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Reply #119: People like Warren will NEVER change. [View All]

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Starbucks Anarchist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-18-08 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #118
119. People like Warren will NEVER change.
It's pointless to have a dialogue with them.

This is like asking MLK to sit down with George Wallace.
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  -The more I hear both sides complain, the more I like Obama's choice of Rick Warren gravity  Dec-18-08 12:12 PM   #0 
  - Fuck that -- I have no desire to find "common ground" with bigots  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 12:13 PM   #1 
  - Seconded.  Dennis Donovan   Dec-18-08 12:16 PM   #5 
  - Thirded.  bvar22   Dec-18-08 12:31 PM   #29 
     - Fourthed.  lwcon   Dec-22-08 10:45 AM   #186 
  - and thus, ironically, you become part of the problem. Someone has to be the grown up  cryingshame   Dec-18-08 12:27 PM   #21 
  - THANK YOU  dave29   Dec-18-08 12:34 PM   #35 
  - Fuck that -- NO COMMON GROUND WITH BIGOTS  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 12:36 PM   #38 
     - Your attitude means no further progress in society. That's okay, those of us committed to changing  cryingshame   Dec-18-08 01:02 PM   #63 
     - The "problem" is we do have common ground with Warren whether you like it or not  dmesg   Dec-22-08 09:05 AM   #175 
        - Warren's contribution to AIDS is to spread AIDS in Africa  IndianaGreen   Dec-22-08 10:18 AM   #182 
           - That's a gross simplification of what he's done on AIDS  dmesg   Dec-22-08 10:22 AM   #184 
  - +1!!!  scheming daemons   Dec-18-08 12:35 PM   #36 
  - +2  jakem   Dec-18-08 12:39 PM   #40 
  - -2  Dennis Donovan   Dec-18-08 12:50 PM   #52 
     - cheater. nt  jakem   Dec-18-08 12:52 PM   #53 
     - +4  snooper2   Dec-18-08 01:56 PM   #107 
        - -infinity  Dennis Donovan   Dec-18-08 02:07 PM   #114 
  - Why can't Warren the bigot be the grown-up?  Starbucks Anarchist   Dec-18-08 12:42 PM   #45 
  - Because he's too busy making millions and getting off on being powerful. You & I on the other hand,  cryingshame   Dec-18-08 01:03 PM   #67 
  - And we can get "there" without him.  Starbucks Anarchist   Dec-18-08 01:05 PM   #70 
  - Denying someone's existence is an extreme form of violence.  cryingshame   Dec-18-08 01:07 PM   #72 
     - Denying someone's existence... like Prop 8, which Warren vocally supported?  Starbucks Anarchist   Dec-18-08 01:09 PM   #78 
        - Yes, I do. BTW, this is exactly why comedians like Jon Stewart are so important in changing society  cryingshame   Dec-18-08 01:16 PM   #86 
           - So you think ignoring/despising Warren is on par with doing the same with gays?  Starbucks Anarchist   Dec-18-08 01:18 PM   #90 
              - It's just as counter-productive to progressing the cause of social justice  cryingshame   Dec-18-08 01:48 PM   #105 
                 - You're right, we should just play nice.  Starbucks Anarchist   Dec-18-08 01:54 PM   #106 
                    - Where did I say we should just play nice? And yes, grown ups tend to act respectfully  cryingshame   Dec-18-08 02:23 PM   #118 
                       - People like Warren will NEVER change.  Starbucks Anarchist   Dec-18-08 02:24 PM   #119 
                          - word up!  frylock   Dec-18-08 02:27 PM   #123 
                          - Sorry, replied to the wrong post!  Moderate Dem   Dec-18-08 02:39 PM   # 
                          - I think MLK would have gladly sat down with George Wallace.  Moderate Dem   Dec-18-08 02:41 PM   #134 
                          - Shirley Chisholm did  loyalsister   Dec-18-08 02:44 PM   #135 
                          - Guess what? Wallace DID change.  Odin2005   Dec-21-08 10:09 PM   #146 
                          - After he was shot!  IndianaGreen   Dec-21-08 10:45 PM   #150 
