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Reply #33: I don't support Clinton because I support Obama more [View All]

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Orangepeel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-18-08 07:15 PM
Response to Original message
33. I don't support Clinton because I support Obama more
It's silly to say "don't compare her to Obama." Those are the two people still in the race, so I made my decision of who to support based on comparing them. I don't support her because I'm supporting him.

Clinton and Obama are very similar on positions. That's part of the reason why it's gotten so personal between camps. There's not much to argue about policy wise. So, to me, that's basically a wash.

I think that both of them are capable, intelligent and strong. So, that's a wash.

In my mind, Clinton gets "bonus points" for being a woman. The ability break down barriers and inspire is a factor that I consider when deciding who to vote for, as long as I feel the candidate is qualified and supports my policy positions. (I wouldn't vote for a republican woman, but if I like two candidates, gender is a plus).

But Obama also breaks down barriers. So, he gets as many "bonus points" as Clinton. Wash.

So it comes to the fact that, in my opinion, Obama is more inspiring. He has the gift of charisma. He has run a much better campaign. I believe that he is better able to beat McCain. And, he has managed to do what other politicians I strongly supported haven't been able to do -- increase participation in the democratic process *cough*howarddean*cough*

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  -Question for women and women only. Texas Hill Country  Apr-18-08 06:50 PM   #0 
  - She voted to authorize the "war" in Iraq.  PassingFair   Apr-18-08 06:53 PM   #1 
  - respectable reason and I can understand that sentiment. thank you for the honest answer.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 06:53 PM   #2 
  - My first and foremost reason as well. (the War)  TexasLady   Apr-18-08 07:16 PM   #34 
  - she's dishonest, calculating in a bad way, dismissive, lies and  roguevalley   Apr-18-08 08:37 PM   #110 
  - I second this, the IWR killed it for me. But I more of support Obama than dislike Hillary  angie_love   Apr-18-08 11:35 PM   #156 
  - I believe she is false  blogslut   Apr-18-08 06:54 PM   #3 
  - how can you say that... she has a 35 year history of advocacy for women? she made one of the most  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 06:55 PM   #4 
     - Advocacy?  blogslut   Apr-18-08 06:58 PM   #7 
     - how about her Beijing speech in 1995? heard of that? or...  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:07 PM   #21 
        - It's a nice speech  blogslut   Apr-18-08 07:20 PM   #44 
        - 2 things...  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:30 PM   #56 
        - Not only was Hillary one of the most vocal democrats in support of the war,  JTFrog   Apr-19-08 12:26 AM   #165 
           - wow.. great info. You should post this separately. I don't think many people know this.  futureliveshere   Apr-19-08 11:38 AM   #202 
        - but she has a speech!  hfojvt   Apr-18-08 07:35 PM   #60 
        - Nice SN  Carni   Apr-18-08 08:26 PM   #105 
           - I have no problems with my name  blogslut   Apr-18-08 08:31 PM   #107 
        - I do not recall her being a leader in any of this.  Hepburn   Apr-19-08 12:05 AM   #161 
     - No. She's disparaged speeches! She is a destroyer, not a builder.  votesomemore   Apr-18-08 07:58 PM   #88 
     - I know of NO important speech she gave on this subject.  Hepburn   Apr-19-08 12:03 AM   #160 
     - 35 years? Ha. Every time she says that, people snicker. She has 6 years of experience...  indie_ana_500   Apr-19-08 08:40 AM   #180 
  - Three things.  undeterred   Apr-18-08 06:57 PM   #5 
