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Reply #64: The "truth" of the matter is the OPPOSITE of that [View All]

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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-10 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #53
64. The "truth" of the matter is the OPPOSITE of that
This interview with Edward Wolff, Professor of Economics at NYU illustrates that for us:

MM: Apart from the absolute level of wealth of people at the bottom of the spectrum, why should inequality itself be a matter of concern?

Wolff: I think there are two rationales. The first is basically a moral or ethical position. A lot of people think it is morally bad for there to be wide gaps, wide disparities in well being in a society.I think there are two rationales. The first is basically a moral or ethical position. A lot of people think it is morally bad for there to be wide gaps, wide disparities in well being in a society.

If that is not convincing to a person, the second reason is that inequality is actually harmful to the well-being of a society. There is now a lot of evidence, based on cross-national comparisons of inequality and economic growth, that more unequal societies actually have lower rates of economic growth. The divisiveness that comes out of large disparities in income and wealth, is actually reflected in poorer economic performance of a country.

Typically when countries are more equal, educational achievement and benefits are more equally distributed in the country. In a country like the United States, there are still huge disparities in resources going to education, so quality of schooling and schooling performance are unequal. If you have a society with large concentrations of poor families, average school achievement is usually a lot lower than where you have a much more homogenous middle class population, as you find in most Western European countries.

So schooling suffers in this country, and, as a result, you get a labor force that is less well educated on average than in a country like the Netherlands, Germany or even France. So the high level of inequality results in less human capital being developed in this country, which ultimately affects economic performance.


