jemelanson
(64 posts)
|
Sat Oct-17-09 06:38 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
| 4. From time to time we hear Christians claim that they are being |
 |
Edited on Sat Oct-17-09 07:09 PM by jemelanson
persecuted, unless all of those folks stand up and defend these children, then they forfeit any claim they have to being persecuted in my book. Those who attend any Church which professes to be Christian, they need to bring this story to their ministers and their church leaders. This needs to be talked about, it needs to be discussed and the people who to profess to be Christian need to stand up to those who claim to be Christian and do Something to protect these children who are being tortured and killed in the name of Christianity. Many of the main stream Christian Churches support missionary work in Africa. There needs pressure brought on the government in Nigeria, and through the missionaries in the field to put a stop to these practices. This is a stain on every person who professes to be a Christian. How you deal with this speaks to your beliefs and your character. Remember the WW JD bumper stickers. It is time to ask yourself What would Jesus do to those who commit these crimes against children, and to those who stand aside and allow them to commit those crimes and do nothing to stop them? I will stop my rant for now. Think on these things. MSNBC has picked up the story now. I hope it gets lots of coverage. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33356826/ns/world_news-afri... // African churches denounce children as ‘witches’ Pastors accuse thousands of children, leading to torture or death The following is a quote from one of the children: "Please stop the pastors who hurt us," said Jerry quietly, touching the scars on his face. "I believe in God and God knows I am not a witch."
|
Nigerian Children Deemed Witches Tortured |
jemelanson |
Oct-17-09 03:21 PM |
#0 |

DU Christians - take a look at this child's face |
Taverner |
Oct-17-09 03:28 PM |
#1 |
 
+about a million |
FiveGoodMen |
Oct-17-09 03:32 PM |
#2 |
 
+1 |
DeSwiss |
Oct-17-09 04:11 PM |
#3 |
 
From time to time we hear Christians claim that they are being |
jemelanson |
Oct-17-09 06:38 PM |
#4 |
  
what do you really know about the Nigerian religious divide? |
kwassa |
Oct-17-09 10:38 PM |
#8 |
   
Why do you try to change to subject? |
jemelanson |
Oct-17-09 11:54 PM |
#10 |
   
But the sky God COMMANDS people to kill witches |
hokies |
Oct-19-09 12:27 PM |
#54 |
  
Yes |
Dorian Gray |
Oct-20-09 06:12 AM |
#90 |
 
In decades of church-going, I've never heard a sermon about witchcraft; I've never heard |
struggle4progress |
Oct-17-09 07:36 PM |
#5 |
  
So are you saying that because it did not happen at you local |
jemelanson |
Oct-17-09 09:44 PM |
#6 |
   
I will go through this very slowly, using smalls words. I replied to: "That is Christianity ... |
struggle4progress |
Oct-18-09 10:24 AM |
#14 |
  
You may consider the torture and murder of children in the name |
jemelanson |
Oct-18-09 01:30 PM |
#16 |
  
Anyone interested, in what I actually said, can read what I wrote. Perhaps simpler grammar would |
struggle4progress |
Oct-18-09 02:32 PM |
#17 |
  
Seems you have a problem with reading comprehension also |
jemelanson |
Oct-18-09 03:38 PM |
#21 |
  
Well, a commandment to kill witches is in the Bible |
hokies |
Oct-19-09 12:23 PM |
#53 |
 
So, DU Christians are responsible? |
Sal316 |
Oct-18-09 06:24 PM |
#25 |
 
Thanks for the warning! |
Meshuga |
Oct-19-09 08:07 AM |
#47 |
 
Sorry.... |
Dorian Gray |
Oct-20-09 06:10 AM |
#89 |

I see more people denouncing these people's ties to Christianity than denouncing their actions |
Chulanowa |
Oct-21-09 04:01 PM |
#148 |

Religion. Is. Evil. |
Odin2005 |
Oct-17-09 10:02 PM |
#7 |
 
How. Knee. Jerk. eom |
Sal316 |
Oct-18-09 06:25 PM |
#26 |

Here is more background on Nigeria's religious conflicts. |
kwassa |
Oct-17-09 11:15 PM |
#9 |
 
