - correct? |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 05:16 PM |
#66 |
| -
People want to own their own property. |
proteus_lives |
Aug-07-10 05:22 PM |
#70 |
| -
So many in the world barely have food to eat - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 05:47 PM |
#76 |
| -
Life is supposed to be fair? |
proteus_lives |
Aug-07-10 06:25 PM |
#81 |
| -
Easier to make light of that when you're the one who's not |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 08:55 PM |
#89 |
| -
Slaves? |
proteus_lives |
Aug-07-10 10:48 PM |
#97 |
| -
It doesn't help the owners that's for sure - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 10:51 PM |
#98 |
| -
Now see, THAT'S a RW talking point that I've ALWAYS |
socialist_n_TN |
Aug-08-10 10:56 AM |
#120 |
| -
And getting to the roots of that unfairness is key - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 12:09 PM |
#136 |
| -
The only ones who benefit from unfairness |
socialist_n_TN |
Aug-08-10 12:15 PM |
#138 |
| -
When did I say that? |
proteus_lives |
Aug-08-10 05:12 PM |
#171 |
| -
It's the attitude. Life's unfair and you can't do anything |
socialist_n_TN |
Aug-08-10 06:52 PM |
#175 |
| -
Dupe. |
proteus_lives |
Aug-07-10 06:25 PM |
#82 |
| -
Why would we want to follow the epic failure of forced collectivism? |
ProgressiveProfessor |
Aug-07-10 06:46 PM |
#84 |
| -
You're right - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 12:07 PM |
#135 |
| -
Indeed forced collectivism caused massive failures in housing and food production |
ProgressiveProfessor |
Aug-08-10 06:00 PM |
#172 |
| -
Those tent cities aren't fantasies, Professor, |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 07:33 AM |
#177 |
| -
Neither was Stalin |
ProgressiveProfessor |
Aug-09-10 08:38 AM |
#184 |
| -
2) Promotion/Development of Local Food Systems |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 01:45 PM |
#11 |
| -
Nobody said no supermarkets - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 01:51 PM |
#17 |
| -
But, you see, supermarkets are corporate entities, supported by |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 02:01 PM |
#24 |
| -
Why do corporations have to own everything? nt |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:03 PM |
#25 |
| -
They don't. But supermarkets exist because of corporations that |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 02:08 PM |
#27 |
| -
I know about Walmart destroying small business - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:38 PM |
#45 |
| -
That is a silly statement, with plenty of weasel room of course. |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 11:50 AM |
#129 |
| -
Love it all!! |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 01:32 PM |
#4 |
| -
lol @ the bananas - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 01:37 PM |
#6 |
| -
Demands are OK if you are walking the walk |
flamingdem |
Aug-07-10 01:46 PM |
#12 |
| -
A most excellent point. I'd be interested in hearing about this |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 01:49 PM |
#14 |
| -
Smart choices. |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 01:54 PM |
#19 |
| -
Tell us about your choices, then. What will you be eating this |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 02:11 PM |
#28 |
| -
In several posts now you've done your best to make this personal - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:14 PM |
#32 |
| -
Yes, I have. It is all personal. You're calling for something, so |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 02:21 PM |
#36 |
| -
Lifestyle changes are not going to do it. Sorry. It's going to take |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:26 PM |
#40 |
| -
You're saying we should vote with our dollars in a free market? |
Nuclear Unicorn |
Aug-08-10 02:09 PM |
#167 |
| -
No, not at all - |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 07:34 AM |
#178 |
| -
I believe you've hit the nail on the head. |
proteus_lives |
Aug-07-10 06:27 PM |
#83 |
| -
Wrong on all counts, |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 08:59 PM |
#90 |
| -
A 90% reduction in the military budget would mean that |
cliffordu |
Aug-07-10 01:49 PM |
#15 |
| -
WalMart needs to go too. nt |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 01:55 PM |
#20 |
| -
She won't go to Walmart. She'll spin her own flax thread and weave |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 01:56 PM |
#21 |
| -
Why do we need to have clothing from China? |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:01 PM |
#23 |
| -
Oh, dear. Factories. That won't do, though, you see, in your |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 02:05 PM |
#26 |
| -
I wish I lived in some Utopia, but unlike you I am not a property owner |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:12 PM |
#29 |
| -
You're funny. Thanks for visiting my blog. How do you figure |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 02:18 PM |
#33 |
| -
Well however unrealistic these ideas may be, it's a starting point |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:41 PM |
