ProSense
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Sat Jan-13-07 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #29 |
| 32. I said nothing about remaining in Iraq. |
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Edited on Sat Jan-13-07 09:07 PM by ProSense
That would be until the Iraqis took over, by the deadline.
Also, you mentioned morality. I would not advocate just standing by and watching the Iraqis continue killing themselves. This is where the political and diplomatic solutions come in.
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| -The morality of abandoning Iraq: Why we should stay. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 05:45 PM |
#0 |
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Here is my take |
uppityperson |
Jan-13-07 05:51 PM |
#1 |
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I agree. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 06:00 PM |
#8 |
| -
no flame - I simply do not believe our staying in Iraq is helpful at this point. |
peacebird |
Jan-13-07 05:53 PM |
#2 |
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The problems with that. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 06:06 PM |
#10 |
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What evidence do you have that "We are the lesser of all the evils...?" |
John Q. Citizen |
Jan-13-07 07:02 PM |
#15 |
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Simple. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 07:25 PM |
#17 |
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Iran would like nothing better than normalized relations with the West. It's |
John Q. Citizen |
Jan-13-07 07:58 PM |
#23 |
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I agree with one point: |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 08:41 PM |
#28 |
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Iran is still developing. They will get the fine points tuned on how to maintain |
John Q. Citizen |
Jan-14-07 03:49 PM |
#132 |
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So you would have the fools that did this continue to torment |
TexasProgresive |
Jan-13-07 05:54 PM |
#3 |
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That is why we have a Democratic Congress. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 06:09 PM |
#12 |
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Without a 2/3 majority to override the "Decider's" veto |
TexasProgresive |
Jan-13-07 07:13 PM |
#16 |
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Yes, I am well aware. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 07:35 PM |
#19 |
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"The vast majority of people here want to leave Iraq and never |
panader0 |
Jan-13-07 05:55 PM |
#4 |
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That is what I am proposing. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 06:16 PM |
#13 |
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our presence there is a crime against humanity- the first step... |
mike_c |
Jan-13-07 05:56 PM |
#5 |
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Well I am an American and I didn't support |
doc03 |
Jan-13-07 05:57 PM |
#6 |
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Bases. As what? Oases? Refuges for the "moderates"? |
aquart |
Jan-13-07 05:58 PM |
#7 |
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I for One Agree with You |
ribofunk |
Jan-13-07 06:06 PM |
#9 |
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Yes, I think a lot of people can't picture Iraq getting worse, but it can - far worse. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 06:36 PM |
#14 |
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I Beleive the Wrong Question is Often Ask |
ribofunk |
Jan-13-07 11:32 PM |
#58 |
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horrendous story, but you shouldn't let ur emotions |
NYCALIZ |
Jan-13-07 06:09 PM |
#11 |
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You cannot.. |
sendero |
Jan-13-07 07:32 PM |
#18 |
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You are over looking a simple fact. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 07:42 PM |
# |
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The whole point is.. |
sendero |
Jan-13-07 07:44 PM |
#21 |
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That is where I disagree. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 08:51 PM |
#30 |
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So... |
sendero |
Jan-14-07 09:06 AM |
#87 |
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First... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 09:49 AM |
#92 |
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Radical elements? |
sendero |
Jan-14-07 11:45 AM |
#103 |
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So you are willing... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 12:51 PM |
#110 |
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First, a question: Who is talking about abandoning Iraq? |
ProSense |
Jan-13-07 07:42 PM |
#20 |
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I read them, here is my responce. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 08:13 PM |
#25 |
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Staying in Iraq will |
ProSense |
Jan-13-07 08:30 PM |
#27 |
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Yes, I agree and that is exactly what I am suggesting. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 08:49 PM |
#29 |
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I said nothing about remaining in Iraq. |
ProSense |
Jan-13-07 09:07 PM |
#32 |
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What possible political and diplomatic solutions can be made? |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 09:13 PM |
