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Reply #39: 15 yard penalty for illegal substitution :) [View All]

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cosmik debris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-06-06 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #38
39. 15 yard penalty for illegal substitution :)
In your first post you talked about "bound together around rational, practical realities then you substitute "more sensible societal goals"

The goals don't bind society together; the myth has achieved that before the goals are addressed. First society must be united, and then goals can be achieved.

The emotionally weak and intellectually challenged would not agree on social goals without an appropriate myth. For example, the social goal of helping the poor will not be achieved if the people believe the myth that the poor are lazy and stupid. But if you substitute the myth that poor people are put here by god to test your generosity, the problem gets solved. One myth unites, one myth divides. Same problem, same social goal, opposite outcomes.

And you asked what has changed. Numbers, ours not theirs. There are enough of us now that we don't absolutely need the people who are dependent on myth to motivate them to improve society. We are now a large and affluent segment of the population and when we see a situation like my example above, we address it without myth. We help the poor because we don't want to live in a society where poor people have to suffer. We do it because of our individual values rather than our shared values. At least that is my opinion.
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  -Myth has outlived its utility cosmik debris  Aug-02-06 11:07 AM   #0 
  - Has any human society ever existed without myth?  Jim__   Aug-02-06 11:13 AM   #1 
  - That's a good point  Orrex   Aug-02-06 11:18 AM   #2 
  - To further my analogy  cosmik debris   Aug-02-06 11:29 AM   #5 
     - By teaching critical thinking  Orrex   Aug-02-06 11:38 AM   #6 
        - Wouldn't that eliminate myth  cosmik debris   Aug-02-06 11:47 AM   #9 
           - I don't think so, at least not automatically  Orrex   Aug-02-06 12:07 PM   #12 
  - I'm no history expert  cosmik debris   Aug-02-06 11:20 AM   #3 
  - Do you think that creation of myth is the dividing line between humans  greyl   Aug-03-06 12:42 AM   #16 
     - It is impossible to tell  cosmik debris   Aug-03-06 06:46 AM   #19 
  - Look at your definition of myth.  igil   Aug-02-06 11:29 AM   #4 
  - I declined to define  cosmik debris   Aug-02-06 11:41 AM   #7 
  - self delete.  valerief   Aug-02-06 11:42 AM   #8 
  - You need to read 'The Power of Myth'  China_cat   Aug-02-06 11:55 AM   #10 
  - I have read that  cosmik debris   Aug-02-06 12:02 PM   #11 
     - If you'd really read Campbell  China_cat   Aug-02-06 12:31 PM   #13 
        - I beg your pardon  cosmik debris   Aug-02-06 12:39 PM   #14 
           - No, but it would help if you understood Campbell  China_cat   Aug-02-06 01:11 PM   #15 
              - Have you read past page 5? ;) nt  greyl   Aug-03-06 12:49 AM   #17 
  - Most have, yes.  greyl   Aug-03-06 12:53 AM   #18 
  - I think myth has outlived it's usefulness.  ozone_man   Aug-03-06 10:57 AM   #20 
  - Please don't get the idea that I am only talking about religion  cosmik debris   Aug-03-06 11:46 AM   #21 
     - I don't need an Earth mother myth either  ozone_man   Aug-03-06 04:24 PM   #22 
     - Ah, ok. :)  greyl   Aug-04-06 03:49 AM   #26 
        - I like that.  cosmik debris   Aug-04-06 07:40 AM   #27 
  - Maybe You're Right  Southpawkicker   Aug-03-06 05:54 PM   #23 
  - Once again you missed the point  cosmik debris   Aug-03-06 06:46 PM   #24 
     - Oh, I Understand You Perfectly Cosmik  Southpawkicker   Aug-03-06 09:07 PM   #25 
  - Not all myths are religious in nature.  Odin2005   Aug-04-06 08:02 AM   #28 
  - I agree (see post 21)  cosmik debris   Aug-04-06 08:49 AM   #29 
     - Manifest Destiny is perhaps the worst of myths.  ozone_man   Aug-04-06 01:50 PM   #30 
        - Everyone has their favorite Rockefeller horror story  cosmik debris   Aug-04-06 02:49 PM   #31 
        - Well, Christianity also supported Manifest Destiny.  Zhade   Aug-04-06 09:28 PM   #32 
           - That's right.  ozone_man   Aug-04-06 11:05 PM   #33 
  - I haven't read Campbell,  neebob   Aug-06-06 09:27 AM   #34 
  - Devil's Advocate position  cosmik debris   Aug-06-06 11:01 AM   #35 
     - I don't see how more sensible societal goals  neebob   Aug-06-06 01:54 PM   #38 
        - 15 yard penalty for illegal substitution :)  cosmik debris   Aug-06-06 03:34 PM   #39 
           - Realities, goals, needs, values -  neebob   Aug-06-06 04:28 PM   #40 
              - sorry, I didn't mean to frustrate you.  cosmik debris   Aug-06-06 04:41 PM   #41 
                 - Thank you for that nice surprise.  neebob   Aug-07-06 08:50 AM   #43 
  - Rationalism might be a myth  kwassa   Aug-06-06 12:05 PM   #36 
     - I dont know how to take that.  cosmik debris   Aug-06-06 12:59 PM   #37 
     - If They Get Food  Southpawkicker   Aug-06-06 07:48 PM   #42 
        - Or even a wrong belief, if it does a good thing?  kwassa   Aug-07-06 09:01 AM   #44 
           - The difference is  cosmik debris   Aug-07-06 09:40 AM   #45 
           - I don't think that there is any relevant connection  kwassa   Aug-07-06 09:55 AM   #46 
              - The myth of nationalism  cosmik debris   Aug-07-06 10:32 AM   #47 
                 - Huh?  Southpawkicker   Aug-07-06 05:20 PM   #50 
                 - Nationalism isn't a myth  kwassa   Aug-08-06 10:37 AM   #51 
                    - It was not my idea  cosmik debris   Aug-08-06 11:05 AM   #52 
                    - I am disagreeing with you.  kwassa   Aug-08-06 07:50 PM   #54 
                    - Yes, Nationalism is a myth.  Odin2005   Aug-08-06 07:59 PM   #55 
           - A Very Good Point  Southpawkicker   Aug-07-06 05:17 PM   #49 
     - Rationalism  Orrex   Aug-07-06 11:52 AM   #48 
        - good point, rationalism is being viciously attacked by postmodernist...  Odin2005   Aug-08-06 07:48 PM   #53 

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