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Carolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-13-08 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #22
32. the war impacts the economy... duh!
Kitchen table issues are in largely affected by the trillions of $$$$ spent in Iraq.

So all of HRC's plans and proposals mean nothing because of the depleted treasury.

Her vote, like the Dem losers before her who also went along to get along and get ahead (Kerry, Edwards, Biden, Dodd), was pure political calculation and it has blown up in all her face. We expected the repukes to go along with the squatter/thief in chief but some Dems with presidential aspirations caved for no good reason other than personal gain!

War is destruction (in so many ways and on so many levels).
Iraq was NEVER an imminent threat.
Ergo, those who supported pre-emptive war against an innocent nation then (2002), don't deserve to lead now.

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  -Why Is Clinton Losing? THE WAR. THE WAR. THE WAR. Stephanie  Feb-13-08 09:53 AM   #0 
  - + continuation of the Lamont and 2006 national election casting off of the DC way  underpants   Feb-13-08 09:55 AM   #1 
  - You left out the "L"..... n/t  PassingFair   Feb-13-08 10:17 AM   #20 
  - I think that's one of two major reasons she's going to lose.  hiaasenrocks   Feb-13-08 09:56 AM   #2 
  - I can't argue with that  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 09:57 AM   #3 
  - War Peace War ... Oops ... no, I won't go down a liar's path  Fredda Weinberg   Feb-13-08 10:01 AM   #6 
  - Clinton is desperate to keep the keys of information  Whisp   Feb-13-08 05:40 PM   #58 
  - You left out the Bush VP years  progressive_realist   Feb-14-08 01:56 AM   #84 
  - They burned many a Dem AND their camps when they undermined them. Karma.  blm   Feb-13-08 10:07 AM   #10 
  - Despite Clinton fatigue, I would have probably voted for her  soleft   Feb-13-08 10:07 AM   #12 
  - that plus the fact that the kitchen table issues  Carolina   Feb-13-08 10:27 AM   #26 
  - I don't think it's even the Clintons so much as elites...  personman   Feb-14-08 11:19 AM   #99 
  - Stephanie...why spin a non-issue into something it isn't?  Tellurian   Feb-13-08 10:01 AM   #4 
  - I respectfully disagree  ayeshahaqqiqa   Feb-13-08 10:07 AM   #11 
  - It isn't a secret how we got into this War...Bush LIED to everyone...  Tellurian   Feb-13-08 11:47 AM   #41 
     - Let me clarify  ayeshahaqqiqa   Feb-13-08 12:25 PM   #46 
     - OK, thanks..  Tellurian   Feb-13-08 12:36 PM   #48 
     - over 50% of democrats in the house and senate voted against IWR  IrishBloodEngHeart   Feb-13-08 11:39 PM   #75 
     - Well, given that similar choices would be faced by the next President ...  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:08 AM   #94 
  - I disagree, there is a whole world of people who want to examine why and how we went to war so that  Mountainman   Feb-13-08 10:17 AM   #21 
  - Yes, This Could Hurt Her, BUT  Dinger   Feb-13-08 10:23 AM   #23 
  - oh really  Carolina   Feb-13-08 10:33 AM   #29 
  - The war may be a non issue to Hillary, but it was a big issue to familes of dead soldiers and Iraqis  WillYourVoteBCounted   Feb-14-08 12:14 AM   #79 
  - Caring about Iraq = Bombing it?  personman   Feb-14-08 11:05 AM   #92 
  - Vet and long-time Hillary supporter. I strongly disagree  sampsonblk   Feb-14-08 01:13 PM   #121 
  - Excuse me, but HilBilly tried to make the campaign about who had  coalition_unwilling   Feb-14-08 02:18 PM   #128 
  - Lies can get you only so far.  speedoo   Feb-13-08 10:01 AM   #5 
  - Do You Really Believe That? LOL  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 10:03 AM   #7 
  - "fringe lefties"  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 10:08 AM   #13 
  - You Heard Me Right.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 10:14 AM   #18 
  - Wrong  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 10:21 AM   #22 
