JonQ
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Thu Dec-10-09 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #120 |
| 124. Big push was never from US based enterprises |
|
Edited on Thu Dec-10-09 10:52 AM by JonQ
it's always been a largely international occurrence. Hence, the CRU in europe is heading it up, and the major meetings have been in europe and asia.
Surely you don't think the US is the only country in the world?
"Please explain how government "benefits" from global warming being real and all of the attendant problems. They would save money and grief by simply denying it out of hand. You claim there's an agenda, then prove it."
Cap and trade, a massive expansion in government that would provide more tax revenues, more employees and more ways to reward/punish supporters/opponents.
Can you think of a time in history when a government has voluntarily turned down more money and more power? A few perhaps, usually following a bloody revolution. But not often.
You really don't see putting more money in the governments coffers as a reason for them to act?
|
| -A Poll on Scientific Transparency |
Nederland |
Dec-09-09 06:40 PM |
#0 |
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should not have to release code and data |
bridgit |
Dec-09-09 06:46 PM |
#1 |
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who enforces scientists "having" to do anything...? |
mike_c |
Dec-09-09 06:48 PM |
#2 |
 -
I think when it comes |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 06:51 PM |
#5 |
  -
There has never been a time when data, protocols and results were not entirely open and available |
timeforpeace |
Dec-09-09 07:01 PM |
#12 |
   -
The double standard is concerning |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 07:06 PM |
#18 |
   -
what do you mean, "until now...?" |
mike_c |
Dec-09-09 08:43 PM |
#44 |
  -
I've yet to read of anyone on here |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:02 PM |
#50 |
  -
but how would you propose that be done...? |
mike_c |
Dec-09-09 08:25 PM |
#34 |
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I think a good start |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 08:36 PM |
#36 |
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Someone's going to break into your lab, and if they find ANYTHING... |
Junkdrawer |
Dec-09-09 07:13 PM |
#24 |
  -
I suppose that demonstrates how little the general public knows... |
mike_c |
Dec-09-09 08:19 PM |
#33 |
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I honestly don't think most people even know what they are asking for anymore |
CreekDog |
Dec-10-09 10:50 AM |
#122 |
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Nothing good can come from hiding data |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 06:48 PM |
#3 |
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The only thing scientists should release is what they submit to peer-review. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 06:50 PM |
#4 |
 -
End of thread. |
Forkboy |
Dec-09-09 06:52 PM |
#6 |
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Wouldn't repeating the experiment exactly |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 06:54 PM |
#8 |
  -
Ever read a scientific paper? |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 06:56 PM |
#10 |
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Yes, they do |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 06:58 PM |
#11 |
  -
Oh, nevermind. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 07:02 PM |
#13 |
   -
Sorry, but no |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 07:05 PM |
#16 |
    -
Once you publish the paper... |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 07:11 PM |
#21 |
   -
Who get's to decide what's relevant |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 07:23 PM |
#27 |
   -
The peers. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:17 PM |
#65 |
   -
Here's where you screwed up: |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:18 PM |
#66 |
   -
It doesn't. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:24 PM |
#70 |
   -
Again, you screwed up |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:26 PM |
#72 |
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If one wants to renew a grant and get more money, sure. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:28 PM |
#75 |
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So findings do affect funding |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:30 PM |
#77 |
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No, output affects funding. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:33 PM |
#79 |
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Incorrect |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:42 PM |
#81 |
   -
All labs show global warming to be manmade. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:53 PM |
#84 |
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Incorrect |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:56 PM |
#85 |
    -
Scientific American's a biased source, eh? |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:58 PM |
#86 |
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An editorial within it is |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 10:01 PM |
#87 |
    -
I never argued they were scientific papers. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-10-09 02:42 PM |
#156 |
    -
So you believe an editorial |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 11:45 PM |
#163 |
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I remain curious though |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 10:08 PM |
#88 |
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The science is not settled |
Nederland |
Dec-10-09 08:29 AM |
#96 |
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That's the same thing George W. Bush says about evolution. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-10-09 02:43 PM |
#157 |
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I'm not wrong |
Nederland |
Dec-10-09 03:39 PM |
#159 |
   -
Clarify Please |
Nederland |
Dec-09-09 08:38 PM |
#37 |
  -
It's still reproducable |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-09-09 07:46 PM |
#29 |
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That would neccessitate |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 07:53 PM |
#30 |
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Oh, bullcrap. |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-09-09 08:38 PM |
#38 |
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No, I suspect you are lying |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 08:42 PM |
#43 |
  -
Nope, just you that's lying. |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-09-09 09:01 PM |
#48 |
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What's the point of reproducing one paper |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:04 PM |
#52 |
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The purpose would be to satisfy concerns about the data. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:09 PM |
#57 |
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If that's the case |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:10 PM |
#59 |
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Oh, I already gave you several good reasons. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:14 PM |
#61 |
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Give me 10 years |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:17 PM |
#64 |
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Alright, go for it. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:18 PM |
#67 |
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Ah but of course |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:21 PM |
#69 |
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If the research is legimate, science would be happy to accept it. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:26 PM |
