| 92. I have a question ... |
|
Edited on Thu May-21-09 01:34 AM by RoyGBiv
Who do you think you're convincing?
I know I'm not going to convince you that there's more to determining the effectiveness of a medical treatment for a disease than citing those comments that seem to support your position. You know as well as I do that I could cite hundreds of peer reviewed journal articles that document the effectiveness of targeted chemotherapy for Hodgkin's disease, and I know that you'll continue to rely on these 20+ year old articles re-published with selective editing until we're both blue in the fingers. I'm not going to engage in this futile exercise. I will simply add that unlike faith-based healing and wishful thinking, the science involved in cancer treatment (in most areas of medical science actually) has advanced tremendously in 20 years.
So, who do you think you're convincing with this repetitive nonsense? Me? You're smarter than that.
P.S. If you actually want me to read all that, provide a proper citation for the journal articles in which they are published.
|
| -For those critical of the child not receiving chemo/radiation..... |
Infinite Hope |
May-20-09 09:39 PM |
#0 |
 -
Non Sequitur |
Xipe Totec |
May-20-09 09:49 PM |
#1 |
 -
+1 n/t |
Realityhack |
May-21-09 07:54 AM |
#126 |
| -
+1 n/t |
donco6 |
May-21-09 08:01 AM |
#127 |
| -
+1 |
Maru Kitteh |
May-21-09 09:51 AM |
#133 |
 -
-4 |
harun |
May-21-09 11:47 AM |
#135 |
| -
Is the flight the choice of the cancer victim or the parent? |
madeline_con |
May-20-09 09:50 PM |
#2 |
| -
It's the parent's choice. |
Stellabella |
May-20-09 09:53 PM |
#5 |
| -
Put me in the "critical of the parent" column. |
madeline_con |
May-20-09 10:01 PM |
#10 |
| -
Yep, I agree. |
Stellabella |
May-20-09 10:05 PM |
#15 |
| -
Yup. |
emilyg |
May-21-09 12:13 AM |
#78 |
| -
The fact that he is home-schooled and can't read is enough to sever parental rights. |
alarimer |
May-20-09 10:05 PM |
#14 |
| -
I agree. My husband (cancer survivor) is a teacher. |
Stellabella |
May-20-09 10:11 PM |
# |
| -
Yes, I agree wholeheartedly. |
madeline_con |
May-20-09 10:26 PM |
#37 |
| -
It seems the mother and/or father is keeping him in purposeful state of ignorance for CONTROL |
Maru Kitteh |
May-21-09 12:47 PM |
#140 |
| -
well, I wouldn't go that far . . . |
DollyM |
May-21-09 05:30 PM |
#163 |
| -
Do you honestly believe |
Control-Z |
May-21-09 08:46 PM |
#167 |
| -
Kidney failure from chemo used to treat hep c and Hodgkins are completely |
Stellabella |
May-20-09 09:51 PM |
#3 |
| -
No, it's not a matter of personal choice |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 09:51 PM |
#4 |
| -
Well said. nt. |
marybourg |
May-20-09 09:55 PM |
#6 |
| -
Maybe ESPECIALLY from their parents. |
Jackpine Radical |
May-20-09 09:58 PM |
#8 |
| -
What's your business? |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:07 PM |
#16 |
| -
Psychologist. |
Jackpine Radical |
May-21-09 06:02 PM |
#165 |
| -
Does any child's parents, under any circumstances... |
Recursion |
May-21-09 12:59 PM |
#143 |
| -
Would you require a 13 year old girl to get parental permission to get an abortion? |
Freddie Stubbs |
May-21-09 02:51 PM |
#157 |
| -
I'd love to see these self riteous assh*les answer this one. |
harun |
May-21-09 03:49 PM |
#161 |
| -
Wow. |
Robb |
May-21-09 05:35 PM |
#164 |
| -
Flame bait |
Orrex |
May-20-09 09:56 PM |
#7 |
| -
Judges and the state can't 'protect' everybody or necessarilly save a life |
Mimosa |
May-20-09 10:00 PM |
#9 |
| -
No treatment of any kind "guarantees" a cure |
Orrex |
May-20-09 10:03 PM |
#12 |
| -
Without treatment, he WILL DIE. |
alarimer |
May-20-09 10:08 PM |
#17 |
| -
Deleted message |
Name removed |
May-20-09 11:50 PM |
#74 |
| -
Chemo drugs have changed quite a bit since 1987. n/t |
Contrary1 |
May-21-09 12:24 AM |
#80 |
| -
But not the nature of "for profit" medicine . . . nor the greed of pharmaceutical companies! |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 01:15 AM |
#87 |
| -
But chemo for Hodgkins isn't a specifically American phenomenon! |
LeftishBrit |
May-21-09 04:15 AM |
#101 |
| -
