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Reply #36: I hate to be crass and Walmart-mentality, but I'd say "Monica." [View All]

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calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts)  Journal Click to send private message to this author Click to view this author's profile Click to add this author to your buddy list Click to add this author to your Ignore list Donate to DU! Wed Nov-04-09 03:05 PM
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36. I hate to be crass and Walmart-mentality, but I'd say "Monica."
Yes, it's WAY less significant all across the board. Yes, those other issues are WAY more important and critical to people's LIVES. Yes to all of that!

But people were obsessed with Monica Lewinsky. Sex sells and this sure did, for more than a year. Hell, in some respects it's STILL selling. And therein lies the problem. That's what makes the whole Monica business so damaging, longterm.

It goes back to public perception and the manipulation thereof. Unfortunately, public perception CAN be managed and manipulated. Bullshit does baffle. Our side can have all the issues and all the research and all the background and we'll lose every time to someone who can craft a different message that baffles or dissuades, or even frustrates (annoys) the voter - someone who can manipulate the public perception better.

What the Monica thing did was create a huge, cold, wet, heavy, scratchy, bad-smelling, bug-eaten, larvae-filled blanket that dropped over Clinton and everything that involved his side, ie: the Democrats. It laid a gigantic, bright red negative over him and those of us who'd supported him or thought like he did or voiced similar ideas and opinions. It gave observers AND ESPECIALLY critics and opponents more ammo. More entitlement to sneer and snicker and cluck and gloat and roll their eyeballs and quote ronald reagan "there you go again!" Which automatically and subconsciously unleashes the avalanche of negative feelings toward what everyone's been programmed to think about our side since the early '80's: that liberals are bad, naive, stupid, foolish, irrational, tree-hugging, baby-killing, America-hating terrorists. Granted the last three words are fairly recent additions, given the circumstances that were ripe for exploitation over the last eight years. The Monica business only aggravated all of that. Hung Christmas tree lights all over it and flew it around in front of all the TV cameras so it was unescapable anywhere.

It just reinforced all the things that far too many gullible Americans have been trained to hate.

AND, because it's sex, it's gonna be fun to talk about and titter about - for-evv-ver. There are thousands of ways to keep it in the front of the public mind. Every time ANY politician, Democrat or republi-CON, is caught in the wrong bed, there is the inevitable montage and commentary about all the other politicians who've done so. And the BIGGEST OF THEM ALL is Bill Clinton. He's the star on top of the Christmas tree. The leader of the pack. The cherry on top of the sundae. The biggest name on the marquee. And then, everybody gets reminded about all those bad things. The sex and then the lying and the haranguing and waste of time and money all through Congress and the negative feelings that immediately pop up in reaction - to oneself - for being so low-life as to be interested in this tawdry, lurid crap. Negativity all around, of every sort imaginable, AND it's associated DIRECTLY with Clinton, and by extension, the rest of us Dems and liberals and progressives.

Because THEN, thus softened up, the properly conditioned mindset can move onward through the rest of the litany of the REALLY SERIOUS issues - like NAFTA, the ridiculous handling of gays in the military, the compromises with the bad guys on taxes and welfare, the whole argument about the so-called "third way" of the accursed DLC, the betrayal of the true liberal/progressive agenda, ALL of it. ALL THE REST of it.

Just remember the human nature calculus here - too many Americans have the donald rumsfeld mentality - "go wide, sweep it all up." Remember that infamous statement immediately after 9/11 when they were looking for ANYTHING to hang it on?

Another complication of that annoying obsession on the Monica affair is how it dilutes public opinion against us. Seeing that newsreel of any sexual bad boy in Washington DC, which inevitably includes the star of our show, Bill Clinton, just reduces him as any sort of distinguished figure of POSITIVE note. It further reinforces the pervasive attitude of "see? They ALL do it. They're ALL guilty. Both sides. One's no better than any of the others." What THAT turns into is a diminished commitment to one side (OURS), diminished activism, more throw-up-your-hands-and-a-pox-on-both-your-houses detachment, apathy, frustration, and less enthusiasm for our ENTIRE side of things. Everything we believe in and keep working toward.

