HughBeaumont
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Thu Nov-20-08 04:51 AM
Response to Original message |
| 137. Apparently no one ever saw "The Big One". |
|
The Clinton fluffers need to watch that movie, lest they forget about the supposed "prosperity" blue collar workers "acheived". A continuation of the shittiest aspects of Reaganomics WASN'T a step in the right direction; can the NAFTA/free trade defenders (one of them being Mrs. Clinton herself) tell us all NOW that bit of Republican legislation (and the Pukes get no free pass either, as NAFTA was around since the Reagan/Bewsh I years) was a success to working Americans? Or for that matter, working Canadians or Mexicans? It exacerbated the race to the bottom, with plants being moved to cheaper pastures, often to Mexico or the corporate American slave state known as China. The Big One highlights the Great Job/Risk shift in it's adolescence; practices that would become common in the corporation-friendly Bewsh administration.
The signing of the 1996 Telecommunications Act was also a death knell in making our voice heard. It's the reason the conservative pro-corporate, pro-war, anti-worker, fear-overdrive message was allowed to creep into our lives to stay. It sort of reared it's ugly head in the 80s on occasion (remember The Day After?), but went into full throttle in the late 90s, with powerful conservatives actually dictating the message and memes each week. It made way for our own mild versions of "Two Minutes Hate".
While good things did happen under Clinton, so did a lot of bad things. Obama HAS to discourage the unbridled corporatism of neo-Reaganomics. Our country is not going to survive any longer if we continue with what's failed. Rights HAVE to be given back to workers. Rich people have WAY too much power, wealth and influence. That NEEDS to be reversed and FAST. Strong economies employ EVERYONE, not just the heavily degreed and privileged (which, as the Bewsh-conomy showed, is no longer a guarantee of job security). When we're laying off people with Masters Degrees, you gotta step back and think "what the hell is wrong with this picture and how do I make it STOP"?
The answer is go back to Keynes economics. Slow, boring, but EFFECTIVE. Problem is, Infrastructure/green investment is going to cost money we don't have, thanks to Bewsh's looting of the treasury and bankrupting of the country. Obama's got a nice ball and chain around his ankle and he's not even started. And that's what pisses me off the most.
|
| -Why are some people here STILL trying to silence progressive dissent? |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 12:38 PM |
#0 |
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I didn't realize the last dem administration was a failure. |
OhioBlues |
Nov-19-08 12:40 PM |
#1 |
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It certainly was to the middle class and working americans in many ways |
OwnedByFerrets |
Nov-19-08 12:52 PM |
#21 |
| -
maybe you can find yourself in here somewhere... |
paulk |
Nov-19-08 01:33 PM |
#64 |
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Thank you for the link..... |
OwnedByFerrets |
Nov-19-08 05:03 PM |
#115 |
| -
Just look at the economy under Clinton |
olegramps |
Nov-20-08 05:57 AM |
#138 |
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In many, many ways it was. |
girl gone mad |
Nov-19-08 03:18 PM |
#108 |
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Clinton was one of the most accomplished presidents in history. |
niceypoo |
Nov-19-08 03:23 PM |
#109 |
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OMG, I really cant believe you said that he reversed Reaganomics |
OwnedByFerrets |
Nov-19-08 05:05 PM |
#116 |
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Compare the gap between rich and poor... |
Virginia Dare |
Nov-20-08 02:29 PM |
#153 |
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Of course he did NOT. The fact that it happened |
OwnedByFerrets |
Nov-20-08 02:48 PM |
#158 |
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If Clinton had reversed Reaganomics we wouldn't be in the hole we're in now |
Raineyb |
Nov-19-08 08:37 PM |
#122 |
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We're in this hole because Bush practiced Reaganomics with no controls or oversight.. |
Virginia Dare |
Nov-20-08 02:25 PM |
#152 |
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in this way it failed |
Two Americas |
Nov-19-08 06:29 PM |
#120 |
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Clinton was the best Republican President we've ever had. And the most successful. |
baldguy |
Nov-19-08 09:00 PM |
#124 |
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No one's silencing us. If they were, posts would be locked and people would be tombstoned. |
Bicoastal |
Nov-19-08 12:41 PM |
# |
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*facepalm* |
Alter Ego |
Nov-19-08 12:41 PM |
#2 |
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I've been mouthing off right along. |
Deep13 |
Nov-19-08 12:41 PM |
#3 |
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Everyone has the right to display ignorance or stupidity |
dmordue |
Nov-19-08 12:41 PM |
#4 |
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That's right: is the enemy |
BeFree |
Nov-19-08 12:41 PM |
#5 |