#47 |
| -
+1,000,000 |
Common Sense Party |
Aug-08-10 01:49 AM |
#100 |
| -
It wasn't so long ago that many clothes were made in the USA, NAFTA |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 03:07 PM |
#53 |
| -
There are still clothes made in the USA. Do you own any? |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 08:10 PM |
#88 |
| -
I buy my clothes second hand... |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 10:20 PM |
#94 |
| -
What do you have against Chinese workers? |
Nuclear Unicorn |
Aug-08-10 02:10 PM |
#168 |
| -
You are killing me! |
janx |
Aug-08-10 11:35 AM |
#127 |
| -
"you couldn't afford oil " |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 11:52 AM |
#130 |
| -
Yes really. I disagree with supporting it but the sad truth is that he's right n/t |
Catherina |
Aug-08-10 12:24 PM |
#144 |
| -
Believe me I hate being right. |
cliffordu |
Aug-08-10 12:40 PM |
#152 |
| -
why would the saudis not want to sell their oil? |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 01:06 PM |
#162 |
| -
It's good to have on record that you're fully cognizant of your support for the war machine |
Catherina |
Aug-08-10 12:23 PM |
#143 |
| -
A 90% reduction in the military budget would mean that we'd be spending twice as much as Russia. |
L0oniX |
Aug-09-10 11:17 AM |
#193 |
| -
Tripling the taxes of people making more than $75k is way off. |
Marr |
Aug-07-10 01:54 PM |
#18 |
| -
This is a chart I found earlier today about tax rates |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 01:56 PM |
#22 |
| -
Yes, those were the rates in the 50s and 60s. Do you have any |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 02:13 PM |
#31 |
| -
You think our rates are in line with what people are making now? |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:19 PM |
#34 |
| -
I am 100% in favor of taxing the wealthy, and very heavily, at that. |
MineralMan |
Aug-07-10 02:22 PM |
#37 |
| -
Sure, I'm ok with negotiating on that number - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:28 PM |
#41 |
| -
I don't have a problem |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 02:53 PM |
#49 |
| -
One dollar in 1950 was worth about what eight dollars is worth today. |
Marr |
Aug-07-10 04:29 PM |
#59 |
| -
It isn't 'big money' anywhere in the US. |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 11:53 AM |
#131 |
| -
Why do you deserve that much money |
FooshIt |
Aug-08-10 05:05 PM |
#170 |
| -
You're trolling. |
Marr |
Aug-08-10 06:07 PM |
#174 |
| -
Excellent list! |
Laughing Mirror |
Aug-07-10 02:12 PM |
#30 |
| -
Thank you - I was beginning to think I was alone in this. |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:25 PM |
#39 |
| -
No you are not alone in this |
Laughing Mirror |
Aug-07-10 02:35 PM |
#44 |
| -
You have a great list and I'm with you too!! |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 03:01 PM |
#50 |
| -
Wow! You sound like a fundie expecting the rapture to occur any day now. |
WonderGrunion |
Aug-09-10 09:18 AM |
#186 |
| -
4, 7, 8, 11, and 12 should be dumped from the list |
Warpy |
Aug-07-10 02:19 PM |
#35 |
| -
Not bad - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:30 PM |
#42 |
| -
excellent adjustments! |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 11:54 AM |
#132 |
| -
No rent / mortgage? How does that work? |
Quantess |
Aug-07-10 02:25 PM |
#38 |
| -
No private ownership of property. Nobody homeless. nt |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:31 PM |
#43 |
| -
So who owns it? And who takes it from those who now own it? |
Common Sense Party |
Aug-07-10 05:16 PM |
#67 |
| -
See reply #63 - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 05:19 PM |
#69 |
| -
When you say no private ownership of property, do you mean |
Synicus Maximus |
Aug-07-10 07:52 PM |
#87 |
| -
I was thinking more in terms of real property - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 09:04 PM |
#91 |
| -
that hasn't worked out so well anywhere |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 11:58 AM |
#133 |
| -
We can't keep capitalism and expect to eliminate economic insecurity. |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 12:22 PM |
#142 |
| -
quite a few social democracies have done just that |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 12:32 PM |
#145 |
| -
Curiously absent from your program: |
BOG PERSON |
Aug-07-10 02:40 PM |
#46 |
| -
Consider them added. I have no problem with any of the things |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 02:45 PM |
#48 |
| -
not just marijuana but hemp...nt |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 03:03 PM |
#51 |
| -
I love #10 |
Starry Messenger |
Aug-07-10 03:03 PM |
#52 |
| -
Yep, yep, yep ... |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 03:10 PM |
#54 |
| -
It's insane. Truly. |
Starry Messenger |
Aug-07-10 03:37 PM |
#55 |
| -
but, but, our national security is at stake!!! |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 03:39 PM |
#56 |
| -