(This in addition to poorer health outcome and higher crime rates).
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  -Why Weddings Matter Oregone  Jul-23-10 11:50 AM   #0 
  - OK. I won't post anything. I mean since you don't want to discuss it.  MineralMan   Jul-23-10 11:52 AM   #1 
  - I want to discuss disparity  Oregone   Jul-23-10 11:53 AM   #2 
  - I am almost positive that about 70% of DUers do not understand your point.  JanMichael   Jul-23-10 12:01 PM   #7 
  - Well, we have to start somewhere  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:03 PM   #10 
  - lol  HughMoran   Jul-24-10 08:31 AM   #48 
     - "telling us shit we already know"  Oregone   Jul-24-10 02:33 PM   #52 
  - I think everybody here pretty much gets that disparity and waste are the root issue  northernlights   Jul-25-10 05:48 AM   #57 
  - lol  HughMoran   Jul-24-10 08:30 AM   #47 
  - They have money, their daughter is getting married -- GET OVER IT  KurtNYC   Jul-23-10 11:57 AM   #3 
  - "I hope we can removed the Clintons for a moment and talk openly and honestly about the system that  uppityperson   Jul-23-10 12:00 PM   #5 
  - The OP was even more explicit than that  depakid   Jul-25-10 09:47 PM   #63 
  - See, this is precisely the problem  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:01 PM   #6 
  - The rich get richer, the rest get poorer  uppityperson   Jul-23-10 11:59 AM   #4 
  - I think that the Lottery Mentality you mention is the main reason we have lotteries.  FiveGoodMen   Jul-23-10 12:04 PM   #11 
     - Don't rise up because may be rich....someday  uppityperson   Jul-23-10 12:05 PM   #12 
     - We have lotteries because its better than the alternative  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:15 PM   #22 
     - The Clintons won the lottery when Bill was elected president  dflprincess   Jul-23-10 12:21 PM   #24 
  - it's going to be interesting  JanMichael   Jul-23-10 12:02 PM   #8 
  - Besides, a change in wedding plans has been announced:  MineralMan   Jul-23-10 12:02 PM   #9 
  - What about the system that perpetuates disparity and makes these kind of events possible?  uppityperson   Jul-23-10 12:07 PM   #14 
     - I do have some thoughts on that, yes.  MineralMan   Jul-23-10 12:15 PM   #21 
        - "In the real society..."  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:25 PM   #26 
           - My emigrant friend:  MineralMan   Jul-23-10 12:31 PM   #29 
              - a bash, "i've been trying", another bash.  uppityperson   Jul-23-10 12:34 PM   #31 
              - Ideals do not have to be fully realized (and scary for some if they often ever are)  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:38 PM   #34 
                 - Exactly my point. Movement toward ideals is about the best  MineralMan   Jul-23-10 01:06 PM   #42 
  - see, I kind of like that answer  sui generis   Jul-23-10 12:05 PM   #13 
  - "liberal education and liberal values mean that we inculcate a higher sense of fairness"  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:09 PM   #16 
  - I like your last 2 paragraphs  uppityperson   Jul-23-10 12:09 PM   #17 
  - If you leave Clinton out of the discussion, what's the point of arguing?  tularetom   Jul-23-10 12:08 PM   #15 
  - Is there ever a point of arguing against disparity after observing an event made possible by it?  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:13 PM   #18 
  - So its okay to tell people how to live their lives and spend their money  TZ   Jul-23-10 12:14 PM   #19 
  - Please read the topic before responding  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:20 PM   #23 
     - I applaud you for your patience in trying to explain your point  uppityperson   Jul-23-10 12:36 PM   #32 
  - Anger over the disparity? Nah - we LOVE to watch the rich flaunt it.  Lance_Boyle   Jul-23-10 12:15 PM   #20 
  - Interesting point, actually.  Robb   Jul-23-10 12:24 PM   #25 
     - Maybe part defense mechanism and part ol fashion entertainment  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:31 PM   #28 
     - I just love your sig line image in relation to this thread topic.  Lance_Boyle   Jul-23-10 12:36 PM   #33 
        - Oh yeah, quite true  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:44 PM   #36 
           - Now THAT would be reality TV.  Lance_Boyle   Jul-23-10 12:50 PM   #38 
     - I don't know.  Lance_Boyle   Jul-23-10 12:33 PM   #30 
     - That is so unfair.  Guy Whitey Corngood   Jul-23-10 12:52 PM   #41 
  - Oregone, I don't often agree with you  NeedleCast   Jul-23-10 12:25 PM   #27 
  - I have nothing against weddings but everything against Robber Barons.  earth mom   Jul-23-10 12:38 PM   #35 
  - While I find it tone deaf...  Oregone   Jul-23-10 12:49 PM   #37 
  - +1000000  leftstreet   Jul-23-10 12:52 PM   #40 
  - Ironically, the area where the wedding is taking place was a hotbed for Robber Barons.  OmmmSweetOmmm   Jul-24-10 08:28 AM   #46 
  - That is true with everything  treestar   Jul-23-10 12:51 PM   #39 
  - I agree with much of what you say. The system is indeed broken and needs a fixin'.  Rabrrrrrr   Jul-23-10 01:30 PM   #43 
  - Bravo. I think many DUers are creating fantasy OPs and replacing your OP with the fantasy.  ZombieHorde   Jul-24-10 04:38 AM   #44 
  - k&r  blindpig   Jul-24-10 08:24 AM   #45 
  - so, no more birthday parties? or backyard BBQs?  brooklynite   Jul-24-10 09:00 AM   #49 
  - Did I even say "no more weddings"?  Oregone   Jul-24-10 02:31 PM   #51 
  - Tax the rich, feed the poor, till there are no rich no more  txlibdem   Jul-24-10 12:37 PM   #50 
  - The truth is that there is a tradeoff between wealth disparity and increasing standard of living.  BzaDem   Jul-24-10 08:12 PM   #53 
  - Are you suggesting increased standard of living necessitates increased disparity?  Oregone   Jul-24-10 09:45 PM   #54 
  - I'm just saying there is a trade-off.  BzaDem   Jul-25-10 02:25 AM   #55 
     - You are saying it, but not proving it  Oregone   Jul-25-10 10:59 AM   #58 
        - "Why must they grow at a faster pace that that to make "risk" worth it?"  BzaDem   Jul-25-10 04:59 PM   #59 
           - "What I'm saying is that the reward for the risk is currently inversely proportional to ..."  Oregone   Jul-25-10 08:11 PM   #61 
              - "your original argument was an appeal to disparity as a means to raise the standard of living"  BzaDem   Jul-25-10 09:35 PM   #62 
                 - "but even under the current system there is limited ROI on low-risk investments"  Oregone   Jul-25-10 10:31 PM   #72 
  - The "truth" of the matter is the OPPOSITE of that  depakid   Jul-25-10 09:54 PM   #64 
     - It is obviously a matter of degree.  BzaDem   Jul-25-10 09:59 PM   #65 
        - Eisenhower era taxation levels didn't "stifle innovation" -and that's where the neoliberal arguments  depakid   Jul-25-10 10:04 PM   #67 
           - There were many more loopholes and exceptions when the top tax rate was 90%  BzaDem   Jul-25-10 10:12 PM   #68 
              - The fact remains that by current standards in the US it was astonomical  depakid   Jul-25-10 10:14 PM   #69 
                 - We brought in about 17-18% of GDP as taxation during the Eisenhower administration.  BzaDem   Jul-25-10 10:16 PM   #71 
                    - The issue is where does the revenue come in from- and how does it relate to "innovation"  depakid   Jul-25-10 11:58 PM   #74 
  - Weddings, honeymoons, cars, jewelry, education, clothes, vacations....  cynatnite   Jul-25-10 03:51 AM   #56 
  - I am glad my girlfriend wants nothing to do with a fancy wedding!  Lucky Luciano   Jul-25-10 05:12 PM   #60 
  - I'm all for it, Weddings help out our economy a lot.  Initech   Jul-25-10 10:03 PM   #66 
     - You do realize this money is only spent because its negligible against the amount they retain?  Oregone   Jul-25-10 10:16 PM   #70 
        - I know trickle-down economics is bullshit.  Initech   Jul-25-10 10:56 PM   #73 

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