#73 |
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Ahem |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:30 PM |
#76 |
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JonQ, all real scientists back my line of argument. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:31 PM |
#78 |
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Sigh |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:45 PM |
#82 |
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So, was the NSF in on the conspiracy when Bush was in office? |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:30 AM |
#109 |
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How is bush |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:44 AM |
#114 |
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You're avoiding the question |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:48 AM |
#120 |
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Big push was never from US based enterprises |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:51 AM |
#124 |
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You offer no proof, only conjecture |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:55 AM |
#131 |
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Not really conjecture |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 11:13 AM |
#143 |
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It can cost billions of dollars |
Nederland |
Dec-10-09 08:09 AM |
#95 |
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Yes, that's right. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-10-09 02:45 PM |
#158 |
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LHC scientists disagree with you |
Nederland |
Dec-10-09 03:50 PM |
#160 |
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Not really. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-10-09 04:36 PM |
#161 |
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And since you are such a prolific reading of scientific journals |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 07:02 PM |
#14 |
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Two per day? |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 07:10 PM |
#20 |
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Sorry, but yes, I do |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 07:21 PM |
#25 |
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Hmmm, no you don't. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 08:39 PM |
#39 |
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You misunderstood |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 08:47 PM |
#45 |
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And do you really think |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:00 PM |
#47 |
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Oh, it's entirely possible. I read three or four today. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:01 PM |
#49 |
  -
Well sure, if that's what you need to believe |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:05 PM |
#53 |
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JonQ, you're a global warming denier. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:06 PM |
#54 |
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In a few years |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:09 PM |
#58 |
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Now you're sounding like doomsday cultists. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 09:12 PM |
#60 |
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? |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:15 PM |
#63 |
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A whole TWO papers per day? |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-09-09 09:02 PM |
#51 |
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Some people seem to think it is impossible |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:07 PM |
#55 |
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No. I don't think it's impossible. |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-09-09 09:25 PM |
#71 |
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Like I said |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:27 PM |
#74 |
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Oh, please. |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-09-09 09:38 PM |
#80 |
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So saying it's |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:47 PM |
#83 |
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Hahahahaha!!! |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 09:16 AM |
#99 |
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Sigh |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 09:43 AM |
#102 |
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Thanks, JonQ! |
Rabrrrrrr |
Dec-10-09 10:09 AM |
#104 |
  -
Believe me |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:22 AM |
#107 |
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Wow, you're full of right-wing talking points, aren't you? |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:33 AM |
#110 |
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RW talking point? |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:45 AM |
#117 |
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Let's see |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:50 AM |
#123 |
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You really don't understand the debate |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:53 AM |
#126 |
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LOLOLOLOLOL |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:57 AM |
#132 |
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And there it is |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:59 AM |
#135 |
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That is EXACTLY what you are doing, loserboy. |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 10:15 AM |
#105 |
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No need to get testy |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:19 AM |
#106 |
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LOL!!! |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 10:40 AM |
#112 |
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You could always do your own study |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:47 AM |
#119 |
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A blog? |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 10:54 AM |
#128 |
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The data is there |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 11:02 AM |
#139 |
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Climate Change Fraud, they got charts too |
bridgit |
Dec-10-09 10:54 AM |
#129 |
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Yup. |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 11:18 AM |
#145 |
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Funny you didn't provide a source for that image |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:45 AM |
#116 |
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It's based on |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:49 AM |
#121 |
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What the hell are you talking about? |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:52 AM |
#125 |
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So are you in favor of transparency or not? |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:53 AM |
#127 |
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Answer my question. |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:57 AM |
#133 |
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Not really |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 11:01 AM |
#137 |
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Not all data is peer reviewable |
