406
DONATIONS
Donate to DU!
Democratic Underground Latest Threads
Latest
Greatest Threads
Greatest
Lobby
Lobby
Journals
Journals
Search
Search
Options
Options
Help
Help
Login
Login
Google

Reply #63: My take is that the article's author is about 4 days behind the curve [View All]

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
First thread | Last thread
Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU
krkaufman (1000+ posts)  Journal Click to send private message to this author Click to view this author's profile Click to add this author to your buddy list Click to add this author to your Ignore list Mon Mar-31-08 10:14 AM
Response to Original message
63. My take is that the article's author is about 4 days behind the curve
Edited on Mon Mar-31-08 10:38 AM by krkaufman
I've been posting since last Thursday AM (3/27), based on a tip from my nephew Weds night, that the Vogue cover photo is based on a WWI military recruitment propaganda poster, and started posting a side-by-side image to illustrate the point. (see here for a detailed list of the similarities)

By Friday afternoon the image had made its way to Huffington Post... via a couple other bloggers*...
HuffPost -- Uncovered: Possible Inspiration For Controversial LeBron James Vogue Cover

Now, Sportsfilter blogger Rogers Cadenhead (via Portfolio.com's Jeff Bercovici) uncovered a possible (likely) inspiration for the Annie Liebovitz shoot: a famous World War I recruitment poster from 1917.

The poster, which shows a gorilla and says "Destroy This Brute," would seem to justify any sort of outrage over the racial stereotypes perpetuated by the Vogue cover.

I don't have a clue who staged the photo to recreate the WWI poster, nor do I know what their intent may have been; but I can understand -- given historical precedents -- how many people will be outraged if/when this relationship hits the wider media, beyond the Intertubes.

But before I let Annie Liebovitz completely off the hook, I need to note that, in my surfing about on this subject, it's become apparent that Liebovitz has a penchant for such recreations; e.g. (h/t Jezebel) What I'm beginning to wonder, now, is whether Liebovitz may not have been trying to draw attention to a book by Stuart Ewen and Elizabeth Ewen, Typecasting: On the Arts and Sciences of Human Inequality (h/t forgotten) -- a book whose "newly revised, paperback edition", coincidentally, hit the stores at about the same time as the controversial Vogue issue. Things that make you go hmmmm...

Oh, the cover of the book may seem familiar:

Lastly, I must note that both Phawker (3/17) and Jezebel (3/25) had ref'd the WWI propaganda poster before I was ever aware of the Vogue controversy and before my nephew made me aware of the poster; however, both sites failed to push the connection between the poster and the cover photo, opting, instead, to simply embed a pic of the poster in each of their articles.

==========

* Unfortunately, because Cadenhead opted not to credit the source of his information in his initial posts on the subject, the Huffington Post blogger, Danny Shea, missed the mention of DU in Cadenhead's later, expanded post to the 'Watching the Watchers' website:

The comparison was brought to light by K.R. Kaufman on the online community Democratic Underground.

