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Reply #59: Well, I see where you're coming from... [View All]

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MrScorpio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-21-10 10:43 AM
Response to Reply #55
59. Well, I see where you're coming from...
But at its core, you're comparing apples with oranges

On one hand, you have a privileged class who derive their advantage by way of their wealth, and yes even wealthy non-whites are afforded a degree of privilege over people who are white, but NOT as so economically.

Yes, a system of class privilege can disregard color.

However, within this system of class privilege exists a racial sub-construct, composed to people who are within the same economic class and who are competing with one another. A black billionaire has to compete within his own status arena against his white billionaire counterpart. Whereas, the white poor and working working class can never compete against a black billionaire economically, but they can compete against those who are also poor and working, but yet are non-white. White privilege is the game which makes uneven a level economic playing field.

You see, acknowledging one does not nullify the other.

True, the wealthy exploit us all, of course, regardless of color.

But, it is best to see the fact that white privilege works most efficiently when people of the same economic class are forced to work against each other, instead of together against those who are at the top.

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  -"There is no such thing as white racism, but there is plenty of non-white racism to go around" MrScorpio  Jul-21-10 08:09 AM   #0 
  - Simultaneously using the term "white privilege" and whining about "inflammatory language"  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 08:22 AM   #1 
  - You don't think that there are people who believe in and promote white privilege?  drm604   Jul-21-10 08:27 AM   #2 
  - I think the term "white privilege" is inflammatory language  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 08:32 AM   #3 
     - How is the term by itself inflammatory?  drm604   Jul-21-10 08:42 AM   #9 
     - Self-evident IMO. It implies that the privileges of white people are not deserved.  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 08:45 AM   #12 
     - It is not the least bit self-evident.  drm604   Jul-21-10 08:58 AM   #20 
     - Yes it is.  LaydeeBug   Jul-21-10 09:10 AM   #29 
        - What?  drm604   Jul-21-10 09:17 AM   #34 
        - And "color rich folk" (whatever that is) get arrested, too.  AspenRose   Jul-21-10 09:44 AM   #47 
           - We have a black President now  Borderlineanarchist   Jul-21-10 04:46 PM   #108 
              - The trick is that white privilege isn't going away because we have a black president  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 05:15 PM   #114 
                 - Do you really believe that?  Borderlineanarchist   Jul-21-10 06:24 PM   #132 
                    - The difference is that, if Obama was white...  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 07:08 PM   #141 
                       - I do not deny there are morons in this country..  Borderlineanarchist   Jul-21-10 07:34 PM   #146 
                          - Taking more shit? You bet  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 07:45 PM   #149 
                             - Okay, I did not live in D.C during the Clinton era...  Borderlineanarchist   Jul-21-10 07:56 PM   #151 
                                - I'm afraid that you have to be a little bit more specific, and so do I  MrScorpio   Jul-22-10 01:12 AM   #168 
     - Please name a priviage that white people deserve to have.  slampoet   Jul-21-10 12:22 PM   #87 
     - Please name a privilege that poor white people have.  Confusious   Jul-21-10 06:26 PM   #134 
        - Easier to get a cab.  slampoet   Jul-21-10 06:53 PM   #139 
           - Wouldn't it better to say that we all deserve those priliveges  Confusious   Jul-21-10 08:23 PM   #158 
              - Maybe but i said NEITHER  slampoet   Jul-21-10 09:46 PM   #161 
     - "The problem isn't that white people get too much..."  KansDem   Jul-21-10 06:14 PM   #130 