What does that have to do with the price of tea in China? |
darkstar3 |
Oct-18-09 12:50 AM |
#11 |

Because every time Christians see their religion doing something they can't excuse... |
Chulanowa |
Oct-18-09 03:09 PM |
#18 |
 
Let me say, first, that I have never myself heard it preached in any church that pouring acid |
struggle4progress |
Oct-18-09 06:56 PM |
#27 |
  
See below three different articles all saying that this was done in |
jemelanson |
Oct-18-09 08:21 PM |
#29 |
   
The critical issue for your analysis, and the one you fail to address, is this: if the |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 01:19 AM |
#37 |
  
What you fail to comprehend is that this was done in the |
jemelanson |
Oct-19-09 02:20 AM |
#39 |
   
Let us try again: first the facts, then the analysis. What is happening in Akwa-Ibom? |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 02:58 AM |
#42 |
  
See #34. n/t |
darkstar3 |
Oct-19-09 12:12 PM |
#52 |
  
Translation: a detailed consideration of the facts on the ground does not interest you |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 01:19 PM |
#63 |
  
A detailed consideration is unnecessary in this case, |
darkstar3 |
Oct-19-09 01:50 PM |
#68 |
  
The problem you miss is that this has happened before |
darkstar3 |
Oct-19-09 12:06 PM |
#50 |
   
A scientific examination of problems in Nigeria would begin with conditions and events there, not |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 01:03 PM |
#60 |
  
There's nothing new here! |
darkstar3 |
Oct-19-09 01:47 PM |
#66 |
  
if they had turned to Buddhism, they would have killed the kid anyway. |
yodermon |
Oct-19-09 07:08 PM |
#73 |
  
Yeah, I have to disagree |
darkstar3 |
Oct-19-09 07:39 PM |
#75 |
  
history is replete with examples of infanticide & child sacrifice. No xianity required. |
yodermon |
Oct-19-09 11:53 PM |
#80 |
  
"Hello, I'd like to have an argument please." |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 12:04 AM |
#83 |
  
You're missing the point |
Chulanowa |
Oct-21-09 03:50 PM |
#147 |
  
Secular law in more developed countries is what has prevented these types of things |
rd_kent |
Oct-19-09 12:44 PM |
#59 |
  
Good for you. |
Chulanowa |
Oct-18-09 10:56 PM |
#31 |
 
Your wild stab is close to the truth. |
jemelanson |
Oct-19-09 12:21 AM |
#36 |
 
It is, of course, true that people can (and often do) justify their bad behaviors by lofty appeals: |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 01:57 AM |
#38 |
 
The thing is, it's not made up out of thin air |
Chulanowa |
Oct-19-09 04:05 AM |
#44 |
  
That book tells you a lot of stuff that reasonable people |
jemelanson |
Oct-19-09 05:23 AM |
#45 |
 
I'm aware |
Chulanowa |
Oct-19-09 06:48 PM |
#71 |
 
I know what your mean. |
jemelanson |
Oct-19-09 07:06 PM |
#72 |
 
delete - wrong place |
darkstar3 |
Oct-19-09 12:11 PM |
#51 |
 
and who is doing that? |
kwassa |
Oct-18-09 11:10 PM |
#32 |

You are |
Chulanowa |
Oct-19-09 07:37 PM |
#74 |

just to spell it out for you |
kwassa |
Oct-19-09 11:55 PM |
#81 |

'Who is more accurately Christian, and which belief is more representative of Christianity?' |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 12:06 AM |
#84 |
 
Only in your opinion. |
kwassa |
Oct-20-09 10:22 AM |
#93 |

I suggest you read up on the fallacy before you call it misapplied, |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 10:31 AM |
#94 |

uh, no. |
kwassa |
Oct-20-09 02:48 PM |
#100 |

but is simply one of many definitions of what constitutes a Christian. |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 04:50 PM |
#111 |

You don't understand the fallacy. |
kwassa |
Oct-20-09 10:09 PM |
#126 |

Is that all you have? Projection? Now you bore me. |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 10:25 PM |
#127 |

