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Reply #20: All very interesting but try reading his words, as I quoted them to you. Much simpler [View All]

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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-10-10 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #13
20. All very interesting but try reading his words, as I quoted them to you. Much simpler
Edited on Wed Feb-10-10 05:35 PM by Joe Chi Minh
and more telling. Why erect strawmen, rather than concede what is there before your eyes.

I made no claims about 19th century homeopathy or conventional medicine - which latter would have been no great shakes by our standards today, of course.

"Science, however, is not dogma. It is a practice, and the beauty of it is that anyone can do it. As such, it doesn't suffer self-appointed "high priests" gladly - the scientific method and the results that stem from it overrule personal ego and mob rule every time."

You live in fantasy world. Knowledge without understanding is an onerous liability, although fortunately, in that regard, the victims tend to be the last to realise it.

From the Guardian article linked below:

"So, the suggestion is that you could be forgiven for concluding that science is only possible because scientists are prepared to make a collective leap of faith, a commitment to the prevailing paradigm. Further, science just wouldn't be possible if scientists always and everywhere adhered to the scientific method alone, the procedures that have come to define what counts as rational. Something other than repeated observations and correct inference is required for progress."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/belief/2010/jan...
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  - The Case FOR Homeopathic Medicine: The Historical And Scientific Evidence Lorien  Feb-10-10 04:31 PM   #0 
  - Dana Ullman misquoted Mark Twain at the end of the article  derby378   Feb-10-10 04:39 PM   #1 
  - ".... which forced the old-school doctor to stir around and learn  Joe Chi Minh   Feb-10-10 04:50 PM   #6 
     - Try researching the history of standard medicine AND homeopathy in the 19th century  derby378   Feb-10-10 05:03 PM   #13 
        - All very interesting but try reading his words, as I quoted them to you. Much simpler  Joe Chi Minh   Feb-10-10 05:26 PM   #20 
           - I produced the actual quote for you  derby378   Feb-11-10 08:57 AM   #64 
  - LOL. Get that crap off of Huffinton Post  Oregone   Feb-10-10 04:39 PM   #2 
  - HuffPo does seem intent on bringing itself down with its anti-science goofiness.  HuckleB   Feb-10-10 04:44 PM   #4 
  - And so is the placebo effect... nothing to it, medical science says  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 05:19 PM   #19 
     - Placebo is the only mechanism that homeopathy could work from  Oregone   Feb-10-10 05:33 PM   #24 
        - German farmers would disagree with you... or perhaps they are  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 05:36 PM   #25 
           - Fuck delusional German farmers  Oregone   Feb-10-10 05:41 PM   #27 
              - You don't believe in quantum mechanics?? Strange that. You don't  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 05:47 PM   #30 
                 - lol. Nice reach. Its all bullshit  Oregone   Feb-10-10 06:04 PM   #34 
                    - Diluted allopathic medicines have an effect on the body and if  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 06:21 PM   #37 
                       - Many homeopathic remedies are dilluted to the point the original molecule cannot statistically exist  Oregone   Feb-10-10 06:56 PM   #41 
                          - And what makes you think that you need the original molecule?  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 07:00 PM   #42 
                             - Because, if you didn't, common tap water would be able to cure anything  Oregone   Feb-10-10 07:05 PM   #43 
                                - I believe in science and all that it doesn't understand... perhaps  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 07:10 PM   #44 
                                   - Ah, mysterious quantum workings? Well Ill start drinking the ocean just in case then  Oregone   Feb-10-10 07:12 PM   #45 
                                      - Glad you were able to understand that science doesn't have all  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 07:13 PM   #46 
                                      - Thats why I kill goats for Bhall, Yaweh, and Shiva each week  Oregone   Feb-10-10 07:18 PM   #47 
                                      - Delusional American Dairy Farmers....  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 07:25 PM   #48 
                                      - Delusional Norwegian Farmers  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 07:28 PM   #49 
                                      - Delusional Indian Farmers...  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 07:31 PM   #50 
                                         - Heh, farmers...  Oregone   Feb-10-10 07:41 PM   #52 
                                            - Results in sick animals, the ultimate placebo killing, skeptic slaying  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-10-10 07:44 PM   #53 
                                               - heh, farmers...  Oregone   Feb-10-10 08:01 PM   #54 
                                               - You sure about that wind of yours?  HuckleB   Feb-10-10 08:09 PM   #56 
                                               - From your link:  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-11-10 05:27 AM   #62 
                                               - Really? That's your response?  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 09:17 AM   #65 
                                               - You probably know as well as I do, that's HD's standard attack pattern.  trotsky   Feb-11-10 02:01 PM   #82 
                                               - He certainly conjures up one confused, bizarro world.  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 05:51 PM   #94 
                                               - In truth, his posts are usually so all over the place that I don't bother reading them.  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 08:43 PM   #101 
                                               - Your quote refers to Bach flower remedies as homeopathic  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-11-10 05:42 PM   #92 
                                               - Thank you for adding to my post.  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 05:50 PM   #93 
                                               - No problem... and if I am wrong about everything I threw up here,  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-11-10 05:58 PM   #96 
                                               - Actually, your posts are both wrong AND inconsistent.  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 05:59 PM   #97 
                                               - Thank your for your kind words... but really you should stop. n/t  HysteryDiagnosis   Feb-11-10 06:05 PM   #98 
                                               - Try responding to the actual content of the posts you "respond" to...  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 06:08 PM   #99 
                                      - Before even reading his response, I was going to say, 'Don't bank on it'!  Joe Chi Minh   Feb-11-10 04:24 PM   #89 
                                      - Actually, homeopaths tend to have a simpler label for it  derby378   Feb-10-10 08:05 PM   #55 
  - Fascinating information, Lorien. Paging Ian David! Paging Ian David!  Joe Chi Minh   Feb-10-10 04:44 PM   #3 
  - I have no personal success stories with homepathic medicine  Lorien   Feb-10-10 09:16 PM   #57 
     - I soon gave up on Saw Palmetto for my prostate problem, but am sure that  Joe Chi Minh   Feb-11-10 04:01 PM   #88 
        - It appears that you don't know what homeopathy is.  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 05:53 PM   #95 
        - Yeah, there are lots of plants with healing properties.  laconicsax   Feb-11-10 09:53 PM   #102 
        - +1  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 11:33 PM   #103 
        - Homeopathic != Herbal...nt  SidDithers   Feb-16-10 09:02 AM   #120 
  - Lorien, it seems like Germany has embraced Homeopathic remedies  fascisthunter   Feb-10-10 04:47 PM   #5 
  - Ah, Old Europe.... What would they know!  Joe Chi Minh   Feb-10-10 04:50 PM   #8 
  - Homeopathy certainly does no harm  Warpy   Feb-10-10 04:50 PM   #7 
  - Indeed, it can do great harm if care is not taken. Your post is foolish from start to finish.  Joe Chi Minh   Feb-10-10 04:52 PM   #9 
  - Exactly  NoNothing   Feb-10-10 04:53 PM   #10 
  - And Faith Healers.  HuckleB   Feb-10-10 04:58 PM   #11 
  - Then again...  HuckleB   Feb-10-10 04:58 PM   #12 
  - Modern medicine laden with chemicals does not cure anything.  kimmerspixelated   Feb-10-10 05:08 PM   #16 
  - Utter bullshit  Oregone   Feb-10-10 05:27 PM   #22 
  - Where did you get your biology degree?  SemiCharmedQuark   Feb-10-10 05:31 PM   #23 
  - You might want to reconsider that snotty post assessing lack of education.  Warpy   Feb-10-10 05:59 PM   #32 
  - That is one of the most ignorant, uninformed, ridiculous things I've ever read on DU.  trotsky   Feb-10-10 06:09 PM   #35 
  - Do you think that you can try to make a point WITHOUT personal attacks?  Lorien   Feb-11-10 11:32 AM   #74 
     - Did you miss the post that generated this? It calls scientists "sheeple" who can't be bothered to  SemiCharmedQuark   Feb-11-10 12:14 PM   #76 
     - Worse than that...  LeftishBrit   Feb-16-10 08:35 AM   #118 
        - Ah you're right. It calls patients sheeple and implies that scientists are shysters  SemiCharmedQuark   Feb-16-10 09:12 AM   #121 
     - If it's a personal attack, then alert on the post and it will be deleted.  trotsky   Feb-11-10 12:54 PM   #79 
     - Calling people who are in need of modern medicine 'sheeple' who won't try to 'educate themselves  LeftishBrit   Feb-15-10 03:57 PM   #114 
  - Your post would be funny in its complete and total foolishness  EvolveOrConvolve   Feb-10-10 06:43 PM   #39 
  - Dogpiling is kinda cheap,  Codeine   Feb-10-10 10:09 PM   #61 
  - Modern medicine is ONE OF THE MOST PRECIOUS THINGS IN THE WORLD!  LeftishBrit   Feb-15-10 03:54 PM   #113 
  - Unless you skip on real medicine when you need it thinking you have a cure  Oregone   Feb-10-10 05:27 PM   #21 
  - At this point he's like the crazy uncle who keeps going on and on  eShirl   Feb-10-10 05:04 PM   #14 
  - +1  HuckleB   Feb-10-10 05:05 PM   #15 
  - Ha, nice! :)  EvolveOrConvolve   Feb-10-10 06:47 PM   #40 
  - Excellent Post Lorien!  kimmerspixelated   Feb-10-10 05:10 PM   #17 
  - As responsible adults SHOULD do when they are confronted with such colossal ignorance.  trotsky   Feb-10-10 06:10 PM   #36 
  - Hey, I just posted it because it seemed like an interesting debate  Lorien   Feb-10-10 09:34 PM   #60 
  - For one, if you think this is "white hot seething rage," you have lived a sheltered life.  trotsky   Feb-11-10 06:36 AM   #63 
     - I'm am neither sheltered, nor promoting anything  Lorien   Feb-11-10 11:18 AM   #72 
        - You didn't post an article, you posted a piece of charlatan fiction.  trotsky   Feb-11-10 12:51 PM   #78 
  - I was lecturing to our students on the fallacies of the 'bell curve' theory last week!  LeftishBrit   Feb-15-10 04:36 PM   #115 
  - Thanks! But I'm neither a believer nor a denier  Lorien   Feb-10-10 09:21 PM   #58 
  - Every doctor I've seen here in Florida thinks that it has some merit  Confusious   Feb-15-10 12:47 PM   #111 
  - Homeopathic A&E  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 01:56 PM   #81 
     - A classic...  SidDithers   Feb-11-10 02:31 PM   #83 
  - Don't use big words like Homeopathic around FReepers.  OneTenthofOnePercent   Feb-10-10 05:10 PM   #18 
