You are viewing an obsolete version of the DU website which is no longer supported by the Administrators. Visit The New DU.
Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login

Reply #125: Butch350, that was not eloquent. It was just plain inaccurate. One form of torture [View All]

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-24-09 11:35 PM
Response to Reply #110
125. Butch350, that was not eloquent. It was just plain inaccurate. One form of torture
IS NOT necessarily the same as another. Of course, it all induces pain and fear, but some is more horrible and can be administered in ways that make it slower and even more painful than other types of torture.

I don't know where you're getting your information, but some people have NO IDEA what torture really is and a dictionary definition will do nothing to help them understand. Words on a page are far less convincing than images.

To many Americans this is the discussion of a WORD, not horrific acts of physical violence against human beings. There are still ignorant assholes who are saying that waterboarding isn't even torture.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
  -Helen Thomas to Obama: If you see the importance of Neda video, why won't you release abuse photos? Sweet and Spicy  Jun-24-09 09:35 AM   #0 
  - Answer is obvious.  Occam Bandage   Jun-24-09 09:36 AM   #1 
  - +1. n/t  vaberella   Jun-24-09 09:38 AM   #5 
  - +2! n/t  Boomerang Diddle   Jun-24-09 02:50 PM   #58 
  - yep, that covers it completely.  wyldwolf   Jun-24-09 10:03 AM   #19 
  - That's right. We've seen how the Neda pics have inflamed people  Political Tiger   Jun-24-09 01:16 PM   #53 
  - Are you confused by the similarity in names between Iran and Iraq?  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:09 AM   #135 
  - Some people are culpable for their actions and others aren't.. Duh. nt  Umbral   Jun-24-09 06:50 PM   #85 
  - A 21 year old kid shouldn't have to die because of what Cheney/Bush  ecstatic   Jun-24-09 07:15 PM   #90 
     - What if the protesters kill innocent Iranian soldiers in retaliation?  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 09:14 PM   #107 
  - So let me see if I have...  SkyIsGrey   Jun-24-09 07:15 PM   #91 
  - If you want to see those kinds of pictures - go to the library...  Butch350   Jun-24-09 08:07 PM   #100 
     - So the Iranian government should oppress any photos or video?  SkyIsGrey   Jun-24-09 08:43 PM   #103 
     - I will eloquently put it this way.  Butch350   Jun-24-09 09:42 PM   #110 
     - Butch350, that was not eloquent. It was just plain inaccurate. One form of torture  bertman   Jun-24-09 11:35 PM   #125 
     - That you have a picture of Neda as your avatar  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:17 AM   #137 
     - Front Page.  SkyIsGrey   Jun-25-09 05:23 AM   #153 
     - Bullshit...  quickesst   Jun-25-09 05:35 AM   #154 
     - Deleted message  Name removed   Jun-24-09 09:20 PM   #108 
     - +1! n/t  JohnnyK   Jun-24-09 11:25 PM   #123 
     - Well Said... Frylock! n/t  ChiciB1   Jun-24-09 11:30 PM   #124 
     - A little over the top, but I agree with some parts of your post.  liquid diamond   Jun-24-09 09:52 PM   #112 
     - Except that the average idiot American will be forced to confront  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:21 AM   #138 
     - Good point! I have hard enough time getting them out of my mind.  Alameda   Jun-24-09 10:35 PM   #115 
     - really? that's just weird  fascisthunter   Jun-25-09 08:57 AM   #157 
     - What the fuck is wrong with you.  girl gone mad   Jun-24-09 10:46 PM   #122 
     - Sophistry at it's worst  fascisthunter   Jun-25-09 09:00 AM   #159 
     - dupe  fascisthunter   Jun-25-09 09:00 AM   #160 
