Land Shark
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Tue Feb-06-07 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #38 |
| 42. elections are mutlidisciplinary and the facts that make this winning% principle mostly wrong |
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Edited on Tue Feb-06-07 11:52 AM by Land Shark
come from OUTSIDE MATHEMATICS AND STATISTICS. Namely, it comes from the reality that tabulator fraud, for example, a function of knowing elections systems and fraud methods that are outside the domain of the expertise of mathematicians, makes winning percentages infinitely variable. In Kentucky, they cheated to make not only a victory in a previously VERY close race between the same two candidates, but to win by more than 2 to 1. The court would not even ALLOW a contest to be filed because of a 'winning percentage' statute that barred any such contest if the win is by 2 to 1 or more. (that wasn't an audit statute but shows the danger of basing things on winning percentage).
If you were here visiting me now, or at any time, you'd not be able to take a picture of me showing "outrage." I'm just saying that SOME people, I can't be sure who, do not enjoy risking that sort of feeling being a part of their experience because they don't enjoy it's stressfulness and so will argue themselves out of being outraged even on a subjective, interior level. This is one big reason why revulsion against some things doesn't sweep the nation like many activists think it ought to, and activists are not immune to the same defense mechanisms.
Unless I am quoting something, just like everything anybody else says, whatever i write is indeed by definition my own opinion or thought, unless i've inadvertantly plagiarized or something. Therefore, your request for me to appear to weaken my own arguments by peppering them with "i thinks" or "in my opinions" in order to expressly state that they are merely my own personal opinions is hereby DENIED. But have a good day anyway. : )
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| -New "Holt Bill": Fraudulent and Deceptive Use of term "Ballot" |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 12:37 AM |
#0 |
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"Fradulent paper record dressed up as a ballot" |
kpete |
Feb-06-07 12:48 AM |
#1 |
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Why the *uck wasn't electoral reform part of the 'first 100hrs'? n/t |
bananarepublican |
Feb-06-07 12:57 AM |
#2 |
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good question. But actually the Congress has so much to learn that it's not READY |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 01:05 AM |
#3 |
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But....what happened to all the Info from the Conyers Basement Hearings and |
KoKo01 |
Feb-06-07 03:10 PM |
#59 |
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People are being lectured that any major pro-public oversight is not "realistic" |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 09:41 PM |
#62 |
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K&R |
GuvWurld |
Feb-06-07 01:05 AM |
#4 |
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Just come right out and say it, LS. |
Wilms |
Feb-06-07 01:06 AM |
#5 |
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DRE's are a specific problem, Electronic Counts are the General Problem |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 01:30 AM |
#6 |
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And I should have noted I appreciate what you're saying about bastardizing the ballot. |
Wilms |
Feb-06-07 01:44 AM |
#7 |
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My reaction. |
garybeck |
Feb-06-07 01:49 AM |
#8 |
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garybeck, the studies showing that people do not check their paper |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 02:24 AM |
#11 |
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Well, since you ask. |
garybeck |
Feb-06-07 03:07 AM |
#12 |
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Very nicely analysed |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 04:46 AM |
#15 |
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Everyone assumes that the silly sign "INFORMS" the public of something, but |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 09:00 AM |
#19 |
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Well, thanks for the invite... |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 09:55 AM |
#24 |
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C'mon Febble are you actually thingins this through? the more you cheat the smaller the sample size |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 10:10 AM |
#26 |
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I'm not following: |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 10:33 AM |
#27 |
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ok, garybeck writes favorably of Holt generally and you say that's a good analysis |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 10:52 AM |
#29 |
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What I read, Land Shark, was your post |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 11:03 AM |
#32 |
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WARNING: DO NOT READ THIS MESSAGE whatever you do. |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 11:21 AM |
#36 |
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That's silly |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 11:39 AM |
#41 |
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As a practical matter, using objective methods of counting, the paper will rarely count |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 12:04 PM |
#45 |
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Perception: |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 12:10 PM |
#48 |
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well i took back the highlighted comment before I saw this |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 01:12 PM |
#53 |
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Well, I'm not going to do that |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 01:26 PM |
#56 |
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Febble when I am writing to you or thinking of you I am always smiling |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 09:51 PM |