                          - self delete  mondo joe   Dec-21-08 11:58 PM   #164 
                          - But not because his opponents ever said "Hey, he may have a point there--  eridani   Dec-23-08 10:56 PM   #190 
                          - Having a dialogue with him does not require honoring him with the  No Elephants   Dec-21-08 11:59 PM   #166 
  - Mana from heaven comes in the form of  mrone2   Dec-18-08 01:07 PM   #71 
  - Because we who are grown-up have to show him (and those like him) the way...  stevietheman   Dec-22-08 01:17 AM   #168 
  - Please try to understand this: Bigots are to be SHUNNED, not LEGITIMIZED...  Dennis Donovan   Dec-18-08 12:49 PM   #50 
  - What are you trying to accomplish?  gravity   Dec-18-08 12:57 PM   #55 
  - i agree with you  mkultra   Dec-18-08 12:59 PM   #58 
  - You don't honor them into agreeing with you either.  dbonds   Dec-18-08 01:01 PM   #61 
  - But you have to respect them as a human being  gravity   Dec-18-08 01:08 PM   #74 
     - That is the crux of the issue, they don't respect us and wish us harm.  dbonds   Dec-18-08 01:14 PM   #82 
        - Do you know how to get people to respect you?  gravity   Dec-18-08 01:17 PM   #87 
           - Sorry, you just don't get it.  dbonds   Dec-18-08 01:24 PM   #94 
           - They never had respect for gay people  gravity   Dec-18-08 01:36 PM   #102 
              - They have to call off the war first.  dbonds   Dec-18-08 01:45 PM   #104 
                 - You sound jus like * regarding Iran. n/t  yowzayowzayowza   Dec-18-08 01:56 PM   #108 
                 - You sound like an idiot.  dbonds   Dec-18-08 02:03 PM   #110 
                    - .  yowzayowzayowza   Dec-18-08 02:35 PM   #128 
                 - And that is why we are in a stalemate  gravity   Dec-18-08 02:04 PM   #111 
                    - The mistake here is thinking you will win their hearts.  dbonds   Dec-18-08 02:24 PM   #120 
                       - But we don't even have enough hearts to get it passed in California  gravity   Dec-18-08 02:30 PM   #125 
                          - My take on CA...  dbonds   Dec-18-08 02:34 PM   #127 
                          - Your buddy Warren made sure of that  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 02:56 PM   #138 
           - You have got to be kidding me  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 01:32 PM   #98 
           - There's respect and then there's a national platform.  Raineyb   Dec-22-08 10:02 AM   #178 
  - It's one thing to talk to them, it's completely another to honor them...  Dennis Donovan   Dec-18-08 01:10 PM   #79 
  - As a former fundamentalist, all I can say is Wake the hell up.  donco6   Dec-18-08 02:38 PM   #130 
  - You're the only fundamentalist capable of changing?  WonderGrunion   Dec-22-08 10:18 AM   #181 
  - DU talking about Warren sounds like Bush talking about Ahmadinajad NT  dmesg   Dec-22-08 09:07 AM   #176 
  - so you think shunning bigotry will actually make things better? Good thing MLK didn't agree  cryingshame   Dec-18-08 01:18 PM   #89 
  - He most certainly DID shun bigotry. Do you THINK he tried to find common ground?  Dennis Donovan   Dec-18-08 01:21 PM   #93 
  - Like Senator Byrd?  WonderGrunion   Dec-22-08 10:19 AM   #183 
  - Being a wimp isn't being a grown up, don't flatter yourself with that.  dbonds   Dec-18-08 12:59 PM   #59 
  - I do support some of the discussion his choice has sparked on DU...  AntiFascist   Dec-21-08 08:41 PM   #141 
  - Yes, but inviting someone to give an invocation is not doing the hard work  No Elephants   Dec-21-08 11:53 PM   #161 
  - Here! Here! nt  verges   Dec-21-08 11:58 PM   #165 
  - Warren already guaranteed no common ground can be found.  IWantAnyDem   Dec-22-08 05:46 AM   #171 
  - Agreed.  Neecy   Dec-18-08 12:39 PM   #41 
  - then im sure you wont.  mkultra   Dec-18-08 12:46 PM   #49 
  - Wish I coudl rec a response. n/t  IWantAnyDem   Dec-18-08 01:16 PM   #84 
  - Thanks  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 01:32 PM   #99 