     - You seem to be suffering from a logical disconnect...  Stand and Fight   Jun-25-09 12:41 AM   #128 
     - Do you think we actually are looking forward to seeing the pictures?  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:14 AM   #136 
     - Way to miss the point completely  spiritual_gunfighter   Jun-25-09 05:03 AM   #150 
     - So you don't think the German people should  truth2power   Jun-25-09 09:50 AM   #164 
  - such easy answers  mdmc   Jun-24-09 09:45 PM   #111 
  - With that statement, you ruin your credibility.  LittleBlue   Jun-25-09 04:06 AM   #134 
     - Obama is the President of the United States it's his job to act in the nation's self-interest  Hippo_Tron   Jun-25-09 04:56 PM   #178 
  - Big kick for Helen  Autumn   Jun-24-09 09:36 AM   #2 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Jun-24-09 11:25 AM   #37 
     - You don't have to like her  Autumn   Jun-24-09 11:35 AM   #39 
     - I thought she was brilliant to insert a cogent question at that moment  lunatica   Jun-24-09 06:14 PM   #81 
     - What a loathsome thing to say - even "metaphorically."  Peregrine Took   Jun-24-09 06:46 PM   #84 
        - Deleted message  Name removed   Jun-25-09 07:38 AM   #156 
  - How are the two issues related? n/t  vaberella   Jun-24-09 09:36 AM   #3 
  - Citizens seeing injustice by police or soldiers,  Eric J in MN   Jun-24-09 10:18 AM   #24 
  - See my post #42  Forkboy   Jun-24-09 11:48 AM   #43 
  - It's censorship plain and simple  Liberation Angel   Jun-24-09 06:58 PM   #86 
  - K&R  invictus   Jun-24-09 09:37 AM   #4 
  - Dumb question  BeyondGeography   Jun-24-09 09:38 AM   #6 
  - If US forces killed a Neda in New Jersey, would Obama attempt to supress the video?  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 09:40 AM   #7 
     - I assume not.  Occam Bandage   Jun-24-09 09:47 AM   #9 
     - Why do you "assume not," if you don't think it could ever happen?  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 09:49 AM   #10 
     - Because the likely response is not related to the practicality of the hypothetical.  Occam Bandage   Jun-24-09 09:57 AM   #14 
        - A hypothetical question needs not contain a likely scenario  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 10:07 AM   #20 
           - Yes, that's what I just said. The practicality is unrelated to the answer.  Occam Bandage   Jun-24-09 10:15 AM   #22 
              - So your answer was "I assume not." as far as I can tell,  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:31 AM   #140 
     - Occam Bandage, you are making a huge assumption in your first paragraph. There are  bertman   Jun-24-09 05:28 PM   #77 
     - None dare call it genocide.  asteroid2003QQ47   Jun-24-09 06:41 PM   #83 
     - I have never seen so many posts on a single OP  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:29 AM   #139 
     - How's Obama suppressing the video in that scenario unless the Feds are there shooting it themselves?  high density   Jun-24-09 09:53 AM   #13 
  - So torture at Gitmo by USA is somehow related to Iran shooting people in the street?  high density   Jun-24-09 09:46 AM   #8 
  - just simplify to clarify:  mikelgb   Jun-24-09 10:00 AM   #16 
  - Except...  high density   Jun-24-09 11:08 AM   #34 
  - That's what I couldn't get either. n/t  vaberella   Jun-24-09 10:02 AM   #17 
  - Pictures and pictures  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:35 AM   #141 
  - Release photos of Timmy McVeigh's death shroud while we're at it  zulchzulu   Jun-24-09 09:50 AM   #11 
  - Timothy McVeigh was legally killed  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 09:52 AM   #12 
     - Neda was as well. nt  Occam Bandage   Jun-24-09 09:59 AM   #15 