Is that a rhetorical question? |
Chulanowa |
Oct-21-09 02:18 AM |
#142 |

A faith-based initiative? It is, but not of Christian origin. |
kwassa |
Oct-18-09 11:24 PM |
#33 |

While it is true that a belief in witchcraft predates Christianity, |
darkstar3 |
Oct-18-09 11:37 PM |
#34 |

It has to be viewed in context. It doesn't begin and end with Christianity. |
kwassa |
Oct-19-09 11:30 PM |
#78 |
 
Christians believe in witches too. |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 12:00 AM |
#82 |

Very few Christians worldwide believe in witches. |
kwassa |
Oct-20-09 03:08 PM |
#101 |

Yes, he could have fallen victim to one of the indigenous African beliefs in |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-20-09 03:18 PM |
#104 |

But do they put sugar on their porridge? n/t |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 05:28 PM |
#113 |

This is not any kind of mainstream Christianity |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-20-09 03:14 PM |
#103 |

Does this mean you are denying their Christianity? n/t |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 04:56 PM |
#112 |

Yes, they're syncretists |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-20-09 11:24 PM |
#129 |

So who IS Christian? n/t |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 11:36 PM |
#131 |

Someone who actually tries to follow the teachings of Jesus |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-20-09 11:40 PM |
#133 |

You've made some broad statements here. |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 11:54 PM |
#135 |

The Sermon on the Mount is a good start |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-21-09 12:22 AM |
#137 |

So who picks what is right and what to ignore? n/t |
darkstar3 |
Oct-21-09 12:42 AM |
#138 |

The stuff that is internally consistent, as with any set of writings |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-21-09 01:06 AM |
#139 |

I haven't found anything that was internally consistent yet. |
darkstar3 |
Oct-21-09 06:55 PM |
#151 |

If I am wrong and there IS a god and he passes judgement, I know I am WAAYYY down on the list |
rd_kent |
Oct-18-09 02:58 AM |
#12 |
 
Of course there are |
Dorian Gray |
Oct-20-09 06:25 AM |
#91 |

Nothing new here. The Christian chruch has burned witches for.. |
Ozymanithrax |
Oct-18-09 03:00 AM |
#13 |
 
Nah, the "burning times" are a myth |
Chulanowa |
Oct-18-09 03:15 PM |
#19 |

And some say the Bible is all myth. |
jemelanson |
Oct-18-09 03:43 PM |
#22 |
 
Maybe you should read my post and not just the title? |
Chulanowa |
Oct-18-09 03:47 PM |
#23 |

You are right. I was merely pointing out that Christians have murdered other people... |
Ozymanithrax |
Oct-18-09 07:02 PM |
#28 |

It is my considered opinion, that Christians DO NOT risk denouncing..... |
DeSwiss |
Oct-18-09 12:57 PM |
#15 |
 
Are any churches in your neighborhood advocating pouring acid down children's throats? |
struggle4progress |
Oct-18-09 03:22 PM |
#20 |
  
you are not killing witches because your religion's power |
tiny elvis |
Oct-19-09 03:16 AM |
#43 |
   
I'm not killing witches because I do not believe in witchcraft and I do not believe in violence |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 12:04 PM |
#49 |
  
Perhaps instead of saying "well, me and MY church are not doing this" you should get proactive |
rd_kent |
Oct-19-09 12:39 PM |
#57 |
   
I shall defer to your self-righteousness and will allow you to explain your understanding |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 01:17 PM |
#62 |
  
self-righteousness? Im not a xtian, no one is killing people under the banner of non-belief of god |
rd_kent |
Oct-19-09 01:49 PM |
#67 |
  
Actually, it rests on the shoulders of all human beings, not just Christians. |
kwassa |
Oct-19-09 11:39 PM |
#79 |
   
There is no discussion to walk into. |
rd_kent |
Oct-20-09 11:35 AM |
#95 |
  
You create false parameters. |
kwassa |
Oct-20-09 04:39 PM |
#109 |
  
Clearly?! |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 05:56 PM |
#119 |
  
You mistake persistence for an argument. |
kwassa |
Oct-20-09 10:07 PM |
#125 |
  
So as a human being |
Dorian Gray |
Oct-20-09 06:28 AM |
#92 |
  
No, not what I am sayiong at all. |
rd_kent |
Oct-20-09 11:37 AM |
#96 |
  
Okay... |
Dorian Gray |
Oct-20-09 12:47 PM |
#98 |
  
We will just have to disagree. |
rd_kent |
Oct-20-09 02:04 PM |
#99 |
  
I don't think that we'll see that in our lifetime |
Dorian Gray |
Oct-20-09 03:24 PM |
#105 |
  
can you not recall? |
tiny elvis |
Oct-19-09 08:00 PM |
#76 |
  
The links you provide contain no actual references to witchcraft allegations in daycares but |
struggle4progress |
Oct-20-09 12:48 AM |
#85 |
  
yes they do |
tiny elvis |
Oct-20-09 01:32 AM |
#86 |
  
do you really not recall the allegations of satanic rituals even now? |
tiny elvis |
Oct-20-09 02:22 AM |
#88 |
  
Your 2nd and 3rd links in #76 contain neither references to witchcraft nor to satanic rituals. Your |
struggle4progress |
Oct-20-09 12:38 PM |
#97 |
  
made you look |
tiny elvis |
Oct-20-09 04:38 PM |
#108 |
   
oops. assumed i was conversing with an adult. let's try again after you're out of middle school |
struggle4progress |
Oct-20-09 05:57 PM |
#120 |
  
sayeth the lord |
tiny elvis |
Oct-20-09 06:31 PM |
#121 |
  
you are a douchebag. |
rd_kent |
Oct-20-09 09:19 PM |
#124 |
  
because you were ][ this close to winning before i got douchey |
tiny elvis |
Oct-24-09 12:23 AM |
#164 |
  
Another thing about "Satanic abuse" |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-20-09 11:38 PM |
#132 |
  
Yes. |
DeSwiss |
Oct-19-09 11:15 AM |
#48 |
   
Nice! |
rd_kent |
Oct-19-09 12:39 PM |
#58 |
    
Thanks! |
DeSwiss |
Oct-19-09 04:22 PM |
#70 |
   
But, of course! LOL! Still, you have merely exhibited your talent for clever equivocation, since you |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 01:15 PM |
#61 |
  
Well you don't address my post's points either..... |
DeSwiss |
Oct-19-09 04:20 PM |
#69 |
  
Are any churches in your neighborhood CONDEMNING what is done in their name? |
rd_kent |
Oct-19-09 12:38 PM |
#56 |
 
Remind me: in the name of what churches in my neighborhood is this done? |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 01:29 PM |
#64 |
 
You can be as obtuse about the subject as you want to be. |
rd_kent |
Oct-19-09 01:45 PM |
#65 |
 
+1000000000! Christians are in the same spot as Muslims that condone (by lack of action) |
rd_kent |
Oct-19-09 12:37 PM |
#55 |

Don't forget Sarah's Hero! |
hootinholler |
Oct-18-09 06:03 PM |
#24 |

If xianity had never been introduced, they would have found some other reason to burn the kid. |
yodermon |
Oct-18-09 09:42 PM |
#30 |
 
See post #34. n/t |
darkstar3 |
Oct-18-09 11:38 PM |
#35 |

Curse of the rains (Sunday Orisakwe | June 2002) |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 02:22 AM |
#40 |
 
How does this relate to violent exorcisms? nt |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-20-09 01:41 AM |
#87 |

My POV is explained in #14, ¶2. And again in #42. Yet again in #60. Et passim. |
struggle4progress |
Oct-20-09 03:55 PM |
#107 |

OK, I think I understand now. |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-20-09 08:21 PM |
#123 |

Sale of Womanhood or Sex? (Sexuality in Africa Vol 5 #3 2008) |
struggle4progress |
Oct-19-09 02:34 AM |
#41 |

People would get jail time |
Meshuga |
Oct-19-09 07:58 AM |
#46 |

Sad and disturbing. nt |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-19-09 08:29 PM |
#77 |