And we just saw, yet again last night, what a difference it makes when one side is feeling that diminishment, that apathy, that lack of enthusiasm, while the opponents were All Fired Up.

The Monica affair rendered Clinton a late-night comedians' joke, and the rest of us less able to advance our agenda as Dems because we look bad and reckless and irresponsible (the "fish rots from the head" thing) since we're on his team. It puts us on the defensive and gives the enemy more ammo to use against us to demean and diminish our side in the media and the public's view. We look ethically compromised so we're not as effective in standing for the things we do. And we look trivial because - well, all this fuss about cigars and a stained blue dress, those "hot-pants" liberals, can't keep it zipped up, what a cad - tsk-tsk-tsk. JUST the thing when your opponents are the most sanctimonious, judgmental, narrow-minded, holier-than-thou priss-ants on the planet. Nothing like feeding THEIR God-anointed superiority complexes, 'eh?

It's psychology and human nature and group-think and perception management and manipulation and all that crazy stuff. The whole Monica business just gave SUCH a black-eye, in general, overriding, pervasive, visceral. Down in the gut. Instinctive. You feel it before you realize it and have time to process it consciously. It's already there. The point's already been made. The game has already been one. You're trained to go there automatically because the visceral lever was thrown. The Monica mess just fucked EVERYTHING over. Made EVERYTHING worse. Made our case all the more difficult to defend. Gave us all a kick in the teeth. It hobbled our ability to advance our agenda, while piling on embarrassment that makes ANY Democrat, even the most ardent Clinton admirer, cringe and want to run from the room and hide. That, in turn, disables us as far as being able, willing, or enthusiastic, about making a strong case for our agenda.

That's why I think it's the over-arching detrimental legacy. Even with the issues that happened before Monica - that we all still have to advocate for and defend - it just didn't help. It left us on the defensive. And opponents have been able to spread that around, so that it's not just Mr. Sex-Addict that's the problem, it's everything he stands for. And since we're on his team, it's automatically presumed that we're part of that too. By the time it happened in his administration, there wasn't a lot of time left, and I think the fight may have gone out of him. Certainly did with a lot of us. And it left us with that millstone around our necks after he left the center stage and we still had to stay in the chorus. It wasn't his problem anymore because he really didn't count anymore. But we did and it's still our problem because it's still OUR agenda that needs protecting and defending, and his fucking around damaged US. And every damn time some david vitter or john ensign or larry craig or mark sanford blunders onto the headlines, "roll the video!" and here again will be everybody's sexcapades and the biggest offender of all - hey, let's bring back the Grand Wazoo of the Naughty Schlong Hall of Fame - Biiiiiiiiiiiiilllll CLINTON!!!! And we'll just cringe and have to endure that resurrected ordeal of humiliation and diminishment - yet again. Back on defense - yet again.