     - Explain the law that resulted in the death of Neda n/t  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 10:02 AM   #18 
        - Iran does not have the same system of comprehensive legal protections America does.  Occam Bandage   Jun-24-09 10:14 AM   #21 
           - No, but they do have universal healthcare  Oregone   Jun-24-09 10:36 AM   #31 
     - But can't we see the pictures? Huh? Huh? Huh?  zulchzulu   Jun-24-09 11:50 AM   #45 
  - There's a reason they're laughing condescendingly. I fear Helen's heyday..  Tarheel_Dem   Jun-24-09 10:15 AM   #23 
  - Well, Helen has a history of being petty  Oregone   Jun-24-09 10:21 AM   #26 
  - No, Helen has a selective memory. I'm still waiting for her hitpiece on  Tarheel_Dem   Jun-24-09 10:57 AM   #33 
     - Oh Boy, So Helen's "Big Crime" Was Supporting Hillary?  Dinger   Jun-24-09 05:13 PM   #75 
     - Nope. Helen's big crime is intellectual dishonesty. She threw her full support  Tarheel_Dem   Jun-24-09 10:34 PM   #114 
        - I don't agree but your questions are definitely legitimate ones  Swagman   Jun-24-09 10:41 PM   #119 
     - Get over the primaries & take your blinders off. Not much has changed and Helen is pointing it out.  earth mom   Jun-24-09 07:07 PM   #88 
  - I see you as not getting over the primaries either. Guess you two are even.  Forkboy   Jun-24-09 11:20 AM   #36 
  - Helen Thomas supported Obama against McCain  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 11:36 AM   #40 
  - You take a journalist doing her job as an assault on the President?  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:38 AM   #142 
  - If you see the importance of Neda video, why do *we* keep killing Iraqis  Oregone   Jun-24-09 10:20 AM   #25 
  - Dancing around the truth, what a surprise.  Metta   Jun-24-09 10:21 AM   #27 
  - Oh dear. It appears it is time for Helen to retire as her mind is deteriorating.  GarbagemanLB   Jun-24-09 10:24 AM   #28 
  - Is Greenwald's mind deteriorating too?  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 11:34 AM   #38 
     - Glen Greenwald?  HiFructosePronSyrup   Jun-24-09 11:38 AM   #41 
        - That funny, because Obama reads Greenwald every day  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 11:50 AM   #44 
  - Is releasing the torture photos worth another uprising in Iraq?  ericgtr   Jun-24-09 10:26 AM   #29 
  - Its their country  Oregone   Jun-24-09 10:32 AM   #30 
  - ""Experts see no clear link between the Abu Ghraib and military deaths"  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 11:53 AM   #46 
  - You think the Iraqis don't already know what went on?  dflprincess   Jun-24-09 08:49 PM   #104 
  - Point?  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:41 AM   #143 
  - Go, Helen, go!  Vidar   Jun-24-09 10:54 AM   #32 
  - +1  emilyg   Jun-24-09 01:03 PM   #51 
  - I don't see the connection.  AtomicKitten   Jun-24-09 11:18 AM   #35 
  - Actually, it does, though I agree it needs some more context.  Forkboy   Jun-24-09 11:44 AM   #42 
     - Neda's murder was captured and sent out virtually real-time.  AtomicKitten   Jun-24-09 11:59 AM   #47 
  - He snubbed her  Politicalboi   Jun-24-09 12:08 PM   #48 
  - The question she blurted out, interrupting him?  Clio the Leo   Jun-24-09 12:49 PM   #50 
     - Oooh, the people dared to interrupt the President! How rude of the vox populi!  WinkyDink   Jun-24-09 02:50 PM   #57 
        - Nope and SHE is not God's gift to the White House ....  Clio the Leo   Jun-24-09 02:55 PM   #61 
           - Helen is certainly not God's Gift to the White House....  bvar22   Jun-24-09 03:34 PM   #65 
           - But you NEVER heard applause coming from me....  Clio the Leo   Jun-24-09 03:56 PM   #68 