  - well, taking out the Obama thing, you dont trust Bill to keep his dick in his pants, and she lies?  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 06:58 PM   #8 
     - I'm worried about Bill Clinton doing much more  undeterred   Apr-18-08 07:05 PM   #17 
        - ok, good. such as? please, enlighten me.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:07 PM   #23 
           - When the Clintons Mine Big Bucks  undeterred   Apr-18-08 07:23 PM   #51 
  - MANY of them are misogynist. Oops, I'm not a woman.  jesus_of_suburbia   Apr-18-08 06:57 PM   #6 
  - the women are misogynist?  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 06:58 PM   #9 
  - misogynist - One who hates women.  jesus_of_suburbia   Apr-18-08 07:07 PM   #22 
     - i am aware of the definition lol, and i do not completely disagree.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:08 PM   #24 
  - As a male, I better add this.... I think there are many women on this board  jesus_of_suburbia   Apr-18-08 07:13 PM   #29 
     - i agree to that as well. I was really speaking to a select few but seem to have raised a storm lol  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:26 PM   #54 
  - I'm not female, but as someone who used to respect HRC greatly and defended her here...  Bicoastal   Apr-18-08 06:58 PM   #10 
  - i am specifically talking about the women I have seen that say "I want a woman Prez, not her tho"  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 06:59 PM   #11 
     - You don't think *I* want a woman Prez?  Bicoastal   Apr-18-08 07:02 PM   #14 
  - Not Hillary because I like Obama better  democrattotheend   Apr-18-08 07:00 PM   #12 
  - exactly the opposite of what I asked. why NOT hillary, without the comparison please.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:08 PM   #25 
     - My point is, my decision to back Obama was not motivated by any dislike for Hillary  democrattotheend   Apr-18-08 07:09 PM   #26 
     - I think this is important, because it seems to be the key thing Hillary supporters don't get  Shakespeare   Apr-18-08 07:13 PM   #31 
     - I am talking about a specific set of women i see on here saying any woman but not her.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:36 PM   #61 
        - Okay, then on that point:  Shakespeare   Apr-18-08 10:40 PM   #147 
     - then I am not talking about you.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:19 PM   #41 
     - Then what's the point? Seriously, you make no sense.  Blondiegrrl   Apr-18-08 09:52 PM   #134 
     - discussing why people dont pick someone out of many without comparing to the many is dumb  goletian   Apr-19-08 12:03 AM   #159 
  - I checked, and I qualify to answer  DearAbby   Apr-18-08 07:01 PM   #13 
  - To paraphrase Shaw: Why does a woman have to be like a man?  cali   Apr-18-08 07:03 PM   #15 
  - i thank you for the honest response... here is mine.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:16 PM   #38 
  - If the AUMF had passed without her, she'd have a clear conscience and more Democrats voting for her  SaveAmerica   Apr-18-08 09:09 PM   #115 
  - See, to me, being strong means that you have to do  OhioBlue   Apr-18-08 10:08 PM   #138 
  - Fantastic answer. You do your candidate proud.  jesus_of_suburbia   Apr-18-08 07:23 PM   #50 
  - Why do you hold it against Hillary so much when Kerry, Biden and Edwards  Auntie Bush   Apr-18-08 09:38 PM   #128 
     - She's running. They're not. And anyone who's familiar with me  cali   Apr-19-08 03:03 AM   #174 
     - 22 did not, I would argue that Kerry, Biden & Edwards were also cowardly, reality bites,  rosebud57   Apr-19-08 11:08 AM   #198 
  - Honestly, her resume just isn't all that impressive.  thecatburgler   Apr-18-08 07:04 PM   #16 
  - I'm male, but married. I'll let my wife do this one  Asgaya Dihi   Apr-18-08 07:05 PM   #18 
  - She backed up the neo-cons' lies about Iraq.  redqueen   Apr-18-08 07:06 PM   #19 