  - its hard to find common ground when one side isn't even viewed  roguevalley   Dec-18-08 02:22 PM   #117 
  - I'm gay, and I do have the desire to find common ground with them.  stevietheman   Dec-22-08 01:16 AM   #167 
  - Nor do I!  Mad_Dem_X   Dec-22-08 09:02 AM   #174 
  - Do you believe that Sen. Byrd  WonderGrunion   Dec-22-08 10:15 AM   #180 
  - The irony in your final sentence boggles the mind.  leftofthedial   Dec-18-08 12:13 PM   #2 
  - LOL  Zenlitened   Dec-18-08 12:27 PM   #22 
  - sure, throwing women and gays under the bus  musette_sf   Dec-18-08 12:13 PM   #3 
  - But hey, The Inaugeral Committe says Warren is an advocate for "social justice", except of course  saracat   Dec-18-08 12:19 PM   #9 
  - Warren is a disappointing choice, but I don't feel in any way thrown under the bus  Truth Hurts A Lot   Dec-18-08 12:26 PM   #19 
     - glad to hear you like triangulation  musette_sf   Dec-18-08 12:27 PM   #20 
        - Things aren't always black and white. There's a vast  Truth Hurts A Lot   Dec-18-08 12:28 PM   #23 
        - i was willing to live with that grey area  musette_sf   Dec-18-08 12:30 PM   #25 
        - Which of your basic human rights shall we consign to that gray area?  QC   Dec-18-08 12:43 PM   #46 
           - Again, as a woman, I don't feel my human rights have been taken away  Truth Hurts A Lot   Dec-18-08 12:50 PM   #51 
              - No, your rights haven't been taken away.  QC   Dec-18-08 01:05 PM   #69 
              - good line...  gblady   Dec-22-08 10:31 AM   #185 
        - No he hasn't failed. Give him a chance.  Roberto1223   Dec-18-08 01:09 PM   #77 
  - was it Warrens comparison of homosexuals to rapists and child molesters that won you over?  chimpsrsmarter   Dec-18-08 12:16 PM   #4 
  - It is his commitment to fighting poverty and AIDS in Africa  gravity   Dec-18-08 12:17 PM   #6 
  - oh okay, thanks for clearing that up, i can see how that makes up for his statements.  chimpsrsmarter   Dec-18-08 12:18 PM   #8 
  - Yeah, because no Liberal Christian clergy fight poverty or do AIDS Outreach  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 12:20 PM   #11 
  - The point is that he is one of the few, if the only, big pastor on the right who has shown movement  GarbagemanLB   Dec-18-08 12:24 PM   #16 
  - And that is so much more important than the civil rights of American citizens!  saracat   Dec-18-08 12:23 PM   #14 
  - Global poverty is pretty damn important too  gravity   Dec-18-08 12:30 PM   #26 
     - Does that work better for you than going to the Chiropractor???  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 12:31 PM   #28 
     - you're missing the point, his "work" on fighting poverty and aids allows him to make  chimpsrsmarter   Dec-18-08 01:10 PM   #80 
     - DOH! You are right!!!  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 02:05 PM   #112 
        - I'm just here to help.  chimpsrsmarter   Dec-18-08 02:20 PM   #115 
           - I appreciate straight people telling me how to think -- it makes things easier  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 02:21 PM   #116 
              - indeed it is, it's way past bonkers.  chimpsrsmarter   Dec-18-08 02:32 PM   #126 
                 - Rationalizations as twisted as a pretzel  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 02:38 PM   #131 
     - :)  Bluebear   Dec-23-08 10:07 PM   #188 
     - THe ignorance displayed is monumental. Ever hear of Kitchen table issues?  saracat   Dec-18-08 12:38 PM   #39 
  - That's great, since he opposes conom distribution to fight AIDS.  mondo joe   Dec-21-08 11:53 PM   #162 
  - You dodged chimpsrsmarter's question: was it Warren's comparison of homosexuals to rapists & child m  David Zephyr   Dec-21-08 10:19 PM   #148 
  - How special for you.  pecwae   Dec-18-08 12:17 PM   #7 
  - Hey Lincoln! Get some pro slavery people up there.  Neshanic   Dec-18-08 12:19 PM   #10 
  - Andrew Johnson  quakerboy   Dec-18-08 12:58 PM   #57 