           - Just heard on Thom Hartmann:  bvar22   Jun-24-09 05:11 PM   #74 
           - Are you speaking of press briefings or....  Clio the Leo   Jun-24-09 05:32 PM   #78 
           - No, they don't "prescreen" the questions. Whoever you heard on Hartman is incorrect.  FailureToCommunicate   Jun-24-09 07:48 PM   #96 
           - That was long before you showed up here, my dear.  QC   Jun-25-09 09:01 AM   #161 
              - Best post yet!  dgibby   Jun-25-09 10:26 AM   #166 
              - Short and sweet. Nailed it.  Jakes Progress   Jun-25-09 11:20 AM   #169 
           - Yep, the Obama administration is afraid millions here will rise up just like they did in Iran.  earth mom   Jun-24-09 07:10 PM   #89 
           - That's exactly what I was going to say about Helen. (eom)  dflprincess   Jun-24-09 08:52 PM   #105 
           - Spot on!  spoony   Jun-24-09 10:36 PM   #117 
           - This place reeks of hypocrisy from all quarters.  Stand and Fight   Jun-25-09 12:56 AM   #131 
           - Yeah, I'm pretty mortified by the hypocrisy of late  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:49 AM   #145 
           - I remember this  Eric_323   Jun-25-09 10:33 AM   #167 
           - It used to be, in the day of real journalism, that people did sometimes blurt out questions  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:44 AM   #144 
              - I'm wondering if this was the first press conference some people here have seen.  QC   Jun-25-09 04:58 PM   #179 
  - go Helen!  JustinL   Jun-24-09 12:35 PM   #49 
  - Apples and oranges. n/t  Political Tiger   Jun-24-09 01:13 PM   #52 
  - Maybe so as to not inflame those in Iran so they CAN turn against a radical regime  Jennicut   Jun-24-09 01:18 PM   #54 
  - Obama has said he wants to release them later as well. n/t  vaberella   Jun-24-09 02:54 PM   #60 
     - Prove it. You have been known to post fact free assertions and  seaglass   Jun-24-09 04:16 PM   #73 
  - But we have seen abuse photos and we've seen people shot in Iran  WIllo   Jun-24-09 01:34 PM   #55 
  - Laughter erupted? When the subjects at hand were a murdered girl and tortured men and boys?  WinkyDink   Jun-24-09 02:49 PM   #56 
  - Dumbest comparison I've ever heard. Time to retire Helen.  Phx_Dem   Jun-24-09 02:52 PM   #59 
  - It can't possibly be, it got 44 recs and counting. n/t  ProSense   Jun-24-09 07:53 PM   #97 
  - Its a crying shame that the same woman who was lavished  OwnedByFerrets   Jun-24-09 02:59 PM   #62 
  - I'm confused! I thought criticism was good and to be encouraged?  Political Tiger   Jun-24-09 03:20 PM   #63 
  - Do you think that asking Helen to retire is good criticism?  Sweet and Spicy   Jun-24-09 03:53 PM   #67 
  - "Not all criticism is created equal."  Political Tiger   Jun-24-09 04:09 PM   #72 
     - I think it was well said, actually  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:51 AM   #146 
  - She's doing the same thing she's done since Kennedy was president  dflprincess   Jun-24-09 08:56 PM   #106 
  - Criticism is one thing and it is appropriate  rpannier   Jun-24-09 10:28 PM   #113 
  - My feelings exactly.  bvar22   Jun-24-09 03:37 PM   #66 
  - Yep.  Forkboy   Jun-24-09 03:59 PM   #70 
  - no shoot..  frylock   Jun-24-09 09:27 PM   #109 
  - +1  Blue_Tires   Jun-24-09 04:01 PM   #71 
  - Okay, help me out  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:54 AM   #147 
     - it essentially means:  Blue_Tires   Jun-25-09 07:28 AM   #155 
        - I got the gist, I just hadn't seen a single post like that before say, two weeks ago  tavalon   Jun-25-09 05:57 PM   #180 
  - +2  leftstreet   Jun-25-09 12:30 AM   #127 
  - No, no, no... YOU forgot something!  Stand and Fight   Jun-25-09 12:59 AM   #132 
