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Reply #10: How many jusisdictions have a "long and complicated ballot"? How many don't? [View All]

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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-18-08 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. How many jusisdictions have a "long and complicated ballot"? How many don't?
Bear in mind, some of the poll worker shortage is attributed to the introduction of electronic apparatus.

We could, of course, hand count all fed or even statewide races. We could hand count many of the elections in many places in the country...and I think we should.

You mentioned not opposing hand counts while in the same paragraph citing an MIT study that highlighted inaccuracies in NH where hand counts are still employed. You mentioned, as well, audits for Scanned elections.

I have zero doubt that Opscans are more accurate than hand counts...while being more vulnerable to tampering. That's why I think audits are called for even if the election is hand counted.

I also don't instantly equate difficulty with staffing a poll with disenfranchisement, though it certainly seems possible. Right off the bat, it seems it would take more time to get results. I'll be patient.

Please consider that one really big thing going against Hand Counts are the Torch and Pitchfork types advocating it.

To me, that's not sufficient reason to oft post images of ballots of probably the toughest jurisdiction to manage in the entire country. To me, that is bias.

There are plenty of places where implementing hand counts would work fine and would serve as a bit of an economic and even community-building boost.

That's my bias despite some of the other advocates. Can you add anything to it???

BTW Dave Berman is having some success pushing Hand Counts in Humboldt County. I'm sure you'll want to offer appreciation on one of the threads about it.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

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  -Italian paper electoral procedures (Hand Counted Paper Elections) kster  Feb-17-08 10:50 PM   #0 
  - Yep, and they know how to life right too. K*R  autorank   Feb-17-08 10:52 PM   #1 
  - I seem to recall the last election didn't go all that smoothly over in Italy.  MADem   Feb-17-08 10:57 PM   #2 
  - Italy: electronic vote-counting experiment during 2006 general election  kster   Feb-17-08 11:12 PM   #3 
  - One race vs. 50.  troubleinwinter   Feb-18-08 12:27 AM   #4 
  - The old complicated ballot routine  kster   Feb-18-08 12:37 AM   #5 
  - Stupidity = the same idiotic rant that LA County = New Hampshire  eridani   Jan-30-09 03:29 AM   #25 
     - Joe Biden knows how to make it possible to Hand Count the Paper Ballots  kster   Jan-31-09 03:33 AM   #26 
        - Tell us all about how you got your county to switch to HCPB n/t  eridani   Jan-31-09 05:34 AM   #27 
  - Your post seems extremely biased. That's a given election in one jurisdiction.  Wilms   Feb-18-08 09:16 AM   #7 
     - The ballot shown was 2006 General Election  troubleinwinter   Feb-18-08 12:03 PM   #8 
        - How many jusisdictions have a "long and complicated ballot"? How many don't?  Wilms   Feb-18-08 02:19 PM   #10 
           - I'm not sure that we have disagreement.  troubleinwinter   Feb-18-08 07:09 PM   #11 
           - I agree.  Wilms   Feb-18-08 09:24 PM   #12 
           - I'd suggest a different method for auditing hand counts out of general principle  eridani   Dec-27-08 07:07 AM   #23 
           - NC has around 24 contests on the GE ballot, New Hampshire only 12  WillYourVoteBCounted   Feb-02-09 07:27 PM   #30 
  - Oh my God, bring some of those people over here to give us some advice. K&R!  Stevepol   Feb-18-08 08:14 AM   #6 
  - Hopeful news here; REMEMBER, contempt w/o investigation is highly intellectually dishonest  Land Shark   Feb-18-08 01:18 PM   #9 
  - Thanks for this post, kster.  Wilms   Feb-19-08 10:15 PM   #13 
  - Thanks, Al Gore said the same thing  kster   Feb-20-08 02:38 AM   #14 
     - Very nice. But Al was talking about FL2000.  Wilms   Feb-20-08 09:13 AM   #15 
        - GOP candidate Albert Howard on Hand Counted Paper Ballots, February 16, 2008  kster   Feb-20-08 12:23 PM   #16 
           - Re-read what I wrote.  Wilms   Feb-20-08 06:16 PM   #17 
           - This thread was made to show that  kster   Feb-20-08 11:08 PM   #18 
              - Of course I realize that.  Wilms   Feb-20-08 11:30 PM   #19 
                 - Did you ever have an itch in the middle of your back,  kster   Feb-21-08 12:04 AM   #20 
                    - Son of a bitch I have a Wilms  kster   Feb-22-08 02:31 AM   #21 
           - kick.nt  kster   Jan-24-09 10:44 AM   #24 
  - kick.nt  kster   Dec-20-08 12:17 AM   #22 
  - They make some nice ass shoes and suits too  WillYourVoteBCounted   Feb-02-09 01:54 AM   #28 
     - They have more sense than us when it comes to counting ballots,  kster   Feb-02-09 03:26 AM   #29 
        - the big question KSTER is did YOU get hand counted paper ballots in your town?  WillYourVoteBCounted   Feb-02-09 07:28 PM   #31 
           - I'm not making the connection  kster   Feb-02-09 11:17 PM   #32 
              - I just wondered if you had worked to get hand counted paper ballots  WillYourVoteBCounted   Feb-03-09 12:09 AM   #33 
 

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