malaise
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Mon Nov-17-08 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
| 108. If there is a state or federal law prohibiting one group of people from |
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entering into a variety of contracts then what? Isn't a place in a school or college a contract? If my child can't attend a school based on segregation laws then his/her human rights are being violated. Many contracts are enforced by state and federal laws. What if one partner of a gay couple is in hospital and the hospital refuses to let the other partner be at his/her bedside? In my world that's violating their human rights. Sorry, when laws prevent contracts they can violate human rights and not just gay rights.
I've been married for decades and I'd like to think that gay couples have the same human rights as we do. Why should there be laws preventing consenting adults from signing a marriage contract.
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| -Is entering into contracts a human right? |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:28 AM |
#0 |
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Entering into any contract you want isn't a human right |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:29 AM |
#1 |
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How are you going to survive without contacts? |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:32 AM |
#4 |
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We have contracts because they allow our society to function |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:33 AM |
#5 |
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I asked a question, you failed to answer.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:34 AM |
#7 |
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I never suggested our society doesn't need contracts |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:35 AM |
#8 |
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Once again you fail to answer. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:37 AM |
#10 |
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I don't answer because it's a strawman argument |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:39 AM |
#12 |
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How is it a strawman? |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:41 AM |
#14 |
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It's a strawman because I never said we don't need contracts to survive |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:45 AM |
#19 |
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Without a contract you cannot buy or sell anything.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:47 AM |
# |
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Again, that's because of how our society is set up |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:48 AM |
# |
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In your view, can government make any and all contracts illegal. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:54 AM |
#33 |
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Not if the contract involves an underlying right |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:57 AM |
#38 |
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In your view, then, the government can make any and all contracts illegal.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:12 AM |
#49 |
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No, and I never said that |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 09:13 AM |
#50 |
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If something is not a right, the government can make it illegal? |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:16 AM |
#53 |
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If it isn't a right and it's in the state's best interest |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 09:28 AM |
#62 |
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Your right to free speech is not absolute either.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:31 AM |
#64 |
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We live in a society that uses the Constitution as the basis for law. |
obiwan |
Nov-17-08 03:42 PM |
#103 |
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But as to lawful contracts |
treestar |
Nov-17-08 08:43 AM |
#17 |
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Yes, if a contract is lawful then it is, but he's talking about something that is not legal |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:46 AM |
#20 |
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Please show me where I mentioned polygamous marriage on this thread.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:51 AM |
#27 |
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That's what started the whole discussion |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:52 AM |
#29 |
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But this is a different discussion.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:55 AM |
#36 |
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A lot of your questions involve strawman arguments n/t |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:58 AM |
#39 |
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Agreed. Let's agree to disagree, |
obiwan |
Nov-17-08 03:44 PM |
#104 |
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that's not the point |
unpossibles |
Nov-17-08 08:43 AM |
#18 |
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Yes that's excactly right |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:47 AM |
#21 |
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I know that's not the question in the gay rights argument.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:49 AM |
#23 |
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sure. In my opinion we should have the ability to enter into a contract |
unpossibles |
Nov-17-08 09:57 AM |
#75 |
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The Declaration Of Independence is not our governing document. |
obiwan |
Nov-17-08 03:51 PM |
#107 |
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"The Declaration Of Independence is not our governing document." |
unpossibles |
Nov-17-08 04:28 PM |
#110 |
