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Reply #110: I understand why he did it, and don't really dislike him for it. [View All]

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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-09-08 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #73
110. I understand why he did it, and don't really dislike him for it.
For one thing, the bill isn't the pure surrender some around here think it is, but that's a different story.

I just mean that Obama won by claiming he wouldn't compromise and had good judgement and all of that, and a lot of people saw him as some purist and Clinton as a triangulating sell-out. Anyone who took the time to learn the facts and the history of both candidates knew the reverse was true. Obama goes where the wind blows, Clinton has been consistent for decades, though she does slant her arguments. In short, she's a leftist pretending to be a moderate, and he's a centrist who briefly pretended, or at least played up assumptions, that he was a leftist.

I'm not bothered by Obama's actions overly much--he's about like any other candidate I would vote for, at least as far as compromising goes. I'm frustrated by those who didn't get it when he was running, and who voted for him believing he was different.

No matter. He's the candidate, so he's my candidate. BushCo must be destroyed in all its incarnations.
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  -So Senator Obama voted yes on FISA and Senator Clinton voted no? Seen the light  Jul-09-08 02:29 PM   #0 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Jul-09-08 02:30 PM   #1 
  - Welcome to DU!  democrattotheend   Jul-09-08 02:30 PM   #4 
  - And farewell. n/t  LowerManhattanite   Jul-09-08 02:39 PM   #35 
  - Smart politics on her part  democrattotheend   Jul-09-08 02:30 PM   #2 
  - agree. nm  TeamJordan23   Jul-09-08 02:31 PM   #8 
  - Go Hillary!  leftofcool   Jul-09-08 02:30 PM   #3 
  - Deleted sub-thread  Name removed   Jul-09-08 02:31 PM   #6 
  - I love Hillary.  emilyg   Jul-09-08 07:28 PM   #165 
  - Clinton is not running for anything. She doesn't matter now. If the situation was  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 02:31 PM   #5 
  - Either way, we are all losers.  FredfromSpace   Jul-09-08 02:32 PM   #10 
  - Somehow, we shall go on.  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 02:33 PM   #11 
     - I fear this plays into the Puke's hands more than a YEs would have  FredfromSpace   Jul-09-08 03:26 PM   #129 
        - Obama voted against telecom immunity, but refused to obstruct final passage  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 03:28 PM   #131 
           - He also promised to support a filibuster.  FredfromSpace   Jul-09-08 03:31 PM   #134 
           - So, you hope he loses? Is that what you mean by "haunt him"?  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 03:34 PM   #137 
              - I still hope he wins  FredfromSpace   Jul-09-08 03:43 PM   #149 
                 - Calling him "lousy" and "half-assed"--Free Republic is that-a-way.  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 03:45 PM   #150 
                    - Who Are the Brain Police?  FredfromSpace   Jul-09-08 04:08 PM   #154 
           - Which is voting for the war after voting against it.  nosmokes   Jul-09-08 04:08 PM   #155 
  - But isn't she still angling to be on the ticket?  Seen the light   Jul-09-08 02:33 PM   #14 
  - If that's the case  gateley   Jul-09-08 03:35 PM   #141 
  - Is your post  BOSSHOG   Jul-09-08 02:36 PM   #26 
  - Yep--he would have voted differently, if he didn't have the welfare of the entire Democratic party,  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 02:38 PM   #32 
     - I still don't see how a "no" vote would have been so damning come November  Seen the light   Jul-09-08 02:40 PM   #39 
