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Reply #67: I never said racism didn't fuel the abuse. [View All]

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intheflow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-28-09 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #57
67. I never said racism didn't fuel the abuse.
And I NEVER said Crowley's actions were excusable. I'm amazed that so many here read my OP as saying that, because I do believe he is responsible for his actions which were reprehensible no matter what motivated them.

White privilege is racism so deeply ingrained in American (Western/European) culture that white people are often completely unaware of how it informs their actions when interacting with other races. So yes, I do believe there are degrees of racism. The black cop who profiles other blacks driving down the highway is not operating from overt racism, but out of law enforcement training that was developed from a white worldview that assumes blacks with cars are suspicious. That's a big difference from the overt racism that drives idiots to don white sheets and burn crosses.

I think in order for race relations to move forward in a meaningful way in this country, we have to acknowledge both conscious and unconscious racism exists. To lump all racism together gives the unconscious white racists a free pass to not examine how white privilege works through themselves and their communities. Because they can say, "Hey, my best friend is black!" Which may be true, but does that white person still cross the street when and unknown black man walks toward them on the sidewalk, without even thinking twice about why they're crossing the street? In many cases, yes.

Unconscious racism = white privilege. That's really all my OP was about.
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  -There is no proof that Crowley intensionally lied on his report. intheflow  Jul-28-09 11:55 AM   #0 
  - Pass the buttah and salt  xultar   Jul-28-09 11:59 AM   #1 
  - Co-cola?  ronnykmarshall   Jul-28-09 12:02 PM   #4 
     - Need rum too. Don't be skimpin on the refreshments.  xultar   Jul-28-09 12:43 PM   #29 
        - Hi guys, what's go'n on...  bridgit   Jul-28-09 12:57 PM   #36 
           - Nothin just watchin this craziness...and wishin I wasn't. It's like crack.  xultar   Jul-28-09 01:02 PM   #38 
              - hahaha, you got it it's like a Russian tunnel full of ice...  bridgit   Jul-28-09 01:08 PM   #42 
                 - holee shit...yup these Gates threads (mine included) are just like that...  xultar   Jul-28-09 01:10 PM   #43 
  - Before you go all off on white people,  Tangerine LaBamba   Jul-28-09 12:01 PM   #2 
  - A "nice" lynching tree for Caucasians?  redqueen   Jul-28-09 12:02 PM   #6 
  - Some live in alternate realities  ShamelessHussy   Jul-28-09 12:14 PM   #16 
  - An interesting 'turn of phrase', isn't it...  Spazito   Jul-28-09 12:26 PM   #28 
  - Well I got it, at least.  DireStrike   Jul-28-09 01:26 PM   #56 
  - So... it's a joke?  redqueen   Jul-28-09 01:58 PM   #66 
  - Oh yeah, that was HILARIOUS.  Quantess   Jul-28-09 05:09 PM   #123 
  - That one is so far gone she's just a speck on the horizon  Number23   Jul-28-09 07:24 PM   #132 
  - It changing daily only means it was WRONG from the git go. nt  RaleighNCDUer   Jul-28-09 12:08 PM   #12 
  - All the more reason NOT to form an opinion on the details...  JuniperLea   Jul-28-09 05:05 PM   #120 
     - No heroes in this one -  Tangerine LaBamba   Jul-28-09 07:28 PM   #134 
        - LOL! To start, TLB! Just to start!  JuniperLea   Jul-29-09 03:00 PM   #156 
  - Um, where did I go off on white people?  intheflow   Jul-28-09 12:19 PM   #18 
  - "All the information isn't in" = "we haven't figured out the next lie to tell people yet".  BlooInBloo   Jul-28-09 01:17 PM   #47 
  - Yes of course, don't discuss the flat out lies we know about  endarkenment   Jul-28-09 03:15 PM   #84 
  - "there was another witness at the scene, a witness who fits Crowley's description"  lexanman   Jul-28-09 06:40 PM   #130 
  - It's in the news reports -  Tangerine LaBamba   Jul-28-09 07:26 PM   #133 
     - post the link then  lexanman   Jul-28-09 07:40 PM   #135 
        - . .  Tangerine LaBamba   Jul-28-09 07:42 PM   #136 
           - please post the link  lexanman   Jul-28-09 07:50 PM   #137 
              - . . . . ... . . .  Tangerine LaBamba   Jul-28-09 07:59 PM   #139 
                 - show us the site oh Tangerine Esq.  lexanman   Jul-28-09 08:07 PM   #141 
                 - . . . . .  Tangerine LaBamba   Jul-28-09 08:12 PM   #143 
