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Reply #157: Yes, you do. [View All]

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darkstar3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-09-11 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #156
157. Yes, you do.
You also dodge every meaningful point offered to you and continue to spew your circular logic even in the face of it being answered six ways from Sunday. Tell us all again how fallacies aren't fallacies, or how it's actually just fine to use fallacies, or how "proof" means whatever you want it to mean, or how knowledge doesn't require any form of certainty, or how atheists are responsible for the most atrocious things in history, or how religion is valid because ancient society tells us so...

You make baby Jesus cry. (I should know, I saw him being nursed by the Tooth Fairy just last week...)

But if Poe ever reads this, he'll laugh his ruddy ass off.
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  -IS RELIGION/THEOLOGY USELESS AT BEST? Thats my opinion  May-05-11 10:58 AM   #0 
  - sigh.  Buzz Clik   May-05-11 11:01 AM   #1 
  - +1  aquart   May-05-11 11:13 AM   #2 
  - Your posts lose a lot of discussion when you just post the OP  Angry Dragon   May-05-11 11:15 AM   #3 
  - (great minds? LOL!)  JustFiveMoreMinutes   May-05-11 11:16 AM   #5 
  - Yes, there are many great minds on DU  Angry Dragon   May-05-11 11:24 AM   #7 
     - I have had the privilege of engaging him personally on several occasions  Starboard Tack   May-05-11 04:18 PM   #24 
        - If you have the chance to talk to him again  Angry Dragon   May-05-11 05:01 PM   #28 
        - You may be arguing with  skepticscott   May-05-11 06:00 PM   #32 
        - I agree with you  Starboard Tack   May-05-11 06:31 PM   #33 
        - Alright, who had #33 in this month's Scotsman's pool?  EvolveOrConvolve   May-07-11 08:17 PM   #102 
        - Responses?  Thats my opinion   May-05-11 07:53 PM   #42 
           - No one forced you to start three threads.  laconicsax   May-05-11 09:20 PM   #57 
        - What exactly about "do unto others, help those in need, humility etc."...  trotsky   May-06-11 06:12 AM   #63 
           - I did not suggest that these virtues were exclusive to Christianity  Starboard Tack   May-06-11 11:18 AM   #68 
              - You most certainly did suggest that.  trotsky   May-06-11 11:24 AM   #69 
              - I didn't suggest they were exclusive to Christianity.  Starboard Tack   May-06-11 11:36 AM   #70 
                 - Your exact quote:  trotsky   May-06-11 12:31 PM   #71 
                    - These are principles that I learnt as a child  Starboard Tack   May-06-11 01:16 PM   #72 
              - "not important who invented the wheel"  Ninjaneer   May-08-11 07:49 AM   #117 
  - +1  Adsos Letter   May-05-11 04:20 PM   #25 
  - Right!  Thats my opinion   May-05-11 07:47 PM   #41 
     - Science is ideology now?  darkstar3   May-05-11 08:00 PM   #45 
     - All too familiar  skepticscott   May-05-11 08:45 PM   #56 
     - Science is not 'an ideologically based notion'...  LeftishBrit   Jul-04-11 11:01 AM   #189 
  - You poisoned the well.. hope nobody drinks the water!  JustFiveMoreMinutes   May-05-11 11:15 AM   #4 
  - say more  Thats my opinion   May-05-11 07:55 PM   #43 
  - Useless for what?  damntexdem   May-05-11 11:19 AM   #6 
  - legalize lonnie anderson's hair  H2O Man   May-05-11 11:39 AM   #8 
  - I can only speak from personal experience.  dgibby   May-05-11 11:42 AM   #9 
  - dogma  Thats my opinion   May-05-11 07:58 PM   #44 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   May-05-11 12:17 PM   #10 
  - First you take discrediting religion based on the evils caused by its followers off the table  Ninjaneer   May-05-11 12:29 PM   #11 
  - right Off the table  Thats my opinion   May-05-11 08:01 PM   #46 
     - False equivalence so blatant  skepticscott   May-05-11 08:28 PM   #54 
     - I didn't think I had to spell it out.  Ninjaneer   May-06-11 02:50 AM   #62 
     - Thanks for coming back and addressing the issue. eom  Ninjaneer   May-08-11 05:42 PM   #120 
  - So what good has THEOLOGY brought to the table.  Goblinmonger   May-05-11 12:49 PM   #12 
  - Maybe if you're nice enough,  trotsky   May-05-11 03:03 PM   #21 
  - theology  Thats my opinion   May-05-11 08:04 PM   #48 