#34 |
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Whatever that solution is, it should be |
ProSense |
Jan-13-07 09:43 PM |
#35 |
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You see, that is the problem. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 09:57 PM |
#38 |
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We can leave |
ProSense |
Jan-13-07 10:10 PM |
#41 |
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Let me rephrase it, then. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 10:45 PM |
#48 |
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What will happen if the situation |
ProSense |
Jan-13-07 10:49 PM |
#49 |
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A question for you...if Little Boots attacks Iran will our military in effect. |
madfloridian |
Jan-13-07 07:50 PM |
#22 |
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Yes, it is true. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 08:58 PM |
#31 |
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Under the helm of Junior and his cast of felonious assclowns, |
AtomicKitten |
Jan-13-07 08:00 PM |
#24 |
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but the basic premis of your argument |
tnlefty |
Jan-13-07 08:30 PM |
#26 |
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I agree. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 09:09 PM |
#33 |
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It;s a civil war. If your kid wants to go, send him, or go yourself! |
EndElectoral |
Jan-13-07 09:47 PM |
#36 |
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No |
mmonk |
Jan-13-07 09:54 PM |
#37 |
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Dimwit Bush should have listened to McCain calling for |
fuzzyball |
Jan-13-07 10:02 PM |
#39 |
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Yes, we've lost Iraq |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 10:08 PM |
#40 |
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Not until we give our military atleast 6 months to turn things around |
fuzzyball |
Jan-13-07 10:14 PM |
#42 |
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That is one of the problems. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 10:30 PM |
#45 |
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Russia, China and India are doing just too well economically to get |
fuzzyball |
Jan-13-07 10:59 PM |
#50 |
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But what is the response from Saudi Arabia? |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 11:09 PM |
#53 |
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Only response Saudi's can deliver is money help to the sunni's |
fuzzyball |
Jan-14-07 02:11 PM |
#126 |
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Tough OP to respond to. You're right leaving isn't an option. It's an inevitability. |
Bucky |
Jan-13-07 10:23 PM |
#43 |
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Oh, I agree it's already happened. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 10:38 PM |
#46 |
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Oop - a dupe |
Bucky |
Jan-13-07 10:23 PM |
#44 |
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totally disagree - no flames though |
welshTerrier2 |
Jan-13-07 10:42 PM |
#47 |
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Thanks for your reply! |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 11:00 PM |
#51 |
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"placing my faith in our Democratic Congress" |
welshTerrier2 |
Jan-13-07 11:11 PM |
#54 |
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As a general rule: You should never trust anyone in government. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 11:24 PM |
#56 |
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You are advocating that the rape victim spend more time with her rapist |
IndianaGreen |
Jan-13-07 11:08 PM |
#52 |
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That is idealistic, if flawed. |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 11:20 PM |
#55 |
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Have you heard of the expression "white man's burden?" |
IndianaGreen |
Jan-14-07 12:03 AM |
#62 |
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That is crazy. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 12:59 AM |
#69 |
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How many names do we want to see in a future Iraq War Memorial? |
IndianaGreen |
Jan-14-07 01:29 AM |
#71 |
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What I propose - less will die, both less Iraqi's and Americans. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 01:48 AM |
#74 |
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The immediate no-holes barred withdraw of all troops from Iraq |
Clarkie1 |
Jan-14-07 12:00 AM |
#61 |
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Would you rather withdraw now, or would you rather shoot your way out later? |
IndianaGreen |
Jan-14-07 12:06 AM |
#63 |
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False choice. nt |
Clarkie1 |
Jan-14-07 12:28 AM |
#65 |
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I agree with you that we cannot simply withdraw 140,000 troops immediately |
Clarkie1 |
Jan-13-07 11:28 PM |
#57 |
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What the Democrats in Congress NEED to do... |
Meldread |
Jan-13-07 11:37 PM |
#59 |
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Problem is, Bush refuses to deal with Iraq's neighbors. nt |
Clarkie1 |
Jan-13-07 11:57 PM |
#60 |
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Yes we owe them reparations. No we should not stay. |