  - No fucking common ground with bigots and hatemongers.  dbonds   Dec-18-08 12:21 PM   #12 
  - I think we need at least 20 more threads  Mudoria   Dec-18-08 12:23 PM   #13 
  - Yay! Common ground with hatemongers!  Bluebear   Dec-18-08 12:24 PM   #15 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Dec-18-08 12:25 PM   #17 
  - Deleted sub-thread  Name removed   Dec-18-08 12:25 PM   #18 
  - If the far side of both sides hate it, you know it's probably good  alwysdrunk   Dec-18-08 12:28 PM   #24 
  - Why yes, I DO want to obliterate bigotry and discrimination  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 12:30 PM   #27 
  - You don't extinguish the Darkness, you turn on a Light  cryingshame   Dec-18-08 02:26 PM   #122 
  - Are you insane--- the FAR side, we are talking about bigotry and hate.  dbonds   Dec-18-08 12:32 PM   #31 
  - I have the same position that you have  alwysdrunk   Dec-18-08 12:36 PM   #37 
     - This isn't a litmus test of a theoretical issue. This is every bit a safety issue.  dbonds   Dec-18-08 12:42 PM   #44 
  - So the gays and lesbians = the "far" side to you.  Bluebear   Dec-18-08 12:39 PM   #42 
  - No, just the ones blowing this out of proportion  alwysdrunk   Dec-18-08 12:45 PM   #47 
     - And what is "blowing it out of proportion" -- serious question  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 01:08 PM   #73 
     - I see you haven't answered my question yet  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 01:33 PM   #100 
        - Ha! have you read DU today  alwysdrunk   Dec-18-08 01:38 PM   #103 
           - It's exactly like inviting a Klansman,a nd he is legitimizing the bigot's POV  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 02:06 PM   #113 
  - So now you have to be to the far left to oppose the likes of Warren?  Raineyb   Dec-22-08 10:14 AM   #179 
  - You don't understand the difference between  nichomachus   Dec-18-08 12:32 PM   #30 
  - you are disgusting  Skittles   Dec-18-08 12:32 PM   #32 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Dec-18-08 12:32 PM   #33 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Dec-18-08 12:40 PM   #43 
  - Wasn't that a Green Day song?  Dennis Donovan   Dec-18-08 12:56 PM   #54 
  - If you haven't noticed this choice is not bringing people together, it is tearing us apart.  MN Against Bush   Dec-18-08 12:34 PM   #34 
  - It is angering to those who want to fight.  mkultra   Dec-18-08 12:58 PM   #56 
  - It is impossible to be inclusive of both bigots and the victims of bigotry  MN Against Bush   Dec-18-08 01:01 PM   #62 
     - lol. How very assumptive of you.  mkultra   Dec-18-08 01:02 PM   #64 
        - What I said is the truth whether you like it or not.  MN Against Bush   Dec-18-08 01:14 PM   #81 
           - actually, neither your assumption nor your foolish approach are true  mkultra   Dec-18-08 01:27 PM   #96 
              - Cut from the same cloth? Please.  MN Against Bush   Dec-18-08 02:01 PM   #109 
              - Please link to an LGBT site that advocates stripping civil rights from straights n/t  eridani   Dec-24-08 12:00 AM   #191 
  - Not people who think it's not that big a deal  alwysdrunk   Dec-18-08 01:02 PM   #65 
     - So what about Warren's views aren't a big deal?  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 01:08 PM   #76 
     - The ones he will be giving at the event  alwysdrunk   Dec-18-08 01:18 PM   #88 
        - Legitimizing his views by placing him at the forefront and letting him invoke God?  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 01:34 PM   #101 
     - Many do think it is a big deal though, this decision is not unifying for those who condemn bigotry  MN Against Bush   Dec-18-08 01:16 PM   #85 
  - I totally agree with you  RoadRage   Dec-18-08 12:46 PM   #48 
  - So how'd that meeting go with the Grand Wizard of the KKK, David Duke, and  Malikshah   Dec-18-08 01:00 PM   #60 
  - throwing a bone to the fundies.  pansypoo53219   Dec-18-08 01:02 PM   #66 