  - Her support of Iraq War, NAFTA, V-Chip, are MORE important to me than gender  WA98296   Apr-18-08 07:06 PM   #20 
  - Well, first of all....  mamalone   Apr-18-08 07:11 PM   #27 
  - thank you for the reasoned response, i appreciate it... i would like to point out a couple things..  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:54 PM   #82 
     - Excuse me, but...  George Oilwellian   Apr-19-08 02:12 AM   #173 
     - Pardon me...  mamalone   Apr-19-08 07:32 AM   #177 
     - Other brave senators voted against IWR and Clinton finally admitted she regretted her vote  powergirl   Apr-19-08 10:33 AM   #191 
  - She's capable, intelligent, and strong  tishaLA   Apr-18-08 07:12 PM   #28 
  - This is a great analysis...  mcctatas   Apr-18-08 11:00 PM   #149 
  - I don't trust her.  MH1   Apr-18-08 07:13 PM   #30 
  - i missed the Kerry shanking... please describe.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 08:03 PM   #93 
     - Late October 2006....  MH1   Apr-18-08 08:56 PM   #113 
  - Your question contrains people's ability to answer  CreekDog   Apr-18-08 07:14 PM   #32 
  - no, i am specifically talking about the women on here that have stated that they want a woman  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:19 PM   #40 
  - I don't support Clinton because I support Obama more  orangepeel68   Apr-18-08 07:15 PM   #33 
  - The Clintons have become way to close to The Bush Family - And only two families ruling this country  cyberpj   Apr-18-08 07:16 PM   #35 
  - i find that really interesting since she championed NHI and gave corps a heart attack 10 years ago  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 08:02 PM   #91 
  - For all the woman who say they want a woman, but not Hillary  LisaM   Apr-18-08 07:16 PM   #36 
  - Its probably a bad time to conduct that poll  WIllo   Apr-18-08 09:49 PM   #133 
  - LisaM, I'm a woman, and a feminist, and I would answer no to that question  thecatburgler   Apr-19-08 10:48 AM   #193 
  - I am female and frankly, I don't give a shit if we ever have a female prez...  Hepburn   Apr-19-08 11:03 AM   #197 
  - I think she and her husband are TRAITORS to the Dem party and have protected BushInc for decades.  blm   Apr-18-08 07:16 PM   #37 
  - you mean like Pelosi? Reid? please, tell me how Hillary undermined them...  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:37 PM   #63 
     - Every Dem leader who stepped up to OPPOSE Bush - Gore, Kerry, Dean. Clintons protect BushInc  blm   Apr-18-08 07:52 PM   #79 
        - ok, how did the Clintons undermine Kerry? or Dean?  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:59 PM   #89 
           - Hard to believe this is the first you've heard of it.....  blm   Apr-18-08 08:11 PM   #96 
  - Several reasons -- here are just a few.  ocelot   Apr-18-08 07:17 PM   #39 
  - thank you for the response.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:21 PM   #47 
  - I would never vote for someone who voted for IWR  UALRBSofL   Apr-18-08 07:19 PM   #42 
  - She is part of the DLC, and I HATE the DLC.... I don't TRUST her,  MagickMuffin   Apr-18-08 07:20 PM   #43 
  - see, i dont understand that last sentence... ruining Obama's chances...  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:25 PM   #53 
     - Fair enough, although we won't know for sure if any of this would have been brought up in the GE  MagickMuffin   Apr-18-08 07:47 PM   #75 
  - I don't trust her and I don't think she is as qualified as she touts.  merh   Apr-18-08 07:20 PM   #45 
  - I don't like her. She sickens me. That's it.  ScarletSniper   Apr-18-08 07:21 PM   #46 
  - why?  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:21 PM   #48 
  - Gender doesn't enter into it  bambino   Apr-18-08 07:22 PM   #49 
  - Thank you.  helderheid   Apr-19-08 10:05 AM   #186 
  - I have problems with her IWR vote and think her campaign is horrible (surprisingly so).  Glimmer of Hope   Apr-18-08 07:25 PM   #52 