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It's all those posters who've basically said that because Kucinich didn't make much of a showing |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 12:45 PM |
#9 |
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Yeah different |
BeFree |
Nov-19-08 12:53 PM |
#23 |
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That's not my intent. I'm just in here standing up for my principles. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 12:56 PM |
#26 |
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Yes, indeed |
BeFree |
Nov-19-08 01:04 PM |
#44 |
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each other |
Two Americas |
Nov-20-08 01:17 AM |
#127 |
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People on the left seem to forget |
maseman |
Nov-20-08 06:40 AM |
#140 |
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define "hard left" |
Two Americas |
Nov-20-08 02:48 PM |
#159 |
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The litmus test for a true progressive is to be a Kucinich supporter? |
Virginia Dare |
Nov-20-08 02:31 PM |
#154 |
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And dissenting just for the sake of dissenting is idiotic |
stevenleser |
Nov-19-08 01:43 PM |
#67 |
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Not "progressive" just "rational" to question HRC SoS rumors -- Quals and Fit is NOT best |
Sensitivity |
Nov-19-08 12:42 PM |
#6 |
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8 years of peace and prosperity is a failure? |
deadmessengers |
Nov-19-08 12:44 PM |
#7 |
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NOT bashing the poor. Getting a real healthcare system in place. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 12:47 PM |
#15 |
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Thank you |
Generator |
Nov-19-08 01:59 PM |
#77 |
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Indeed. Speaking out now is crucial in order to defend the party from its opponents. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 02:11 PM |
#83 |
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We're paying for that "prosperity" now. |
girl gone mad |
Nov-19-08 03:26 PM |
#110 |
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Food bank use was up dramatically in the 90s |
eridani |
Nov-19-08 08:29 PM |
#121 |
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Many cross-currents and rip-tides caused by all of Obama's Crossovers. |
patrice |
Nov-19-08 12:44 PM |
#8 |
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Deleted message |
Name removed |
Nov-19-08 12:45 PM |
#10 |
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We are Democratic Underground..... |
FrenchieCat |
Nov-19-08 12:46 PM |
#11 |
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Thanks for the link. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 12:49 PM |
#17 |
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yeah no moderates ever canvass or phone bank |
dmallind |
Nov-19-08 12:46 PM |
#12 |
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I know lots of anti-war and anti-Bush moderates who volunteer for DEMS. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 12:49 PM |
#16 |
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wtf is a pro-Bush Dem? lol. |
Jim4Wes |
Nov-19-08 12:53 PM |
#22 |
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So no DEMS supported Bush's far right war or his far right economic policies? |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 12:56 PM |
#28 |
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Well here's your problem |
dmallind |
Nov-19-08 12:56 PM |
#27 |
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I dont have a problem. DEMS who were stupid enough to support Bush have a problem. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 12:59 PM |
#31 |
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Martin Luther King Jr. said it best when he said the day we become |
midnight |
Nov-19-08 12:47 PM |
#13 |
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That's a great way of putting it. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 12:59 PM |
#32 |
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DLCers were 100% wrong in their support for Bush, and now they want to make up for it? |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 12:47 PM |
#14 |
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In my own way, I'm being pro-Obama. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 12:51 PM |
#19 |
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Yes- let's be pro-Obama and give him a chance to succeed! |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 01:01 PM |
#36 |
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By publicly shitting on every appointment our two-week-old PE is considering.... |
scheming daemons |
Nov-19-08 01:01 PM |
#37 |
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For the record, the only problem I have is Lieberman. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 01:03 PM |
#41 |
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For the record, I wasn't replying to you..... look again |
scheming daemons |
Nov-19-08 01:12 PM |
#50 |