     - Because he doesn't want to admit that non white people are treated as less than.  Raineyb   Jul-21-10 03:42 PM   #93 
        - Straw Man  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 04:54 PM   #110 
           - Apparently, you just can't admit that white people are treated better because  Raineyb   Jul-21-10 05:31 PM   #118 
              - I've never been personally treated better than anyone else because of my white skin  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 05:33 PM   #119 
                 - Not a straw man at all. I mentioned your proclivity to deny it when I first commented.  Raineyb   Jul-21-10 06:15 PM   #131 
                    - Another ad hominem  slackmaster   Jul-22-10 11:54 AM   #175 
     - white privilage goes beyond  handmade34   Jul-21-10 08:44 AM   #11 
     - Lots of appeals to "isness" but no real meat to back them up  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 08:46 AM   #14 
     - The truth is often inflammatory.  Heidi   Jul-21-10 08:46 AM   #13 
     - I think everyone else deserved the good fortune that you feel was being dispensed to you  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 08:56 AM   #19 
     - That's why it's an issue.  uncommon   Jul-21-10 09:11 AM   #30 
     - More appeals to "isness". More labels, still no substance.  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 10:08 AM   #54 
     - That may be true ...  Kweli4Real   Jul-21-10 10:49 AM   #61 
     - I don't believe I've ever had anything good handed to me because of my race  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 05:01 PM   #111 
     - Where can I get some of this good fortune?  Confusious   Jul-21-10 06:30 PM   #136 
     - I certainly think that, too. But us believing this does NOT mean white privilege doesn't exist.  Heidi   Jul-21-10 12:09 PM   #84 
     - Compared to wealth privilege, education privilege and even non-disabled privilege.  SunnySong   Jul-21-10 09:17 AM   #35 
     - But it still gets plenty of bang for the buck  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 09:23 AM   #37 
     - It's fairly useless on its own... just ask a homeless person or Walmart Greeter  SunnySong   Jul-21-10 09:27 AM   #39 
        - It's all part of the big picture, isn't it?  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 09:28 AM   #41 
     - I've been a victim of "youth privilege" at least twice in my working career  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 11:54 AM   #78 
     - Deleted message  Name removed   Jul-21-10 12:04 PM   #82 
     - I'm not surprised that this is your view.  Heidi   Jul-21-10 12:08 PM   #83 
        - Deleted message  Name removed   Jul-21-10 12:15 PM   #85 
           - More regular whites should own up to how they've benefitted from white privilege.  Heidi   Jul-21-10 12:20 PM   #86 
              - Most of us probably couldn't identify specific examples  One_Life_To_Give   Jul-21-10 01:53 PM   #90 
                 - I can't think of a single example of having discrimination work to my advantage  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 04:42 PM   #104 
                    - But one can say:  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 06:36 PM   #137 
     - What would that privilege be? nt  Confusious   Jul-21-10 06:28 PM   #135 
     - You are kidding, right? Everyone deserves  uncommon   Jul-21-10 09:09 AM   #28 
     - The fact that the term inflames me is sufficient for me to call it inflammatory  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 11:54 AM   #79 
        - If I were to show you source material written by white people on the subject...  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 05:19 PM   #116 
           - If I saw that kind of thing attributed to a white writer, I'd think the writer had a chip...  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 05:27 PM   #117 
              - and what would be the source of that chip?  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 06:05 PM   #126 
                 - I wouldn't bother trying to analyze it  slackmaster   Jul-22-10 11:56 AM   #176 
                    - Well, ok. That's nice to know  MrScorpio   Jul-22-10 02:21 PM   #178 
