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Reply #86: the utter vacuousness of your argument is made plain by the use of the word "scum" [View All]

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Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
bread_and_roses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 02:39 PM
Response to Original message
86. the utter vacuousness of your argument is made plain by the use of the word "scum"
The need to dehumanize is not a characteristic of reasoned argument. It is a characteristic of demagoguery. As for the rest, it's hollowness has been well illustrated by mythsage and others above.
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  -All this outrage over the "prolonged detention" policy is premature and ignores what HAS changed. phleshdef  May-23-09 03:57 PM   #0 
  - Rec'd...thanks for your post. It's a mess and I'm glad he's working  firedupdem   May-23-09 04:06 PM   #1 
  - I agree with the primise of you OP, I wish I had a solution to this problem.  ZombieHorde   May-23-09 04:07 PM   #2 
  - Get your outrage in early  Uzybone   May-23-09 04:12 PM   #3 
  - You first. n/t  5X   May-23-09 04:13 PM   #4 
  - Adults Only!  NYC_SKP   May-23-09 04:27 PM   #5 
  - Well said. nt  quiet.american   May-23-09 05:25 PM   #6 
  - The outrage proves the adage that nothing is impossible to those who do not have to do it.  ClarkUSA   May-23-09 05:28 PM   #7 
  - Rubbish. Please find a human rights or constitutional scholar  EFerrari   May-24-09 01:14 AM   #22 
     - Constitutional scholar: John Yoo  Autonomy   May-24-09 02:19 PM   #84 
        - LOL! You're right about Yoo. But the specious privileging of  EFerrari   May-24-09 02:31 PM   #85 
  - "These people would kill you and your entire family just because you are American"  rug   May-23-09 05:47 PM   #8 
  - Thanks for thinking this  Cha   May-23-09 05:54 PM   #9 
  - "no one knows the details of how this is going to be carried out"  mzmolly   May-23-09 08:17 PM   #10 
  - oh stop it!  EquallyExhausted   May-23-09 09:18 PM   #11 
  - that's supposed to include snark tags  EquallyExhausted   May-23-09 09:20 PM   #12 
  - That's what I've been thinking......  FrenchieCat   May-23-09 11:23 PM   #13 
  - Too bad Rachel Maddow can't see it that way...  jenmito   May-23-09 11:39 PM   #15 
  - The mess that Bush left is horrible but Obama is responsible for his own positions.  EFerrari   May-24-09 12:37 AM   #19 
     - The other Dems need to have the light shown on them for their NIMBY bullshit also.  SemiCharmedQuark   May-24-09 01:33 AM   #24 
     - Absolutely. Our crazy uncles in the Senate and the weenies in the House  EFerrari   May-24-09 01:41 AM   #25 
     - God, I am so sick of the total turn around.......  springhill   May-24-09 02:33 AM   #26 
  - I always wanted to be the 24th person to recommend a thread!  jenmito   May-23-09 11:36 PM   #14 
  - We Should Call This What It Really Is -- Paranoid Detention  Senator   May-23-09 11:40 PM   #16 
  - How do you know for sure what the threat is?  creeksneakers2   May-24-09 03:02 PM   #87 
     - No one knows "for sure" ...  Senator   May-24-09 09:38 PM   #110 
  - Thank you for your thoughtful OP.  Brigid   May-24-09 12:11 AM   #17 
  - The administration presented an idea that is incompatible with the rule of law  EFerrari   May-24-09 12:36 AM   #18 
  - Bingo what EFerrari said  Vincardog   May-24-09 12:42 AM   #20 
  - You have no idea how this would be put into practice so you have no idea what its in line with.  phleshdef   May-24-09 06:03 AM   #27 
  - What difference does it make?  Raineyb   May-24-09 10:58 AM   #38 
  - Nope, the other guy's assumptions are better  DireStrike   May-24-09 11:12 AM   #47 
  - Why would you need details to know that holding someone without charging them  EFerrari   May-24-09 01:25 PM   #74 
  - Habeas corpus was so last century. Only the choir sings this is ok. nt  Mithreal   May-24-09 10:36 AM   #35 
     - The house band is a little off key  Moochy   May-24-09 12:14 PM   #58 
  - "To some degree it matters who's in office".........  flyarm   May-24-09 12:50 AM   #21 
  - I don't see what's so complicated here.  Usrename   May-24-09 01:30 AM   #23 
  - Here here!  grahamhgreen   May-24-09 09:30 AM   #30 