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I thought this was an open discussion board, and you were posting in my sub-thread. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 01:14 PM |
#53 |
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You seemed like you were responding directly to my post, as if I directed it at you... |
scheming daemons |
Nov-19-08 01:21 PM |
#58 |
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No, I was just trying to express my views to anyone reading. A "discussion board" as it were. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 01:25 PM |
#60 |
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I'm not against every appointment. I like the AG appointment. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:14 PM |
#54 |
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Obama says he wants to hear dissenting voices. Well where are the progressive voices in his |
Skwmom |
Nov-19-08 01:01 PM |
#38 |
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He's named less than 5% of his administration. Sheesh. |
scheming daemons |
Nov-19-08 01:04 PM |
#43 |
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Exactly. Who are some good Liberals that you would like to see in an Obama admin? |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 01:12 PM |
#51 |
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I'd love to hear your answer to post #51. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 01:38 PM |
#65 |
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Reich as Commerce Secretary(we can't have another corporate type in there) |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:53 PM |
#74 |
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It would interest me to see if scheming daemons would agree with you on those pics. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 02:02 PM |
#79 |
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Oh the drama... the DRAMA! |
bunnies |
Nov-19-08 12:50 PM |
#18 |
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,,, |
prodn2000 |
Nov-19-08 02:47 PM |
#103 |
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If "progressive dissent" is being silenced, why am I reading your OP? |
scheming daemons |
Nov-19-08 12:52 PM |
#20 |
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Why are you trying to silence those of us who are telling you to shut the fuck up? |
scheming daemons |
Nov-19-08 12:53 PM |
#24 |
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you know how i deal with it? |
maxsolomon |
Nov-19-08 12:54 PM |
#25 |
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Let them try. The only one who will silence you is you. |
Forkboy |
Nov-19-08 12:57 PM |
#29 |
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That's why I AM speaking out. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:01 PM |
#39 |
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And we need the centrists. |
Forkboy |
Nov-19-08 01:12 PM |
#49 |
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sure we do |
Two Americas |
Nov-19-08 06:19 PM |
#118 |
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With the progressives track record on being right on so many issues, it makes you wonder why they |
Skwmom |
Nov-19-08 12:59 PM |
#30 |
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If you're dissenting against an administration that doesn't take office for two months yet, then.... |
scheming daemons |
Nov-19-08 01:00 PM |
#33 |
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If you don't speak out AT THE START, the opening for action slips away. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:04 PM |
#42 |
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The last administration made the MISTAKE of being too progressive during the first two years |
scheming daemons |
Nov-19-08 01:06 PM |
#46 |
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Bogus analysis of those first two years. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:12 PM |
#52 |
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yours is the "progressive" analysis? |
paulk |
Nov-19-08 01:45 PM |
#70 |
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It's not "THE" analysis, It's just mine. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:50 PM |
#72 |
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I noticed you offer no actual rebuttal to it, simply an insult. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:54 PM |
#75 |
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What exactly would you like the administration to do? |
olegramps |
Nov-20-08 06:30 AM |
#139 |
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Here's what I'd like |
Ken Burch |
Nov-20-08 11:14 AM |
#148 |
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Oh yeah, let's wait until he makes all of his appointments to start voicing our concerns. |
Skwmom |
Nov-19-08 01:27 PM |
#61 |
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nonsense |
Two Americas |
Nov-20-08 01:25 AM |
#128 |
| -
I think the new administration should be given a chance before anyone complains. |
phleshdef |
Nov-19-08 01:00 PM |
#34 |
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No one is silencing anyone. But can the man get a chance to fucking govern |
BrentTaylor |
Nov-19-08 01:00 PM |
#35 |
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Nope. |
scheming daemons |