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law school basics |
ROakes1019 |
Nov-17-08 08:55 AM |
#35 |
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So the reason polygandrous marriage is not a right.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:59 AM |
#40 |
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If there is a state or federal law prohibiting one group of people from |
malaise |
Nov-17-08 04:17 PM |
#108 |
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Not until you're 18 in the United States |
Rabrrrrrr |
Nov-17-08 08:29 AM |
#2 |
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Other rights are also limited by age.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:42 AM |
#15 |
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Also, that thead was about polygamy more than same-sex marriage n/t |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:32 AM |
#3 |
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You also need to be competent to sign a |
dkf |
Nov-17-08 08:33 AM |
#6 |
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Too vague. You can't legally enter a contract to do something illegal - like kill someone. NT |
mondo joe |
Nov-17-08 08:36 AM |
#9 |
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So you think the government has the power to ban any and all citizens.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:40 AM |
#13 |
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It depends on what the contract is for |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:43 AM |
#16 |
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Again, *contracts* is too vague. Some contracts can be legally prohibited, such |
mondo joe |
Nov-17-08 08:49 AM |
#25 |
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So in your view, government can ban any and all contracts? |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:52 AM |
#30 |
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No, it can ban some contracts. And the reasons must - in the US anyway - meet |
mondo joe |
Nov-17-08 08:53 AM |
#32 |
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Not if the underlying issue involves a right |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:54 AM |
#34 |
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Well said. Well said. NT |
mondo joe |
Nov-17-08 08:55 AM |
#37 |
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Should government have the power to stop you from doing something.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:03 AM |
#42 |
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It depends on why the state feels it has an interest |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 09:07 AM |
#44 |
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So any behavior that might harm society as a whole... |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:14 AM |
#51 |
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Our government is there in part to protect society |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 09:23 AM |
#58 |
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My wife used to get volunteer workers at her place of business.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:27 AM |
#61 |
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I volunteer at a few places. Why should that be illegal? |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 09:31 AM |
#65 |
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Still waiting for that nailing jello to the wall smiley :) |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:46 AM |
#70 |
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Personally |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 09:51 AM |
#72 |
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That wasn't the case in this particular company.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 10:00 AM |
#77 |
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Yes, actually, to ensure protection of ordinary workers from corporations. |
mondo joe |
Nov-17-08 09:32 AM |
#66 |
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Should corporations then not be allowed to engage in barter? |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:48 AM |
#71 |
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Engaged with whom? |
mondo joe |
Nov-17-08 09:57 AM |
#76 |
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Stock options? |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 10:02 AM |
#78 |
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No problem there, personally. NT |
mondo joe |
Nov-17-08 10:04 AM |
#80 |
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Ah, so your ban is not absolute.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 10:05 AM |
#84 |
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Because stock options is likely to have more value than a year's supply of Rice-a-roni. |
mondo joe |
Nov-17-08 10:11 AM |
#87 |
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wrong |
Bluenorthwest |
Nov-17-08 10:04 AM |
#82 |
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Thanks, I didn't know that.. n/t |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 10:06 AM |
#85 |
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In a way it used to be ... |
meegbear |
Nov-17-08 08:38 AM |
#11 |
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I've lost money on more jobs than I really like to think about.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:56 AM |
#74 |
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According to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights: |
GodlessBiker |
Nov-17-08 08:48 AM |
#22 |
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He isnt' talking about one specific contract involving something that is a right |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:49 AM |
#24 |
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Does that imply the right to enter into contracts though? |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 08:50 AM |
#26 |
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I agree. And "property" can have a broad meaning. It doesn't say "real estate." |
GodlessBiker |
Nov-17-08 09:08 AM |
#46 |
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Exactly.. n/t |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:16 AM |
#54 |