     - getting picked first or paid more because you are white is NOT a human right.  bettyellen   Jul-21-10 04:26 PM   #100 
        - I don't believe that has ever happened to me.  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 04:42 PM   #105 
           - why should you know or care, right? why believe recorded history, when this is all about YOU really?  bettyellen   Jul-22-10 07:23 AM   #169 
  - "White Privilege" is a fact; hence,  Dogtown   Jul-21-10 08:33 AM   #4 
  - Yeah well, that's just, ya know, like, your opinion, man.  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 08:35 AM   #5 
     - Yes, it is  Dogtown   Jul-21-10 08:37 AM   #6 
        - My opinion's the opposite, mostly because this isn't about racial lines, it's about an underclass,  LaydeeBug   Jul-21-10 09:06 AM   #24 
           - You're entitled to your opinion.  Dogtown   Jul-21-10 11:55 AM   #80 
  - So, I take that, in your mind, the promotion of white privilege is non existent?  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 08:40 AM   #8 
  - Is your solution to the problem of racism, to take something away from white people?  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 08:48 AM   #15 
  - Let's make sure that I'm clear about what I'm saying  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 09:06 AM   #23 
  - I've been white all my life, and I grew up in an affluent community  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 10:09 AM   #55 
     - Well, I see where you're coming from...  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 10:43 AM   #59 
        - Last time I took a friend to a welfare office, about half the people in the waiting area were white  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 11:32 AM   #70 
           - So are you saying that the meritocracy works as touted?  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 11:47 AM   #73 
              - I think that racial discrimination is an important factor, but not the only imporant factor  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 04:37 PM   #102 
                 - The prisms by which we see the world show each of us different colors  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 06:04 PM   #125 
  - Speaking for myself: Yes, absolutely.  uncommon   Jul-21-10 09:13 AM   #31 
     - That's a great example of what I've heard referred to as "white guilt"  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 10:10 AM   #56 
        - I don't feel guilty, I just know I didn't earn it.  uncommon   Jul-21-10 11:23 AM   #67 
           - And thus don't think I am entitled to it.  uncommon   Jul-21-10 11:23 AM   #68 
           - I think I earned and am entitled to everything I have  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 11:36 AM   #71 
  - The facts are  notesdev   Jul-21-10 08:48 AM   #16 
     - This "is" that, blah blah blah  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 08:48 AM   #17 
  - I would have suggested reading (white guy) Tim Wise on the subject  AspenRose   Jul-21-10 09:41 AM   # 
  - How about suggesting this YouTube vid to him instead?  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 09:45 AM   #48 
  - Wow ... Did I stumble into VDare this morning ...  Kweli4Real   Jul-21-10 10:44 AM   #60 
  - You don't understand it  JonLP24   Jul-21-10 10:52 AM   #62 
  - White privilege exists  Generic Other   Jul-21-10 11:48 AM   #74 
  - Why, thank you. I had almost forgotten to recommend.  Commie Pinko Dirtbag   Jul-21-10 11:53 AM   #77 
  - I just negated your petulent unrec...  ProudDad   Jul-21-10 05:36 PM   #121 
  - They pine woefully for the good old days when everyone knew their place  lunatica   Jul-21-10 08:38 AM   #7 
  - Misogyny and homophobia are extensions of the same dynamic  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 08:42 AM   #10 
     - Precisely!  uncommon   Jul-21-10 09:14 AM   #33 
  - In broad generality . . .  Morning Dew   Jul-21-10 08:54 AM   #18 
  - That's exactly correct  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 09:08 AM   #27 
  - That's perfectly stated.  AspenRose   Jul-21-10 09:49 AM   #50 
  - Wish I could rec your response. nt  uncommon   Jul-21-10 11:24 AM   #69 
