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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-18-07 12:09 PM
Original message
Time to Doff Tin Foil Hats - No Suspicious Undervote in NC 08
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Edited on Thu Jan-18-07 12:18 PM by WillYourVoteBCounted
R/e NC 08 compared to Fl 13.

There's a DKos Diary on Mecklenberg, discussing the election and refuting reports of
error. Should you want to weigh in - since DKos has a large, national, activist audience, I
think it's a good idea - useful to do it today. (they also don't have the "block" feature)

Time to Doff the Tin Foil Hats - No Suspicious Undervote in Meck/NC-08

by The Southern Dem

Thu Jan 18, 2007 at 08:14:43 AM PST
Unless you've been in seclusion or you've been living under a rock, you've heard about the alarmingly high undervote rate in Florida's 13th Congressional District race.
According to The San Francisco Chronicle piece linked above via CommonDreams, the undervote of somewhere around 15% in Sarasota County means that close to 18,000 people voted for other races, but failed to select a choice for the Jennings/Buchanan race. Unlike North Carolina, Florida does not require a paper trail for its touch screen machines. There are several theories floating around as to what happened to those 18,000 votes, but with no paper trail, it is difficult, if not impossible to verify the count from the machine.

Grab a cuppa and get comfy. This one's looooong....

The Southern Dem's diary :: ::
Now, conspiracy theories are cropping up surrounding the 4.2% Mecklenburg County undervote in the 8th Congressional race between Larry Kissell and Robin Hayes.
It started with an email going around with lots of THESE and quite a few of !!!!!!! these. According to the author of the email the Mecklenburg County Board of Elections was negligent in its execution of the 3% eye-hand recount performed on November 29, 2006. The author also claims that there is an unprecedented undervote in Mecklenburg County for the 8th Congressional District race. The undervote rate of 4.2% is unprecedented in this race for Mecklenburg County, however, in light of circumstances surrounding November's elections, it is not surprising, shocking or significant and all the CAPITAL LETTERS and !!!!! exclamation points!!!! in the world will not change that fact.

Why address this publicly? The email has had broad enough distribution that it deserves to be addressed publicly. Not only that, diaries are showing up on Daily Kos, Democratic Underground and now BlueNC. A new web site asserting this claim also exists. It isn't my intention to call out any one person or to try and embarrass someone, therefore I'm not addressing the author of this email or the web site by name.

Another reason to address this publicly is the spread of faulty data that is now getting wider distribution. A couple of days ago, Kirk Ross brought our attention to a writer who is spreading confusion by using a completely inaccurate undervote total for North Carolina's 8th Congressional District. Michael Collins has a post at Scoop Independent News, and it was taken to Crooks and Liars by Nicole Belle. In this article Collins claims that the undervote percentage in the 8th Congressional race in Mecklenburg County was over 15%. I'll refute his numbers later in this post...