  - Basic human rights aren't in style when the President says so. nt  Mithreal   May-24-09 10:38 AM   #36 
  - Presumption of innocence doesn't apply to external threats  geek tragedy   May-24-09 11:01 AM   #41 
  - Considering he is a human being, the Constitution does  Mithreal   May-24-09 11:21 AM   #50 
  - If he is considered a person...  Usrename   May-25-09 09:57 AM   #117 
  - It's not that clear because this resembles a war  creeksneakers2   May-24-09 03:06 PM   #88 
     - I guess they are a separate sub-species of non-humans.  Usrename   May-25-09 09:52 AM   #116 
  - Thank you for the thoughtful OP nt  Adelante   May-24-09 07:51 AM   #28 
  - Most of the people detained have been innocent. Your logic is tortured.  grahamhgreen   May-24-09 09:27 AM   #29 
  - He's attacking habeus corpus and our constitution - you know, the costitution he swore to defend,  grahamhgreen   May-24-09 09:40 AM   #31 
  - Right on, and I am sure he can find some lawyers to defend his position  Mithreal   May-24-09 10:44 AM   #37 
  - First you have to have EVIDENCE, most of these people are guilty because?  HillbillyBob   May-24-09 09:57 AM   #32 
  - If there were real evidence they could be tried.  Mithreal   May-24-09 01:32 PM   #75 
  - Don't pretend to know us.  mmonk   May-24-09 10:06 AM   #33 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   May-24-09 11:01 AM   #42 
     - It's unconstitutional pure and simple.  mmonk   May-24-09 11:13 AM   #48 
     - Geek hasn't read the Constitution. nt  Mithreal   May-24-09 11:22 AM   #51 
     - I'm all for people reading it and highly recommend it.  mmonk   May-24-09 11:41 AM   #53 
        - The problem is you only think you understand  geek tragedy   May-24-09 12:18 PM   #62 
           - The problem is without evidence, one tends to play god.  mmonk   May-24-09 01:43 PM   #78 
           - I apologize for my directness.  mmonk   May-24-09 02:12 PM   #83 
           - We all know what the Constitution doesn't say.  Mithreal   May-24-09 04:32 PM   #102 
           - It entitles them to a fair trial and theright to challenge their detention in court, this is what  grahamhgreen   May-24-09 07:24 PM   #107 
              - The right to challenge their detention, yes.  geek tragedy   May-25-09 09:29 AM   #112 
     - Congress has the power to declare war  creeksneakers2   May-24-09 03:12 PM   #89 
        - I see no reason to abandon our laws because a war is declared.  mmonk   May-24-09 03:28 PM   #94 
           - The SCOTUS has ruled that the government has to provide  geek tragedy   May-25-09 09:35 AM   #115 
     - Yes, you are.  Forkboy   May-24-09 11:43 AM   #54 
  - The outrage is not "premature."  noamnety   May-24-09 10:26 AM   #34 
  - MOST detainees will in fact be tried so the ones that are innocent will likely be let go.  phleshdef   May-24-09 10:59 AM   #39 
     - "known terrorists" can't be tried like anybody else?  ima_sinnic   May-24-09 11:18 AM   #49 
     - It's possible to be certain and unable to hold a trial  creeksneakers2   May-24-09 03:17 PM   #91 
        - how convenient, that the informant "can't be revealed"  ima_sinnic   May-24-09 03:29 PM   #95 
           - I also said confirmed by a listening device  creeksneakers2   May-24-09 03:49 PM   #97 
              - gee, how do people ever get busted for conspiracy and brought to trial?  ima_sinnic   May-24-09 05:34 PM   #104 
                 - The stakes  creeksneakers2   May-24-09 07:39 PM   #108 
     - you mean like the 10 year old and 14 & 15 year old boys sent to Gitmo by Bush??????  flyarm   May-24-09 12:23 PM   #65 
        - Excessive overreacting, throwing out silly scenarious and using a billion ??? characters...  phleshdef   May-26-09 09:07 AM   #121 
  - I can't believe so many people support this.  DireStrike   May-24-09 11:00 AM   #40 
  - Belonging to an organization dedicated to killing Americans  geek tragedy   May-24-09 11:02 AM   #43 
  - Do they actually get little Al Qaeda membership cards now?  noamnety   May-24-09 11:04 AM   #44 
  - They train at AQ camps, they swear allegiance, same  geek tragedy   May-24-09 12:15 PM   #60 
     - How do you know they trained at AQ camps or swore allegiance?  Bjorn Against   May-24-09 12:38 PM   #70 