I'd change 7) to start at 50K and how would u accomplish 8? |
FooshIt |
Aug-07-10 03:41 PM |
#57 |
| -
Yes, private property should be the first thing to go. |
Grabo |
Aug-07-10 04:12 PM |
#58 |
| -
I don't know that you would - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 05:12 PM |
#63 |
| -
I would say that before "the left" (i.e., you and your friend) start "demanding" |
Common Sense Party |
Aug-07-10 05:38 PM |
#74 |
| -
Every detail does not need to be ironed out to reject capitalism. |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 05:43 PM |
#75 |
| -
Simple. Eminent Domain could obtain anything the government needs. |
Xenotime |
Aug-09-10 11:21 AM |
#195 |
| -
A question about human nature. |
Glassunion |
Aug-07-10 04:45 PM |
#61 |
| -
I don't know that humans are competitive by nature - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 05:58 PM |
#78 |
| -
I totally see where you are coming from. |
Glassunion |
Aug-07-10 06:49 PM |
# |
| -
I know where you're coming from as well - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 07:22 PM |
#86 |
| -
These aren't demands of the left, these are demands of your friend, |
MadHound |
Aug-07-10 05:15 PM |
#64 |
| -
I'd love to hear your definition of "left" - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 05:25 PM |
#73 |
| -
Umm, go do some searching around here, |
MadHound |
Aug-07-10 06:49 PM |
#85 |
| -
So start talking MH |
Catherina |
Aug-08-10 12:33 PM |
#146 |
| -
Thank you Catherina - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 12:50 PM |
#155 |
| -
13. Universal Free Distribution of Whatever it is that You're Smoking |
Common Sense Party |
Aug-07-10 05:15 PM |
#65 |
| -
Do we really have to settle? can we demand more? |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 10:13 PM |
#93 |
| -
You want to triple my taxes? |
Common Sense Party |
Aug-07-10 05:17 PM |
#68 |
| -
To provide for people who are homeless and starving - yes. |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 05:23 PM |
#72 |
| -
The art of haggling is lost on most Americans |
MrScorpio |
Aug-07-10 05:52 PM |
#77 |
| -
I do know democrats can't negotiate - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 06:06 PM |
#79 |
| -
Bingo! |
MrScorpio |
Aug-07-10 10:21 PM |
#95 |
| -
Likewise. nt |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 10:52 PM |
#99 |
| -
A comment on the "hairy details" of how it could work - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 06:23 PM |
#80 |
| -
Thanks for this! |
maryf |
Aug-07-10 10:10 PM |
#92 |
| -
Thanks - |
TBF |
Aug-07-10 10:38 PM |
#96 |
| -
maybe |
maryf |
Aug-08-10 06:29 AM |
#101 |
| -
I love that piece as well - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 09:29 AM |
#114 |
| -
You did yourself proud! |
maryf |
Aug-08-10 03:03 PM |
#169 |
| -
These are not the "demands of the left".. |
sendero |
Aug-08-10 06:33 AM |
#102 |
| -
From Dallas I would expect nothing less than right-wing rhetoric. |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 07:37 AM |
#103 |
| -
You know what.. |
sendero |
Aug-08-10 08:21 AM |
#104 |
| -
I've lived in Dallas, and I now live in Houston - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 08:31 AM |
#105 |
| -
If you are going to use.. |
sendero |
Aug-08-10 08:36 AM |
#106 |
| -
If you're going to red-bait maybe you should say so up front. nt |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 08:38 AM |
#107 |
| -
That's not the point.. |
sendero |
Aug-08-10 08:45 AM |
#109 |
| -
Did a google search and couldn't find that - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 09:17 AM |
#112 |
| -
Rather than calling them the demands of morons |
socialist_n_TN |
Aug-08-10 11:10 AM |
#122 |
| -
These are NOT my ideals |
ibegurpard |
Aug-08-10 11:13 AM |
#124 |
| -
Just as it's "fucking ridiculous" that labor is now represented |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 11:22 AM |
#125 |
| -
Well I guess I'm a moron then or at least moronish........... |
socialist_n_TN |
Aug-08-10 11:23 AM |
#126 |
| -
It's very troubling - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 12:36 PM |
#149 |
| -
That's jut crazy talk. |
Stoic |
Aug-08-10 08:39 AM |
#108 |
| -
Actually these are "Demands from TBF", not "from the left" |
JHB |
Aug-08-10 08:48 AM |
#110 |
| -
Never said I did - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 09:15 AM |
#111 |
| -
I understand all that, very clearly... |
JHB |
Aug-08-10 09:27 AM |
#113 |
| -
I suppose I could have called it "demands from the far left" |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 09:37 AM |
#116 |
| -
In all fairness to TBF, DU is center right to left of center, not left. n/t |
Catherina |
Aug-08-10 12:35 PM |
#148 |
| -
You have to talk enough voters into it |
treestar |
Aug-08-10 09:35 AM |
#115 |
| -
I'm not convinced that "so many" do not agree with me. |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 09:41 AM |
#117 |
| -
But they never join that strike |
treestar |
Aug-08-10 10:10 AM |
#118 |
| -
The strike - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 10:48 AM |