dailykoff |
Jan-14-07 12:15 AM |
#64 |
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Thanks Meldread for this serious thought provoking thread. |
Auntie Bush |
Jan-14-07 12:40 AM |
#66 |
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Thanks. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 01:33 AM |
#73 |
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Immoral to go or stay. Bad for America to go or stay. |
gulliver |
Jan-14-07 12:41 AM |
#67 |
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WTF?!?!? AIR STRIKES!?!?! You're kidding, right? |
eridani |
Jan-14-07 12:55 AM |
#68 |
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Not indiscriminate. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 01:24 AM |
#70 |
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You have just described what we already did to Fallujah |
eridani |
Jan-14-07 05:35 AM |
#77 |
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I agree with you on the airstrikes, but we're talking about more than dishes. |
Clarkie1 |
Jan-14-07 02:05 AM |
#75 |
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Really? Why does the fact that our destruction has been more intense-- |
eridani |
Jan-14-07 05:38 AM |
#78 |
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O.K., I'll meet you half-way. |
Clarkie1 |
Jan-14-07 06:28 PM |
#156 |
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We are utterly unable to fix the social problems we have unleashed as well |
eridani |
Jan-15-07 03:01 AM |
#165 |
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I think the only thing American that should stay there |
tavalon |
Jan-14-07 01:30 AM |
#72 |
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Phased redeployment combinded with renewed legitimate political/diplomatic efforts. |
ellisonz |
Jan-14-07 02:26 AM |
#76 |
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Un-fucking-believable |
MadHound |
Jan-14-07 06:56 AM |
#79 |
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Word. |
iwillalwayswonderwhy |
Jan-14-07 08:07 AM |
#81 |
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Okay, there is a bit of arrogance here |
iwillalwayswonderwhy |
Jan-14-07 07:53 AM |
#80 |
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Yes, you're correct. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 09:15 AM |
#88 |
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I don't think there is anything moral |
iwillalwayswonderwhy |
Jan-14-07 10:20 AM |
#95 |
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So what are you suggesting as an alternative? |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 10:34 AM |
#96 |
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You don't understand |
iwillalwayswonderwhy |
Jan-14-07 01:46 PM |
#116 |
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I am aware. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 01:58 PM |
#120 |
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I must disagree with your premise that the American people supported this war. |
BleedingHeartPatriot |
Jan-14-07 08:20 AM |
#82 |
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A .... "KINDER ...... GENTLER" ..... (arrogant) ....EMPIRE ??? |
charles t |
Jan-14-07 08:29 AM |
#83 |
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I'm not pretending... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 09:25 AM |
#89 |
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Every day of our unjust occupation of Iraq is a thousand atrocities. |
personman |
Jan-14-07 08:38 AM |
#84 |
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The assumption is: |
kentuck |
Jan-14-07 08:47 AM |
#85 |
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Indeed, that's what got us into this war in the first place |
iwillalwayswonderwhy |
Jan-14-07 08:57 AM |
#86 |
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Yet we know that... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 09:28 AM |
#90 |
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No, we don't "know" that... |
kentuck |
Jan-14-07 09:43 AM |
#91 |
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What do you think will happen, then? |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 09:57 AM |
#93 |
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It doesn't matter |
iwillalwayswonderwhy |
Jan-14-07 10:17 AM |
#94 |
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I'm sorry I disagree... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 10:38 AM |
#97 |
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The immorality of staying in Iraq: Why the U.S. should withdraw. |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 10:45 AM |
#98 |
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Then how do we do that? |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 11:00 AM |
#99 |
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Here is the |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 11:07 AM |
#100 |
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Problems with that, point by point: |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 11:40 AM |
#102 |
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The plan is clear, it's not what you want it to be, it is what it is. |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 11:58 AM |
#104 |
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You missed the points, in the end his proposal doesn't really differ from what Bush is doing. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 12:19 PM |
#108 |
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That's completely ridiculous. |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 12:46 PM |
#109 |