     - Theology is just the study of  Angry Dragon   May-05-11 08:12 PM   #50 
     - Can you honestly tell me that without theology  Goblinmonger   May-06-11 08:33 AM   #64 
     - You don't see how  skepticscott   May-06-11 04:55 PM   #89 
  - Please address the central issue  edhopper   May-05-11 12:57 PM   #13 
  - I'm not sure how useful religion would be if god did exist.  Deep13   May-05-11 12:59 PM   #15 
  - LOL  edhopper   May-05-11 01:23 PM   #16 
  - You certainly spend a lot of time discussing something that is  humblebum   May-05-11 02:21 PM   #19 
     - We are trying to light one candle  edhopper   May-05-11 06:42 PM   #35 
     - Do you realize that there are only 2 possibilities. Either  humblebum   May-05-11 07:08 PM   #37 
        - LOL! n/t  laconicsax   May-05-11 07:14 PM   #38 
        - LOL! nt  humblebum   May-05-11 07:21 PM   #39 
        - I know there  edhopper   May-06-11 08:41 AM   #65 
        - What Objective proof do you have that "proves" no supernatural  humblebum   May-06-11 02:33 PM   #73 
           - The fact that every claim of allegedly supernatural phenomena affecting the natural world  darkstar3   May-06-11 02:50 PM   #74 
              - You are not even using good logic. You can that you don't believe in any of these things certainly.  humblebum   May-06-11 03:24 PM   #79 
                 - Show me one, just one, supernatural claim that has been supported.  darkstar3   May-06-11 03:26 PM   #81 
                    - Supported empirically, as you have established as the rules of the game or  humblebum   May-06-11 03:45 PM   #83 
                       - Weasel words.  darkstar3   May-06-11 04:20 PM   #85 
                       - You're kinda hung up on that weasel words thing aren't you?  humblebum   May-06-11 07:30 PM   #92 
                          - Speaking of dodging, you've dodged every question I asked.  darkstar3   May-06-11 10:10 PM   #93 
                          - Hahahaha! The only dodge was by YOU, just now!  cleanhippie   May-07-11 04:11 PM   #100 
                          - So can you prove anything you're saying?  darkstar3   May-07-11 08:19 PM   #104 
                             - Yep. But God cannot be proven empirically, nor disproven. We have already covered that.  humblebum   May-07-11 08:56 PM   #108 
                                - You're using the argument from design,  darkstar3   May-07-11 09:19 PM   #110 
                                   - the only way that you can possibly give any credence to your argument  humblebum   May-08-11 03:49 AM   #113 
                                      - Who's ignoring whom, here?  darkstar3   May-08-11 03:57 AM   #114 
                                         - You are still doing it. nt  humblebum   May-08-11 04:02 AM   #115 
                                            - Aren't you out of piss yet?  darkstar3   May-08-11 04:06 AM   #116 
                       - Witnesses?  LAGC   May-07-11 10:10 AM   #96 
                       - I can't believe you're still peddling that "other ways of knowing" stuff  Ninjaneer   May-08-11 07:54 AM   #118 
                          - Oh, it's been going on for years.  laconicsax   May-08-11 02:22 PM   #119 
                          - Hardly. Those "other ways of knowing" are now more regularly used  humblebum   May-09-11 06:49 AM   #122 
                             - "now more regularly used by more disciplines than your logical empiricism"  Ninjaneer   May-09-11 08:27 AM   #123 
                             - Well, you don't really have to dig too deep to find examples.  humblebum   May-09-11 01:01 PM   #126 
                                - I want examples of disciplines,  Ninjaneer   May-09-11 01:21 PM   #127 
                                   - Well just pick one from the sciences, to business, to art - you name it.  humblebum   May-09-11 01:30 PM   #128 
                                      - Engineering then.  Ninjaneer   May-09-11 01:38 PM   #129 
                                         - Of course engineering. But let me ask you first if you even know  humblebum   May-09-11 02:43 PM   #131 
                                            - Thanks for the condescension,  Ninjaneer   May-09-11 03:08 PM   #133 
                                            - That's what I thought. But I wasn't trying to be condescending.  humblebum   May-09-11 04:15 PM   #134 
