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Reply #74: The new French report shows why "warning fatigue" is highly unlikely [View All]

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HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-18-07 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #72
74. The new French report shows why "warning fatigue" is highly unlikely
Edited on Wed Apr-18-07 05:10 PM by HamdenRice
The main point of the le Monde article is not that it describes a specific warning, as the American media has portrayed it. It is that the article provides an entirely new context in which to understand how those warnings flowed from a successful intelligence penetration of AQ.

Up until now, "warning fatigue" was a possible explanation because AQ was a "black box" out of which seemed to flow incomplete or contradictory intelligence. Le Monde's dossier shows that AQ was not a black box, but was virtually transparent.

The old paradigm was that "warning fatigue" might set in because our warnings were: AQ is going to strike in Germany; AQ is going to strike in Chicago; AQ is going to strike airplanes; etc.

The new paradigm is that French, Uzbek and Northern Alliance intelligence operatives have penetrated the command structure of AQ. They are following the plot as it unravels.

The report you cite is from September 2002, before even the 9/11 Commission hearings, and the revelation of the August presidential PDB. The reporter knew very little about what the Bush administration knew and in what form its intelligence was received. That very Independent news article, however, is based on intelligence from the Uzbek jihadist movement that was leaked to a not very enthusiastic Taliban foreign minister who tried to convey it to the US embassy. In 2002, that might have seemed to a reporter like a loose tidbit of information. The Le Monde report, however, shows that that same Uzbek jihadist source was thoroughly penetrated by Uzbek and French intelligence -- that the French likely knew from the fake Uzbek jihadis in bin Laden's command structure what bin Laden was planning, even before the Taliban's foreign minister knew! That information would have been provided to the US CIA station chief in Paris -- and presumably directly to Tenet in Washington -- in narrative form in the context of a years' worth of steady narrative reports about what was coming out of bin Laden's camps through Uzbek channels.

The "warning fatigue" comment comes from an unnamed state department official when the Bush administration was still in full blown stonewall mode. But by the time of the 9/11 Commission hearings, both Tenet and Clark have admitted that they did not have "warning fatigue" but that "their hair was on fire" because of intelligence reports that were converging, not diverging, in their indications.

The Le Monde report means it is crucial for us to know how specific the reports were that were coming out of the Uzbek-French connection, and whether there were other intelligence agencies that penetrated AQ as thoroughly, and how specific those reports were.

The Le Monde report convincingly indicates that it is likely that those reports were very, very concrete and specific.