... who credits his nephew.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
  "King Kong" Vogue cover? What's your take? bean fidhleir  Mar-30-08 05:32 PM   #0 
   LeBron looks like the intense basketball player that he is, and Gisele  SeattleGirl   Mar-30-08 05:35 PM   #1 
   Outcries from the church of the "perpetually offended"  Mike Daniels   Mar-31-08 08:48 AM   #32 
   The guy is showing his war face and she is just kinda hanging there  Rex   Mar-30-08 05:36 PM   #2 
   Yet such orgs pay marketing/psych teams to effectively hone in on the public mind  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 08:48 AM   #33 
      I agree--this is what "framing" is all about. We talk  bbgrunt   Mar-31-08 12:52 PM   #81 
      "It is exactly that most people can discount this picture as nothing to take offense with...."  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 07:29 PM   #108 
      Not really, the media is hurting our country day in and day out by  Rex   Mar-31-08 03:00 PM   #90 
      Re: corporate marketing, a central part of dumbing down the populace involves selling...  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 07:40 PM   #111 
      It is done mostly randomly  Indenturedebtor   Apr-01-08 10:58 PM   #149 
   Much ado over nothing  panader0   Mar-30-08 05:37 PM   #3 
   when i look, i see people having fun making a cover  seabeyond   Mar-30-08 05:38 PM   #4 
   Annie Leibovitz's was inspired by this WW I poster  Crabby Appleton   Mar-30-08 05:43 PM   #5 
   She never said that - that was someone's theory. nt.  whutgives   Mar-30-08 07:17 PM   #24 
      Yes, my theory.... though I don't literally say that it was Annie Liebovitz's inspiration.  krkaufman   Mar-31-08 08:42 AM   #30 
         one problem tho...  QuestionAll   Mar-31-08 09:28 AM   #47 
            chortle! : ) n/t  krkaufman   Mar-31-08 10:21 AM   #66 
   Who came up with "King Kong?"  PSPS   Mar-30-08 05:44 PM   #6 
   you don't have to relate to king kong to imagine  bbgrunt   Mar-31-08 12:58 PM   #82 
      I think that's disgusting.  dbaker41   Apr-01-08 10:43 AM   #132 
         you only need to study a little about the "hidden  bbgrunt   Apr-01-08 05:55 PM   #145 
   Elephant in the Room  lwfern   Mar-30-08 05:45 PM   #7 
   Gee, you must be getting a different Vogue than I read.  GoneOffShore   Mar-30-08 06:04 PM   #12 
   Don't worry, LWFern. You're not losing your mind..........  TheDebbieDee   Mar-30-08 06:24 PM   #15 
   I don't see it as "racial" as much as it plays on "traditional" gender stereotypes  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 09:07 AM   #36 
   Not exactly subtle, is it? Amazing...  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 09:05 AM   #35 
   Looks fine but I can see where people scared of black men might have an issue.  Bonobo   Mar-31-08 09:36 AM   #50 
   used as an accessory?  Lance_Boyle   Mar-31-08 09:38 AM   #52 
   Commenting on the underlying messages of marketing doesn't automatically equate to "outrage"  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 10:32 AM   #70 
   I don't see the "accessorization" you speak of  Terran   Mar-31-08 10:19 AM   #64 
   So that's your ideal of femininity, Vogue readers are sophisticated, and anyone who doesn't agree...  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 10:23 AM   #67 
   Guess I wasn't clear...  Terran   Mar-31-08 10:34 AM   #71 
      Gotchya. Thanks for clarifying  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 10:41 AM   #75 
   Try imagining the two people swapped.  lwfern   Mar-31-08 10:53 AM   #76 
      I think it's subjective  Terran   Mar-31-08 01:49 PM   #88 
      Have you ever studied gender and media?  lwfern   Mar-31-08 02:44 PM   #89 
         I've never had an art history course  Terran   Mar-31-08 05:26 PM   #95 
            I included "informally" in that list  lwfern   Mar-31-08 05:42 PM   #98 
               Yes I would  Terran   Apr-01-08 10:15 AM   #131 
      he's an athelete, she's a model  northzax   Mar-31-08 05:12 PM   #94 
   Nonsense. Vouge empowers women by forcing men to recognize them as sexual beings.  I work for workers   Apr-01-08 02:50 PM   #137 
   The King Kong comparison would never have occurred to me  notsodumbhillbilly   Mar-30-08 05:47 PM   #8 
   it's not king kong, but did you see this ww1 poster/comparison from upthread...?  QuestionAll   Mar-31-08 10:37 AM   #73 
   What do you expect from a guy from Texas?  ColbertWatcher   Mar-30-08 05:55 PM   #9 
   Great shot  GoneOffShore   Mar-30-08 05:57 PM   #10 
   Manufactured outrage by some.  Blue_In_AK   Mar-30-08 05:58 PM   #11 
   Yes indeed.  GoneOffShore   Mar-30-08 06:05 PM   #13 
   Manufactured outrage, my ass!  TheDebbieDee   Mar-30-08 06:10 PM   #14 
      I don't see it this way  Blue_In_AK   Mar-30-08 06:39 PM   #17 
      For me, the photo re-inforces some blatant  TheDebbieDee   Mar-30-08 06:56 PM   #21 