my dad had hodgkins when i was a kid. he went through some form of treatment |
ejpoeta |
May-21-09 06:10 AM |
#115 |
| -
that doesn't mean that certain drugs don't work |
northernlights |
May-21-09 05:02 AM |
#109 |
| -
Synthetic drugs work but often with severe side effects and at great expense . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 10:43 PM |
#171 |
| -
if you go to that link, what poster put in quotes isn't there. Instead it says |
uppityperson |
May-21-09 01:16 AM |
#90 |
| -
"for some kinds of ca, chemo can be lifesaving, including Hodgkin's" |
uppityperson |
May-21-09 01:15 AM |
#88 |
| -
you're lumping all cancers into one disease |
northernlights |
May-21-09 04:57 AM |
#108 |
| -
Wrong |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:11 PM |
#19 |
| -
So? |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:17 PM |
#25 |
| -
There is the soft romance of a compassionate God who conducts |
saltpoint |
May-20-09 10:22 PM |
#29 |
| -
Beautifully spoken, my friend, |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:27 PM |
#39 |
| -
I was drawn to this thread because you were participating in it. |
saltpoint |
May-20-09 10:32 PM |
#44 |
| -
I love it when you show up .......... |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:37 PM |
#49 |
| -
O those paragraphs. You just underwrote the almost-certain screenplay |
saltpoint |
May-20-09 10:42 PM |
#52 |
| -
Always, saltpoint, |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:45 PM |
#55 |
| -
That is splendid. No, I had not seen it. A clock minute or so very well spent. |
saltpoint |
May-20-09 10:48 PM |
#57 |
| -
I don't mean to interrupt... |
kimmylavin |
May-21-09 02:05 AM |
#93 |
| -
Isn't that amazing? |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-21-09 08:34 AM |
#129 |
| -
That ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-21-09 06:13 PM |
#166 |
| -
"they are the ones who will hurt. " |
northernlights |
May-21-09 05:07 AM |
#110 |
| -
Even STUPID people generally understand there is no such thing as a guaranteed treatment |
Maru Kitteh |
May-21-09 02:18 PM |
#156 |
| -
He will fucking die without it. Period, end of discussion. |
alarimer |
May-20-09 10:03 PM |
#11 |
| -
I haven't read much about this on DU - |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:12 PM |
#20 |
| -
Lots of wooheads following this one |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:14 PM |
#22 |
| -
Sometimes - and this is my own damn fault - |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:21 PM |
#28 |
| -
It's not just the American system, alas |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:26 PM |
#38 |
| -
I once found myself |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:31 PM |
#42 |
| -
I was in a somewhat similar situation |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:43 PM |
#53 |
| -
This: |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:50 PM |
#58 |
| -
I wish I knew, myself |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:57 PM |
#63 |
| -
You're a baby, and you're going to have |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 11:01 PM |
#64 |
| -
It is the very "treatment" that is being questioned . . . chemo/radiation . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-20-09 11:58 PM |
#76 |
| -
This is not unproven therapy n/t |
RoyGBiv |
May-21-09 12:50 AM |
#82 |
| -
And doctors who describe it as "unproven therapy" are simply disagreeable? |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 01:16 AM |
#89 |
| -
I have a question ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-21-09 01:29 AM |
#92 |
| -
As many other adventures under capitalism . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 12:33 PM |
#136 |
| -
Quotation: |
RoyGBiv |
May-21-09 01:44 PM |
#151 |
| -
If I could |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-21-09 02:05 PM |
#154 |
| -
Let's just try to deal with . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 10:58 PM |
#172 |
| -
I can imagine few fates less desirable than seeing boogymen everywhere |
Maru Kitteh |
May-21-09 03:10 PM |
#159 |
| -
From your link on that post, says chemo can be lifesaving for Hodgkins |