  - Fail. Epic. Fail. Racism is racism is racism, the idea that it's not possible  LaydeeBug   Jul-21-10 09:03 AM   #21 
  - It's actually scapegoating, since Obama, Breitbart, Vilsack, et al.  Romulox   Jul-21-10 09:06 AM   #25 
  - Racism is specific to the group that holds power  Generic Other   Jul-21-10 12:02 PM   #81 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Jul-21-10 03:34 PM   #92 
  - You cannot be for real.  Raineyb   Jul-21-10 03:59 PM   #96 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Jul-21-10 04:29 PM   #101 
     - Hell no I can't. You want a cookie for doing what the fuck you're supposed to do?  Raineyb   Jul-21-10 04:45 PM   #107 
  - Hardly "racial enlightenment"...  ProudDad   Jul-21-10 05:45 PM   #123 
  - I don't believe the definition supports your assertion  MajorChode   Jul-21-10 04:21 PM   #98 
  - There is no such thing as 'reverse racism'  MajorChode   Jul-21-10 04:04 PM   #97 
  - The privilege we aren't supposed to talk about is the privilege of class  Romulox   Jul-21-10 09:04 AM   #22 
  - + eleven gazillion, because it could not have been said better. nt  LaydeeBug   Jul-21-10 09:07 AM   #26 
  - All I'm saying is that the promotion of white privilege is a tool  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 09:14 AM   #32 
  - You and I live in the same community...  Romulox   Jul-21-10 09:34 AM   #44 
  - I disagree. In my experience I've seen the worst bigotry among working class  lunatica   Jul-21-10 09:21 AM   #36 
  - Which is what I've been saying  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 09:26 AM   #38 
  - This statement would work as well to the man in the mirror  Romulox   Jul-21-10 09:29 AM   #42 
  - The people who promote it are the beneficiaries of racism  lunatica   Jul-21-10 09:33 AM   #43 
  - Like the men and women who made the decision to kill millions of Iraqis and Afghanis?  Romulox   Jul-21-10 09:28 AM   #40 
     - There's no need to read minds when racists are talking at you behind their hands  lunatica   Jul-21-10 09:37 AM   #45 
        - Um, ketchup?  Romulox   Jul-21-10 09:41 AM   #46 
  - I beg to differ ..  Kweli4Real   Jul-21-10 11:00 AM   #63 
     - Unless Tom Vilsack, Barack Obama, and Andy Breitbart are "working class whites", you're demonstrably  Romulox   Jul-21-10 11:10 AM   #65 
        - Read what I wrote, but take off your victim's glasses first ...  Kweli4Real   Jul-21-10 01:40 PM   #89 
           - President Obama has moral agency; nobody "made" him make a racist choice.  Romulox   Jul-21-10 03:53 PM   #94 
  - We have to separate generic and specific  dmallind   Jul-21-10 09:46 AM   #49 
  - The worst part is that the dominant culture sets up the concept of white privilege to be "denied"  political_Dem   Jul-21-10 10:01 AM   #51 
  - Excellent post  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 10:04 AM   #52 
  - Thank you. :) I appreciate you bringing this issue up. It needs to be talked about.  political_Dem   Jul-21-10 10:06 AM   #53 
  - Saying that "the white working class is not the primary group oppressing people of color in this  Romulox   Jul-21-10 10:13 AM   #57 
  - But poor, white people as well as their middle-class and rich counterparts still recieve  political_Dem   Jul-21-10 10:33 AM   #58 
     - Race is be used in this case to distract from class.  Romulox   Jul-21-10 11:09 AM   #64 
     - But that's how white privilege works  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 11:17 AM   #66 
        - You're twisting yourself into knots now. The white working clas do not "benefit from a class system  Romulox   Jul-21-10 03:56 PM   #95 
           - I think it is pretty clear what the OP is saying.  political_Dem   Jul-21-10 04:24 PM   #99 
           - You want to argue against a point that nobody is making.  Romulox   Jul-21-10 04:43 PM   #106 
              - In response, there are three points I would like to make:  political_Dem   Jul-21-10 05:52 PM   #124 
                 - Just to clarify one point--  Romulox   Jul-21-10 11:12 PM   #162 
                    - You're really reveling in taking my words out of context  MrScorpio   Jul-22-10 09:34 AM   #172 
                       - Olive branch  Romulox   Jul-22-10 09:52 AM   #173 