Nov-19-08 01:03 PM |
#40 |
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It's not about being "pissed off". It's about standing up for ourselves. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:06 PM |
#45 |
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You have it exactly backwards |
scheming daemons |
Nov-19-08 01:08 PM |
#47 |
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you're not supposed to point things like that out. That's an attempt to silence someone |
wyldwolf |
Nov-19-08 03:33 PM |
#111 |
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Just how were you burned again? |
olegramps |
Nov-20-08 06:46 AM |
#141 |
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So criticism of your impatience is now "stifling dissent"? What a pantload of crap! |
Bonobo |
Nov-19-08 01:08 PM |
#48 |
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You are estimating the quantitfy of crap by a couple of exponents... |
stevenleser |
Nov-19-08 01:39 PM |
#66 |
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"The last Democratic administration was a failure" |
TwilightZone |
Nov-19-08 01:16 PM |
#55 |
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The one where the poor were abandoned and insulted by a "Democratic" president |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:19 PM |
#57 |
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President-elect Obama hasn't even taken his oath of office and the |
grantcart |
Nov-19-08 01:19 PM |
#56 |
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But, grantcart, what is taken as "dissent" around here lately is pretty ridiculous. |
Kristi1696 |
Nov-19-08 01:27 PM |
#62 |
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Once again you are on the side of common sense and facts |
stevenleser |
Nov-19-08 02:25 PM |
#95 |
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Go Back To Thailand Grant |
Binka |
Nov-20-08 03:39 AM |
#134 |
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Thank you. |
Kristi1696 |
Nov-19-08 01:22 PM |
#59 |
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OMG! An AG against the death penalty and an HHS Secretary for national health care! |
Alexander |
Nov-19-08 01:29 PM |
#63 |
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I SAID upthread that I like the AG appointment, and also I like Daschle. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:44 PM |
#68 |
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So what, exactly, is your problem? |
Alexander |
Nov-19-08 04:00 PM |
#114 |
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it is an ongoing battle |
Two Americas |
Nov-19-08 01:44 PM |
#69 |
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Excellent post. I'd have no problem with the centrists just disagreeing with me. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 01:47 PM |
#71 |
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the conflict |
Two Americas |
Nov-19-08 02:00 PM |
#78 |
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Bravo. Very well put. |
political_Dem |
Nov-20-08 03:33 AM |
#133 |
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You make an excellent point here |
jonestonesusa |
Nov-20-08 10:25 AM |
#145 |
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The OP in this thread was a failure |
alwysdrunk |
Nov-19-08 01:51 PM |
#73 |
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this post is itself suppressive |
Two Americas |
Nov-19-08 02:07 PM |
#82 |
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It's about treating the progressive faction in the party with respect as an equal force. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 02:13 PM |
#84 |
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I don't see anything being silenced--2/3 of the posts are critical of Obama, so... |
WI_DEM |
Nov-19-08 01:58 PM |
#76 |
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not so |
Two Americas |
Nov-19-08 02:15 PM |
# |
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my point is nobody is trying to stop dissent and the 2/3 of the posts are |
WI_DEM |
Nov-19-08 02:23 PM |
#92 |
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understood |
Two Americas |
Nov-19-08 02:33 PM |
#98 |
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Exactly: "our civic duty...at all times." (n/t) |
kenzee13 |
Nov-19-08 03:41 PM |
#112 |
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This is another "I want my say and no one should argue with me" post |
wyldwolf |
Nov-19-08 02:02 PM |
#80 |
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I'm fine with people arguing with me. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 02:06 PM |
#81 |
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It would be cool if we could ALL agree to cease name calling & bullying of any kind. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 02:15 PM |
#85 |
| -
You're right. Both sides have launched their share of invective. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 02:16 PM |
#87 |
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For the record, I've been defending Obama's centrist picks all over this board for days. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 02:22 PM |
#90 |
| -
I appreciate your comments and your respectful, open tone. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 02:32 PM |