     - Ad: "Barack Obama voted NO on spying on foreign terrorists--will he keep America safe?"  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 02:43 PM   #45 
     - But McCain missed the vote completely  Seen the light   Jul-09-08 02:57 PM   #74 
        - You are counting on the media to inform people that McCain didn't bother?  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 02:59 PM   #81 
        - I don't know? Skip the media completely and put it in a response ad?  Seen the light   Jul-09-08 03:09 PM   #104 
           - I think she voted against it because she has NO upcoming elections--  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 03:11 PM   #108 
              - So the only reason for dems to vote like dems is if they're up for re-election? Pathetic.  LVjinx   Jul-10-08 03:09 AM   #175 
        - McCain has missed more votes than Obama but the talking point is *only* about Obama's missed votes.  SemiCharmedQuark   Jul-09-08 03:00 PM   #85 
     - you are correct  comradebillyboy   Jul-09-08 03:52 PM   #153 
     - So after he gets the nomination  BOSSHOG   Jul-09-08 02:46 PM   #51 
        - Why are so many people bringing Teh Stoopid today?  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 02:49 PM   #56 
           - I have no idea Wiener  BOSSHOG   Jul-09-08 02:53 PM   #63 
  - Guess what, WD?  Pigwidgeon   Jul-09-08 02:39 PM   # 
  - No equivalence between allowing the FISA bill to pass and giving Bush  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 02:41 PM   #43 
  - Please tell me why  polmaven   Jul-09-08 03:14 PM   #113 
  - Eat your nice rhubarb  JoFerret   Jul-10-08 04:56 AM   #180 
  - Obama is running for president. Senator Clinton is not.  SemiCharmedQuark   Jul-09-08 02:31 PM   #7 
  - Especially if there is another "terrorist" attack.  Drunken Irishman   Jul-09-08 02:33 PM   #13 
  - Hmmm  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 02:34 PM   #17 
  - FISA is going to kill thousands of people, including our soldiers, and cost  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 02:35 PM   #21 
  - Oh - I get it  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 02:53 PM   #62 
     - This bill won't destroy the country. Please. It's not perfect, it may have  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 02:58 PM   #78 
        - You honestly don't see how this  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 03:00 PM   #84 
           - I repeat: One foreign surveillance bill will not destroy the country.  wienerdoggie   Jul-09-08 03:04 PM   #93 
              - ACLU plans to fight it anyway after Bush OKs it.  Radio_Lady   Jul-09-08 03:07 PM   #100 
  - Obama is the presumptive nominee, not a primary contender?  SemiCharmedQuark   Jul-09-08 02:36 PM   #27 
  - I'm voting for Sen Obama regardless  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 02:51 PM   #60 
  - Maybe she is smarter now.  Redbear   Jul-09-08 02:37 PM   #30 
  - True dat  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 02:49 PM   #57 
  - Yeah, she is smarter  merh   Jul-09-08 03:00 PM   #83 
  - It's irrelevant but voting for a bill you didn't read is quite different  OhioBlues   Jul-09-08 02:39 PM   #36 
  - Will people be more forgiving of the  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 02:48 PM   #55 
  - I would. I don't know about others.  OhioBlues   Jul-09-08 02:59 PM   #82 
  - If it is irrelevant  polmaven   Jul-09-08 03:16 PM   #116 
     - For the same reason you thought to reply to me I suspect. nt  OhioBlues   Jul-09-08 05:34 PM   #162 
  - If Hillary was "running for President" in 2002  newmajority   Jul-09-08 02:48 PM   #54 
     - Oh - so that's what matters  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 02:54 PM   #68 
        - You're the one making that argument, not me.  newmajority   Jul-09-08 03:21 PM   #122 
           - Not really  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 03:37 PM   #143 
  - But Clinton co-sponsored  Marie26   Jul-09-08 02:50 PM   # 