      I can sort of see your point.  Blue_In_AK   Mar-30-08 07:14 PM   #23 
      "They are robbing it of that hurtful power......"  TheDebbieDee   Mar-30-08 07:27 PM   #25 
         I apologize ... my knee kind of jerked.  Blue_In_AK   Mar-30-08 07:46 PM   #27 
      They should realize when women are encouraged to prostrate themselves to male aggression  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 08:55 AM   #34 
      yes, demographics decidedly are relevant  krkaufman   Apr-01-08 09:35 PM   #146 
      Yep.  lwfern   Mar-30-08 08:31 PM   #29 
      Sixty year old white guy here and I have no idea what you're talking about.  GoneOffShore   Mar-31-08 09:20 AM   #43 
      Your subject line says a lot.  lwfern   Mar-31-08 09:56 AM   #57 
      I was pointing out how silly this whole thing is.  GoneOffShore   Mar-31-08 10:00 AM   #60 
      I'm saying you aren't in a position to judge  lwfern   Mar-31-08 10:36 AM   #72 
         Except when someone says the picture is intended to push the buttons of white men  ProudToBeBlueInRhody   Mar-31-08 07:12 PM   #105 
            I am trying to find that  Two Americas   Mar-31-08 11:31 PM   #124 
      Deleted message  Name removed   Mar-31-08 11:18 AM   #79 
         You're a little out of line here. (nt)  lwfern   Mar-31-08 12:37 PM   #80 
      I believe that you don't  Two Americas   Mar-31-08 05:59 PM   #102 
         It may be this line.....  ProudToBeBlueInRhody   Mar-31-08 07:17 PM   #106 
            We all get that it doesn't push the buttons of ALL white men.  lwfern   Mar-31-08 08:07 PM   #116 
            funny  Two Americas   Mar-31-08 09:02 PM   #121 
               No, it makes it sound like you are disappointed.......  ProudToBeBlueInRhody   Mar-31-08 09:10 PM   #122 
                  no premise, no belief...  Two Americas   Mar-31-08 11:27 PM   #123 
      Maybe, but how many older white males buy Vogue?  Zookeeper   Mar-31-08 09:26 AM   #46 
      Thankfully racial barriers have largely broken down. This imagery is a play on gender stereotypes  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 09:30 AM   #48 
      We have a lonnnnggggg way to go on gender stereotypes...  Zookeeper   Mar-31-08 09:37 AM   #51 
         Exactly! Thank you. I'm surprised that so few here understand that  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 09:41 AM   #53 
            Also interesting to note some posters responses in other current sex-related threads  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 09:45 AM   #54 
      "How could this possibly sell more magazines?"  TheDebbieDee   Mar-31-08 09:57 AM   #58 
         I don't think the cover would inspire anyone to buy the...  Zookeeper   Mar-31-08 01:40 PM   #87 
            My contention is as stated in reply #58.........  TheDebbieDee   Mar-31-08 05:27 PM   #96 
               Thank you, DebbieDee....  Zookeeper   Apr-01-08 03:43 PM   #140 
      This 41 year old white boy  BoneDaddy   Mar-31-08 11:13 AM   #78 
      Maybe it's because you're a white boy  goodgd_yall   Mar-31-08 01:08 PM   #86 
         buzz...wrong  BoneDaddy   Mar-31-08 08:40 PM   #119 
      Hear, hear  goodgd_yall   Mar-31-08 01:07 PM   #85 
      I completely agree  Two Americas   Mar-31-08 05:52 PM   #100 
   King Kong was doing just fine until they kidnapped him and sold him  alfredo   Mar-30-08 06:29 PM   #16 
   Which, of course, is what happened to Black humans as well.  bean fidhleir   Apr-01-08 01:21 PM   #133 
      You restored my faith.  alfredo   Apr-01-08 01:56 PM   #135 
         I hope in a good way, rather than faith that people are interpretive dolts :-)  bean fidhleir   Apr-01-08 04:33 PM   #143 
            In a good way  alfredo   Apr-01-08 05:40 PM   #144 
   Who cares? Not me. nt  laylah   Mar-30-08 06:40 PM   #18 
   !  Beregond2   Mar-30-08 06:42 PM   #19 
   Fake controversy to exploit the topic du jour "race," and sell magazines.  MADem   Mar-30-08 06:53 PM   #20 
   When I first saw this cover I liked it.........  Tinksrival   Mar-30-08 07:07 PM   #22 
   I sort of like it, but who really gives a shit about the cover of Vogue? nt  bemildred   Mar-30-08 07:30 PM   #26 
   Ridiculous.  ellie   Mar-30-08 08:29 PM   #28 
   She symbolically represents his trophy for fostered male aggression  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 08:46 AM   #31 
   Uh, no.  GoneOffShore   Mar-31-08 09:16 AM   #40 
      No need to be an asshole about it  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 09:20 AM   #42 
         Always happy to see a member  GoneOffShore   Mar-31-08 09:58 AM   #59 
            Reading posts online is how you get off, yet you tell me to "get out more"  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 10:02 AM   #61 
            You're being obnoxious  goodgd_yall   Mar-31-08 01:05 PM   #84 