  - so if her campaign had been better and she still had voted for IWR or  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:34 PM   #59 
  - My reasons:  NoBushSpokenHere   Apr-18-08 07:27 PM   #55 
  - What a pathetic question. As the only thing women should care about is voting for a woman...  BlooInBloo   Apr-18-08 07:31 PM   #57 
  - no, I am asking about a very specific sentiment. Women who say that want a woman, just not her.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:33 PM   #58 
  - She accepted being cheated on for political purposes  sandnsea   Apr-18-08 07:36 PM   #62 
  - I dont think that has anything to do with her Feminism, which means being treated fairly and equally  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:39 PM   #65 
     - Now there's a fairy tale fit for the Big Dog  sandnsea   Apr-18-08 07:45 PM   #72 
        - well, i respect your opinion.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:58 PM   #87 
  - I would love to see a woman in the White House  PA Democrat   Apr-18-08 07:39 PM   #64 
  - Well, thank you for the response... one point...  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:43 PM   #68 
     - But the influence of special interests has grown exponentially over the last 20 years.  PA Democrat   Apr-18-08 07:51 PM   #78 
     - interesting. I will have to think about that. Thanks for the equitable discussion. appreciate it.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:57 PM   #84 
        - Thanks for the discussion  PA Democrat   Apr-18-08 08:15 PM   #100 
     - as a man, I was interested in seing the answers to your questions  quakerboy   Apr-18-08 11:54 PM   #158 
     - I was just about to make the same point, realizing I'd missed it in my earlier response.  PA Democrat   Apr-19-08 08:23 AM   #178 
     - Chimpy was not an outsider. n/t  indie_voter   Apr-19-08 10:02 AM   #184 
  - Words cannot describe how disappointed I am with Hillary Clinton.  Tatiana   Apr-18-08 07:39 PM   #66 
  - Hillary = bad politics and bad decisions...  polichick   Apr-18-08 07:42 PM   #67 
  - I've always admired and liked Hillary  Blue_Roses   Apr-18-08 07:44 PM   #69 
  - thank you for the fair response... and just to be clear, I was talking about women that want  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:48 PM   #77 
     - I guess it's like that friend in the group that grates  Blue_Roses   Apr-18-08 07:54 PM   #81 
     - fair enough. lol.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 08:00 PM   #90 
     - I don't understand the confusion/ some were excited about the poss. first woman president  SaveAmerica   Apr-18-08 09:36 PM   #127 
  - For one reason and one reason only. She can't win in the GE.  ourbluenation   Apr-18-08 07:44 PM   #70 
  - why?  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:46 PM   #73 
     - that's really a topic for another thread, no?  ourbluenation   Apr-18-08 07:47 PM   #76 
        - perhaps.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:57 PM   #85 
  - Last year she gave a speech to AIPAC and totally pandered to the Israelis and made  Emillereid   Apr-18-08 07:44 PM   #71 
  - i like Boxer, but i also dont really disagree on Israel.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 07:47 PM   #74 
  - She lacks integrity and character and I can't trust her  Truth Hurts A Lot   Apr-18-08 07:52 PM   #80 
  - this saddens me.  Texas Hill Country   Apr-18-08 08:04 PM   #94 
  - I refuse to vote for an AIPAC-ridden servant of the MIC and Establishment insider.  scarletwoman   Apr-18-08 07:54 PM   #83 
  - Untrustworthy  fedupinBushcountry   Apr-18-08 07:57 PM   #86 
  - I won't vote for an asshole just because it has...  mcctatas   Apr-18-08 08:02 PM   #92 
  - Against my better judgment, I'm going to answer this question.  LiberalAndProud   Apr-18-08 08:11 PM   #95 