                    - you posted close to 4 paragraphs.  lexanman   Jul-28-09 08:15 PM   #145 
                 - where is the other witness that fit Crowley's description  lexanman   Jul-28-09 08:12 PM   #142 
                    - . . . .  Tangerine LaBamba   Jul-28-09 08:13 PM   #144 
                       - Verbatim, by Tangerine La Bamba  lexanman   Jul-28-09 08:18 PM   #146 
                          - Hi lexanman!  redqueen   Jul-29-09 09:52 AM   #150 
                             - hey  lexanman   Jul-30-09 02:33 AM   #157 
  - WTF?  Raineyb   Jul-29-09 10:07 AM   #153 
  - A tree used to lynch caucasians?  Cali_Democrat   Jul-30-09 02:45 AM   #158 
  - He claims to have spoken to the person who placed the 911  dsc   Jul-28-09 12:01 PM   #3 
  - So, he accidentally lied?  redqueen   Jul-28-09 12:02 PM   #5 
  - Kind of.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 12:21 PM   #19 
  - Hillary termed it "mis-spoke" when she did it  marshall   Jul-28-09 06:28 PM   #129 
  - So he's not an asshole...he's just an idiot?  Iggo   Jul-28-09 12:03 PM   #7 
  - Yep. Either way, he needs to be fired.  BlooInBloo   Jul-28-09 12:04 PM   #9 
  - I never said either.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 12:24 PM   #24 
  - No, he is still an asshole and and an idiot, but may have memory issues.  xultar   Jul-28-09 12:45 PM   #32 
  - Self-delete.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 01:15 PM   #45 
  - Yeah. Their tax dollars bought this guy a handgun.  Ikonoklast   Jul-28-09 02:33 PM   #73 
  - lololol!  BlooInBloo   Jul-28-09 12:04 PM   #8 
  - His memory failed in less than 36 MINUTES? WOW!  Spazito   Jul-28-09 12:06 PM   #10 
  - Yes, and I'm sure he was completely over his emotional response to the situation by then.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 12:25 PM   #27 
     - Sgt. Crowley was acting in an official capacity with a great deal of power...  Spazito   Jul-28-09 01:03 PM   #39 
        - True.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 01:12 PM   #44 
           - "what fueled the abuse was white privilege" is saying...  Spazito   Jul-28-09 01:26 PM   #57 
              - I never said racism didn't fuel the abuse.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 02:08 PM   #67 
                 - Your OP header is the why, imo, "so many here read my OP as saying that..."  Spazito   Jul-28-09 02:24 PM   #70 
  - As I said in another thread, this is the real problem with profiling -  RaleighNCDUer   Jul-28-09 12:06 PM   #11 
  - Did you read Leonard Pitt's piece?  Karenina   Jul-28-09 12:12 PM   #14 
     - No, I hadn't - thanks for the link.  RaleighNCDUer   Jul-28-09 12:25 PM   #26 
        - Having so prepped you, would you kindly indulge your Tante K.  Karenina   Jul-28-09 01:16 PM   #46 
           - Sure - lay it on me. nt  RaleighNCDUer   Jul-28-09 01:20 PM   #51 
              - I'm in this club waiting to be called up to the stage  Karenina   Jul-28-09 06:08 PM   #127 
                 - Completely off topic but which sax do you play?  Raineyb   Jul-29-09 10:11 AM   #154 
                    - The double-reed kind!  Karenina   Jul-29-09 11:24 AM   #155 
  - A number of social biases could be involved. Age and education are among them.  TahitiNut   Jul-28-09 12:08 PM   #13 
  - Gates was not brought up  NoQuarter   Jul-28-09 12:17 PM   #17 
     - You're probably more familiar with Piedmont, WV, than I am.  TahitiNut   Jul-28-09 12:24 PM   #25 
  - Soooooo.....  Hepburn   Jul-28-09 12:13 PM   #15 
  - True enough, but he may have *intentionally* lied on his report.. n/t  Fumesucker   Jul-28-09 12:21 PM   #20 
  - i fold  bridgit   Jul-28-09 12:22 PM   #21 
  - ronnykmarshall and I are eating popcorn and drinkin rum and coke post # 2  xultar   Jul-28-09 12:45 PM   #30 
     - Yay! I'll be right over ~  bridgit   Jul-28-09 12:54 PM   #34 
     - Tell Ronny he is missed.  Forkboy   Jul-28-09 02:29 PM   #71 
  - Riiiiight.  HiFructosePronSyrup   Jul-28-09 12:23 PM   #22 
  - I think the fact that he left out the circumstances under which he entered the home  BuyingThyme   Jul-28-09 12:23 PM   #23 
  - Why is everybody so keen on believing the "angry black male"  Solomon   Jul-28-09 12:45 PM   #31 
  - I never said Gates was to blame or got angry.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 01:03 PM   #40 
  - Exactly. And this particular cop knows the way it works so well  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 02:48 PM   #75 
  - Be that as it may, he is GUILTY of abusing his position.  Karenina   Jul-28-09 12:50 PM   #33 