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Yet it remains a truism that one cannot contract to perform an illegal act. Or... |
GodlessBiker |
Nov-17-08 09:25 AM |
#60 |
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I can write a contract for any job for any price I wish.... |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:28 AM |
#63 |
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It depends, I would think, if the intent were to avoid minimum wage laws. McDonald's cannot... |
GodlessBiker |
Nov-17-08 09:52 AM |
#73 |
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You must be a libertarian? |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 08:51 AM |
#28 |
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Have you taken the Political Compass Quiz? |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:01 AM |
#41 |
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I've taken it before |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 09:04 AM |
#43 |
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I think the statistical average of DUers |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:09 AM |
#47 |
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No idea. n/t |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 09:09 AM |
#48 |
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I'm sure if it weren't, someone would have dropped by to tell us by now.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:23 AM |
#59 |
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The two aren't that far away from each other |
gollygee |
Nov-17-08 09:35 AM |
#67 |
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I just took it and that is where I fell too... it might be a gimmick?? n/t |
prayin4rain |
Nov-17-08 10:25 AM |
#88 |
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My uncle has Alzheimer's which is apparent if you talk to him long |
dkf |
Nov-17-08 08:53 AM |
#31 |
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There is a right to refuse to enter into a contract also.,.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:08 AM |
#45 |
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Our society has legislated the concept into a human right in a way |
shadowknows69 |
Nov-17-08 09:16 AM |
#52 |
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That's my point.. I think.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:19 AM |
#56 |
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No- contracts are a human invention. |
BullGooseLoony |
Nov-17-08 09:17 AM |
#55 |
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God is a human invention... |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 09:21 AM |
#57 |
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There may or may not be a God without our invention of it/him/her |
shadowknows69 |
Nov-17-08 09:36 AM |
#68 |
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It's also why most theistic mythology is wrought with flawed heroes and deities |
shadowknows69 |
Nov-17-08 09:41 AM |
#69 |
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Yep, if you start at the beginning, God doesn't seem like such a great guy.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 10:04 AM |
#81 |
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I guess someone views a marriage as a business contract? |
mmonk |
Nov-17-08 10:03 AM |
#79 |
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The state does, it is a legal contract in today's society, whatever else it is too. |
shadowknows69 |
Nov-17-08 10:05 AM |
#83 |
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You get a license from the state to marry. It doesn't however, |
mmonk |
Nov-17-08 03:12 PM |
#94 |
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Yes, it does. As soon as a person gets married - religious ceremony or not - the law kicks in. |
yardwork |
Nov-17-08 03:17 PM |
#96 |
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Contracts have to be specific. Unless its a prenuptial agreement, |
mmonk |
Nov-17-08 03:20 PM |
#98 |
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Exactly. Every state has their own set of statutes related to marriage. |
yardwork |
Nov-17-08 03:24 PM |
#100 |
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Yes, a contract granted by legal right. I was just being picky over the |
mmonk |
Nov-17-08 03:36 PM |
#101 |
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Yes, a marriage contract is different from a business contract. |
yardwork |
Nov-17-08 03:40 PM |
#102 |
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Yes and the problem arises when religious leaders try |
mmonk |
Nov-17-08 03:45 PM |
#105 |
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That is the problem, in a nutshell. Some people believe that their religion should be the law. |
yardwork |
Nov-17-08 03:48 PM |
#106 |
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I guess someone doesn't get the point.. |
Fumesucker |
Nov-17-08 10:10 AM |
#86 |
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Except that you mention marriage in your opening line |
Bluenorthwest |
Nov-17-08 10:52 AM |
#90 |
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So what duties are owed by the prinicipals, what are the enforcement |
mmonk |
Nov-17-08 03:06 PM |
#93 |
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The law in each state determines the thousands of legal obligations contained within marriage. |
yardwork |
Nov-17-08 03:20 PM |
#97 |
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All people should have the same rights to enter contracts |
Bluenorthwest |
Nov-17-08 10:26 AM |
#89 |
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I don't see how it can be... |
LanternWaste |
Nov-17-08 11:08 AM |
#91 |
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Not a human right, but a right implicit to the social contract. |
Chan790 |
Nov-17-08 12:16 PM |
#92 |
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In any case, it's unconstitutional to deny a right to just one group of people. |
yardwork |
Nov-17-08 03:15 PM |
#95 |
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I approach it from the standpoint of whether it is beneficial (and romantic) |
quispismanna |
Nov-17-08 03:23 PM |
#99 |
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Then there should be no right to prevent people from entering contracts. |
rucky |
Nov-17-08 04:20 PM |
#109 |
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