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  What do you think is the most detrimental legacy of the Clinton administration? Toucano  Nov-04-09 12:39 PM   #0 
   500,000 dead Iraqi children comes to mind....  mike_c   Nov-04-09 12:42 PM   #1 
   That blood is on the hands of Saddam for his defiance of UN sanctions  NoPasaran   Nov-04-09 12:59 PM   #12 
   whatever....  mike_c   Nov-04-09 01:07 PM   #14 
   Wow, a link to a really, really, legitimate site!  joeybee12   Nov-04-09 02:31 PM   #31 
      how about hearing from Albright's own mouth...?  mike_c   Nov-04-09 02:46 PM   #32 
      Did Albright make that statement or not?  JackRiddler   Nov-04-09 09:41 PM   #51 
      despite what DU wingnuts say, there is NOTHING wrong with  jonnyblitz   Nov-05-09 03:36 AM   #70 
   Can you explain why sanctions were even appropriate?  wuushew   Nov-04-09 01:22 PM   #17 
   Furthermore, Iraq cooperated (reluctantly) with the UN disarmament team...  JackRiddler   Nov-04-09 09:43 PM   #52 
   to soften Iraq up even more for Boosh the Second to come in.  Whisp   Nov-05-09 02:46 AM   #67 
   "The American Left"?  intheflow   Nov-04-09 02:24 PM   #25 
      sounds that way.. nt  G_j   Nov-04-09 02:29 PM   #30 
   In the international arena, I would say the Rwanda events and inaction would be the worst.  Toucano   Nov-04-09 01:16 PM   #16 
   Had the sanctions been lifted, President Dole would've just re-instated them  Hippo_Tron   Nov-04-09 09:40 PM   #50 
   so you're ready to excuse the murder of half a million children...  mike_c   Nov-04-09 11:04 PM   #61 
      You missed the part about President Dole re-instating them upon taking office  Hippo_Tron   Nov-05-09 01:48 AM   #63 
   +1  invictus   Nov-04-09 11:25 PM   #62 
   All of the above.  Jackpine Radical   Nov-04-09 12:43 PM   #2 
   I'm going to have to agree with you...  prairierose   Nov-04-09 02:13 PM   #23 
   I voted "other" because they were all horrible.  intheflow   Nov-04-09 02:25 PM   #26 
   Agreed, and add the DMCA to the list too. nt  Umbral   Nov-05-09 10:42 AM   #75 
   All of the above -- he's just as bad as any Republican.  FLAprogressive   Nov-04-09 12:43 PM   #3 
   you may be right. But Glass Siegal stands tall, perhaps taller than the rest  ChairmanAgnostic   Nov-04-09 12:45 PM   #4 
   And NAFTA took our jobs,  intheflow   Nov-04-09 02:27 PM   #27 
   Any republican? Another vote that Al Gore = George W Bush.  stray cat   Nov-04-09 12:56 PM   #8 
      kind of a moot point.  FLAprogressive   Nov-04-09 12:56 PM   #10 
      Al would have been ok, but his choice to run with Lieberman  intheflow   Nov-04-09 02:28 PM   #28 
   Maybe there's a cumulative affect of some of these policies. n-t  Toucano   Nov-04-09 12:47 PM   #5 
   This gem led directly to our economic meltdown:  SOS   Nov-04-09 12:51 PM   #6 
   Deepsixing BCCI report and its outstanding matters to protect GHWBush making Bush2 possible  blm   Nov-04-09 12:53 PM   #7 
   All of the above  Individualist   Nov-04-09 12:56 PM   #9 
   All of the above, plus the Rupert Murdoch/Clear Channel Enabling Act of 1996  Sebastian Doyle   Nov-04-09 12:58 PM   #11 
   Chose NAFTA, but it's really 'most of the above.'  damntexdem   Nov-04-09 01:06 PM   #13 
   Triangulation and paddling to the right which helped create all of the above.  Cerridwen   Nov-04-09 01:11 PM   #15 
   ****Follow-up Question****  Toucano   Nov-04-09 01:44 PM   #18 
   None to my knowledge.  Lilith Velkor   Nov-04-09 04:48 PM   #40 
   His Presidency was just part of the continuum set in motion by the Reagan Revolution  kenny blankenship   Nov-04-09 01:50 PM   #19 
   I put NAFTA, but agree with "all of the above."  Brickbat   Nov-04-09 01:52 PM   #20 
   Rwanda  MilesColtrane   Nov-04-09 01:52 PM   #21 