#97 |
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Pro-war, pro-Bush, pro-Lieberman Dems? |
olegramps |
Nov-20-08 07:08 AM |
#143 |
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if you don't believe you're being treated as an equal, that is your issue and no one else's |
wyldwolf |
Nov-19-08 02:15 PM |
#86 |
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you wish |
iamthebandfanman |
Nov-19-08 02:22 PM |
#91 |
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Next thing you know, DUers will be accused of being disloyal for not supporting Lieberman! |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 02:24 PM |
#94 |
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umm.. there's only one group here who accuse others of not being a Democrat |
wyldwolf |
Nov-19-08 03:04 PM |
#106 |
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There were/are at least 2- maybe 3. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 03:12 PM |
#107 |
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we are always silenced. |
iamthebandfanman |
Nov-19-08 02:20 PM |
#88 |
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"The LAST Democratic administration was a failure" reminds me of this classic article: |
Freddie Stubbs |
Nov-19-08 02:21 PM |
#89 |
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Wow, starting to see the problems the Repigs have with their fundamental right wingers. |
Pisces |
Nov-19-08 02:24 PM |
#93 |
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For the record, I can accept HRC at State IF Obama makes it clear |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 02:35 PM |
#99 |
| -
I just want the 'centerists' to begin each sentance with the truth |
Bluenorthwest |
Nov-19-08 02:27 PM |
#96 |
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To be fair, the DLC types used to openly admit that during Bush's 1st term and shortly thereafter. |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 02:38 PM |
#100 |
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The only thing that was good about some DU'ers backing HolyWarJoe |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 02:42 PM |
#101 |
| -
Let me guess- Mr Benchley? |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 02:45 PM |
#102 |
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I didn't want to get my post deleted by mentioning him by name, but yes. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-19-08 02:49 PM |
#104 |
| -
Crap- I didn't know that I might be breaking a rule! |
Dr Fate |
Nov-19-08 02:52 PM |
#105 |
| -
Mr. Benchley was a truely nasty character. |
Odin2005 |
Nov-20-08 08:54 AM |
#144 |
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No one is questioning your right to speak -- some are just questioning some of what you have to say. |
zlt234 |
Nov-19-08 03:51 PM |
#113 |
| -
It appears our services are no longer required. |
Dragonfli |
Nov-19-08 05:30 PM |
#117 |
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Because we're nazis. |
BlooInBloo |
Nov-19-08 06:20 PM |
#119 |
| -
arent you silencing the dissenting dissent? |
mkultra |
Nov-19-08 08:40 PM |
#123 |
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Silencing the progressives |
Enna |
Nov-19-08 09:37 PM |
#125 |
| -
Well put. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-20-08 02:23 PM |
#151 |
| -
I was one who did the hard work... |
stillcool47 |
Nov-19-08 09:45 PM |
#126 |
| -
Of course I want the guy inagurated. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-20-08 02:19 PM |
#150 |
| -
emotions, micro-focusing on minutiae |
KakistocracyHater |
Nov-20-08 01:31 AM |
#129 |
| -
Nah, not for the most part. Some off us a step over |
TheKentuckian |
Nov-20-08 02:35 AM |
#130 |
| -
Give.....it.....a......break!! |
Life Long Dem |
Nov-20-08 02:43 AM |
#131 |
| -
I mean the cutting edge of the very, very, very leftest of all maaann way out there |
TheKentuckian |
Nov-20-08 03:02 AM |
#132 |
| -
Yup, eight years of peace and prosperity sure was |
cboy4 |
Nov-20-08 03:56 AM |
#135 |
| -
Amazing example of a carefully planned under the radar post |
mtnester |
Nov-20-08 04:11 AM |
#136 |
| -
Apparently no one ever saw "The Big One". |
HughBeaumont |
Nov-20-08 04:51 AM |
#137 |
| -
The Big One is an essential film, a great piece of history from the 90s. |
jonestonesusa |
Nov-20-08 10:45 AM |
#146 |
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Expanding the Earned Income Credit was one of the most |
WCGreen |
Nov-20-08 06:58 AM |
#142 |
| -
Progressive Dissent Does Not Equal Insane Or Irrational Rantings And Vitriol With Short Sighted |
OPERATIONMINDCRIME |
Nov-20-08 10:47 AM |
#147 |
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I'm against insane or irrational rantings, too. |
Ken Burch |
Nov-20-08 02:16 PM |
#149 |
| -
NO ONE IS STIFLING YOUR FREEDOM OF SPEECH GOD DAMN IT |
WildEyedLiberal |
Nov-20-08 02:31 PM |
#155 |
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I mostly agree. But although I think the Clinton admin. was far from being a 'failure', they could |
codjh9 |
Nov-20-08 02:32 PM |
#156 |
| -
Leftover hostility from the primaries and the fact that we're not all progressive here. |
PelosiFan |
Nov-20-08 02:32 PM |
#157 |
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