Johonny |
Dec-09-09 08:36 PM |
#35 |
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If it can't be peer reviewed then it isn't science |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 08:39 PM |
#40 |
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clearly then |
Johonny |
Dec-10-09 09:00 AM |
#97 |
  -
Are you really trying to equate the two? |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 09:11 AM |
#98 |
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...and you've never heard of ITAR, then. |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:35 AM |
#111 |
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Reread the poll question being asked |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:55 AM |
#130 |
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You are the expert at diverting the conversation |
PVnRT |
Dec-10-09 10:58 AM |
#134 |
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Still no rereading of the question being asked? |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:59 AM |
#136 |
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That's true, the applied nature of the data isn't always 'peer understood' either... |
bridgit |
Dec-09-09 10:33 PM |
#92 |
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Depends on Who pays for it! |
Traveling_Home |
Dec-09-09 06:52 PM |
#7 |
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Release all and let |
bbinacan |
Dec-09-09 06:54 PM |
#9 |
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Arrest records and the juicy bits of any affairs would also be helpful...n/t |
Junkdrawer |
Dec-09-09 07:03 PM |
#15 |
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If they get public funding, their methodology and data should be public knowledge. n/t |
cherokeeprogressive |
Dec-09-09 07:05 PM |
#17 |
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I find it amazing that some people are actually arguing against transparency |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 07:10 PM |
#19 |
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I find it humorous that global warming deniers are pretending to be scientifically literate. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 07:12 PM |
#22 |
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Sorry, but right now it's the proponents |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 07:23 PM |
#26 |
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I'm reminded of Ben Stein's movie about Creationism. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
Dec-09-09 08:42 PM |
#42 |
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Haven't seen it |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 08:48 PM |
#46 |
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Agree. Strange. n/t |
cherokeeprogressive |
Dec-09-09 07:12 PM |
#23 |
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At least the poll results above have changed dramatically as time goes on. |
timeforpeace |
Dec-09-09 09:14 PM |
#62 |
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real science requires others to attempt to repeat the experiment to either... |
yawnmaster |
Dec-09-09 07:34 PM |
#28 |
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Scientific papers should be subject to peer review. |
baldguy |
Dec-09-09 07:58 PM |
#31 |
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In 1974 Richard Feynman spoke about scientific integrity... |
bik0 |
Dec-09-09 08:05 PM |
#32 |
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Release Everything.. |
RoadRage |
Dec-09-09 08:42 PM |
#41 |
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I'd like some transparency on how many of the leading Global Warming "skeptics" are funded by |
Warren DeMontague |
Dec-09-09 09:09 PM |
#56 |
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How about all scientists |
JonQ |
Dec-09-09 09:19 PM |
#68 |
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Oh, yes, it's all a big conspiwacy. |
Warren DeMontague |
Dec-10-09 03:20 AM |
#93 |
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If you read all those papers you claim to read... |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 09:27 AM |
#100 |
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" Nobody is hiding anything" |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 09:44 AM |
#103 |
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Like I said... |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 10:28 AM |
#108 |
-
How do you "spot fraud" |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 10:43 AM |
#113 |
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Nice try. |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 11:02 AM |
#138 |
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My gosh |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 11:07 AM |
#140 |
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I see that reading comprehension is not one of your better skills |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 11:10 AM |
#141 |
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To you |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 11:11 AM |
#142 |
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You sure like to project your ignorance on other people, don't you? |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 11:17 AM |
#144 |
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I'm not the one defending |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 11:30 AM |
#146 |
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There you go again |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 11:39 AM |
#147 |
 -
So no answer eh? |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 12:19 PM |
#149 |
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Thanks again for proving my point. |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 12:20 PM |
#150 |
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Obfuscation: |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 12:22 PM |
#152 |
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Funny, but I never took a stance either way |
GoCubsGo |
Dec-10-09 12:24 PM |
#153 |
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So what is your stance on this then? |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 01:00 PM |
#154 |
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If no one else understands, and you're the only one that does: then what is going on? |
bridgit |
Dec-10-09 11:40 AM |
#148 |
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I'm not the only one |
JonQ |
Dec-10-09 12:21 PM |
#151 |
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"Scientific Transparency", as mentioned above I have a problem with how quickly... |
bridgit |
Dec-10-09 02:41 PM |
#155 |
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I was gonna say "Yeah, sure, why not?" |
Iggo |
Dec-09-09 10:09 PM |
#89 |
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I think it would be great if you tell us what you think first. n/t |
Cleita |
Dec-09-09 10:10 PM |
#90 |
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Release all code and data (nt) |
Nederland |
Dec-10-09 08:01 AM |
#94 |
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This is already required for NIH funded projects with >500k/yr direct costs. |
moc |
Dec-09-09 10:15 PM |
#91 |
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As soon as we get corporate transparency, sure. |
Overseas |
Dec-10-09 09:27 AM |
#101 |
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Sadly trying to get funding from the government and private sector creates too much pressure |
liberal_at_heart |
Dec-10-09 10:45 AM |
#115 |
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you forgot to say "from the 1980's" |
CreekDog |
Dec-10-09 10:47 AM |
#118 |
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non specialists can do nothing good with the data |
n2doc |
Dec-10-09 05:01 PM |
#162 |