                                            - You say sometimes they don't utilize empirical data or objective proof.  Ninjaneer   May-09-11 04:57 PM   #135 
                                            - My "end game" as you call it is simply to show that religious  humblebum   May-09-11 07:30 PM   #137 
                                            - I nominate this post for "comedic bullshit offering of the year."  darkstar3   May-09-11 07:50 PM   #138 
                                            - I can only classify your rant as pure ignorance. Where you get  humblebum   May-09-11 08:22 PM   #140 
                                            - Go ahead.  darkstar3   May-09-11 08:26 PM   #141 
                                            - Um? Penn Jillette. "There is no god."  humblebum   May-09-11 08:39 PM   #143 
                                            - Nice try, but where's their statement of "actual proof"?  darkstar3   May-09-11 08:47 PM   #144 
                                            - He says " you can't prove a negative" so by definition  humblebum   May-09-11 09:01 PM   #146 
                                            - So you have no quotes from anyone claiming "actual proof of non-existence of a deity"?  darkstar3   May-09-11 09:04 PM   #147 
                                            - I just did as far as I'm concerned. Aman of his intelligence  humblebum   May-09-11 09:42 PM   #149 
                                            - As far as you're concerned doesn't impress me one whit.  darkstar3   May-09-11 09:47 PM   #150 
                                            - Deleted message  Name removed   May-09-11 09:52 PM   #151 
                                            - Says the man who argues that fallacies aren't fallacies by using fallacies.  darkstar3   May-09-11 11:11 PM   #155 
                                            - Says the man who makes false claims.  humblebum   May-09-11 11:17 PM   #156 
                                            - Yes, you do.  darkstar3   May-09-11 11:25 PM   #157 
                                            - And all this brought to you by the man who makes false claims. nt  humblebum   May-09-11 11:57 PM   #158 
                                            - Um?  humblebum   May-10-11 03:51 AM   #162 
                                            - Ooooh, compelling. Where's Penn's quote?  darkstar3   May-10-11 09:22 AM   #166 
                                            - You are definitely the one moving the goal posts. you made the challenge,  humblebum   May-10-11 11:59 AM   #169 
                                            - I asked you for a quote.  darkstar3   May-10-11 12:11 PM   #172 
                                            - My reply is an answer to your assertion:  humblebum   May-10-11 01:31 PM   #178 
                                            - If you say so, sparky.  darkstar3   May-10-11 01:42 PM   #179 
                                            - And we're back to square one.  Ninjaneer   May-09-11 08:18 PM   #139 
                                            - First of all you need to understand that I am not claiming objective proof,  humblebum   May-09-11 08:35 PM   #142 
                                            - There is nothing for me to accept.  Ninjaneer   May-09-11 08:52 PM   #145 
                                            - The tooth fairy doen't have such a lengthy written history and  humblebum   May-09-11 09:39 PM   #148 
                                            - Ho hum, more fallacies.  laconicsax   May-09-11 09:57 PM   #152 
                                            - Since you are on friendly terms with the tooth fairy,  Ninjaneer   May-09-11 10:33 PM   #153 
                                            - I suppose...  laconicsax   May-10-11 12:13 AM   #159 
                                            - It was, of course, a lie what you read about  Ninjaneer   May-10-11 09:01 AM   #165 
                                            - It's only a fallacy if I predicate my argument on age or numbers,  humblebum   May-09-11 10:57 PM   #154 
                                            - OYG! Are you seriously trying to argue that an ad numerum fallacy isn't really a fallacy?  laconicsax   May-10-11 12:27 AM   #160 