uppityperson |
May-21-09 01:19 AM |
#91 |
| -
Excellent work ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-21-09 02:37 AM |
#98 |
| -
I love it when woos post links... |
SidDithers |
May-21-09 08:39 AM |
#130 |
| -
Especially when they are at the TOP of the page . . . !!! |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 12:45 PM |
#138 |
| -
You mean my FIRST link . . at the TOP of the page . . . ??? |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 12:43 PM |
#137 |
| -
Yes, the link right before the quotes. Not the one way down by sig line |
uppityperson |
May-21-09 01:35 PM |
#149 |
| -
Does it occur to you that you were intended to see that link . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 11:05 PM |
#173 |
| -
So you are posting a link showing what you say is wrong, then quotes from another link |
uppityperson |
May-22-09 01:40 AM |
#181 |
| -
No . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-22-09 01:50 PM |
#184 |
| -
and you think nothing has changed since 1988 |
northernlights |
May-21-09 03:14 PM |
#160 |
| -
I certainly hope that things have improved since 1988 . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 11:07 PM |
#174 |
| -
The child will die without treatment - |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-21-09 08:30 AM |
#128 |
| -
I'm not arguing this specific case . . . I am arguing that our medical care is not infallible . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 12:52 PM |
#141 |
| -
Not one person in this thread is saying our medical care is infallible |
Posteritatis |
May-21-09 01:42 PM |
#150 |
| -
Nor did I suggest that . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 11:12 PM |
#175 |
| -
I think your "argument" |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-21-09 02:04 PM |
#153 |
| -
It is not a "belief" . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 11:15 PM |
#176 |
| -
Oh yes ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-20-09 10:24 PM |
#33 |
| -
And we mock the "intelligent design" folks? |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:40 PM |
#50 |
| -
Deleted message |
Name removed |
May-21-09 12:09 AM |
#77 |
| -
All of that is irrelevant to this case n/t |
RoyGBiv |
May-21-09 12:49 AM |
#81 |
| -
How is information about "treatment" irrelevant . . .??? |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 01:13 AM |
#85 |
| -
Adults do have a right to refuse treatment |
LeftishBrit |
May-21-09 04:27 AM |
#103 |
| -
I'm not arguing this specific case . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 12:56 PM |
#142 |
| -
You keep blathering |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-21-09 02:08 PM |
#155 |
| -
"It's about a child being denied treatment" |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 10:28 PM |
#170 |
| -
Exactly! He is being denied treatment by the parent who has now broken the law |
uppityperson |
May-22-09 01:48 AM |
#182 |
| -
Rather, the Court is ordering the treatment . . . is that correct? |
defendandprotect |
May-22-09 01:58 PM |
#185 |
| -
None of that has anything to do with the documented results of chemo for particular cancers n/t |
eridani |
May-22-09 07:07 AM |
#183 |
| -
Indeed, you misunderstand science and the power of profit . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-20-09 11:56 PM |
#75 |
| -
I am not American, and am not defending the American healthcare system! |
LeftishBrit |
May-21-09 07:47 AM |
#124 |
| -
I don't recall accusing you of being American . . .! |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 01:10 PM |
#145 |
| -
I honestly think that you are confounding a system for delivering health care with the medicines |
LeftishBrit |
May-21-09 04:54 PM |
#162 |
| -
Our medical industry is being motivated by bottom line thinking . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 11:40 PM |
#177 |
| -
I'm sick of this ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-20-09 10:04 PM |
#13 |
| -
I am tired of the anti-science morons on this website. |
alarimer |
May-20-09 10:10 PM |
#18 |
| -
