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Reply #37: As a Detroiter, born and raised, and former GM employee, here's my perspective. [View All]

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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts)  Journal Click to send private message to this author Click to view this author's profile Click to add this author to your buddy list Click to add this author to your Ignore list Tue Mar-31-09 02:35 PM
Response to Original message
37. As a Detroiter, born and raised, and former GM employee, here's my perspective.
Edited on Tue Mar-31-09 02:46 PM by TahitiNut
When Roger Smith became the CEO of GM, the die was cast: the MBA 'abitrage' types took over. The "car guys" were told to STFU and do what they were told. What's that about? Simply this. There was a decades-long struggle within GM between the Guys Who Made Money and the Guys Who Made Cars. The GWMM crowd was all about trading paper and playing money games ... and the factory rats were mere window dressing for those arbitrage games. The GWMC crowd were all about cars ... big ones and small ones and cheap ones and expensive ones. The accounting guys were there to make it POSSIBLE to make cars. From the time Roger Smith became CEO, it was all about making money. ONLY. Close a factory and make money. Close down all of Flint and make money. Lay off workers and make money. Get rid of separate car line engineering (intrapreneuring) and make money. Get rid of separate assembly plants (forcing ALL car lines into the same mold) and make money.

The engineers were 'out' and the MBAs were 'in'.

The MBAs were in bed with the bankers. They lived in the same neighborhoods and belonged to the same country clubs and graduated from the same schools (Wharton and Chicago and Harvard Business Schools). They weren't smart enough to survive in the engineering schools. They harbored the resentment for being treated like the morons they were by the engineering students. The MBA/BusAd fraternities had good test files ... and the faculty cooperated by keeping the same tests and quizzes year after year after year. It was incest. When they became the bosses, they got even. They treated the "car guys" like shit. The engineering cooperative educational programs were shut down. The outreach into high schools to sustain 'auto shops' were terminated. After all, the MBA types didn't need them.

Roger Smith ONLY hired and promoted people like HIM. Inbreeding. MBA types ONLY hire and promote MBA types. After all, everyone knows that the greatest advantage of getting a Harvard MBA is NETWORKING ... being a member of the "club." Competence isn't required to "play ball" ... not their kind of "ball."


FWIW, Thorsten Veblen warned us about this 100 years ago.


In the interest of full disclosure, I knew Ed Cole ... one of the very last "car guys" to be CEO of GM back in the late 60s. Ed Cole was an extraordinary guy. I miss him.

While Roger Smith personified the MBA mentality, his mentor and predecessor, Thomas A. Murphy, is the one who said it all aloud: 'General Motors is not in the business of making cars. It is in the business of making money."