                                            - By your reasoning then the testimonies of ten people who witness  humblebum   May-10-11 03:44 AM   #161 
                                            - Your commitment to BS is awe inspiring, sir.  Ninjaneer   May-10-11 07:22 AM   #164 
                                            - Now you know that's not "by [his] reasoning".  darkstar3   May-10-11 09:27 AM   #167 
                                            - The fallacy charge in this case, of course, is by design, a straw man.  humblebum   May-10-11 11:44 AM   #168 
                                            - Pointing out that someone is using a fallacy is not a straw man.  darkstar3   May-10-11 12:02 PM   #170 
                                            - Except when it is not an actual fallacy, which I claim here. nt  humblebum   May-10-11 12:10 PM   #171 
                                            - Your claim is worthless, as you have been clearly shown. You invoked a fallacy. Get over it.  darkstar3   May-10-11 12:12 PM   #173 
                                            - No matter how many people believe something, that doesn't necessarily make it true or right.  laconicsax   May-10-11 01:08 PM   #176 
                                            - If I had made the claim it provided "proof", then you would be correct.  humblebum   May-10-11 06:27 PM   #180 
                                            - You used numbers (and tradition) to support the claim that your god exists. Both are fallacies.  laconicsax   May-11-11 01:08 AM   #181 
                             - I see you're now moving the goalposts  skepticscott   May-09-11 10:15 AM   #124 
                                - Nope. Been using it for a long time. It's only the "strong" atheists  humblebum   May-09-11 12:47 PM   #125 
                                   - If you go back and look at your other threads  Ninjaneer   May-09-11 01:58 PM   #130 
                                      - Um? post #122? nt  humblebum   May-09-11 02:45 PM   #132 
                                         - You mean the post where you moved the goalposts?  darkstar3   May-09-11 06:55 PM   #136 
                                         - And wow, it had really been a "long time"  skepticscott   May-10-11 05:24 AM   #163 
                                            - The statement is valid with or without the word "probably".  humblebum   May-10-11 12:23 PM   #174 
                                               - There is only one thing here having its simplicity clearly demonstrated time and again.  darkstar3   May-10-11 12:26 PM   #175 
                                               - Definitely a non-answer. Another demonstration of simplicity and a straw man. nt  humblebum   May-10-11 01:24 PM   #177 
        - Exactly! And until there IS some proof, the logical conclusion is that it does NOT exist.  cleanhippie   May-06-11 09:29 AM   #66 
        - You really do not even know what you are talking about.  humblebum   May-06-11 02:51 PM   #75 
           - Why not use the recognized names for those "enquiries" bum?  darkstar3   May-06-11 02:58 PM   #76 
           - Those are the recognized names and are different epistemologies.  humblebum   May-06-11 03:11 PM   #77 
              - You seem to know very little of  edhopper   May-06-11 03:22 PM   #78 
              - Actually I have never said "God exists because I know he does".  humblebum   May-06-11 03:37 PM   #82 
                 - Disciplines  edhopper   May-06-11 04:30 PM   #87 
                 - In my best Walter Matthau voice I say  darkstar3   May-06-11 04:38 PM   #88 
                 - "you are merely confirming my points. " - i guess so, since "where you see contradiction..."  cleanhippie   May-07-11 04:08 PM   #98 
              - Read the links. Your arguments are not "enquiries", and they have sucked for centuries.  darkstar3   May-06-11 03:24 PM   #80 
                 - "they have sucked for centuries." Now that's intelligent debate.  humblebum   May-06-11 03:51 PM   #84 
                    - And they are mocked when used today, rightfully so.  darkstar3   May-06-11 04:20 PM   #86 
                       - No actually they do not. Questions of being and purpose are asked often.  humblebum   May-06-11 07:28 PM   #91 
                          - This is my final word in this subthread.  darkstar3   May-06-11 10:15 PM   #94 
                             - Your epistemology is very limited as is proven by its definition.  humblebum   May-07-11 10:00 AM   #95 
                                - Broken record.  cleanhippie   May-07-11 04:09 PM   #99 
                                   - Anytime someone challenges the "wisdom" of atheism, you  humblebum   May-07-11 06:26 PM   #101 
                                      - Not someone, just you.  darkstar3   May-07-11 08:18 PM   #103 
                                      - Well I'm at least glad to see that you admit you  humblebum   May-07-11 08:50 PM   #106 
                                         - Can you read? Do you know what that little tag in the upper-left of every post is,  darkstar3   May-07-11 08:53 PM   #107 
                                         - Yep. And my answer is still the same. nt  humblebum   May-07-11 08:59 PM   #109 
                                         - Oh, I see, "we all look the same to you."  darkstar3   May-07-11 09:20 PM   #111 
                                      - No, one-track, only you.  cleanhippie   May-08-11 01:48 AM   #112 
           - I guess I was wrong. YOu actually have TWO broken records.  cleanhippie   May-07-11 04:06 PM   #97 
        - If anyone needs to see the black and white world the religious live in  EvolveOrConvolve   May-07-11 08:21 PM   #105 
           - Well enlighten me please. If there is an alternative answer other  humblebum   May-08-11 07:54 PM   #121 
     - fruitless  Thats my opinion   May-05-11 08:08 PM   #49 
  - Instead of trying to discuss the merits of the forum...  Deep13   May-05-11 12:58 PM   #14 
  - PEOPLE USE RELIGION/THEOLOGY ALL THE TIME!!!!  Iggo   May-05-11 01:33 PM   #17 
  - THAT IS HOW CIVILIZED DISCOURSE HAPPENS!!!  Ninjaneer   May-05-11 01:40 PM   #18 
  - I THINK I"M GOING TO VOMIT!  cleanhippie   May-05-11 02:29 PM   #20 
  - Why am I not surprised,  Starboard Tack   May-05-11 03:35 PM   #22 
  - It's a piece of literary genius in comparison to the OP. n/t.  Ninjaneer   May-05-11 05:18 PM   #29 
     - Deleted message  Name removed   May-05-11 06:33 PM   #34 
  - I see ignored chimed in.  cleanhippie   May-05-11 04:55 PM   #27 
     - They became "Name removed" so it must have been really compelling. n/t  laconicsax   May-05-11 09:24 PM   #58 
  - Maybe  digonswine   May-05-11 04:03 PM   #23 
  - ethics  Thats my opinion   May-05-11 08:13 PM   #51 
     - Even if we acknowledge that religion once did some good...  LAGC   May-06-11 01:36 AM   #61 
  - If that's the best you have, you shouldn't have bothered  skepticscott   May-05-11 04:46 PM   #26 
  - theology and action  Thats my opinion   May-05-11 08:15 PM   #52 
     - Deleted message  Name removed   May-05-11 08:30 PM   #55 
     - And see my response  skepticscott   May-06-11 04:56 PM   #90 
  - SORRY, I DIDN'T CATCH THAT! CAN YOU SPEAK UP?  laconicsax   May-05-11 05:22 PM   #30 
  - Organized religion  frogmarch   May-05-11 05:29 PM   #31 
  - TMO: welcome to the lion's den!  dimbear   May-05-11 07:00 PM   #36 
  - Well, most Christian apologists  skepticscott   May-05-11 07:24 PM   #40 
  - Ethics and religion are mutually exclusive.  darkstar3   May-05-11 08:01 PM   #47 
  - Two things are mutually exclusive if they cannot be in the same place.  dimbear   May-06-11 01:30 AM   #60 
     - Or if can exist completely and unmodified without the other.  darkstar3   May-06-11 10:11 AM   #67 
  - Thomas Paine  Interzone   May-05-11 08:21 PM   #53 
  - They are unavoidable.  rrneck   May-06-11 01:22 AM   #59 
  - Kick  Boojatta   Jun-30-11 10:26 PM   #182 
  - LOL.  Iggo   Jul-01-11 11:07 AM   #185 
  - Yes. Without a solid basis in fact...  Deep13   Jun-30-11 11:02 PM   #183 
  - this OP is useless, AT BEST  deacon_sephiroth   Jul-01-11 05:36 AM   #184 
  - Even as an Atheist I say no  Taverner   Jul-01-11 02:17 PM   #186 
  - Yes, when it keeps people in fear and ignorance.  Manifestor_of_Light   Jul-02-11 11:59 PM   #187 
  - Well, I'm not sure this forum keeps anyone in fear.  okasha   Jul-03-11 08:48 AM   #188 
     - I was talking about religion, NOT about this forum keeping people in fear.  Manifestor_of_Light   Jul-05-11 07:19 PM   #191 
  - My view is, as stated in another post...  LeftishBrit   Jul-04-11 11:04 AM   #190 
 

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