                          - Sure...  MrScorpio   Jul-22-10 09:57 AM   #174 
           - Let me get this clear:  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 06:10 PM   #129 
              - No, that's not what I'm saying.  Romulox   Jul-21-10 11:19 PM   #163 
                 - I didn't say that the white working class the authors of oppression  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 11:55 PM   #166 
     - "class is also used to deny that racism and white privilege exists."  Number23   Jul-21-10 07:35 PM   #147 
        - Mr. Rock had many witty lines, but you're spot on there.  political_Dem   Jul-21-10 08:15 PM   #155 
        - Sorry, but that line always rang REALLY hollow with me.  Romulox   Jul-21-10 11:20 PM   #164 
           - Rings solid as hell to me.  Number23   Jul-21-10 11:55 PM   #165 
           - That line is true as hell.  Raineyb   Jul-22-10 12:44 AM   #167 
  - excellent!  handmade34   Jul-21-10 11:37 AM   #72 
  - Precisely. nt  EFerrari   Jul-21-10 11:50 AM   #75 
  - Handmade34 and EFerrari, thank you for your compliments. :)  political_Dem   Jul-21-10 04:39 PM   #103 
  - Should priviledge be color-blind?  Borderlineanarchist   Jul-21-10 05:05 PM   #112 
  - Privilege has never been color blind in America  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 06:50 PM   #138 
     - Agreed, but are you in favor of...  Borderlineanarchist   Jul-21-10 07:21 PM   #143 
        - Your point is moot  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 07:24 PM   #144 
           - I agree with you!  Borderlineanarchist   Jul-21-10 07:44 PM   #148 
              - The key:  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 07:56 PM   #152 
                 - You're right, I was beating around the bush...  Borderlineanarchist   Jul-21-10 08:13 PM   #154 
                    - No, I don't think that quotas are the answer  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 08:20 PM   #157 
                       - Agreed again...  Borderlineanarchist   Jul-21-10 08:26 PM   #159 
  - What a fantastic post.  Number23   Jul-21-10 07:31 PM   #145 
     - No problem. :) . It needed to be said.  political_Dem   Jul-21-10 08:18 PM   #156 
  - K & R  MilesColtrane   Jul-21-10 11:52 AM   #76 
  - They take an idea and use it to their advantage...and it WORKS!  Rex   Jul-21-10 12:25 PM   #88 
  - Social conditioning  handmade34   Jul-21-10 02:06 PM   #91 
  - You mean in the US. Go to Japan and you will see anti-white racism. It's a big eye opener  McCamy Taylor   Jul-21-10 04:48 PM   #109 
  - SInce the thread has developed into a discussion about the nature of white privilege...  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 05:07 PM   #113 
  - WOW! Impressive cut and paste skills!  deaniac21   Jul-21-10 05:17 PM   #115 
     - Is your post an attempt to engage in civil discourse?  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 06:07 PM   #127 
  - For those who think white privilege doesn't exist, I have a question:  Starbucks Anarchist   Jul-21-10 05:35 PM   #120 
  - I don't deny the existence of what you call white privilege.  slackmaster   Jul-21-10 05:41 PM   #122 
  - How else would you phrase it?  Starbucks Anarchist   Jul-21-10 06:09 PM   #128 
     - I'd say that non-white people are frequently and sometimes systematically discriminated against  slackmaster   Jul-22-10 11:58 AM   #177 
  - That depends.  LostInAnomie   Jul-21-10 06:24 PM   #133 
  - One of the top reasons...  MellowDem   Jul-21-10 06:58 PM   #140 
  - Yes, class privilege rules the roost...  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 07:20 PM   #142 
     - They don't aknowledge privilege of any sort...  MellowDem   Jul-21-10 07:45 PM   #150 
  - Everybody, if they can, should watch today's Rachel Maddow  MrScorpio   Jul-21-10 08:08 PM   #153 
  - Or just listen to the voice mail left at the NAACP recently.  Sebastian Doyle   Jul-21-10 08:31 PM   #160 
  - Rachel's segment was incredible.  myrna minx   Jul-22-10 07:50 AM   #170 
  - Great post.  CBR   Jul-22-10 08:03 AM   #171 
  - Complete and total BS.  laureloak   Jul-22-10 02:51 PM   #179 
     - So, I didn't get anything right at all?  MrScorpio   Jul-22-10 03:39 PM   #180 
 

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