     - Federal courts will be the judge of that.  geek tragedy   May-25-09 09:34 AM   #114 
        - If they were all getting trials in federal court we wouldn't be debating this.  Bjorn Against   May-25-09 10:41 AM   #119 
           - AQ members aren't entitled to trials.  geek tragedy   May-25-09 11:45 AM   #120 
     - First, there isn't any evidence of that with the vast majority of these people.  noamnety   May-24-09 01:34 PM   #76 
        - excellent analogy! I will have to use that in these threads  ima_sinnic   May-24-09 06:32 PM   #106 
        - If they belong to an enemy organization like AQ, that  geek tragedy   May-25-09 09:32 AM   #113 
  - The Constitution is stronger than your demonstrated fears. nt  Mithreal   May-24-09 11:07 AM   #45 
  - And you don't see the potential for abuse made possible by that framework?  DireStrike   May-24-09 11:08 AM   #46 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   May-24-09 12:13 PM   #57 
     - Deleted message  Name removed   May-24-09 12:19 PM   #64 
     - That is not what the previous poster said.  Bjorn Against   May-24-09 12:39 PM   #71 
  - ooohhhh, hide under the bed!!! oh, I AM SO AFWAID!!!  ima_sinnic   May-24-09 11:23 AM   #52 
  - Deleted sub-thread  Name removed   May-24-09 11:44 AM   #55 
  - Deleted sub-thread  Name removed   May-24-09 11:59 AM   #56 
  - The far left like Pat Tillman?  EFerrari   May-24-09 01:55 PM   #80 
  - This is DU  Moochy   May-24-09 12:15 PM   #59 
     - Do you really think Obama is further from the American mainstream  geek tragedy   May-24-09 12:16 PM   #61 
     - I have NEVER seen a "free the terrorists" post from a non-low-post troll poster  LostinVA   May-24-09 12:19 PM   #63 
     - Nah...  Mythsaje   May-24-09 12:34 PM   #67 
     - LOL  EFerrari   May-24-09 01:52 PM   #79 
     - Yes, the opposition are Marxists.  Mythsaje   May-24-09 12:35 PM   #68 
  - Have to disagree strongly. No more indefinite detentions!  jonestonesusa   May-24-09 12:31 PM   #66 
  - "President Obama Announces Tribunal Changes That Bring Them In Line With The Rule Of Law"  ClarkUSA   May-24-09 03:35 PM   #96 
  - I totally disagree. Either we are a nation of laws or we are not. In the  MasonJar   May-24-09 12:36 PM   #69 
  - Bullshit......  Tangerine LaBamba   May-24-09 12:41 PM   #72 
  - CO-SIGN  DerekJ   May-24-09 03:55 PM   # 
  - Ah, the "These are evil bad terrible terrorist evil dudes" defense. Where have I heard that before?  dorkulon   May-24-09 12:57 PM   #73 
  - Unlimited imprisonment without due process is a violation of the Constitution. Period.  Better Believe It   May-24-09 01:39 PM   #77 
  - Who said "unlimited imprisonment" but you? Pres. Obama restored due process for detainees.  ClarkUSA   May-24-09 03:27 PM   #93 
     - With all due respect, Obama doesn't make law.  mmonk   May-24-09 03:55 PM   #98 
        - I never said he could "make law"; however these immediate rule changes were made by executive order.  ClarkUSA   May-24-09 04:08 PM   #101 
           - I have one big problem with giving the DOJ and Congress any more time.  mmonk   May-25-09 09:09 AM   #111 
  - lol "terrorist scum". Maybe most people who are arrested are criminal scum  LittleBlue   May-24-09 02:09 PM   #81 
  - How Long? How Long Has This Been Going On??? IT IS NOW TIME  ChiciB1   May-24-09 02:11 PM   #82 
  - the utter vacuousness of your argument is made plain by the use of the word "scum"  bread_and_roses   May-24-09 02:39 PM   #86 
  - I agree with you. Now, in the meantime,  Enthusiast   May-24-09 03:15 PM   #90 
  - K & R  creeksneakers2   May-24-09 03:22 PM   #92 
  - I asked my self, would a president voluntarily restrict his executive powers?!  DerekJ   May-24-09 03:59 PM   #99 
  - To make excuses to keep human beings locked up indefinitely is just wrong...  winyanstaz   May-24-09 04:07 PM   #100 
  - Let's Not Criticize Obama!  placton   May-24-09 05:20 PM   #103 
  - Ah, I was waiting for someone to trot out that ol' red herring again. Epic fail...  ClarkUSA   May-24-09 06:05 PM   #105 
  - Who said that?  creeksneakers2   May-24-09 07:53 PM   #109 
  - dangerous precedent  thread-bear   May-25-09 10:26 AM   #118 
 

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