  - You're Still Wrong, And I'm Laughing At Your 'Evidence' LOL  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 10:27 AM   #27 
  - honestly i thought you gave up being a jerk a while back  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 10:34 AM   #31 
  - Why Do Facts Offend You So Much? And How HILARIOUS Was Your Response? ROFLMAO!!!!!  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 11:11 AM   #39 
     - You are the first and only DUer ever to go on my Ignore list  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 12:03 PM   #42 
        - Oh For God's Sake Get Some Thicker Skin. Since When Is Competent Rebuttal Being A Troll?  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 12:10 PM   #43 
  - jeeze, get a grip.  stillrockin   Feb-13-08 10:53 AM   #37 
     - I'm The One With The Grip.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 11:12 AM   #40 
        - Of course you don't.  stillrockin   Feb-13-08 10:35 PM   #72 
  - the war impacts the economy... duh!  Carolina   Feb-13-08 10:37 AM   #32 
  - so whoever 'squawked' about Bush and the war is fringe as well?  Whisp   Feb-13-08 12:53 PM   #51 
  - yes, that fringe 65% of the population that thinks it was a mistake to invade Iraq.  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:11 AM   #96 
     - Pay Attention.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-14-08 11:48 AM   #107 
        - You give your own reading and writing skills far too much credit.  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 12:11 PM   #116 
           - Twist It However You Want. The Declaration Is Pretty Clear.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-14-08 12:17 PM   #117 
  - You are wrong, OMC.  Oregonian   Feb-13-08 10:10 AM   #16 
  - Why, Cause You Say So? Sorry, But I Don't Think So.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 10:16 AM   #19 
     - Oh, I guess I don't know any "regular people." So says you.  Oregonian   Feb-13-08 10:28 AM   #28 
     - "fresh face" "inspiring voice" "charisma, freshness and inspiration" aren't issues  personman   Feb-14-08 10:26 AM   #87 
  - So military families = "fringe lefties"?  Lilith Velkor   Feb-13-08 05:46 PM   #59 
  - LOL I Love When Other Posters Try And Make Up Their Own Context As If They Had A Point LOL  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 06:00 PM   #60 
  - Not as laughable as your premise that only "fringe lefties" care about the war  Lilith Velkor   Feb-13-08 06:52 PM   #61 
     - More Mischaracterization.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 06:57 PM   #62 
        - No, your point is false  Lilith Velkor   Feb-13-08 08:59 PM   #66 
           - No Point Of Mine Has Been False, And You Continue To Skew Context.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 09:13 PM   #67 
           - If you were truly sick of repeating yourself, you would stop.  Lilith Velkor   Feb-13-08 09:36 PM   #69 
              - On Every Other Tuesday In Every Other Month, The Sky Is Purple.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-13-08 10:30 PM   #71 
                 - 'Night OMC  Lilith Velkor   Feb-13-08 11:29 PM   #74 
           - This OMC Asshole Actually Said The War Is Not A Factor  Binka   Feb-14-08 10:50 AM   #88 
              - Hi Binka!  Stephanie   Feb-14-08 11:07 AM   #93 
              - I Hate That MOFO  Binka   Feb-14-08 11:09 AM   #95 
                 - That's Cause You're An Irrational Mess.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-14-08 11:55 AM   #114 
              - Roarrrrrr!!!!!! Grrrrrrr!!!!!! Rowwwwwrrrrrr!!!!! Swipe Swipe. Booga Booga Booga Snarf Snarf.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-14-08 11:52 AM   #111 
              - It's a scam alright  Lilith Velkor   Feb-14-08 01:15 PM   #122 
                 - The Only Thing Obvious Is That I Bested You, And You Don't Much Like It.  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-14-08 02:12 PM   #127 
                    - The only thing I have to get over  Lilith Velkor   Feb-14-08 02:38 PM   #132 
  - Her Kyl-Lieberman vote demonstrated that she hadn't learned from her Iraq vote.  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:18 AM   #97 
     - You know that and I know that  Lilith Velkor   Feb-14-08 12:58 PM   #119 
        - I dunno about the motivations for admin's judging the appropriateness of their posts...  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 01:07 PM   #120 
        - That one's a lolcow to me  Lilith Velkor   Feb-14-08 01:31 PM   #124 
           - You're Blathering About What Now? I Did What To Who Now?  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-14-08 02:10 PM   #126 
              - !  Lilith Velkor   Feb-14-08 02:35 PM   #131 
        - Are You Really That Bitter That I So Handily Decimated Your Empty Arguments Above?  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-14-08 02:07 PM   #125 
           - Blah blah blah  Lilith Velkor   Feb-14-08 02:34 PM   #130 
  - Totally agree  goodgd_yall   Feb-13-08 07:03 PM   #63 
  - I care how our candidate voted in 2002 ...  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:22 AM   #100 
  - An attempt to add more weight to the phenomenon of Obama support  goodgd_yall   Feb-13-08 07:07 PM   #64 
  - Hill's vote for the war made me look for ANY candidate but her  WillYourVoteBCounted   Feb-14-08 12:17 AM   #80 
  - Same boat. I preferred Edwards because of his economic, anti-poverty message ...  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:28 AM   #101 
  - I would probably support Hillary..  girl gone mad   Feb-14-08 05:08 AM   #85 
  - The war is still a very important issue to many voters  ayeshahaqqiqa   Feb-13-08 10:03 AM   #8 
  - Right. As someone recently said... we need to change the mindset that got us into Iraq.  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:30 AM   #102 
  - it's the WAR stoopid...  rndmprsn   Feb-13-08 10:03 AM   #9 
  - It's so ironic, isn't it? The vote for political expediency might have ruined her politically.  Oregonian   Feb-13-08 10:08 AM   #14 
  - Exactly. It was a poltical calculation but she MIScalculated  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 10:13 AM   #17 
  - TOUCHE!  Carolina   Feb-13-08 10:40 AM   #36 
  - ... coupled with her support for the war during its first few years, her failure ...  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:32 AM   #103 
  - Correct, Dems who voted for the IWR were afraid of losing their seats if they didn't.  Mountainman   Feb-13-08 10:10 AM   #15 
  - where's the proof?  bigtree   Feb-13-08 10:26 AM   #24 
  - see my post #22 above  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 10:27 AM   #25 
  - the economy now may be because Iraq has sucked  Whisp   Feb-13-08 12:47 PM   #49 
  - Because Democratic Activisists are so blinded by this one  OHdem10   Feb-13-08 10:34 AM   #30 
  - I'm not sure how nominating another candidate is sacrificing the party's future.  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:39 AM   #104 
  - K&R  Laura PackYourBags   Feb-13-08 10:39 AM   #33 
  - It's because of the media  zalinda   Feb-13-08 10:39 AM   #34 
  - PROJECTION, PROJECTION, PROJECTION  incapsulated   Feb-13-08 10:40 AM   #35 
  - DENIAL, DENIAL, DENIAL  stillrockin   Feb-13-08 10:53 AM   #38 
  - That's for sure: it's all "change" and "hope," not Iraq.  goodgd_yall   Feb-13-08 07:09 PM   #65 
  - Then they haven't asked me. n/t  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:40 AM   #105 
  - Maureen Dowd cites the same quote I did recently on the war question ->  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 12:21 PM   #44 
  - WHO really cares what Maureen Dowd has to say?  pirhana   Feb-13-08 09:17 PM   #68 
     - I do. I think she trolls here looking for material to use.  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 11:01 PM   #73 
  - It's the war, stupid. Always has been. Always should be.  AtomicKitten   Feb-13-08 12:23 PM   #45 
  - apparently it wasn't the war in 2004, when dems picked Kerry over Dean. what message are they sendi  VotesForWomen   Feb-14-08 12:11 AM   #77 
     - Exactly  seasonedblue   Feb-14-08 11:19 AM   #98 
  - That's more or less what Rachel said the other night on MSNBC.  sfexpat2000   Feb-13-08 12:33 PM   #47 
  - And she did it for reasons she cannot state  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 12:52 PM   #50 
     - Not only to appear hawkish, I think. Our politicians depend upon  sfexpat2000   Feb-13-08 01:05 PM   #52 
     - I had never thought of that  Stephanie   Feb-13-08 02:35 PM   #53 
     - Sometimes I think that the arguments we get to hear  sfexpat2000   Feb-13-08 02:45 PM   #55 
        - All of the Ohio Democrats in Congress voted against the war  TheBorealAvenger   Feb-13-08 05:08 PM   #56 
     - Lincoln Chaffee, then Senator from RI, says they voted for it because they thought the war would be  heraldsqure   Feb-13-08 09:42 PM   #70 
     - Except that her more recent Kyl-Lieberman vote shows she's still of the hawkish mindset ...  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:45 AM   #106 
  - she visibly bristled on 60 Minutes the other night when Katie Couric mentioned the IWR.  closeupready   Feb-13-08 02:37 PM   #54 
  - McCain Harldy Seems "Blunted"  DrFunkenstein   Feb-13-08 05:35 PM   #57 
  - How come dems picked Kerry in 2004? they're stupid? could be. nt  VotesForWomen   Feb-14-08 12:09 AM   #76 
  - That was my opinion, at the time. We had several good anti-war candidates from which to choose ...  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:48 AM   #108 
  - the time to make a stand on the war was 2004. dem voters chose not to. nt  VotesForWomen   Feb-14-08 12:12 AM   #78 
  - We will pay for that mistake for the rest of our lives.  Lilith Velkor   Feb-14-08 12:40 AM   #82 
  - It was a "make up" vote from when the Dems almost prevented the 1990 war  TheBorealAvenger   Feb-14-08 07:10 AM   #86 
     - Great signature. Failure to read the full Iraq NIE is *another* reason ...  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:53 AM   #112 
        - Thanks. I found Clinton's quote on sometime last year  TheBorealAvenger   Feb-14-08 12:04 PM   #115 
           - here you go >  Stephanie   Feb-14-08 01:17 PM   #123 
  - Take your one month here and three hearts and go troll someplace else  Binka   Feb-14-08 10:58 AM   #89 
  - You're A Real Nasty One You Know That?  OPERATIONMINDCRIME   Feb-14-08 02:24 PM   #129 
     - You won't win any Mr. Congeniality contests around here. eom  TheBorealAvenger   Feb-16-08 05:50 AM   #134 
  - Nice thought, but every election is the time to make a stand on the war ...  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:51 AM   #110 
  - Agreed. Her inability/unwillingness to acknowledge that voting for the IWR was a mistake is huge.  impeachdubya   Feb-14-08 12:18 AM   #81 
  - The real problem is it wasn't a one-time "mistake."  dailykoff   Feb-14-08 01:43 AM   #83 
  - Exactly. See her Kyl-Lieberman vote for evidence that Sen. Clinton still suffers ...  krkaufman   Feb-14-08 11:55 AM   #113 
  - Only a fool would blame Bush's War in Iraq on one Senator.  MethuenProgressive   Feb-14-08 11:01 AM   #90 
  - Who is blaming Iraq-Nam on HilBilly? She was one of a group of  coalition_unwilling   Feb-14-08 02:39 PM   #133 
  - "THE WAR. THE WAR. THE WAR."? Bullshit! She has been confronted with.....  suston96   Feb-14-08 11:04 AM   #91 
  - WRONG - Its been the same shit for 20 years - they want difference..  Thepricebreaker   Feb-14-08 11:49 AM   #109 
  - You neglected to mention Obama's change of heart on the war in 2002. Hmmm?  elixir   Feb-14-08 12:18 PM   #118 
  - Well, I think books will be written about this campaign  psychopomp   Feb-16-08 07:34 AM   #135 

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