Oh, now I'm really intrigued - |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:13 PM |
#21 |
| -
Not necessarily ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-20-09 10:19 PM |
#27 |
| -
I know .......... |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:22 PM |
#31 |
| -
Agreed ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-20-09 10:18 PM |
#26 |
| -
It's that fun little everyone-is-an-expert-now mindset |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:23 PM |
#32 |
| -
We're all paid shills here ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-20-09 10:25 PM |
#36 |
| -
Man, being a paid shill sounds awesome sometimes |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:33 PM |
#46 |
| -
Wait ......... |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:53 PM |
#60 |
| -
There's another area - |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:25 PM |
#34 |
| -
Absolutely ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-20-09 10:31 PM |
#41 |
| -
I know the feeling, |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:34 PM |
#47 |
| -
That one's just terrifying on this side of the border |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:32 PM |
#43 |
| -
Ignorance is ignorance, regardless of geography, |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:43 PM |
#54 |
| -
Definitely |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:52 PM |
#59 |
| -
There is nothing more frightening |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 10:57 PM |
#62 |
| -
Both extremes are troublesome |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 11:02 PM |
#65 |
| -
As I grew up, things were black and white, |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 11:06 PM |
#67 |
| -
I'm mostly out of my initial B&W phase; I was a horrible jackass then ;) |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 11:13 PM |
#70 |
| -
Actually, "modern" medicine is anti-science in it's denial of |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 01:14 AM |
#86 |
| -
As the youth of today say in the vernacular: "...wut." |
Posteritatis |
May-21-09 02:22 AM |
#94 |
| -
Actually, no, it isn't |
LeftishBrit |
May-21-09 04:22 AM |
#102 |
| -
Of course they are . . .!!! |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 11:45 PM |
#178 |
| -
broad brush bullshit from you |
cali |
May-21-09 05:14 AM |
#112 |
| -
Like quinine, digitalis, paclitaxel, vinblastine, vincristine? The last three used in chemo btw. |
Garbo 2004 |
May-21-09 05:48 AM |
#113 |
| -
Of course they are plant based . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 11:51 PM |
#179 |
| -
You're not alone in that feeling... |
SidDithers |
May-21-09 08:43 AM |
#131 |
| -
And, of course, NATURE isn't "science" . . . !!!??? |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 01:15 PM |
#146 |
| -
That's true, they're two different journals. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
May-21-09 01:19 PM |
#148 |
| -
For anyone who doesn't understand there are different types of chemo for different things, |
uppityperson |
May-20-09 10:15 PM |
#23 |
| -
But - but - but - that would require thinking and knowing what one's discussing! |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:15 PM |
#24 |
| -
Rather like saying an aspirin is comperable to oxycodone |
uppityperson |
May-20-09 10:22 PM |
#30 |
| -
Some of these guys would probably equate aspirin with plutonium, never mind oxycodone |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:29 PM |
#40 |
| -
Uh (oh, honestly, I hate myself for this, but I am weak - |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 11:03 PM |
#66 |
| -
I'll admit it, I do typos. Regularly since I don't take time to spell check |
uppityperson |
May-21-09 01:11 AM |
#84 |
| -
To make an apt comparison, here is info for the disease that kid has, not another disease. |
uppityperson |
May-20-09 10:25 PM |
#35 |
| -
Wow! |
handmade34 |
May-20-09 10:32 PM |
#45 |
| -
It's probably overflow from some other discussions |
Posteritatis |
May-20-09 10:34 PM |
#48 |
| -
Well ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-20-09 10:41 PM |