read more analysis here
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  -Time to Doff Tin Foil Hats - No Suspicious Undervote in NC 08 WillYourVoteBCounted  Jan-18-07 12:09 PM   #0 
  - Excellent. Thanks for the link.  troubleinwinter   Jan-18-07 02:01 PM   #1 
  - Sweeping up the mess?  BeFree   Jan-21-07 12:06 AM   #56 
  - kandr  fooj   Jan-18-07 02:03 PM   #2 
  - Collins has posted this on the subject of his "Scoop" article:  Kurovski   Jan-18-07 05:24 PM   #3 
  - but he is _cherry-picking_ the "published figures"  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-18-07 06:37 PM   #4 
  - if you think those figures are bad, look at Lenoir County NC's  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-19-07 01:14 AM   #14 
     - whoa, I thought I was playing pinball for a moment  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-19-07 05:39 AM   #17 
  - "either intentionally... or has no idea how to figure the undervote."  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-18-07 07:02 PM   #5 
     - again, one quibble with SoDem's excellent diary  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-18-07 07:32 PM   #6 
        - I thought you were going to say...  Bill Bored   Jan-18-07 07:53 PM   #7 
           - that's my belief, but I can't confirm it at this time  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-18-07 07:57 PM   #8 
  - C'mon TAKE THE CHALLENGE!!  kster   Jan-18-07 11:35 PM   #9 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Jan-19-07 12:44 AM   #11 
  - Oh C'mon we all know the cause of global warming  kster   Jan-19-07 01:00 AM   #13 
     - frankly  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-19-07 01:17 AM   #15 
  - oops forgot something  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-19-07 12:46 AM   #12 
  - "when necessary to complete the canvass"  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-19-07 06:09 AM   #18 
  - The candidate conceded  Kelvin Mace   Jan-22-07 12:14 PM   #121 
  - When reporting of results is this messed up, it may obscure other problems....  Land Shark   Jan-19-07 12:31 AM   #10 
  - the scandal of the decade  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-19-07 01:34 AM   #16 
     - now we just need someone to chime in with a supporting table  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-19-07 06:29 AM   #19 
     - this table is the conclusive proof  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-19-07 02:27 PM   #30 
     - What is the investigative standard to pronounce Meck OK?  Land Shark   Jan-19-07 10:46 AM   #20 
     - this will help  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-19-07 11:27 AM   #21 
        - feeling a bit frazzled? (grin)  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-19-07 11:55 AM   #23 
           - zzrl?  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-19-07 01:23 PM   #24 
           - that's inaccurate -- it was zzril ;)  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-19-07 01:39 PM   #26 
           - plenty of work for volunteers, and comments from BlueNC  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-19-07 01:34 PM   #25 
           - well, I have it, but don't know what to do with it  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-19-07 02:05 PM   #29 
           - the source of the latin  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-19-07 01:39 PM   #27 
              - Why won't you answer me?  galloglas   Jan-19-07 05:00 PM   #31 
                 - Why?  BeFree   Jan-19-07 08:00 PM   #32 
                 - "Elvis has left the building" !!??  galloglas   Jan-19-07 08:49 PM   #35 
                 - My hopes for NC  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-20-07 02:43 PM   #44 
                 - Since you are impatient...  galloglas   Jan-21-07 05:34 PM   #76 
                 - Ok I answered your question, and now seems no one interested  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-20-07 10:49 PM   #45 
                    - Nope  BeFree   Jan-20-07 11:11 PM   #46 
                    - tell us all about you  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-20-07 11:19 PM   #48 
                    - No one is interested  BeFree   Jan-20-07 11:29 PM   #49 
                       - does your state have voting machines??  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-20-07 11:47 PM   #52 
                       - Badly  BeFree   Jan-20-07 11:56 PM   #54 
                          - why not answer the other questions  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-21-07 12:11 AM   #58 
                             - Deleted message  Name removed   Jan-21-07 12:22 AM   #60 
                       - Thanks for the disclosure.  Wilms   Jan-20-07 11:47 PM   #53 
                          - I don't have a sig line  BeFree   Jan-20-07 11:58 PM   #55 
                          - I'm not sure I wouldn't interpret that as threatening and aimed at stifling debate.  Wilms   Jan-21-07 12:10 AM   #57 
                             - Deleted message  Name removed   Jan-21-07 12:19 AM   #59 
                             - Bingo, the whole point is to disrupt  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-21-07 01:18 AM   #61 
                                - Mega-Bingo.  troubleinwinter   Jan-21-07 01:28 AM   #62 
                          - What part on the sig line, Wilms?  galloglas   Jan-21-07 04:17 PM   #74 
                             - Sure.  Wilms   Jan-21-07 05:34 PM   #77 
                    - Burns night is coming very soon... n/t  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-21-07 07:22 AM   #63 
                    - So, providence  Kelvin Mace   Jan-22-07 12:21 PM   #123 
                    - Uhhh, I also eat, sleep and do other things. I don't live at DU!  galloglas   Jan-21-07 05:27 PM   #75 
                    - Google Lorem Ipsum  troubleinwinter   Jan-21-07 06:04 PM   #78 
                    - oh, you noticed that too?  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-21-07 06:11 PM   #79 
                    - I'm quite sure he will be.  troubleinwinter   Jan-21-07 06:26 PM   #80 
                       - Quite Obviously!  galloglas   Jan-21-07 08:48 PM   #83 
                          - here's that Latin, straight from the site I copied it from  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-21-07 08:52 PM   #84 
                          - No, I am not familiar with Latin at all.  troubleinwinter   Jan-21-07 10:16 PM   #88 
                             - Perhaps not  galloglas   Jan-21-07 11:39 PM   #97 
                                - See post #98  troubleinwinter   Jan-21-07 11:57 PM   #100 