  - I appreciate the tone of your post.  Texasgal   Apr-18-08 08:12 PM   #97 
  - For many reasons but I'll say this again  Generator   Apr-18-08 08:12 PM   #98 
  - This is why...  yourguide   Apr-18-08 08:14 PM   #99 
  - I find it odd that anyone claiming to be a feminist would vote for her because she is a woman  TheDoorbellRang   Apr-18-08 08:18 PM   #101 
  - She voted to authorize the Iraq war  Raineyb   Apr-18-08 08:18 PM   #102 
  - I think she's intelligent and strong, BUT  abbyg8r   Apr-18-08 08:19 PM   #103 
  - Number One: Dynasties are NOT democratic  boobooday   Apr-18-08 08:25 PM   #104 
  - hillary is way too conservative for me.  psychmommy   Apr-18-08 08:31 PM   #106 
  - HRC: DLC, IWR, Kyle-Leiberman, Patriot Act, Cluster-bomb votes, did I mention DLC?  Melinda   Apr-18-08 08:31 PM   #108 
  - I question her integrity and motives.  gateley   Apr-18-08 08:34 PM   #109 
  - A long, rambly, honest response  Lucky 13   Apr-18-08 08:42 PM   #111 
  - Many reasons  Undercurrent   Apr-18-08 08:52 PM   #112 
  - There is a very interesting piece I found on this topic.  cbayer   Apr-18-08 09:06 PM   #114 
  - I don't trust her  tammywammy   Apr-18-08 09:13 PM   #116 
  - She is capable of lying, intelligent enough to be manipulative, strong enough, well,  ProSense   Apr-18-08 09:13 PM   #117 
  - They are very similar in many ways. For me the deciding issue is the war.  Lone_Star_Dem   Apr-18-08 09:15 PM   #118 
  - She sounds like my mother nagging me...  IndyHatedByBothSides   Apr-18-08 09:17 PM   #119 
  - YES!  Undercurrent   Apr-18-08 09:41 PM   #129 
     - Thanks. I'm glad somebody understands.  IndyHatedByBothSides   Apr-18-08 10:24 PM   #145 
  - Not Hillary - because even before this all began  FLDem5   Apr-18-08 09:21 PM   #120 
  - She voted for the war, nafta, and negative, can not vote for her, do not trust her  GetTheRightVote   Apr-18-08 09:22 PM   #121 
  - I don't want a woman to be president. I want the best PERSON to be president. And Hillary ain't it  jenmito   Apr-18-08 09:24 PM   #122 
  - Me too - I don't care what gender - as long as I trust them to do a  whutgives   Apr-18-08 09:27 PM   #123 
  - Because she is an incredibly polarizing figure  Mystery2Me   Apr-18-08 09:29 PM   #124 
  - But, I DO support her!  DawgHouse   Apr-18-08 09:31 PM   #125 
  - My problems with her is not about her abilities  WIllo   Apr-18-08 09:33 PM   #126 
  - Because there are other considerations that go into picking a candidate  TayTay   Apr-18-08 09:43 PM   #130 
  - Hillary is smart enough, I give her that. But simply put, it's her character.  TexanDem   Apr-18-08 09:48 PM   #131 
  - Your post is insulting.  Blondiegrrl   Apr-18-08 09:48 PM   #132 
  - I think the Clintons move the Democratic Party to the right  OhioBlue   Apr-18-08 09:55 PM   #135 
  - The problem is that you make an assumption that everyone believes her to be as  grace0418   Apr-18-08 10:01 PM   #136 
  - No answer here - Just support for our HRC!  GrandmaJones7   Apr-18-08 10:02 PM   #137 
  - I'll answer you  Patchuli   Apr-18-08 10:11 PM   #139 
  - Because she is not honest enough  karynnj   Apr-18-08 10:13 PM   #140 
  - Because she behaves the way she does, and I don't trust her to do what  PetraPooh   Apr-18-08 10:14 PM   #141 
  - being a woman has nothing to do with it.  gabby garcia   Apr-18-08 10:17 PM   #142 
  - They say it because she competes against their true love. nt  Jim4Wes   Apr-18-08 10:20 PM   #143 
  - You're a sexist ass. nt  thecatburgler   Apr-18-08 10:43 PM   #148 
  - I'd call you a dick, but...  Hepburn   Apr-19-08 12:24 AM   #164 
  - One more thing...  Undercurrent   Apr-18-08 10:23 PM   #144 
  - I have thought she was a feminine version of George Bush since  appleannie1   Apr-18-08 10:26 PM   #146 
  - In rereading your OP, I realize it was a contrived setup.  thecatburgler   Apr-18-08 11:03 PM   #150 
  - The War. Her Lies.  sparosnare   Apr-18-08 11:09 PM   #151 