  - Maybe he's a pot smoker.  Fuzz   Jul-28-09 12:55 PM   #35 
  - ..  intheflow   Jul-28-09 01:07 PM   #41 
  - "I lost my temper. I screwed up. I'm sorry."  Iggo   Jul-28-09 12:58 PM   #37 
  - They screwed it up worse at the police station.  4lbs   Jul-28-09 01:30 PM   #59 
  - Yep. You're right.  Iggo   Jul-28-09 01:32 PM   #61 
  - This sums up the whole mess. n/t  rucky   Jul-28-09 03:05 PM   #81 
  - Being in such a position of power over an individual's freedom, he had better get it fucking right  Bobbie Jo   Jul-28-09 01:17 PM   #48 
  - It would be great if we could get that kind of accuracy rate!  intheflow   Jul-28-09 01:22 PM   #52 
  - Yes, there is proof.  merh   Jul-28-09 01:19 PM   #49 
  - He couldn't misremember a conversation with a woman he didn't talk to.  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 01:58 PM   #65 
     - Have you listened to the recording of all of the audio on this?  merh   Jul-28-09 02:15 PM   #68 
        - I haven't listened to this, not. But you bring up a great point.  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 02:30 PM   #72 
           - He was manufacturing his "public"  merh   Jul-28-09 03:04 PM   #79 
              - That actually happened at our house once  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 03:08 PM   #82 
                 - Or at least had enough coffee and a few dozen doughnuts for them.  merh   Jul-28-09 04:10 PM   #104 
                 - Look at this, you can still see the lies (or NYT's inaccurate reporting.)  merh   Jul-28-09 04:30 PM   #109 
                    - LOL. Oh, brother. n/t  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 04:35 PM   #112 
                    - Holy crap! That HAD to have been written before they released the calls!  Spazito   Jul-28-09 05:02 PM   #119 
                       - my apologies, it was published on the 26th.  merh   Jul-28-09 05:06 PM   #121 
                          - I am VERY glad you did post it!  Spazito   Jul-28-09 05:10 PM   #124 
  - The audio of the 911 call refutes most of Crowley's police report.  4lbs   Jul-28-09 01:19 PM   #50 
  - I'm not saying he didn' t file a factually incorrect report.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 01:24 PM   #55 
     - That really doesn't make it any better. Falsifying a police report is bad no matter if it was  4lbs   Jul-28-09 01:27 PM   #58 
     - Please show me where in this thread I said Crowley shouldn't be held accountable.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 01:49 PM   #63 
        - You said there was no proof that Crowley intentionally lied on the police report.  4lbs   Jul-28-09 01:57 PM   #64 
        - You've never been in a situation with other people  intheflow   Jul-28-09 02:15 PM   #69 
           - Sure, weeks later. My memory would fail... weeks or months later.  4lbs   Jul-28-09 04:46 PM   #117 
           - That happened to me too when I was a kid  lexanman   Jul-28-09 07:13 PM   #131 
        - I hear what you're saying, I just don't agree with you this time.  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 02:45 PM   #74 
           - Well, again, that's white privilege, isn't it?  intheflow   Jul-28-09 03:22 PM   #90 
              - The way I can agree with your point about white privilege  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 03:26 PM   #92 
     - Sorry, he is the trainer at the Police Academny on how to avoid  merh   Jul-28-09 01:32 PM   #62 
  - Sounds like a distinction without a difference to me  KamaAina   Jul-28-09 01:24 PM   #53 
  - false report + false arrest = lying stupidly  jpak   Jul-28-09 01:24 PM   #54 
  - He lied. It's obvious.  Iggo   Jul-28-09 01:31 PM   #60 
  - I agree with you in part, but it may have zero to do with racism!  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 02:49 PM   #76 
  - Sgt. Crowley is a trained professional and, as such, is not only expected to...  Spazito   Jul-28-09 02:56 PM   #77 
  - I'll put it this way: I don't think Professor Gates is an evil person,  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 03:00 PM   #78 
  - Ahhh, I see! You always strive to "see and hope for the best in others" but...  Spazito   Jul-28-09 03:12 PM   #83 
  - Why did you use the word 'chosen?'  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 03:21 PM   #88 
     - That's what Sergeant Jim Crow said. He found Gates' tone disturbing.  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 03:34 PM   #96 
     - The very fact you use the "yo mama" quote...  Spazito   Jul-28-09 03:46 PM   #100 