            "As Freud said, "Sometimes a cigar is JUST a cigar.""  bean fidhleir   Apr-01-08 06:58 AM   #130 
   I just thought it was playful and sexy  eShirl   Mar-31-08 09:12 AM   #37 
   Non issue. They're mainstream icons doing what they do. NT  mondo joe   Mar-31-08 09:15 AM   #38 
   Eh. Who cares. n/t  distantearlywarning   Mar-31-08 09:16 AM   #39 
   It's kind of cute. No big deal. /nt  mwb970   Mar-31-08 09:17 AM   #41 
   Anyone who looks at that photo and sees King Kong has some issues to work out  Bucky   Mar-31-08 09:22 AM   #44 
   I don't think he looks scary at all. It's a playful shot.  alphafemale   Mar-31-08 09:23 AM   #45 
   Has anyone asked Annie Leibowitz?  GloriaSmith   Mar-31-08 09:32 AM   #49 
   A Beautiful Man and a Beautiful Woman.  Hottest Housewife   Mar-31-08 09:45 AM   #55 
   I think it's humorous.  Ordr   Mar-31-08 09:56 AM   #56 
   WHO CARES ABOUT A MAGAZINE COVER?  robcon   Mar-31-08 10:11 AM   #62 
   er... yeah. pop culture has no influence at all on ...um... pop culture.  Iris   Mar-31-08 07:24 PM   #107 
   My take is that the article's author is about 4 days behind the curve  krkaufman   Mar-31-08 10:14 AM   #63 
   No matter their intent, they "won"  SoCalDem   Mar-31-08 10:19 AM   #65 
   Revealing how so few can acknowledge "advertising/psych" techniques exist  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 10:25 AM   #69 
   Yeah, let's keep interracial shit off magazine covers  Paint It Black   Mar-31-08 10:24 AM   #68 
   King Kong? Oh Lord what utter nonsense. I am always amazed  JeanGrey   Mar-31-08 10:39 AM   #74 
   some people will find something offensive about everything  BoneDaddy   Mar-31-08 11:12 AM   #77 
   damned liberals  Two Americas   Mar-31-08 06:22 PM   #103 
      I do not mind intelligent discourse  BoneDaddy   Mar-31-08 08:43 PM   #120 
         I am confused  Two Americas   Apr-01-08 12:48 AM   #125 
            Nice try  BoneDaddy   Apr-01-08 02:48 PM   #136 
               "pervasive need to feel like a victim"  Two Americas   Apr-01-08 04:28 PM   #141 
                  I don't feel like a victim at all  BoneDaddy   Apr-02-08 07:52 AM   #151 
   Hmmm  goodgd_yall   Mar-31-08 01:03 PM   #83 
   I think Gisele needs to learn to play defense.  DuStrange   Mar-31-08 04:40 PM   #91 
   But first she needs some "sensible shoes"  Karenina   Mar-31-08 06:42 PM   #104 
   I see two attractive young, healthy, people. n/t  bluedawg12   Mar-31-08 05:06 PM   #92 
   The idea that it's ok to relate that handsome athlete  varelse   Mar-31-08 05:11 PM   #93 
   Publicity stunt.  Bornaginhooligan   Mar-31-08 05:31 PM   #97 
   Not 100% sure, but I think we may have a winner here.  nomorenomore08   Mar-31-08 05:43 PM   #99 
   I'm going with the hooligan on this one.  rucky   Mar-31-08 07:48 PM   #115 
   That is indeed the purpose  mitchum   Apr-01-08 03:15 PM   #139 
   Who cares about the cover when Apolo Ohno is on the inside?!  janetle   Mar-31-08 05:54 PM   #101 
   It's a cultural Rorschach test  ProudToBeBlueInRhody   Mar-31-08 07:29 PM   #109 
   I think this may be the best post of the thread. Short and to the point.  nomorenomore08   Mar-31-08 07:37 PM   #110 
      Within a corporate culture mired in a 24/7 barrage of marketed images/ideas, the "test" is rigged..  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 07:44 PM   #112 
         I don't disagree with that at all, and the constant barrage of imagery does cloud the mind.  nomorenomore08   Mar-31-08 07:48 PM   #114 
            Everywhere one turns there are images that promote machismo and subordinate women  Echo In Light   Mar-31-08 08:13 PM   #117 
               Here's the flaw in your thinking  ProudToBeBlueInRhody   Mar-31-08 08:40 PM   #118 
                  the flaw in your argument  Two Americas   Apr-01-08 01:03 AM   #126 
   My take is that Gisele Bundchen is REALLY cute  jmowreader   Mar-31-08 07:44 PM   #113 
   WTF ?  HuffleClaw   Apr-01-08 02:06 AM   #127 
   King Kong: adding a new layer of racism.  readmoreoften   Apr-01-08 02:41 AM   #128 
   it looks like she wants him more than he wants her  JI7   Apr-01-08 02:44 AM   #129 
   Or he's all but refusing to play his assigned part  bean fidhleir   Apr-01-08 04:31 PM   #142 
   thread douchebaggery overload limit has been breached!  DS1   Apr-01-08 01:26 PM   #134 
   Holy Shit! (OT)  Beetwasher   Apr-01-08 09:39 PM   #147 
   Of course that's what it is...it is not as if marketing culture and court hack Annie Leibowitz  mitchum   Apr-01-08 02:55 PM   #138 
   I Think We All Need To Keep Fucking Eachother Until We're All The Same Color  Beetwasher   Apr-01-08 09:42 PM   #148 
   Isn't it racist to equate a picture of a black athlete to King Kong?  Paint It Black   Apr-01-08 11:04 PM   #150 
 

Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals  |  Links  |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2009 Democratic Underground, LLC