OK, this misinformed bullshit again--I'll try once more |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-20-09 03:12 PM |
#102 |
 
Fred Phelps is a free-lance fundie too, |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 05:32 PM |
#115 |
  
Phelps is not a Christian by Jesus' ethical standards |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-20-09 11:32 PM |
#130 |
 
The game you're playing is known as No True Scotsman |
darkstar3 |
Oct-21-09 10:07 AM |
#144 |
 
The game you are playing is misapplying a logical fallacy, one more time. |
kwassa |
Oct-21-09 09:25 PM |
#152 |
 
Lack of understanding on your part does not constitute a mistake on mine. |
darkstar3 |
Oct-21-09 09:56 PM |
#153 |
 
If you could refute my NTS analysis, you would have done so. |
kwassa |
Oct-22-09 10:19 AM |
#158 |
 
Bwaaaaack, Stalin! Bwaaack, misapplied! |
darkstar3 |
Oct-22-09 11:39 AM |
#159 |
 
Still no rebuttal |
kwassa |
Oct-22-09 10:01 PM |
#160 |
 
and here is a version of NTS that applies to atheists: |
kwassa |
Oct-22-09 10:30 PM |
#161 |
 
Oh, I'm sorry, Polly, are you still squawking? I have better things to do. n/t |
darkstar3 |
Oct-22-09 10:33 PM |
#162 |
 
No, you don't, because you still responded to me. And still no rebuttal. |
kwassa |
Oct-22-09 10:44 PM |
#163 |
 
"This is NOT Christianity as taught by the missionaries." |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-20-09 08:15 PM |
#122 |
  
Yeah, I knew I was wasting electrons |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-20-09 11:22 PM |
#128 |
 
Those FACTS do not make any real point since violent exorcisms happen in the U.S. |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-20-09 11:41 PM |
#134 |
 
And the mainstream groups DO NOT do this |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-21-09 12:19 AM |
#136 |
 
This is a strawman fallacy because I never claimed mainstream groups preformed violent exorcisms. |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-21-09 01:49 AM |
#140 |
 
So what? Why single out the Bible? |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-21-09 09:26 AM |
#143 |
 
The exorcists singled out the Holy Bible. |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-21-09 10:22 AM |
#145 |
 
Well, yes, but not the only source for that idea |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-21-09 01:29 PM |
#146 |
 
The Holy Bible may not be the only source, but the Holy Bible is the source they claimed to use. |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-21-09 06:29 PM |
#150 |
 
So fuckin' what? |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-21-09 10:55 PM |
#154 |
 
"I see is a bunch of atheists gleefully using this horrible situation as an opportunity to bash..." |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-21-09 11:08 PM |
#155 |
 
The missionaries in Nigeria were mostly Anglicans, and they've |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Oct-22-09 12:06 AM |
#156 |
 
""three-legged stool" of Scripture, tradition, and reason" |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-22-09 03:23 AM |
#157 |
 
So, you are saying that this is not "REAL" christianity? Oh, ok then... |
rd_kent |
Oct-24-09 10:49 AM |
#165 |

15,000 children have been accused in two of Nigeria's 36 state |
moobu2 |
Oct-20-09 03:38 PM |
#106 |

Blaming this on Christianity shows incredible ignorance. |
Sal316 |
Oct-20-09 04:48 PM |
#110 |
 
It's the wackiest of fundies we have a problem with |
darkstar3 |
Oct-20-09 05:33 PM |
#116 |
 
"People within the church have opposed this translation since the 16th Century." |
ZombieHorde |
Oct-21-09 02:02 AM |
#141 |
 
Okay, so it means poisoner. |
Chulanowa |
Oct-21-09 04:12 PM |
#149 |

Slavery is still alive in Nigeria |
struggle4progress |
Oct-20-09 05:31 PM |
#114 |

A haven for child traffickers |
struggle4progress |
Oct-20-09 05:33 PM |
#117 |

Nigeria: Trafficked Children - 'We Are Human, Not Commodities' (2008) |
struggle4progress |
Oct-20-09 05:38 PM |
#118 |