#51 |
| -
That's too bad. I wonder if those name-callers have had personal experience |
Stellabella |
May-20-09 10:47 PM |
#56 |
| -
Blind advocacy ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-20-09 10:56 PM |
#61 |
| -
I have an autoimmune disorder, |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 11:15 PM |
#71 |
| -
I'm glad the treatment works for you! |
Stellabella |
May-21-09 07:02 AM |
#117 |
| -
No kidding ... |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 11:11 PM |
#69 |
| -
Anger? |
Tangerine LaBamba |
May-20-09 11:10 PM |
#68 |
| -
Have you seen what cancer does to the human body? Take the chemo and radiation - it |
kiranon |
May-20-09 11:16 PM |
#72 |
| -
"In many cases, more of a gamble than a proven therapy" . . . |
defendandprotect |
May-20-09 11:47 PM |
#73 |
| -
From the very first fucking line of the site in your link... |
SidDithers |
May-21-09 08:54 AM |
#132 |
| -
You mean you found the link at the TOP of the page . . . ??? |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 01:17 PM |
#147 |
| -
Just highighting your cherry-picking of quotes... |
SidDithers |
May-21-09 01:59 PM |
#152 |
| -
Sorry, I'm playing it using the odds. |
backscatter712 |
May-21-09 12:24 AM |
#79 |
| -
Here's more info on chemo/radiation as "unproven therapy" .. . |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 01:11 AM |
#83 |
| -
And some more ... |
RoyGBiv |
May-21-09 02:34 AM |
#97 |
| -
Yes . . . from MY LINK -- at the top of the page . . .!!! |
defendandprotect |
May-21-09 10:25 PM |
#169 |
| -
Those are some pretty old links. |
Stellabella |
May-21-09 07:06 AM |
#118 |
| -
He'd have a 95% 5-year survival chance with chemo. |
Occam Bandage |
May-21-09 02:26 AM |
#95 |
| -
Deleted message |
Name removed |
May-21-09 02:27 AM |
#96 |
| -
Not all chemo is the same; nor is all cancer |
LeftishBrit |
May-21-09 04:08 AM |
#99 |
| -
Hard to get much stupider than this without a lobotomy. |
Forkboy |
May-21-09 04:08 AM |
#100 |
| -
Deleted message |
Name removed |
May-21-09 04:33 AM |
#104 |
| -
For those supportive of this type of stupid religious fuck .... read this: |
TWiley |
May-21-09 04:45 AM |
#105 |
| -
how can an illiterate, home-schooled boy make that choice? |
northernlights |
May-21-09 04:49 AM |
#106 |
| -
This case is cut and dried. The parents want to kill their kid. |
WeDidIt |
May-21-09 04:50 AM |
#107 |
| -
One function of the state is to provide for the welfare of is its citizens. That includes the child. |
armyowalgreens |
May-21-09 05:12 AM |
#111 |
| -
my thinking is that it should be the kid's choice. he is old enough |
ejpoeta |
May-21-09 06:04 AM |
#114 |
| -
ridiculous. Not saying that he shouldn't be heard but |
cali |
May-21-09 06:14 AM |
#116 |
| -
i am saying this in the sense that the kid probably doesn't even know |
ejpoeta |
May-21-09 07:10 AM |
#120 |
| -
it's simple with chemo the kid stands a 90% chance of being cured |
cali |
May-21-09 07:19 AM |
#121 |
| -
i understand what you are saying. but THEY are the ones that have to go through the chemo |
ejpoeta |
May-21-09 07:27 AM |
#122 |
| -
The kid is illiterate. He can't decide because he has no knowledge of the issue. |
Stellabella |
May-21-09 07:08 AM |
#119 |
| -
when i wrote the post i didn't know how uneducated the kid was. |
ejpoeta |
May-21-09 07:41 AM |
#123 |
| -
Yes, I don't understand why they are allowed to neglect their children like that. |
Stellabella |
May-21-09 11:42 AM |
#134 |
| -
Not when his decision making |
Control-Z |
May-21-09 09:46 PM |
#168 |
| -
This cancer has a 95% cure rate if treated in time |
Peacetrain |
May-21-09 07:52 AM |
#125 |
| -
I'm reminded of people who shoot abortion clinic doctors. |
HiFructosePronSyrup |
May-21-09 12:45 PM |
#139 |
| -
I have taught several students with Hodgkins Lymphoma. |
Kajsa |
May-21-09 01:03 PM |
#144 |
| -
Well the effect of not getting the treatment is DEATH |
walldude |
May-21-09 02:56 PM |
#158 |
| -
You're missing a huge point here. |
varkam |
May-22-09 12:06 AM |
#180 |
Printer-friendly format
Email this thread to a friend
Bookmark this thread
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore