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kwassa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-17-06 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #106
121. Are you calling me a hypocrite?
You don't know what my method is, so your attempt to question it is amusing, to say the least. You also misrepresent my views on Hitler's so-called Christianity.

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  -Faith Won't Heal a Divided World Freedom_from_Chains  Nov-16-06 09:27 AM   #0 
  - Harris doesn't think faith will  TallahasseeGrannie   Nov-16-06 09:35 AM   #1 
  - He provides damn solid reasons for his view.  greyl   Nov-16-06 09:44 AM   #2 
  - Every time I post one of these they become damn silent  Freedom_from_Chains   Nov-16-06 10:27 AM   #3 
  - Well, arguments against Harris aren't just lying around everywhere, so  greyl   Nov-16-06 10:49 AM   #7 
  - You're an optimist!  Freedom_from_Chains   Nov-16-06 10:51 AM   #8 
  - Why do anyone of us need to prove anything to you?  kwassa   Nov-16-06 01:37 PM   #15 
  - Exactly  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 01:41 PM   #17 
     - I'm curious what you think the difference is between spreading beliefs  greyl   Nov-16-06 03:03 PM   #22 
        - In the context of religion?  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 04:44 PM   #25 
           - No, not in religious context - including it.  greyl   Nov-17-06 09:01 AM   #62 
           - It's not a cop-out.  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 10:39 AM   #72 
              - Faults seen in Harris's argument can't be replicated for others?  greyl   Nov-17-06 01:10 PM   #83 
                 - Wait... what?  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 02:27 PM   #99 
           - "there's no need for me to justify that belief to others."  Zhade   Nov-17-06 09:43 PM   #144 
  - Explain something to me  TallahasseeGrannie   Nov-17-06 08:19 AM   #59 
     - But would you go to a crochet forum and refuse to discuss your techniques? n/t  Finder   Nov-17-06 01:58 PM   #93 
        - Ahhhhh "I see, said the blind man!"  TallahasseeGrannie   Nov-17-06 02:38 PM   #101 
           - You are always open to discussion...both sides luv ya...  Finder   Nov-17-06 02:59 PM   #104 
              - Thank you very much  TallahasseeGrannie   Nov-17-06 06:35 PM   #129 
  - The Abrahamic-centric notion that all theists believe in Hell, for one.  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 10:30 AM   #4 
  - O.K. so when you look at the major religions of the world  Freedom_from_Chains   Nov-16-06 10:45 AM   #5 
  - Your estimates appear to be off  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 01:46 PM   #19 
     - Didn't notice this earlier.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 01:28 PM   #87 
  - Buddhism and Hinduism have the "same" thing.  greyl   Nov-16-06 10:47 AM   #6 
  - Yeah, I have been really concerned lately about those Buddhist  Freedom_from_Chains   Nov-16-06 10:53 AM   #9 
  - Pol Pot was a Buddhist  kwassa   Nov-16-06 02:14 PM   #20 
     - He was raised as one...  catbert836   Nov-16-06 04:54 PM   #27 
     - Actually, he attended Catholic School as a child. n/t  Finder   Nov-16-06 05:19 PM   #29 
     - The medieval Japanese used Buddhism as an excuse for some pretty  Lydia Leftcoast   Nov-16-06 08:00 PM   #40 
     - Well said. (n/t)  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 08:07 PM   #44 
     - a central function of the samurai? Guarding crops. nt  greyl   Nov-17-06 09:43 AM   #65 
        - And that is germane to the discussion exactly how?  Lydia Leftcoast   Nov-17-06 11:49 AM   #80 
           - Locking up the food is a policy that distinguishes our culture  greyl   Nov-17-06 01:13 PM   #84 
     - How are you to know he wasn't practicing?  kwassa   Nov-16-06 08:44 PM   #46 
     - Interesting thing here, kwassa.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 03:07 PM   #106 
        - Though I would agree that he wasn't a practicing Buddhist  Dorian Gray   Nov-17-06 04:01 PM   #114 
        - This just devolves into the "No true Scotsman" fallacy.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 04:34 PM   #128 
           - Nope...  Dorian Gray   Nov-18-06 01:14 AM   #156 
        - Are you calling me a hypocrite?  kwassa   Nov-17-06 04:10 PM   #121 
           - Just wanted you to explain the apparent double standard.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 04:27 PM   #125 
  - Not at all.  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 12:13 PM   #10 
     - On the contrary.  greyl   Nov-16-06 01:25 PM   #12 
        - It's not eternal  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 01:29 PM   #13 
        - Depends on which variety of Buddhism you're talking about  Lydia Leftcoast   Nov-16-06 08:06 PM   #43 
           - Every salvationist religion has varieties, but the crucial similarity remains.  greyl   Nov-17-06 09:34 AM   #64 
              - Name the five "salvationist" religions  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 10:49 AM   #74 
                 - If Christians aren't afraid of Hell, that's no problem either, correct?  greyl   Nov-17-06 01:09 PM   #82 
                    - Strawman  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 02:24 PM   #97 
  - Since when is hell an "Abrahamic" notion?  struggle4progress   Nov-17-06 09:03 PM   #135 
     - Since about 100 BCE. (n/t)  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 09:09 PM   #136 
        - It certainly doesn't seem to be one of Abraham's notions.  struggle4progress   Nov-17-06 09:17 PM   #137 
           - That's not what "Abrahamic religion" means.  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 09:20 PM   #138 
              - Of course. Incidently, Judaism isn't united on the subject of hell.  struggle4progress   Nov-17-06 09:34 PM   #139 
                 - I believe I actually argued that somewhere in this thread.  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 09:38 PM   #141 
                    - Ah, yes. #97. Sorry. Didn't see it before  struggle4progress   Nov-17-06 09:42 PM   #143 
                       - The thread is growing at a rather rapid pace  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 09:45 PM   #145 
  - Actually I kind of like his writings  TallahasseeGrannie   Nov-16-06 12:37 PM   #11 
     - You have an internal dialogue which bears fruit, correct?  greyl   Nov-16-06 01:35 PM   #14 
     - You are way, way outta my league now,  TallahasseeGrannie   Nov-16-06 01:44 PM   #18 
     - What does being a creativity facilitator have to do with it? :)  greyl   Nov-17-06 08:46 AM   #60 
     - I'm willing to bet that TG teaches her students truths that can't be  Ron_Green   Nov-16-06 04:17 PM   #24 
     - Thank you very much  TallahasseeGrannie   Nov-16-06 04:59 PM   #28 
     - What is "maieutic teaching?"  Dorian Gray   Nov-17-06 10:09 AM   #67 
        - Quite the opposite, really.  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 10:51 AM   #75 
        - Thanks Kiahzero  Dorian Gray   Nov-17-06 04:04 PM   #116 
        - I was too, and never heard it till later.  greyl   Nov-17-06 01:22 PM   #85 
     - Yes, formal logic can prove just about anything, but it's all about the axioms  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 01:39 PM   #16 
        - I don't think so. Can you give me an example  greyl   Nov-17-06 08:51 AM   #61 
           - I was only discussing validity.  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 10:34 AM   #71 
              - Well, that's the rub. That means a better phrasing would be:  greyl   Nov-17-06 01:28 PM   #86 
                 - Fallacies generally refer to the validity of an argument, not the soundness. (n/t)  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 02:26 PM   #98 
                    - Generally? That means you admit the existence of  greyl   Nov-20-06 08:25 AM   #173 
  - Just what I was thinking!  JerseygirlCT   Nov-16-06 02:47 PM   #21 
  - Actually, Harris pretty effectively destroyed the tolerant/moderate viewpoint.  trotsky   Nov-16-06 04:08 PM   #23 
     - Hardly  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 04:48 PM   #26 
     - You misstate his position.  trotsky   Nov-16-06 06:50 PM   #30 
     - A number of reasons:  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 07:05 PM   #31 
        - So you're saying there is one, agreed-upon, 100% certain interpretation?  trotsky   Nov-16-06 07:40 PM   #34 
           - No  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 07:42 PM   #36 
              - Why do you have to misstate Harris' position?  trotsky   Nov-16-06 07:48 PM   #38 
                 - Maybe I will write him to try and figure out what the hell he means, then.  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 08:05 PM   #42 
                 - Alternative interpretations have existed as long as the texts  JerseygirlCT   Nov-16-06 08:12 PM   #45 
                    - Well sure they've been arguing.  trotsky   Nov-16-06 09:10 PM   #48 
                       - What's the difference between scholarship and  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 07:13 AM   #55 
                          - You're misunderstanding.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 07:41 AM   #57 
                          - Scholarship is academic and secular...  Finder   Nov-17-06 01:05 PM   #81 
     - I should have read yours first!  JerseygirlCT   Nov-16-06 07:17 PM   #33 
     - I disagree  JerseygirlCT   Nov-16-06 07:16 PM   #32 
        - Nope, he's not doing that.  trotsky   Nov-16-06 07:42 PM   #35 
           - He is arguing that only fundamentalists "fully embrace" scripture.  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 07:44 PM   #37 
           - Nope.  trotsky   Nov-16-06 07:49 PM   #39 
           - I don't think so  JerseygirlCT   Nov-16-06 08:03 PM   #41 
              - Sorry, not reading it the same way you are.  trotsky   Nov-16-06 09:08 PM   #47 
              - What is he saying about moderates, then?  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 09:11 PM   #49 
                 - That you're enabling the extremists.  trotsky   Nov-16-06 09:19 PM   #50 
                    - So "at face value" is the only valid way to interpret the texts?  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 09:21 PM   #51 
                    - So the Christians in 300CE *didn't* believe in a virgin birth?  trotsky   Nov-16-06 09:24 PM   #52 
                       - Your assurances are misplaced  kiahzero   Nov-16-06 10:01 PM   #53 
                          - Hold on there.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 07:38 AM   #56 
                             - I'm not Christian  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 10:24 AM   #70 
                                - Actually you backed way off.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 10:45 AM   #73 
                                   - I think you're misstating the liberal position on the Bible.  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 11:08 AM   #76 
                                      - There is no one "liberal" position on the bible.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 11:22 AM   #77 
                                         - No, I'm not saying there's only one position.  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 11:29 AM   #78 
                                         - Sure you are.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 11:37 AM   #79 
                                         - And again, entirely possible  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 01:40 PM   #91 
                                         - Sounds to me that such a god  trotsky   Nov-17-06 02:10 PM   #95 
                                         - I don't think it's God's choice -- I think it's our human limitations  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 03:32 PM   #109 
                                         - So, god doesn't know about these limitations?  trotsky   Nov-17-06 04:31 PM   #127 
                                         - If God manipulated events in the way you suggest, there  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 07:26 PM   #131 
                                         - Ah yes, the old free will conundrum.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 09:41 PM   #142 
                                         - You continue to base you view on the idea that God  JerseygirlCT   Nov-18-06 07:11 AM   #162 
                                         - An active god is not necessary to see the problem.  trotsky   Nov-18-06 10:37 AM   #166 
                                         - The short version: "All believers pick and choose what they believe...  Zhade   Nov-17-06 10:03 PM   #149 
                                         - Yup!  trotsky   Nov-18-06 10:47 AM   #169 
                                         - "They all prayed to god and got different answers?"  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 01:33 PM   #89 
                                            - And then they went and killed each other over those different answers.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 02:11 PM   #96 
                                            - You really don't think people would find plenty of other things  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 03:29 PM   #108 
                                            - Stay on topic, please.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 04:28 PM   #126 
                                            - You branched off here, I just responded.  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 07:28 PM   #132 
                                            - Right. Limitations.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 09:37 PM   #140 
                                            - It's a sneaky way of blaming God, isn't it? nt  greyl   Nov-18-06 06:40 AM   #158 
                                            - Yeah, interesting, isn't it?  trotsky   Nov-18-06 10:39 AM   #167 
                                            - The necessary flip-side of free will nt  JerseygirlCT   Nov-18-06 07:12 AM   #163 
                                            - "humanity's limitations" ! Goddammit.  greyl   Nov-18-06 06:31 AM   #157 
                    - Reasoning isn't the same thing as "secular" you know  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 07:10 AM   #54 
                    - See post #57. n/t  trotsky   Nov-17-06 07:44 AM   #58 
                    - Pardon me, may I butt in here?  cosmik debris   Nov-17-06 07:10 PM   #130 
                       - Clarify which remark?  trotsky   Nov-17-06 09:51 PM   #146 
                          - Actually, the Free Exercise clause does privilege religious exercise (n/t)  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 09:55 PM   #147 
                          - It enumerates it as a right, sure. Like the right to bear arms, or speak freely.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 10:02 PM   #148 
                             - That's a secular law, though.  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 10:04 PM   #150 
                                - Um, yes?  trotsky   Nov-17-06 10:05 PM   #151 
                                   - It was a joke.  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 10:09 PM   #152 
                                      - Okey dokey.  trotsky   Nov-17-06 10:12 PM   #153 
                          - This remark:  cosmik debris   Nov-17-06 10:37 PM   #154 
                             - Read Harris' full article.  trotsky   Nov-18-06 10:42 AM   #168 
              - But isn't the book supposedly the word of God?  WakingLife   Nov-17-06 09:13 AM   #63 
              - This is the problem...  Dorian Gray   Nov-17-06 10:24 AM   #69 
              - That's just it -- we're absolutely not  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 01:29 PM   #88 
                 - I'd love it if  greyl   Nov-17-06 01:50 PM   #92 
                 - You know, if I had exhibited even a part of the disdain for  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 03:26 PM   #107 
                 - If I've torn your view apart, fantastic.  greyl   Nov-18-06 06:51 AM   #159 
                 - But I don't want to.  Dorian Gray   Nov-17-06 04:13 PM   #123 
                    - All liberal Christians I'm aware of talk about "identifying bullshit"  greyl   Nov-18-06 06:54 AM   #160 
                 - How do you know Paul existed?  Finder   Nov-17-06 03:45 PM   #111 
                 - You don't know what we do accept and what we don't  kwassa   Nov-17-06 03:54 PM   #113 
                 - The response is to post 88. n/t  Finder   Nov-17-06 04:05 PM   #118 
                 - What do you accept? n/t  Finder   Nov-17-06 04:07 PM   #119 
                 - No, I accept that within what is written, truth can be found  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 07:33 PM   #133 
                 - Exactly, JerseygirlCT  Dorian Gray   Nov-17-06 04:09 PM   #120 
                 - But the official Catholic definition of 'inspired' goes beyond that  muriel_volestrangler   Nov-18-06 07:09 AM   #161 
                    - Well, having grown up RC, I think it's pretty safe to say  JerseygirlCT   Nov-18-06 07:15 AM   #164 
                       - Actually, the RCC discourages reading the scriptures without a guide...  Finder   Nov-18-06 10:01 AM   #165 
                          - How do you know that is what Harris meant?  kwassa   Nov-18-06 11:07 AM   #170 
                             - What do you think "Scriptural ignorance" means? n/t  Finder   Nov-18-06 02:10 PM   #171 
                                - Sorry, but I think this is your own personal interpretation of Harris  kwassa   Nov-18-06 09:03 PM   #172 
              - Especially when you take the  Dorian Gray   Nov-17-06 10:17 AM   #68 
                 - I agree. And I find the idea that using literary tools  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 01:37 PM   #90 
                    - The End of Faith was never sold as a Perfect Book, yet  greyl   Nov-17-06 02:01 PM   #94 
                    - I'm disagreeing with the argument presented.  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 02:31 PM   #100 
                       - First of all, what is the premise you are calling false?...  Finder   Nov-17-06 02:49 PM   #102 
                          - This premise:  kiahzero   Nov-17-06 02:54 PM   #103 
                          - This premise is false:  kwassa   Nov-17-06 03:02 PM   #105 
                             - Not at all...let me ask you....  Finder   Nov-17-06 03:33 PM   #110 
                                - Required by who?  kwassa   Nov-17-06 03:51 PM   #112 
                                   - Does it matter which God? n/t  Finder   Nov-17-06 04:02 PM   #115 
                                      - There is no God but God  kwassa   Nov-17-06 04:05 PM   #117 
                                         - What do you base that on?  Finder   Nov-17-06 04:12 PM   #122 
                    - You and I are on the same page in this discussion  Dorian Gray   Nov-17-06 04:17 PM   #124 
                       - Thank you!  JerseygirlCT   Nov-17-06 07:36 PM   #134 
  - That one caught be off guard, too, Grannie!  Dorian Gray   Nov-17-06 10:03 AM   #66 
  - I don't think faith itself will heal it.  Elrond Hubbard   Nov-17-06 10:47 PM   #155 
     - Love, and only Love? No, that's woefully inadequate as stated.  greyl   Nov-20-06 08:42 AM   #174 
 

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