  - Fuck that-  Marrah_G   Dec-18-08 01:04 PM   #68 
  - Why didn't Rick Warren campaign with Obama?  leftstreet   Dec-18-08 01:08 PM   #75 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Dec-18-08 01:15 PM   #83 
  - This is the Fox News "fair and balanced" argument that tries to  sfexpat2000   Dec-18-08 01:19 PM   #91 
  - Nicely done!  leftstreet   Dec-18-08 01:20 PM   #92 
  - Yep. The "both sides" argument is almost always bull  sampsonblk   Dec-21-08 10:58 PM   #153 
  - Yes, the choice of Warren certainly has united Obama's supporters.  yardwork   Dec-18-08 01:26 PM   #95 
  - The trouble is, Warren isn't part of the political spectrum, he's a bigot and homophobe  MadHound   Dec-18-08 01:28 PM   #97 
  - So....David Duke will also speak? Common ground and all...  Evergreen Emerald   Dec-18-08 02:25 PM   #121 
  - Yeah, why the Hell not?  Sebastian Doyle   Dec-21-08 08:47 PM   #143 
  - Yeah, I'm farting rainbows of joy right now. n/t  donco6   Dec-18-08 02:28 PM   #124 
  - Face it, this forum has a lot of "far leftists"...  Moderate Dem   Dec-18-08 02:38 PM   #129 
  - hahahahaha --DU HAS ALOT OF "FAR LEFTISTS"???????  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 02:39 PM   #132 
     - You disagree?  Moderate Dem   Dec-18-08 02:44 PM   #136 
        - Three things  LostinVA   Dec-18-08 02:55 PM   #137 
        - "Mocking attitude"  IAmJacksSmirkingRevenge   Dec-18-08 02:58 PM   #139 
  - I agree with you  DeschutesRiver   Dec-18-08 02:41 PM   #133 
  - It's very Matt Santos...  mwei924   Dec-18-08 06:02 PM   #140 
  - And the only two places on earth where you'll find "reasonable" Republicans anymore  Sebastian Doyle   Dec-21-08 08:45 PM   #142 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Dec-21-08 08:47 PM   #144 
  - Sure, Rick Warren is a fine example of how Obama will bring this nation together  IndianaGreen   Dec-21-08 08:55 PM   #145 
  - When I saw that both extreme ends were bitching I knew Obama must be doing something right.  Odin2005   Dec-21-08 10:15 PM   #147 
  - i agree with ya on that n/t  Bodhi BloodWave   Dec-21-08 10:44 PM   #149 
  - I suppose Nelson Mandela was totalitarian for insisting on the end of apartheid  IndianaGreen   Dec-21-08 10:49 PM   #151 
  - No, but he didn't have to problem talking with racists.  Odin2005   Dec-21-08 10:55 PM   #152 
     - Dr. King's words don't apply to gays, eh? You should be ashamed of yourself.  Bluebear   Dec-21-08 11:24 PM   #156 
     - Coretta Scott King said those words directly applied to gays. Are you a greater authority  mondo joe   Dec-21-08 11:55 PM   #163 
        - Do you run away from every threat?  yowzayowzayowza   Dec-22-08 03:19 AM   #169 
           - When did I run away?  mondo joe   Dec-22-08 09:22 AM   #177 
  - "Extreme ends" = gays and lesbians, yes?  Bluebear   Dec-21-08 11:23 PM   #155 
  - "gays = child molesters" vs "no we're not" is now two extreme ends.  mondo joe   Dec-21-08 11:51 PM   #160 
  - I don't have "common ground" with Nazis nor do I associate with trash that does....  Rowdyboy   Dec-21-08 11:18 PM   #154 
  - Yes, after all we need to learn how to reach out to bigots and homophobes,  MadHound   Dec-21-08 11:39 PM   #157 
  - Both sides of the political spectrum? First, the "political spectrum"  No Elephants   Dec-21-08 11:44 PM   #158 
  - I look forward to your future appalling disappointment.  mondo joe   Dec-21-08 11:50 PM   #159 
  - Don't hold your breath.  The Godfather   Dec-22-08 07:16 AM   #172 
  - I've been thinking this also.  Skidmore   Dec-22-08 05:38 AM   #170 
  - I'm waiting to see how much Warren  bigwillq   Dec-22-08 07:37 AM   #173 
  - the great thing about the internet is no one is ashamed of publicly displaying stupidity  lionesspriyanka   Dec-22-08 10:54 AM   #187 
  - Yes, for 8 years the complaint was Bush divided a nation staying on either side of that divide is >  cooolandrew   Dec-23-08 10:12 PM   #189 

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