#63 |
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Like this? |
Febble |
Feb-07-07 04:21 AM |
#64 |
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Tis True, the biggest smiles are always for the camera (or the cameraMAN!) |
Land Shark |
Feb-07-07 10:36 PM |
#67 |
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And of course, I also read garybeck's post |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 11:05 AM |
#33 |
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it's not a "with us vs against us" analysis. Just pointing out that |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 11:35 AM |
#39 |
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I did NOT defend |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 11:54 AM |
#43 |
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Deleted message |
Name removed |
Feb-06-07 01:05 PM |
#52 |
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OK |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 10:57 AM |
#31 |
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I don't think a DRE will ever work. |
eomer |
Feb-06-07 12:09 PM |
#47 |
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I'd be happy with that |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 12:11 PM |
#49 |
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well many I've talked to seem to agree |
garybeck |
Feb-06-07 10:54 AM |
#30 |
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a "basis" for doing something doesn't mean it's justified in this particular expression |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 11:11 AM |
#34 |
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c'mon |
garybeck |
Feb-06-07 11:33 AM |
#38 |
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elections are mutlidisciplinary and the facts that make this winning% principle mostly wrong |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 11:49 AM |
#42 |
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Just because one law |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 12:03 PM |
#44 |
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clarifying the term "BALLOT" |
garybeck |
Feb-06-07 10:43 AM |
#28 |
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I take your point |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 11:14 AM |
#35 |
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well, we agree on the following quote, and to me it ends the important part of the argument |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 11:27 AM |
#37 |
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I will always be seriously bothered |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 12:05 PM |
#46 |
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For the nth time, WHO should perform the audits? Govt audits itself??? |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 01:20 PM |
#54 |
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Well, who do you suggest conduct HCBPs? |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 01:31 PM |
#57 |
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well Holt II provides that entirely APPOINTED people do it, not elected |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 03:18 PM |
#60 |
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The link to the bill |
Land Shark |
Feb-07-07 10:51 AM |
#65 |
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Holt is a grown man but he does not get it, |
kster |
Feb-06-07 01:55 AM |
#9 |
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Ugh!!! |
nicknameless |
Feb-06-07 01:57 AM |
#10 |
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Land Shark: |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 03:26 AM |
#13 |
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So you do NOT think that people EXPECT a ballot to be counted the FIRST TIME??? |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 09:43 AM |
#23 |
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No, it's not a "technical" argument at all |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 10:03 AM |
#25 |
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Good grief!! What is it about crooked elections that our |
loudsue |
Feb-06-07 03:44 AM |
#14 |
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OK, Everyone --- Here's His Form ---- Attack |
Senator |
Feb-06-07 05:48 AM |
#16 |
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Good questions. And WHY does Holt think that unless we follow the Arthur Anderson rule |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 09:26 AM |
#22 |
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You're right. It's not a ballot |
rock |
Feb-06-07 06:19 AM |
#17 |
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They do in fairness propose some legal fiction language to partly address the chaos |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 09:15 AM |
#20 |
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Two ballots? |
BeFree |
Feb-06-07 12:46 PM |
#51 |
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Why did I just get an earworm of |
stellanoir |
Feb-06-07 07:23 AM |
#18 |
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Instead of "I Voted Electronically" stickers we will need a new sticker that says |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 09:21 AM |
#21 |
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the correct language would be: |
garybeck |
Feb-06-07 11:35 AM |
#40 |
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Cool. n/t |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 12:12 PM |
#50 |
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"...in the case of an audit or recount but not if the race is close and an automatic recount |
Land Shark |
Feb-06-07 01:24 PM |
#55 |
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You will have to explain your problem |
Febble |
Feb-06-07 01:34 PM |
#58 |
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Thank you. |
SimpleTrend |
Feb-06-07 08:28 PM |
#61 |
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Hand Counted Paper Ballots NOW! Nothing more and Nothing less! nt |
In Truth We Trust |
Feb-07-07 12:11 PM |
#66 |
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Kick.(nt) |
Kurovski |
Feb-10-07 02:15 AM |
#68 |