  - Not from me  tavalon   Jun-25-09 04:55 AM   #148 
  - I keep using this  spiritual_gunfighter   Jun-25-09 05:09 AM   #152 
  - That was a very different DU that sent roses to Helen Thomas. n/t  QC   Jun-25-09 08:58 AM   #158 
  - hypocrisysome have forgotten that truth is a virtue  fascisthunter   Jun-25-09 09:03 AM   #162 
  - More people might call for accountability, we cannot have that :( nt  slipslidingaway   Jun-24-09 03:29 PM   #64 
  - Give 'em hell, Helen!  bigwillq   Jun-24-09 03:57 PM   #69 
  - And now....Helen Thomas goes under the bus  Zodiak   Jun-24-09 05:16 PM   #76 
  - Bill Maher nails it with his latest video. There are 2 parties: center right party & the crazy party  earth mom   Jun-24-09 07:18 PM   #92 
  - I don't typically start OPs  Zodiak   Jun-25-09 04:36 PM   #176 
  - Soon To Add Seymour Hersh  NashVegas   Jun-25-09 04:10 PM   #175 
     - Why?  Zodiak   Jun-25-09 04:45 PM   #177 
  - And doing it now would be so much more effective, AND a challenge to the Iranians to do the same!  cascadiance   Jun-24-09 05:35 PM   #79 
  - Thank you Helen.  Gregorian   Jun-24-09 06:07 PM   #80 
  - I agree....  rustydad   Jun-24-09 06:17 PM   #82 
  - Helen is our National Treasure!  winyanstaz   Jun-24-09 07:00 PM   #87 
  - Helen Thomas IS NOW A COLUMNIST. Columnists don't get called on in WH press  FailureToCommunicate   Jun-24-09 07:26 PM   #93 
  - It's much easier to address Irans abuses than our own. That doesn't require US to change.  Wizard777   Jun-24-09 07:31 PM   #94 
  - Will noone rid me of this troublesome reporter?  billyoc   Jun-24-09 07:32 PM   #95 
  - LOL  Forkboy   Jun-24-09 07:59 PM   #99 
  - Perzackly.  WinkyDink   Jun-25-09 10:07 AM   #165 
  - ironically, releasing them would no doubt undermine even the Iran protesters by letting them say...  tomm2thumbs   Jun-24-09 07:57 PM   #98 
  - We do not need to see those pictures  Barbara2423   Jun-24-09 08:23 PM   #101 
  - long as a jury sees them.....  Alameda   Jun-24-09 10:36 PM   #116 
     - Best response ever!  tavalon   Jun-25-09 05:02 AM   #149 
  - Thanks, Helen Thomas! Hypocrites, beware. Helen Thomas is there.  JDPriestly   Jun-24-09 08:31 PM   #102 
  - Helen is my Heroine  Swagman   Jun-24-09 10:38 PM   #118 
  - The day the Neda video came out, I had exactly the same thought  Duer 157099   Jun-24-09 10:42 PM   #120 
  - I hope I'm still that sharp at her age.  girl gone mad   Jun-24-09 10:43 PM   #121 
  - Helen Thomas might not know what a "war crime" is?  boppers   Jun-24-09 11:45 PM   #126 
  - I will not -- in the interest of maintaining the party line -- knock down Helen Thomas.  Stand and Fight   Jun-25-09 12:46 AM   #129 
  - Helen is the best  Necon-Be-Gone   Jun-25-09 12:55 AM   #130 
  - Released photos WOULD taint a jury pool for the war crimes trial.  troubledamerican   Jun-25-09 01:14 AM   #133 
  - What war crimes trial?  tavalon   Jun-25-09 05:05 AM   #151 
  - Oh SNAP!  kenny blankenship   Jun-25-09 09:50 AM   #163 
  - Her analogy is flawed  karynnj   Jun-25-09 10:51 AM   #168 
  - Yeah. If Obama released those photos now,  bvar22   Jun-25-09 01:21 PM   #170 
     - The memos are more damning than the photos - and they are out  karynnj   Jun-25-09 03:13 PM   #172 
        - But aren't you worried that the photos will "Incite" people?  bvar22   Jun-25-09 03:30 PM   #173 
        - I respectfully disagree  karynnj   Jun-25-09 03:56 PM   #174 
        - Have you noticed that we the people are not very good at getting outraged by words  tavalon   Jun-25-09 06:02 PM   #181 
  - Good for Helen!  Starry Messenger   Jun-25-09 02:09 PM   #171 

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators

Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC