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Reply #98: You're not telling me anything I don't already know [View All]

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IrateCitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-04 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #97
98. You're not telling me anything I don't already know
I first got "involved" in issues as a fair trade activist. I lobbied local Congressional reps on behalf of my local Sierra Club. I'm also well aware of Rand Beers' role in Plan Colombia, and it is certainly not something I support.

I'm also well aware of Kucinich's plan vis a vis Iraq. The problem is, the UN has pretty much said that they won't take over force protection. And if you simply pull out, then you will doom Iraq to a civil war.

Whether you or I think that big mansions should be taxed is immaterial. The problem is that such behavior is seen as just fine by society. You earned it, so you get to enjoy it. Do you think that such high taxes would be easy to implement in the current environment? I doubt it. This means then that we need to get around to changing the way in which people view the world around them -- a much more difficult proposition.

Sorry, but much of what I hear in your statements is a frustration that the world isn't what you want it to be -- so all that is required is to impose your will on it and suddenly a great utopia will arise. It would certainly be much easier if this is the way things were, but unfortunately it is not. Therefore, we have to work in the situation in which we find ourselves. As such, your plan becomes entirely unworkable.
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  -Check out Chomsky's blog for his position re: this election nothingshocksmeanymore  Mar-26-04 01:06 AM   #0 
  - I guess now some people will say Chomsky is a tool of Corporate America  bluestateguy   Mar-26-04 01:11 AM   #1 
  - Actually  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 01:19 AM   #2 
  - I didn't get that at all.  JDStutts   Mar-26-04 01:34 AM   #3 
     - Yes that's what he said  Feanorcurufinwe   Mar-26-04 01:44 AM   #4 
     - I just love the words "seems to be saying"  sangh0   Mar-26-04 09:04 AM   #15 
     - Isn't everyone tired of "march in lockstep" by now?  RandomKoolzip   Mar-26-04 09:36 AM   #19 
     - Yep  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 02:02 AM   #5 
     - did he really, or is that merely your projection?  kodi   Mar-26-04 02:06 AM   #6 
     - Put it on pause  zulchzulu   Mar-26-04 02:15 AM   #7 
     - Maybe I'm thinking of another vote.  JDStutts   Mar-26-04 02:22 AM   #8 
        - "gave B*sh all the cover he needed to invade Iraq "????  sangh0   Mar-26-04 09:07 AM   #16 
     - ?  ulysses   Mar-26-04 05:31 AM   #10 
     - I think he just said hold your nose and vote against bush, actually  redqueen   Mar-26-04 09:40 AM   #20 
        - Sorry my friend, I think the point is FAR more salient and is  nothingshocksmeanymore   Mar-26-04 10:13 AM   #30 
        - I think his blog proves Chomsky is sane.  saywhat   Mar-26-04 11:11 AM   #57 
  - Chomsky is ignorant  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 05:19 AM   #9 
  - No, Chomsky knows where its at  Vladimir   Mar-26-04 06:07 AM   #12 
  - Chomsky Knows How to Discourage the Left  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 08:47 AM   #14 
  - discourage the left??  ZombyWoof   Mar-26-04 10:01 AM   #25 
  - Discourage the Left  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 10:44 AM   #39 
  - I disagree entirely  Vladimir   Mar-26-04 10:39 AM   #36 
     - Just more thoughts...  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 12:28 PM   #77 
        - Fair enough  Vladimir   Mar-26-04 12:38 PM   #78 
           - Fair Enough  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 12:55 PM   #80 
  - Best. Post. Ever.  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 10:28 AM   #34 
     - Interesting how some will quote Chomsky on the need to vote...  Zhade   Mar-26-04 09:53 PM   #108 
  - Wish I'd said that! I'm a DK Democrat who is befuddled by  blondeatlast   Mar-26-04 07:58 AM   #13 
  - You're the one being unaware -- see my post #17, below. (nt)  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 09:22 AM   #18 
     - Unawareness?  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 09:59 AM   #24 
  - I guess we learn something every day.  Kerryfan   Mar-26-04 10:15 AM   #31 
     - : ) Politics is at least 3D  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 12:58 PM   #81 
        - Thought is 3 dimensional.  info being   Mar-26-04 04:08 PM   #101 
  - Yikes! Check out  charlie   Mar-26-04 05:43 AM   #11 
  - I had to WADE through the thread to get to this..YIKES is right  nothingshocksmeanymore   Mar-26-04 04:45 PM   #104 
  - Those railing against Kerry are betraying the "margins of society"  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 09:21 AM   #17 
  - "I mean, it's almost Orwellian!"  redqueen   Mar-26-04 09:45 AM   #21 
  - redqueen, I think you're missing a vital piece of Chomsky's argument  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 10:05 AM   #26 
  - Grassroots  redqueen   Mar-26-04 10:45 AM   #40 
  - In the words of Ronnie Raygun, "There you go again..."  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 10:51 AM   #46 
     - Issues, of course  redqueen   Mar-26-04 10:58 AM   #52 
        - Party politicos at fundraisers have nothing to do with issues!  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 11:06 AM   #54 
           - *sigh*  redqueen   Mar-26-04 11:14 AM   #59 
              - sigh, yourself  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 11:22 AM   #62 
                 - I'm not saying *I* dont' see the need to evict the usurper  redqueen   Mar-26-04 11:30 AM   #64 
                    - But what you are doing right now is *gambling*, redqueen  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 11:36 AM   #67 
                       - Am I?  redqueen   Mar-26-04 11:52 AM   #71 
                          - Yes you are, and that denial was very disingenous  sangh0   Mar-26-04 04:29 PM   #103 
  - Yes, yes and yes again  Vladimir   Mar-26-04 10:45 AM   #42 
     - "We as activists"  redqueen   Mar-26-04 11:01 AM   #53 
        - Then get out there and do something for the nominee!!!  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 11:08 AM   #55 
        - I'm in Texas, IC  redqueen   Mar-26-04 11:16 AM   #60 
           - Do you at least find openings on issues down there?  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 11:47 AM   #69 
              - Yes, and I do that  redqueen   Mar-26-04 11:54 AM   #72 
        - I'm not trying to convert  Vladimir   Mar-26-04 11:43 AM   #68 
  - What anti-leftist rhetoric?  Feanorcurufinwe   Mar-26-04 10:08 AM   #27 
  - Nothing to see here. Move along.  blondeatlast   Mar-26-04 09:50 AM   #22 
  - The Margins of Society?  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 09:56 AM   #23 
  - he DID support DK  ZombyWoof   Mar-26-04 10:08 AM   #28 
  - What I am concerned about is Unity without Representation  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 11:33 AM   #65 
  - Your background on this subject is duly noted  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 10:09 AM   #29 
     - About tactics  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 11:55 AM   #73 
  - Actually Chris, there are CERTAIN segments on the far left  nothingshocksmeanymore   Mar-26-04 10:20 AM   #32 
  - I'm not sure I'm seeing your point on the housing issue, Teena  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 10:27 AM   #33 
  - The point is that THIS form of socialized housing  nothingshocksmeanymore   Mar-26-04 10:42 AM   #37 
     - OK, now I see your point  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 10:46 AM   #43 
        - NOT quite the point I was making  nothingshocksmeanymore   Mar-26-04 10:50 AM   #45 
           - OK, NOW I see where you are going with this  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 10:53 AM   #47 
              - It is one area where I do tend to lean tinfoilish  nothingshocksmeanymore   Mar-26-04 10:57 AM   #51 
                 - Believe me, Teena -- I can tinfoil with the best of em!  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 11:11 AM   #58 
  - Then what do you think about?  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 12:13 PM   #75 
     - Oh I have no problem with this...if they got solar power in  nothingshocksmeanymore   Mar-26-04 06:44 PM   #105 
  - I think you're overstating the case, at least in your subject line.  RichM   Mar-26-04 10:29 AM   #35 
     - No, Rich -- I think it's you who doesn't have a case in this instance  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 10:42 AM   #38 
     - "...the issues I believe in, and that DK championed. "  redqueen   Mar-26-04 10:54 AM   #49 
        - Yeah, he's still championing them -- to the already converted  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 11:09 AM   #56 
           - Yer killin' me!  redqueen   Mar-26-04 11:19 AM   #61 
              - Percentage vs. turnout  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 11:24 AM   #63 
                 - I hate guessing games, so I checked  redqueen   Mar-26-04 11:35 AM   #66 
                    - The way I see this...  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 11:51 AM   #70 
                       - But you still think he was just preaching to the choir?  redqueen   Mar-26-04 11:57 AM   #74 
                          - Not totally, no. But I still think there's a danger you're ignoring.  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 12:21 PM   #76 
                             - Last week I'd have thought they'd follow DK's lead and vote Dem  redqueen   Mar-26-04 12:42 PM   #79 
     - Oh I think he made that point here  nothingshocksmeanymore   Mar-26-04 10:45 AM   #41 
        - Good post  ACK   Mar-26-04 10:47 AM   #44 
           - Thanks it isn't so much running into as running over  nothingshocksmeanymore   Mar-26-04 10:56 AM   #50 
              - Right! People talk like Kerry is some DLC puppet conservative  ACK   Mar-26-04 01:07 PM   #83 
                 - Well, this struck me...  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 01:21 PM   #85 
                    - You won't be satisfied regardless....  nothingshocksmeanymore   Mar-26-04 01:43 PM   #86 
                    - I'll be satisfied if the this Imperialist Crap Stops  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 02:13 PM   #90 
                       - So, basically what you're saying is...  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 02:17 PM   #92 
                          - We should have Authority over the Government  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 02:36 PM   #95 
                             - I don't think you're dictatorial for opposing war  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 02:47 PM   #96 
                                - I apologize for My inflexibility  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 03:40 PM   #99 
                    - single issue voter.  ACK   Mar-26-04 01:57 PM   #87 
                       - No, not quite.  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 02:03 PM   #89 
                          - yeah - there are alot of things I don't like about Kerry  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 02:22 PM   #93 
                             - OK, so what's your plan then  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 02:33 PM   #94 
                                - To answer some of your inquiries.  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 02:57 PM   #97 
                                   - You're not telling me anything I don't already know  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 03:06 PM   #98 
                                      - I've heard it all before....  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 04:17 PM   #102 
  - Wow. He's EXACTLY RIGHT!  mzmolly   Mar-26-04 10:54 AM   #48 
  - But you have to realize  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 01:02 PM   #82 
     - But what you're raising is the question of "ignored by whom?"  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 01:15 PM   #84 
        - The Grassroots of the Party?  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 02:02 PM   #88 
           - Who are the grassroots you're referring to here?  IrateCitizen   Mar-26-04 02:14 PM   #91 
              - Grassroots?  WitchWay   Mar-26-04 04:05 PM   #100 
                 - Grassroots efforts could empower politicians  union_maid   Mar-26-04 09:20 PM   #106 
  - Good for Chomsky!  Darranar   Mar-26-04 09:32 PM   #107 

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