                                   - maybe to avoid talking about inaccuracies in Scoop article? n/t  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-22-07 12:04 AM   #103 
                                   - See post # 102  galloglas   Jan-22-07 12:08 AM   #106 
                                      - "yet some still claimed an unusual undervote/conspiracy..."  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-22-07 12:14 AM   #108 
                                   - Wait now,  Kelvin Mace   Jan-22-07 12:25 PM   #125 
                    - Are you claiming that  galloglas   Jan-21-07 08:42 PM   #82 
                    - I am "claiming"  troubleinwinter   Jan-21-07 09:57 PM   #87 
                    - The question is this.  galloglas   Jan-21-07 10:26 PM   #89 
                       - It appears that you don't read English any better than Latin.  troubleinwinter   Jan-21-07 10:58 PM   #91 
                       - We'll see...  galloglas   Jan-21-07 11:25 PM   #95 
                       - Another try  troubleinwinter   Jan-21-07 11:06 PM   #92 
                          - URL, please  galloglas   Jan-21-07 11:15 PM   #94 
                             - You have already requested that and it was already posted to you.  troubleinwinter   Jan-21-07 11:32 PM   #96 
                             - the point of the OP is to correct misinformation  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-21-07 11:51 PM   #99 
                             - In the mean time,  troubleinwinter   Jan-22-07 12:05 AM   #104 
                             - Right  BeFree   Jan-22-07 12:06 AM   #105 
                             - hey, it's a trifecta!  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-22-07 12:20 AM   #112 
                             - You need to prove *you* aren't crying wolf!  galloglas   Jan-22-07 12:32 AM   #115 
                             - you're backed by good information  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-22-07 01:22 AM   #117 
                             - It "becomes simply childish"  galloglas   Jan-22-07 12:04 AM   #102 
                                - NC 08: Kissell gained 2 votes from manual recount of 5 counties  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-22-07 12:09 AM   #107 
                                - Proof, Joyce, Proof!  galloglas   Jan-22-07 01:35 AM   #118 
                                - "It is Cicero." Hahahaha!!!! It is floor-sweepings of Cicero.  troubleinwinter   Jan-22-07 01:14 AM   #116 
                                   - Perhaps you know more about floors than  galloglas   Jan-22-07 01:41 AM   #119 
                                   - I am so terribly sorry  troubleinwinter   Jan-22-07 03:24 PM   #126 
                             - Are you completely unaware  troubleinwinter   Jan-21-07 11:48 PM   #98 
                             - "a false claim ..dilutes the importance of other, more valid claims"  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-22-07 12:30 AM   #114 
                    - "I wish we could find some irregularity or other reason..."  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-22-07 12:19 AM   #111 
                    - No one is getting  Kelvin Mace   Jan-22-07 12:23 PM   #124 
                    - wish I could see the faces on Latin Dept folks  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-21-07 07:52 PM   #81 
                       - You most certainly did!  galloglas   Jan-21-07 09:27 PM   #85 
                       - BTW, "(edited for grammer in last sentence)"  galloglas   Jan-21-07 09:34 PM   #86 
                       - its a matter of choice  WillYourVoteBCounted   Jan-21-07 10:43 PM   #90 
                          - A matter of choice??  galloglas   Jan-22-07 01:49 AM   #120 
                       - what, calling me out now? (grin)  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-21-07 11:13 PM   #93 
                    - What he wants to do  Kelvin Mace   Jan-22-07 12:20 PM   #122 
     - OK, then....  galloglas   Jan-19-07 11:53 AM   #22 
     - ???  hunter   Jan-19-07 01:41 PM   #28 
  - What a crock!  BeFree   Jan-19-07 08:34 PM   #33 
  - absolutely wrong, for reasons already explained  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-19-07 08:38 PM   #34 
  - You see  BeFree   Jan-20-07 11:18 PM   #47 
     - jeepers  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-21-07 07:27 AM   #64 
        - Not MY official results  BeFree   Jan-21-07 10:07 AM   #67 
           - no, there weren't 19,287 voters in CD 8 Meck  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-21-07 12:46 PM   #68 
              - So  BeFree   Jan-21-07 12:59 PM   #70 
                 - if you look, you will know what we have  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-21-07 01:05 PM   #72 
                    - Wow  BeFree   Jan-22-07 12:18 AM   #110 
                       - no, it's not incredible to people who look  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-22-07 12:26 AM   #113 
  - Let us look at two neighboring districts from Meck.  BeFree   Jan-19-07 09:20 PM   #36 
     - go ahead, parse the numbers  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-19-07 09:25 PM   #37 
     - What we have here  BeFree   Jan-19-07 09:36 PM   #38 
        - An email asks me too lookie here  BeFree   Jan-19-07 10:30 PM   #41 
        - and again  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-20-07 06:04 AM   #43 
           - Sorry  BeFree   Jan-20-07 11:41 PM   #50 
              - I have, and they do -- so what is your excuse for ignoring them? n/t  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-21-07 07:28 AM   #65 
                 - Me?  BeFree   Jan-21-07 09:58 AM   #66 
                    - BeFree, what were the undervote rates in  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-21-07 12:50 PM   #69 
                       - Show me where it says OFFICIAL RESULTS  BeFree   Jan-21-07 01:04 PM   #71 
                          - indeed, attention must be paid  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-21-07 01:23 PM   #73 
                             - The two sets of numbers match?  BeFree   Jan-22-07 12:03 AM   #101 
                                - wrong again  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-22-07 12:15 AM   #109 
        - OK, if you can multipost, so can I  OnTheOtherHand   Jan-20-07 06:00 AM   #42 
           - Yes, they could  BeFree   Jan-20-07 11:45 PM   #51 
  - I'm just going to hide this thread and pretend I never read it. n/t  sfexpat2000   Jan-19-07 09:46 PM   #39 
     - Funny thats what I been thinking...  btmlndfrmr   Jan-19-07 09:53 PM   #40 

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