  - dupe. nt  Marie26   Jul-09-08 02:50 PM   #58 
  - Someone's running for President in 2008  BeyondGeography   Jul-09-08 02:31 PM   #9 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Jul-09-08 02:33 PM   #12 
     - Right, Mr. 8 posts  BeyondGeography   Jul-09-08 02:34 PM   #19 
     - Obama voted against the war in Iraq, Hillary votef for it---when was she always fighting for us?!  vaberella   Jul-09-08 02:35 PM   #25 
        - He did not vote against it. He spoke out against it.  SemiCharmedQuark   Jul-09-08 02:37 PM   # 
        - He was a legislator in Illinois  polmaven   Jul-09-08 03:18 PM   #120 
  - Well, this way Obama can have it both ways  mvd   Jul-09-08 02:33 PM   #15 
  - I don't think so  liberal1973   Jul-09-08 02:35 PM   #22 
  - What I mean is it could be smart framing of the message  mvd   Jul-09-08 02:38 PM   #33 
  - Yeah, sort of like voting "present". nt  Marie26   Jul-09-08 02:52 PM   #61 
     - I think that's a misunderstanding of how the "present" vote works in Illinois.  SemiCharmedQuark   Jul-09-08 02:53 PM   #65 
        - Perhaps. But the larger point stands.  Marie26   Jul-09-08 02:54 PM   #69 
           - That strategy was proposed by the Illinois Planned Parenthood. They asked Obama to vote that way.  SemiCharmedQuark   Jul-09-08 02:59 PM   #79 
              - Hi, SCQ!  mvd   Jul-09-08 03:08 PM   #101 
                 - Yeah, it is a bad bill  SemiCharmedQuark   Jul-09-08 03:34 PM   #140 
  - Clinton is running for 2012.  cryingshame   Jul-09-08 02:33 PM   #16 
  - She's always been Pro-War and commended McCain. If the shoe was on the other foot  vaberella   Jul-09-08 02:34 PM   #18 
  - you and me both  helderheid   Jul-09-08 02:34 PM   #20 
  - I don't know why that surprises you. n/t  LWolf   Jul-09-08 02:35 PM   #23 
  - For one, she did not even vote on the Dodd amendment back in February  democrattotheend   Jul-09-08 02:37 PM   #28 
     - she hasn't been silent on the issue  paulk   Jul-09-08 02:41 PM   #42 
     - You know,  LWolf   Jul-09-08 02:44 PM   #46 
     - Just give her the credit due her and move on  Tom Rinaldo   Jul-09-08 02:46 PM   #48 
        - I said she deserves credit for her vote today  democrattotheend   Jul-09-08 02:50 PM   #59 
           - You're being fair about it  Tom Rinaldo   Jul-09-08 02:58 PM   #77 
           - And you are getting your  polmaven   Jul-09-08 03:23 PM   #126 
              - Who's Kreskin the Magnificent?  democrattotheend   Jul-09-08 04:12 PM   #156 
                 - Oh, I guess I'm a little older than you are...  polmaven   Jul-09-08 05:09 PM   #157 
  - Once again-a vote for political reasons-just like her vote for the IWR and K/L...  jenmito   Jul-09-08 02:35 PM   #24 
  - That's my thinking  democrattotheend   Jul-09-08 02:38 PM   #31 
  - Yup...  jenmito   Jul-09-08 02:41 PM   #41 
  - Oh, Hillary's vote was for poltical reasons?  Skip Intro   Jul-09-08 02:46 PM   #49 
  - Of course it was! And as suspected, they're now talking about it on MSNBC about how  jenmito   Jul-09-08 02:55 PM   #71 
     - Are you actually blaming Hillary for Obama's vote?  Skip Intro   Jul-09-08 03:02 PM   #90 
        - I'm blaming her for causing more reason to keep our party divided.  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:07 PM   #99 
           - So she should have voted the  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 03:11 PM   #107 
           - She should've not voted at all. For the good of the party.  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:14 PM   #114 
              - Okay - I think I get it now  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 03:17 PM   #117 
                 - Not all of them-just Hillary-who's supposedly trying to unite her voters with his.  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:20 PM   #121 
                    - I can't believe you mean this  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 03:34 PM   #139 