   Yep, this is the big one in my book. (nt)  Posteritatis   Nov-04-09 03:01 PM   #34 
   Other  Sinti   Nov-04-09 02:11 PM   #22 
   I read something interesting about sanctions the other day.  Toucano   Nov-04-09 02:20 PM   #24 
      the interesting thing is that even though sanctions fail 3 out of 4 times...  mike_c   Nov-04-09 02:52 PM   #33 
      Thanks, looks like an interesting site in general.  Sinti   Nov-04-09 03:24 PM   #37 
         I think sanctions cannot be considered a diplomatic tool.  Toucano   Nov-04-09 09:29 PM   #44 
            It makes sense, though, doesn't it.  Sinti   Nov-05-09 02:22 AM   #64 
               It does indeed.  Toucano   Nov-05-09 09:26 AM   #71 
   Giving credibility to the DLC. n/t  loudsue   Nov-04-09 02:28 PM   #29 
   Telecommunications Act of 1996.  librechik   Nov-04-09 03:03 PM   #35 
   I was going to add that one too (Telecommunications Act 1996)  bvar22   Nov-04-09 05:03 PM   #41 
   That's the one  Canuckistanian   Nov-04-09 10:39 PM   #58 
   Yep, Telecom Act of 1996  LondonReign2   Nov-05-09 11:08 AM   #78 
   I hate to be crass and Walmart-mentality, but I'd say "Monica."  calimary   Nov-04-09 03:05 PM   #36 
   Sorry I didn't read your post...  TroglodyteScholar   Nov-04-09 10:54 PM   #59 
   Aw thanks. I did read your post.  calimary   Nov-06-09 02:45 AM   #80 
   5 of the 6 options were done before anyone ever heard of Monica. n/t  Greyhound   Nov-05-09 02:31 AM   #65 
      Yes. And I stated that. My point was that the whole Lewinsky mess just put the  calimary   Nov-06-09 02:44 AM   #79 
   I had to go NAFTA because he was all in before election.  montanto   Nov-04-09 03:47 PM   #38 
   Welfare Deform + escalating the drug war  Lilith Velkor   Nov-04-09 04:46 PM   #39 
   Was Clinton active in the "Repeal of Glass-Steagall Act"?  HughMoran   Nov-04-09 05:06 PM   #42 
   I can't consider signing a bill into law a passive act.  Toucano   Nov-04-09 09:23 PM   #43 
   Rubin and Summers advocated banking deregulation.  JackRiddler   Nov-04-09 09:47 PM   #54 
   Rwanda, failed health care reform effort that led to '94 Repub. "Revolution." nt  mb7588a   Nov-04-09 09:30 PM   #45 
   NAFTA #1, GATT and Telecom Act are tied with it in my mind though  upi402   Nov-04-09 09:32 PM   #46 
   Monica!  WillieW   Nov-04-09 09:33 PM   #47 
   "Free trade" in general  Kievan Rus   Nov-04-09 09:35 PM   #48 
   His wandering penis  Kaleva   Nov-04-09 09:40 PM   #49 
   The least of it by a light-year.  JackRiddler   Nov-04-09 09:51 PM   #55 
   The cover up is usually more problematic then the offense.  Kaleva   Nov-04-09 10:01 PM   #56 
      The "offense" in that case was no one's concern but his family's.  JackRiddler   Nov-04-09 10:57 PM   #60 
   Yep. It was just something that put the icing on the cake for a lot of people, including  calimary   Nov-06-09 02:51 AM   #81 
   Deciding not to investigate the financial crimes and covert wars of the Bush government.  JackRiddler   Nov-04-09 09:45 PM   #53 
   NAFTA was the most blatant betrayal - Clinton actually had to WORK  Midwestern Democrat   Nov-04-09 10:21 PM   #57 
   This is an interesting on-mike/off-mike assessment:  saltpoint   Nov-05-09 02:32 AM   #66 
   Media deregulation and the Telecommunications Bill  depakid   Nov-05-09 03:00 AM   #68 
   Giving the "Progressive" patina to Republican Lite me-too-ism  charlie   Nov-05-09 03:20 AM   #69 
   Rahm Emmanuel  Nikki Stone1   Nov-05-09 09:33 AM   #72 
   Iraq Sanctions  Orwellian_Ghost   Nov-05-09 09:40 AM   #73 
   Thanks for providing that  Echo In Light   Nov-05-09 11:06 AM   #77 
   China getting MFN status.  Odin2005   Nov-05-09 09:45 AM   #74 
   Other: Clinton-bashing.  Iggo   Nov-05-09 11:04 AM   #76 
 

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