  - She's strong, capable and intelligent.  OnionPatch   Apr-18-08 11:10 PM   #152 
  - Six reasons...  PADemD   Apr-18-08 11:13 PM   #153 
  - She energizes Republicans to vote against her and Obama is more electable  powergirl   Apr-18-08 11:32 PM   #154 
  - I do NOT want another Clinton in the WH..after another *...  windbreeze   Apr-18-08 11:34 PM   #155 
  - She plays dirty and is totally untrustworthy  CakeGrrl   Apr-18-08 11:37 PM   #157 
  - Yes, she is capable, intelligent and strong.  Left coast liberal   Apr-19-08 12:16 AM   #162 
  - I don't care about the gender of the person, the color of the skin, the religious affiliation...  Hepburn   Apr-19-08 12:19 AM   #163 
  - Many women don't like to see another women succeed.  goldcanyonaz   Apr-19-08 12:28 AM   #166 
  - Especially if she is a liar...  Hepburn   Apr-19-08 12:50 AM   #170 
  - I respect her a lot for her guts and ambition and determination and intelligence.  Withywindle   Apr-19-08 12:35 AM   #167 
  - I don't agree on your assessment of Senator Clinton  k8conant   Apr-19-08 12:42 AM   #168 
  - It's a shame  nbsmom   Apr-19-08 12:44 AM   #169 
  - She reminds me of a mole.  beat tk   Apr-19-08 12:51 AM   #171 
  - I think she would have done just fine...IF  fortyfeetunder   Apr-19-08 01:40 AM   #172 
  - Hillary supporting woman here.  Jamastiene   Apr-19-08 03:08 AM   #175 
  - I do not support Hillary for excellent reasons.  JTFrog   Apr-19-08 07:19 AM   #176 
  - You are assuming that others are looking for the same characteristics in a woman that YOU are.  indie_ana_500   Apr-19-08 08:39 AM   #179 
  - She believes that the end justifies the means. I don't.  Reader Rabbit   Apr-19-08 08:46 AM   #181 
  - I would be happy with Hillary or Obama  treestar   Apr-19-08 09:08 AM   #182 
  - she's an opportunistic liar who voted for the Iraq War Resolution  npincus   Apr-19-08 09:46 AM   #183 
  - She's capable, intelligent and strong. Just not honest and I don't like her dirty politics.  helderheid   Apr-19-08 10:04 AM   #185 
  - This is fucking idiotic.  Rosemary2205   Apr-19-08 10:07 AM   #187 
  - In a nutshell- I don't trust her.  Kajsa   Apr-19-08 10:10 AM   #188 
  - She has proven herself to be..  stillcool47   Apr-19-08 10:15 AM   #189 
  - Too much sleaze. Too much deception. I personally get the  Laura PackYourBags   Apr-19-08 10:16 AM   #190 
  - Do not ask people their opinions and then argue with them  powergirl   Apr-19-08 10:37 AM   #192 
  - I initially supported Clinton at the start, even though I was "meh" about her Iraq vote  slinkerwink   Apr-19-08 10:52 AM   #194 
  - DLC, NAFTA, IRW, etc  Lisa0825   Apr-19-08 10:54 AM   #195 
  - For me, top reason from beginning was Hillary's unfavorables, whether it is fair or her fault  rosebud57   Apr-19-08 10:59 AM   #196 
  - She doesn't "get it"  sonoradesertdem   Apr-19-08 11:28 AM   #199 
  - 1st Woman President won't be from Mine and Hillary's Generation  dbredes   Apr-19-08 11:30 AM   #200 
  - We Are Conditioned to Obsess With Perfection  Crisco   Apr-19-08 11:37 AM   #201 
  - I could and would vote for her if she "wins" the nomination  fed_up_mother   Apr-19-08 11:45 AM   #203 
  - She has too many corporate ties.  kwyjibo   Apr-19-08 11:56 AM   #204 
  - I don't trust her  madwivoter   Apr-19-08 12:14 PM   #205 
  - It's called self-preservation.  Chalco   Apr-19-08 01:47 PM   #206 
  - It's the same reason why people choose a life-partner..  SoCalDem   Apr-19-08 01:58 PM   #207 
  - She fucked up health care when her husband was  Citizen_Penn   Apr-19-08 02:01 PM   #208 
  - I don't think she can win the G.E.  bain_sidhe   Apr-19-08 02:12 PM   #209 
  - I am a caucasian 42-year-old mother  Oregonian   Apr-19-08 02:20 PM   #210 
  - Many reasons, I'll mention just a few  Inuca   Apr-19-08 02:35 PM   #211 
  - She's not strong enough - ethically  JerseygirlCT   Apr-19-08 02:57 PM   #212 

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