#119 |
| -
'Fair Trials For All Members Of The Senate' |
leftstreet |
Aug-08-10 11:08 AM |
#121 |
| -
I'm with you on that my friend. nt |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 11:12 AM |
#123 |
| -
Rec'd yesterday. Surprised at how unrecced this has been n/t |
Catherina |
Aug-08-10 11:41 AM |
#128 |
| -
Sorry but this list is seriously flawed and hardly representative of 'the left'. |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 12:12 PM |
#137 |
| -
Depends how you define the Left. n/t |
Catherina |
Aug-08-10 12:20 PM |
#140 |
| -
outside of a tiny group of irrelevant communists groups on the left |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 12:34 PM |
#147 |
| -
You'd be quite wrong and I suggest you understand what private property is |
Catherina |
Aug-08-10 12:37 PM |
#151 |
| -
hint: it is exactly that to the OP. |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 12:50 PM |
#154 |
| -
Private property is means of production. |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 12:56 PM |
#156 |
| -
So you are contradicting the subthread on housing |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 01:01 PM |
#159 |
| -
I just said I personally would like to see |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 01:10 PM |
#164 |
| -
To that I would respond "define left" (and I mean as opposed to liberals). |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 12:20 PM |
#141 |
| -
there isn't a concise definition |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 12:37 PM |
#150 |
| -
This kind of dystopian nonsense - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 12:41 PM |
#153 |
| -
which comments of mine support our current system? |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 12:56 PM |
#157 |
| -
Ouch... |
Chan790 |
Aug-08-10 12:03 PM |
#134 |
| -
"Staunch Leftist" but still support capitalism? |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 12:18 PM |
#139 |
| -
Keynes was a staunch leftist anti-communist and so am I. |
Chan790 |
Aug-08-10 01:01 PM |
#158 |
| -
Fair enough - |
TBF |
Aug-08-10 01:08 PM |
#163 |
| -
democratically regulated capitalism |
Warren Stupidity |
Aug-08-10 01:02 PM |
#161 |
| -
I have a hard time envisioning a regulated capitalism |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 11:11 AM |
#190 |
| -
Massive boycotts and a general strike.. |
nessa |
Aug-08-10 01:01 PM |
#160 |
| -
I wouldn't agree that people here on DU would be more receptive to my ideas - |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 11:15 AM |
#192 |
| -
I agree with all of them ,except 8, 9 and 11. |
MicaelS |
Aug-08-10 01:13 PM |
#165 |
| -
"Elimination of Rent/Mortgage"? LOL - good luck with *that*. |
apocalypsehow |
Aug-08-10 06:06 PM |
#173 |
| -
That seems to be the one that freaks people out the most - |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 07:38 AM |
#179 |
| -
late kick |
blindpig |
Aug-09-10 07:10 AM |
#176 |
| -
Agreed, I believe ridding the world of capitalism is the only thing that will help the animals - |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 07:40 AM |
#181 |
| -
Nothing could do more for nature... |
blindpig |
Aug-09-10 03:13 PM |
#200 |
| -
Unrecommend for Weirdo Martyr Complex |
alcibiades_mystery |
Aug-09-10 07:38 AM |
#180 |
| -
If you had read the entire paragraph (or understood it) you'd know that |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 07:46 AM |
#182 |
| -
You're the one that insults |
alcibiades_mystery |
Aug-09-10 08:04 AM |
#183 |
| -
It's not feeling righteous - |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 11:05 AM |
#187 |
| -
Revised list after Democrats negotiate with Republicans... |
Evasporque |
Aug-09-10 09:03 AM |
#185 |
| -
lol - ok that's funny. nt |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 11:06 AM |
#188 |
| -
Hard for me to get behind your program |
NeedleCast |
Aug-09-10 11:09 AM |
#189 |
| -
Taxes are key - |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 11:18 AM |
#194 |
| -
Greater than $250k is very wealthy and can afford a large tax hit. |
Xenotime |
Aug-09-10 11:23 AM |
#196 |
| -
No, you shouldn't raise the income level, you should set the tax at a resonable level |
NeedleCast |
Aug-09-10 06:41 PM |
#203 |
| -
The Green Party has key platform planks that seem to be close to these demands. |
MilesColtrane |
Aug-09-10 11:13 AM |
#191 |
| -
I've been a dem since birth - |
TBF |
Aug-09-10 11:24 AM |
#197 |
| -
I applaud your wanting to push the party to the left, but I think that most people will see some... |
MilesColtrane |
Aug-09-10 11:36 AM |
#198 |
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Barring a complete economic collapse |
maryf |
Aug-09-10 02:55 PM |
#199 |
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What do you mean "local currencies?" |
nemo137 |
Aug-09-10 06:17 PM |
#201 |
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Cool story, bro. n/t |
LoZoccolo |
Aug-09-10 06:25 PM |
#202 |
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