That's why GM failed. They forgot why they were in business.
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  the real reason why GM and it's workers are screwed Soylent Brice  Mar-31-09 10:56 AM   #0 
   I do agree. However, I do NOT agree with the double standard  liberalhistorian   Mar-31-09 11:21 AM   #1 
   double standard indeed, and again  Soylent Brice   Mar-31-09 11:26 AM   #2 
   Actually, some Wall Street institutions have been badly  liberalhistorian   Mar-31-09 11:41 AM   #12 
   'splain that to me.......  FredStembottom   Mar-31-09 11:27 AM   #3 
   figures.  Soylent Brice   Mar-31-09 11:31 AM   #5 
   Pronouns. "It's" isn't a possessive any more than "Her's"  TahitiNut   Mar-31-09 11:34 AM   #6 
   Of course!  FredStembottom   Mar-31-09 11:54 AM   #19 
      right on!  Soylent Brice   Mar-31-09 11:56 AM   #21 
   There are two "its."  liberalhistorian   Mar-31-09 11:34 AM   #7 
   my grade for the day:  Soylent Brice   Mar-31-09 11:35 AM   #9 
   memory aids:  Hannah Bell   Apr-01-09 04:58 PM   #49 
   It's not a double standard.  HiFructosePronSyrup   Mar-31-09 11:50 AM   #17 
   "Outside of the toxic assets, they're profitable."  Zenlitened   Apr-01-09 04:45 PM   #48 
   Superb post, excellent point. Spot on, IMO. NT  Mike 03   Apr-01-09 06:18 PM   #55 
   "pushing gas guzzlers"  blue_onyx   Mar-31-09 11:30 AM   #4 
   that's funny, not according to this:  Soylent Brice   Mar-31-09 11:34 AM   #8 
   Check again....  blue_onyx   Mar-31-09 12:14 PM   #23 
   That's kind of circular logic. Yes, it's true that consumers  liberalhistorian   Mar-31-09 11:39 AM   #10 
      and BINGO was his name-oooooo!  Soylent Brice   Mar-31-09 11:40 AM   #11 
      Then you could say that about ANYTHING  blue_onyx   Mar-31-09 12:18 PM   #24 
      No. A lot of people just don't like small cars, and I know plenty of them.  amandabeech   Mar-31-09 12:20 PM   #25 
      Your logic is also circular, and by the same token.  Romulox   Mar-31-09 12:45 PM   #30 
      Oh - so NOOOO American could possibly think for his or herself.  Kalyke   Apr-01-09 04:33 PM   #46 
   Your arguement is ridiculous. You talk about bad management  acmavm   Mar-31-09 11:44 AM   #13 
   They're the same group of people.  HiFructosePronSyrup   Mar-31-09 11:48 AM   #16 
   Oh whatever. The beneficiaries of bailing out Detroit are millions  acmavm   Mar-31-09 11:52 AM   #18 
      Bailing out wallstreet is the same as bailing out detroit.  HiFructosePronSyrup   Mar-31-09 02:06 PM   #35 
         **snark** Okay, you're wasting my time now.  acmavm   Mar-31-09 02:28 PM   #36 
   and here we get to the meat of the issue  Soylent Brice   Mar-31-09 11:55 AM   #20 
      The person trying to fix it is treating the auto companies differently than the financial companies.  amandabeech   Mar-31-09 12:28 PM   #26 
   Bullshit- just sayin  we can do it   Mar-31-09 11:46 AM   #14 
   That's one major part of it, yes.  HiFructosePronSyrup   Mar-31-09 11:48 AM   #15 
   The difference, as I understand it, from Obama's POV is this:  smoogatz   Mar-31-09 12:01 PM   #22 
   i love this:  Soylent Brice   Mar-31-09 12:43 PM   #27 
   I disagree completely with Obama's premise.  amandabeech   Mar-31-09 12:58 PM   #32 
   In 1991, I decided to buy a pickup truck  Urban Prairie   Mar-31-09 12:43 PM   #28 
   We were lazy.  Gregorian   Mar-31-09 12:44 PM   #29 
   Lazy may be too kind. Gluttonous may be more accurate.  No.23   Mar-31-09 12:47 PM   #31 
   You should send that to Geithner and the banks. n/t  amandabeech   Mar-31-09 01:04 PM   #34 
   So goes Mendocino, so goes the world.  amandabeech   Mar-31-09 01:03 PM   #33 
      It wasn't meant to be insulting.  Gregorian   Mar-31-09 03:02 PM   #38 
         to put it simply, yes. the world is was inching towards us for  Soylent Brice   Apr-01-09 08:26 AM   #39 
   As a Detroiter, born and raised, and former GM employee, here's my perspective.  TahitiNut   Mar-31-09 02:35 PM   #37 
   i wish i could recommend a reply.  Soylent Brice   Apr-01-09 08:28 AM   #40 
   Thanks. I usually don't bother starting threads -- we have too many as it is.  TahitiNut   Apr-01-09 12:46 PM   #42 
      "we have too many as it is." True, but ...  ColbertWatcher   Apr-01-09 04:32 PM   #45 
   Kick and rec this post! Beautifully put. n/t  ColbertWatcher   Apr-01-09 04:29 PM   #43 
   Nice post..  Fumesucker   Apr-01-09 05:02 PM   #50 
   That's exactly it - it stopped being run by gearheads who loved making cars,  Rabrrrrrr   Apr-01-09 05:20 PM   #52 
      Yup. I worked at Chevy Central Office when Pete Estes and John Z. were there.  TahitiNut   Apr-01-09 05:59 PM   #53 
         And so many other companies "balanced" their acounting sheets by cutting R&D  Rabrrrrrr   Apr-01-09 06:16 PM   #54 
   That is all bullshit  NNN0LHI   Apr-01-09 08:41 AM   #41 
   AMEN!  Kalyke   Apr-01-09 04:40 PM   #47 
   Land Schooner, (Sequoia) 14 MPG City, 17 MPG Highway, YOUR millage WILL vary  DainBramaged   Apr-01-09 05:03 PM   #51 
   But no one wanted fuel efficient automobiles.  Kalyke   Apr-01-09 04:31 PM   #44 
 

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