                       - She knew it would pass anyway. I'm one of her constituents, too, and I'm  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:37 PM   #144 
                          - So now voting the right was is  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 03:39 PM   #145 
                             - Why are you having trouble? She, like Obama, voted to strip immunity out of the bill...  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:43 PM   #148 
                             - Don't even try to understand.  polmaven   Jul-09-08 05:24 PM   #158 
                             - Tell her you're voting for Lee Mercer, Jr. and see what happens  LostinVA   Jul-09-08 05:30 PM   #160 
           - Are you for real?????????  Beacool   Jul-09-08 10:55 PM   #172 
           - Senator Clinton voted correctly. If it makes Obama look like an ass, whose fault is that?  LVjinx   Jul-10-08 03:14 AM   #176 
  - And now we finally know that if Obama was in the Senate he  HopeLives   Jul-09-08 02:46 PM   #50 
  - No we DON'T know that. He spoke out against it while he was in the IL Senate and was about to run  jenmito   Jul-09-08 02:57 PM   #76 
  - Yes and then he gave him self some wiggle room in 2004,  HopeLives   Jul-09-08 03:14 PM   #115 
     - No he didn't. He was protecting Kerry and Edwards, who both voted FOR it-and he was the keynote  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:18 PM   #118 
  - You're seriously wrong, and walking on thin ice with that suggestion...  NYC_SKP   Jul-09-08 03:25 PM   #128 
     - ...  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:39 PM   #147 
  - What fucking nonsense  leftynyc   Jul-09-08 03:10 PM   #105 
  - No, I'm NOT saying his vote wasn't political. He's the nominee.  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:13 PM   #112 
  - And if she doesn't believe in it  polmaven   Jul-09-08 03:25 PM   #127 
  - Obama had to vote "yes". The dems were complicit in crime.  wurzel   Jul-09-08 02:37 PM   #29 
  - Oh yes, if the Democrats stood for the right position, it would have..  mvd   Jul-09-08 02:39 PM   #37 
  - get used to it...  paulk   Jul-09-08 02:38 PM   #34 
  - She's no longer running for president  larissa   Jul-09-08 02:42 PM   #44 
     - Whe he becomes President, we will certainly be more vocal  mvd   Jul-09-08 02:46 PM   #47 
     - Deleted message  Name removed   Jul-09-08 02:48 PM   #52 
        - Regardless of whether DU'ers agree or disagree..  larissa   Jul-09-08 03:07 PM   #98 
           - your post was not relevant to mine  paulk   Jul-09-08 07:26 PM   #164 
  - That's right, Obama voted yes. That's what's important.  The_Casual_Observer   Jul-09-08 02:39 PM   #38 
  - Vote for Obama anyway  Pigwidgeon   Jul-09-08 02:40 PM   #40 
     - Good luck cracking that whip. :/  Bluebear   Jul-09-08 02:53 PM   #64 
     - The whip has no effect it seems...nt  cags   Jul-09-08 02:53 PM   #66 
     - We don't have any other choice.  The_Casual_Observer   Jul-09-08 02:57 PM   #75 
  - Sigh..... I miss Hillary nt  cags   Jul-09-08 02:48 PM   #53 
  - And that's why she voted against it-for that very reaction-to keep party DISunity.  jenmito   Jul-09-08 02:59 PM   #80 
  - I don't think so. Voting *no* was the right vote, IMHO.  SemiCharmedQuark   Jul-09-08 03:02 PM   #88 
  - I agree... but I'm sure Barack thinks he did the right thing too  cags   Jul-09-08 03:05 PM   #96 
  - Yes, it was-for the wrong reasons IMHO.  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:08 PM   #102 
  - It was totally inconsistent with her previous voting record and totally consistent with Clintonian  cryingshame   Jul-09-08 03:12 PM   #111 
     - Perhaps you can link us to this previous position? I know you aren't just making it up.  LVjinx   Jul-10-08 03:20 AM   #178 
  - No disunity... It won't change my vote... but you can't be happy with everything  cags   Jul-09-08 03:03 PM   #92 