  - amazing how black and white this issue is for those against Homeopathic Medicine  fascisthunter   Feb-10-10 05:40 PM   #26 
  - Here is a clue:  Oregone   Feb-10-10 05:42 PM   #28 
  - amazing how black and white this issue is for those against Creatioinism  SemiCharmedQuark   Feb-10-10 05:43 PM   #29 
  - Penn and Teller revealed the tricks behind magic... and... well...  HuckleB   Feb-10-10 05:58 PM   #31 
  - You got me. I see four different doctors here in Florida. They mostly practice  Lorien   Feb-10-10 09:31 PM   #59 
  - "Top Doctors" lists don't mean a thing.  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 09:20 AM   #66 
  - that makes sense to me...  fascisthunter   Feb-11-10 09:51 AM   #67 
     - By what function, other than the same function that faith healing "works," would homeopathy "work?"  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 09:54 AM   #68 
     - put a lid on the condescending attitude  fascisthunter   Feb-11-10 10:05 AM   #70 
        - I'm asking a question. It's a genuine question.  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 10:09 AM   #71 
        - Good reads, as a start.  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 01:53 PM   #80 
           - thank you  fascisthunter   Feb-11-10 03:21 PM   #85 
     - FWIW; they aren't giving me bottles of water with the "essence" of something  Lorien   Feb-11-10 11:26 AM   #73 
        - I have Read many of your posts since becoming a memeber here, so I trust you  fascisthunter   Feb-11-10 12:30 PM   #77 
        - Then they're not giving you homeopathic remedies  EvolveOrConvolve   Feb-11-10 06:38 PM   #100 
  - If homeopathy works, then science -- all of it -- is wrong.  FiveGoodMen   Feb-11-10 03:00 PM   #84 
  - ok... if is all that is done, then I am a skeptic  fascisthunter   Feb-11-10 03:23 PM   #86 
     - My understanding is that the term Homeopathy has come to mean just that one narrow thing  FiveGoodMen   Feb-11-10 03:52 PM   #87 
        - ahhhh... ok  fascisthunter   Feb-11-10 04:31 PM   #90 
  - You'll see a little below your post, it's all about their fear and hatred of religious belief.  Joe Chi Minh   Feb-11-10 04:32 PM   #91 
  - Ah yes. Because if there's anyone who would know about the scientific method, it's a philosopher.  SemiCharmedQuark   Feb-13-10 05:37 AM   #109 
     - +1  HuckleB   Feb-13-10 09:49 AM   #110 
  - Why not just let con men do their thing?  Confusious   Feb-15-10 12:48 PM   #112 
  - The core concepts of homeopathy are nonsense.  laconicsax   Feb-10-10 06:04 PM   #33 
  - What horseshit.  grytpype   Feb-10-10 06:35 PM   #38 
  - Even for horses.  HuckleB   Feb-10-10 07:40 PM   #51 
  - Homeopaths Admit Expensive Concoctions Just Water  HuckleB   Feb-11-10 10:04 AM   #69 
  - Homeopathy, it's nothing more than shit and sugar...  SidDithers   Feb-11-10 12:06 PM   #75 
  - Here's an idea; if you don't like homeopathy, don't use it.  Lorien   Feb-12-10 01:45 PM   #104 
  - Thanks for the red herring.  HuckleB   Feb-12-10 02:15 PM   #105 
  - "do you run up to everyone at McDonald's and scream at them"  FiveGoodMen   Feb-12-10 05:35 PM   #107 
  - And that perfects the analogy.  trotsky   Feb-12-10 06:57 PM   #108 
  - And what happened to your claim to not have a dog in this hunt?  HuckleB   Feb-15-10 05:57 PM   #116 
  - And here's another one: if you don't like modern medicine don't use it.  LeftishBrit   Feb-16-10 08:39 AM   #119 
  - This shit's hilarious.  HiFructosePronSyrup   Feb-12-10 02:24 PM   #106 
  - Homeopathy "works" great for things that are best treated by doing nothing and waiting.  LeftyMom   Feb-15-10 09:27 PM   #117 
  - So, I had a new riding instructor  Tumbulu   Feb-16-10 11:59 PM   #122 
  - How did I miss this thread? Oh, well...too late now.  MineralMan   Feb-17-10 11:16 AM   #123 
  - MPs deliver their damning verdict: Homeopathy is useless and unethical  HuckleB   Feb-23-10 12:12 PM   #124 
     - It's a conspiracy!  laconicsax   Feb-23-10 02:17 PM   #125 
     - Ouch!  semillama   Feb-23-10 02:21 PM   #126 
 

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