        - You are absolutely right...There was no tape of him saying that, although  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 03:59 PM   #102 
           - I see you have NOT done your homework, gosh, I'm shocked...  Spazito   Jul-28-09 04:11 PM   #105 
              - Has Gates refuted it? n/t  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 04:21 PM   #106 
                 - Yes, he has n/t  Spazito   Jul-28-09 04:30 PM   #108 
  - And those are your projections. n/t  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 03:17 PM   #87 
  - he delivered on his warning  rucky   Jul-28-09 04:31 PM   #110 
  - Your point about the dispatcher actually damns Crowley  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 03:17 PM   #86 
  - "We should always see and hope for the best in others."  intheflow   Jul-28-09 03:26 PM   #91 
     - Wow, so now Crowley is the equivalent of Bush/Cheney?!  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 03:29 PM   #93 
        - No, but assuming everyone should be given a free pass is naive.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 03:36 PM   #97 
           - Hey, I am far from naive, but the information we have been given just doesn't support the charges.  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 03:41 PM   #99 
              - Gates was working in China. And his father worked in a paper mill.  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 04:03 PM   #103 
                 - People were saying that one reason he was cranky was that he had just had a grueling flight  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 04:24 PM   #107 
                    - So, your beef with Gates is that he didn't work hard enough  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 04:33 PM   #111 
                       - Not 'hard enough,' but I think that overall, he has a charmed life, don't you?  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 04:37 PM   #113 
                          - Go run down for yourself all the stuff Gates has done.  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 04:44 PM   #116 
                             - When I went to the library and looked him up  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 04:49 PM   #118 
                                - I've done both. I've hung drywall in my family's business  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 05:07 PM   #122 
                                   - As to your last point, I posted that very factoid. Also, you used the name 'Skip.'  teachableseconds   Jul-28-09 05:18 PM   #125 
                                      - No, I don't know Skip Gates personally. Too bad, too.  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 05:23 PM   #126 
  - I think I'm going to go with Occam on this one.  rucky   Jul-28-09 03:05 PM   #80 
  - Just another isolated incident. n/t  ColbertWatcher   Jul-28-09 03:16 PM   #85 
  - That's not what I'm saying at all!  intheflow   Jul-28-09 03:30 PM   #94 
     - But, it still takes Crowley's responsibility for his own actions away from him.  ColbertWatcher   Jul-28-09 03:37 PM   #98 
        - I don't see how my OP  intheflow   Jul-28-09 03:57 PM   #101 
           - "we are each responsible for our own actions AND we are motivated ..." True.  ColbertWatcher   Jul-28-09 08:27 PM   #147 
  - I'm not sure about his intentionality, but he fabricated a conversation with Whalen  goodhue   Jul-28-09 03:21 PM   #89 
  - Thanks for the clarification.  intheflow   Jul-28-09 03:34 PM   #95 
  - Lame excuses for a bullshit arrest.  Lord Helmet   Jul-28-09 04:38 PM   #114 
  - false arrests  maglatinavi   Jul-29-09 02:28 AM   #149 
  - he knows if he talked to that woman or not. if his short term memory is so poor to remember  seabeyond   Jul-28-09 04:41 PM   #115 
  - Indeed, we all have to make our own judgement. I know I've arrived at mine. nt  bemildred   Jul-28-09 06:10 PM   #128 
  - Ms. Whalen is holding a press conference tomorrow. The scene continues. n/t  EFerrari   Jul-28-09 08:04 PM   #140 
     - Yeah, that ought to be good. nt  bemildred   Jul-29-09 09:57 AM   #151 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Jul-28-09 07:51 PM   #138 
  - fail  fascisthunter   Jul-28-09 08:29 PM   #148 
  - Police officers lie to make cases.  DefenseLawyer   Jul-29-09 10:05 AM   #152 
  - Damn,a late read, too late to recommend, and I see the pro-racism pro-pig crowd  ConsAreLiars   Jul-30-09 04:40 AM   #159 

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