  - It won't change YOUR vote, but it can give Hillary supporters another excuse NOT to vote for him  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:10 PM   #106 
     - Did they need another excuse? I don't think so  cags   Jul-09-08 03:11 PM   #109 
        - No, but this IS another excuse.  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:22 PM   #124 
  - Exactly. Political expediency, even i f it means .....  nomaco-10   Jul-09-08 03:04 PM   #95 
  - Bullshit!  polmaven   Jul-09-08 03:29 PM   #132 
  - Oh yeah, Obama casts the wrong vote, but it's Hillary's fault.  Beacool   Jul-09-08 10:59 PM   #174 
  - Hasn't Hillary always said she'd vote against it? Obama is responsible for his own vote.  LVjinx   Jul-10-08 03:19 AM   #177 
  - Unbelievable  romana   Jul-10-08 04:02 AM   #179 
  - Me too!!!!!!!!!  Beacool   Jul-09-08 10:58 PM   #173 
  - Mine has simply been confirmed.  jobycom   Jul-09-08 02:54 PM   #67 
  - If I was running, I would have voted no  mvd   Jul-09-08 02:57 PM   #73 
     - I understand why he did it, and don't really dislike him for it.  jobycom   Jul-09-08 03:12 PM   #110 
  - What does that mean? Obama was and still is the better candidate.  ProSense   Jul-09-08 02:54 PM   #70 
  - No surprise there.  Phx_Dem   Jul-09-08 02:56 PM   #72 
  - She deserves credit for her vote today  democrattotheend   Jul-09-08 03:01 PM   #87 
     - That's how I see it  mvd   Jul-09-08 03:04 PM   #94 
  - self-delete  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:01 PM   #86 
  - Well....David is wrong on this one  prodn2000   Jul-09-08 03:02 PM   #89 
     - I know-which is why I deleted it.  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:06 PM   #97 
  - this thread is kind of hilarious. I'm sure there are some lurking freepers who are laughing.  ErinBerin84   Jul-09-08 03:03 PM   #91 
  - "sewer" was more the word I had in mind.  bunnies   Jul-09-08 03:08 PM   #103 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Jul-09-08 03:18 PM   #119 
  - Make no mistake. A vote for Nader is a vote for McCain. n/t  elkston   Jul-09-08 03:22 PM   #123 
  - No- a vote for Nader-is a VOTE FOR NADER- no more elitist corporatists thanks  biglake   Jul-09-08 03:27 PM   #130 
     - Alerted. n/t  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:30 PM   #133 
  - If so, you can no longer be a member of the DU. Read the rules. n/t  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:23 PM   #125 
  - Your threat is perfect jenmito  biglake   Jul-09-08 03:32 PM   #135 
     - It's not a threat. It's a fact:  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:33 PM   #136 
        - May not post threats to vote 3rd party on DU? 1st time. I am sure Obama relies on that crap too.  biglake   Jul-09-08 03:39 PM   #146 
        - Enjoy your stay here-no matter how short it may be.  jenmito   Jul-09-08 03:47 PM   #151 
        - And Lee Mercer, Jr. -- I heard Skinner changed the rules just for Mercenaries  LostinVA   Jul-09-08 05:32 PM   #161 
  - Nader? This should end well... n/t  LowerManhattanite   Jul-09-08 05:27 PM   #159 
     - Maybe it already HAS ended well.  jenmito   Jul-09-08 05:50 PM   #163 
        - Yeesh! I go down to the gym for a jog and a carrot juice...  LowerManhattanite   Jul-09-08 07:50 PM   #167 
           - Ya got THAT right!  jenmito   Jul-09-08 07:56 PM   #168 
              - Why mah dear (Best Tennessee Williams character voice)...  LowerManhattanite   Jul-09-08 08:03 PM   #169 
                 - ...  jenmito   Jul-09-08 08:17 PM   #170 
  - Maybe she's learned that centrist voting didn't get her anywhere.  kerry-is-my-prez   Jul-09-08 03:34 PM   #138 
  - props from this Obama supporter for HRC!  dmsRoar   Jul-09-08 03:36 PM   #142 
  - Well, finally!  polmaven   Jul-09-08 03:51 PM   #152 
  - Thank you.  emilyg   Jul-09-08 07:30 PM   #166 
  - Go Hillary!!!!!!!!!!  Beacool   Jul-09-08 10:47 PM   #171 

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