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  -American Media Completely Distorting Bombshell Le Monde 9/11 Report HamdenRice  Apr-17-07 12:24 PM   #0 
  - The usual rightie talking point is that nothing French can be trusted;  Phredicles   Apr-17-07 12:29 PM   #1 
  - That section of the RW playbook reads as follows  KurtNYC   Apr-17-07 03:41 PM   #18 
  - Maybe now to get the drop on G Tenet's little book coming out  itsnot2L8   Apr-18-07 06:13 AM   #43 
  - This flsh film mas made in 2001(or 2002?) - it mentions the French alerts  The Count   Apr-17-07 12:46 PM   #2 
  - Wow, this is utterly eye-opening -  bullwinkle428   Apr-17-07 12:50 PM   #3 
  - I don't know what's stranger -- the actual info in Le Monde ...  HamdenRice   Apr-17-07 01:11 PM   #7 
  - Now THIS needs to stay out there - It belongs on the Home Page and spread far  blm   Apr-17-07 12:57 PM   #4 
  - Thanks -- feel free to spread it! nt  HamdenRice   Apr-17-07 01:22 PM   #11 
  - thanks for all that work  Mandate My Ass   Apr-17-07 01:00 PM   #5 
  - The work was done by Guillaume Dasqui  HamdenRice   Apr-17-07 04:52 PM   #19 
  - Red lights across the board and BushCabal did NOTHING. Recommended.  dicksteele   Apr-17-07 01:04 PM   #6 
  - Yes, they do think we're too lazy to go to the "French" website  NewJeffCT   Apr-17-07 01:11 PM   #8 
  - the U.S. Media/GOP Establishment continues to distort and spin for this Admin  Supersedeas   Apr-17-07 01:16 PM   #9 
  - It's also laziness  HamdenRice   Apr-17-07 05:21 PM   #20 
  - K&R  drm604   Apr-17-07 01:18 PM   #10 
  - HamdenRice, thank you for the translation.  myrna minx   Apr-17-07 01:24 PM   #12 
  - This is only a few paragraphs!  HamdenRice   Apr-17-07 01:33 PM   #13 
     - Thank you so much!  myrna minx   Apr-17-07 01:37 PM   #14 
  - K&R for importance!  Greyskye   Apr-17-07 01:56 PM   #15 
  - Here's something else that brings in the Uzbeks  starroute   Apr-17-07 02:11 PM   #16 
  - Apparently, the Uzbeks are not "our" friends anymore because of games  HamdenRice   Apr-17-07 02:54 PM   #17 
  - So why are the Bushites in such disrepute with our own global corporate predators--  Peace Patriot   Apr-17-07 06:16 PM   #21 
  - Thank you friend and here's some more on the big picture...  JackRiddler   Apr-17-07 06:39 PM   #22 
  - Thanks for mentioning this! You can now read the le Monde...  HamdenRice   Apr-18-07 06:34 AM   #46 
  - Can you find someone inside Al-Qaeda who isn't an agent? n/t  CGowen   Apr-18-07 12:27 PM   #65 
     - LOL! "Ali, all this time I thought YOU were a real jihadi!"  HamdenRice   Apr-18-07 12:54 PM   #66 
  - Kicked and recommended. Thanks HR.  pauldp   Apr-17-07 07:00 PM   #23 
  - BushCo republicons & cronies LIHOP  SpiralHawk   Apr-17-07 07:15 PM   #24 
  - LIHOP my ass  Beam Me Up   Apr-17-07 08:38 PM   #27 
     - Okay - then MIHOP  SpiralHawk   Apr-17-07 09:00 PM   #33 
  - Excellent work. Tremendous information.  tom_paine   Apr-17-07 07:23 PM   #25 
  - Kicked and rec'ed for being hugely important! This is a revelation.  StrictlyRockers   Apr-17-07 07:43 PM   #26 
  - Great work HamdenRice! I just hope this does not travel to the dungeon where it does not belong!  sce56   Apr-17-07 08:39 PM   #28 
  - C'est vrai a... And there's more.  Ghost Dog   Apr-17-07 08:43 PM   #29 
  - Thanks for the translation of that last sentence ..  HamdenRice   Apr-17-07 09:30 PM   #35 
  - Merde, inspector Clouzot lost the complete alquaida file and Dasquier found it  victorhugo   Apr-17-07 08:44 PM   #30 
  - OMG! A compliment from a French person on my translation!  HamdenRice   Apr-17-07 09:33 PM   #36 
  - Important question about French translation  HamdenRice   Apr-17-07 09:42 PM   #37 
  - Native speaker here.  Ravachol   Apr-18-07 03:51 AM   #40 
     - Welcome to DU, Ravachol.  myrna minx   Apr-18-07 08:40 AM   #54 
  - Welcome to DU, victorhugo.  myrna minx   Apr-18-07 08:35 AM   #53 
  - A true treasure trove of information  libodem   Apr-17-07 08:51 PM   #31 
  - K&R!  ftr23532   Apr-17-07 08:54 PM   #32 
  - Thank you, I look forward to 'brushing up'.  Dr_eldritch   Apr-17-07 09:08 PM   #34 
  - You are one of my favorites on the DU, HamdenRice...  Mme. Defarge   Apr-17-07 11:20 PM   #38 
  - Another crucial post. Thanks a bunch.  Usrename   Apr-17-07 11:52 PM   #39 
  - The complete translation is here  paulthompson   Apr-18-07 05:57 AM   #41 
  - By the way...  paulthompson   Apr-18-07 06:02 AM   #42 
  - The translations in the American press are bizarre--and question about Dostum  HamdenRice   Apr-18-07 06:28 AM   #45 
  - Love that tinfoil wig! Thank you so much for this impressive thread.  Judi Lynn   Apr-18-07 07:09 AM   #48 
     - The pic is not of me -- it's from the M.I.T. study ...  HamdenRice   Apr-18-07 08:29 AM   #52 
  - Doesn't that report point to the attempt at confusion being successful?  muriel_volestrangler   Apr-18-07 03:18 PM   #68 
     - I don't think the le Monde reporter saw it that way  HamdenRice   Apr-18-07 04:20 PM   #71 
        - But by July 2001, the report says "warning fatigue" was setting in  muriel_volestrangler   Apr-18-07 04:43 PM   #72 
           - The new French report shows why "warning fatigue" is highly unlikely  HamdenRice   Apr-18-07 05:07 PM   #74 
              - "Concrete and specific" - but pointing at the wrong continent  muriel_volestrangler   Apr-18-07 05:49 PM   #77 
                 - Let's agree to disagree, because I don't think you get it  HamdenRice   Apr-18-07 07:33 PM   #80 
  - Thanks for this -- the material about the bin Laden family is telling  HamdenRice   Apr-18-07 06:24 AM   #44 
  - Of course, the Bush admin had no problem with kidnapping the wives and children  MetaTrope   Apr-18-07 07:32 AM   #49 
  - Very good point!  paulthompson   Apr-18-07 05:27 PM   #76 
  - Thank you, Paul  notsodumbhillbilly   Apr-18-07 11:21 AM   #63 
  - Kick n/t  mhatrw   Apr-18-07 06:57 AM   #47 
  - Kick & a question  NewJeffCT   Apr-18-07 08:19 AM   #50 
     - French warnings  HamdenRice   Apr-18-07 08:26 AM   #51 
        - Thanks  NewJeffCT   Apr-18-07 08:58 AM   #57 
        - Other French warnings  paulthompson   Apr-18-07 05:19 PM   #75 
           - And other French warnings  aint_no_life_nowhere   Apr-18-07 06:29 PM   #79 
              - Yes  paulthompson   Apr-18-07 09:34 PM   #81 
  - Kick....and, thank you! n/t  Hope2006   Apr-18-07 08:45 AM   #55 
  - Thanks for this  Jcrowley   Apr-18-07 08:51 AM   #56 
  - "We thought it was going to be CONVENTIONAL hijackings." - Condi Rice  Stephanie   Apr-18-07 09:06 AM   #58 
  - Thanks, everyone. K&R  speedoo   Apr-18-07 09:25 AM   #59 
  - Thanks everyone! Now let's "catapult the propoganda"...  HamdenRice   Apr-18-07 10:01 AM   #60 
  - How about Olbermann?  southpaw   Apr-18-07 12:57 PM   #67 
  - What difference does it make? The French have the nerve to write in FRENCH!  EstimatedProphet   Apr-18-07 10:52 AM   #61 
  - kick again  JackRiddler   Apr-18-07 10:52 AM   #62 
  - Holy Smokes!  emmadoggy   Apr-18-07 11:57 AM   #64 
  - I have believed that it was LIHOP since '04.  Disturbed   Apr-18-07 03:32 PM   #69 
  - This is stunning  Generator   Apr-18-07 03:48 PM   #70 
  - ttt nt  Blue_Tires   Apr-18-07 04:45 PM   #73 
  - Thank you, HR  me b zola   Apr-18-07 06:09 PM   #78 

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