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Do you even understand what he is proposing? |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 12:59 PM |
#111 |
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You asked if there is something you misunderstand, so let me explain: |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 01:22 PM |
#113 |
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...and how is anything that I stated incorrect? |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 01:29 PM |
#115 |
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OK! |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 02:11 PM |
#125 |
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Here I'll prove you wrong: |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 03:11 PM |
#130 |
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"In reality, what I suggested is not radically different." No, it is. |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 03:58 PM |
#134 |
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So, what? He says... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 04:19 PM |
#138 |
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What exactly does this mean? |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 04:30 PM |
#139 |
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No, no and no. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 04:56 PM |
#142 |
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Here, |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 05:04 PM |
#143 |
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That's funny. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 05:24 PM |
#145 |
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You know, I am |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 05:56 PM |
#150 |
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Here are the actual orders for re-deployment laid out. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 06:16 PM |
#155 |
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That plan is |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 06:39 PM |
#158 |
| -
and what if we leave? |
iwillalwayswonderwhy |
Jan-14-07 01:50 PM |
#118 |
| -
And what if they do? |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 02:04 PM |
#122 |
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You are overlooking one salient fact. |
charlyvi |
Jan-14-07 12:10 PM |
#107 |
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You are right, really, we don't have any moral ground to stand on. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 01:18 PM |
#112 |
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Ah yes, the oil. So now we get down to the crux of the matter. |
charlyvi |
Jan-14-07 02:10 PM |
#124 |
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Lots of questions, I'll try and answer. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 03:00 PM |
#129 |
| -
Thank you for your patient answers. |
charlyvi |
Jan-14-07 03:33 PM |
#131 |
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Thanks. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 04:11 PM |
#136 |
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I agree with you on Powell. |
charlyvi |
Jan-14-07 04:19 PM |
#137 |
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Yes, and that is why... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 04:39 PM |
#140 |
| -
That's a very good point Meldread. |
charlyvi |
Jan-14-07 04:51 PM |
#141 |
| -
Yes, and the fact that... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 05:06 PM |
#144 |
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Our presence is a huge part of the problem. WE are the enemy. WE are |
leesa |
Jan-14-07 11:21 AM |
#101 |
| -
FYI: |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 12:04 PM |
#105 |
| -
We owe Iraq, but we have to get out and turn it over to another peacekeeper |
cmd |
Jan-14-07 12:07 PM |
#106 |
| -
Who is crazy enough... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 01:22 PM |
#114 |
| -
We can not stay there |
cmd |
Jan-14-07 01:57 PM |
#119 |
| -
They won't stand up and do it. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 02:12 PM |
#127 |
| -
Please reconcile your statements....... |
charles t |
Jan-14-07 01:47 PM |
#117 |
| -
No, you aren't out of line |
cmd |
Jan-14-07 01:59 PM |
#121 |
| -
Let me ask you something |
iwillalwayswonderwhy |
Jan-14-07 02:05 PM |
#123 |
| -
Are you talking to me? |
cmd |
Jan-14-07 02:36 PM |
#128 |
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Yes, and here is the rub. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 03:51 PM |
#133 |
| -
I though you said Kerry's plan is the same as Bush's. So you're proposing stay the course? |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 04:06 PM |
#135 |
| -
Yes, this looks like "stay the course" decked out in concern. |
dailykoff |
Jan-14-07 05:40 PM |
#147 |
| -
Since you now CONCEDE that your plan is "evil" & not "moral", why did you frame it as "our MORAL... |
charles t |
Jan-14-07 05:26 PM |
#146 |
| -
Simple. Give an alternative that is better. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 05:53 PM |
#149 |
| -
"I am fully aware of what the Iraqi people want...but what they want is inconsequential" |
ProSense |
Jan-14-07 05:58 PM |
#152 |
| -
That really boggles the mind. (n/t) |
dailykoff |
Jan-14-07 06:08 PM |
#154 |
| -
As if "genuine democracy" has EVER been a US concern, |
dailykoff |
Jan-14-07 06:03 PM |
#153 |
| -
Your 3 points bear little resemblance to your original "moral responsibility" to not "abandon" Iraq |
charles t |
Jan-14-07 06:54 PM |
#159 |
| -
Your suggestion is offensive. |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 07:22 PM |
#160 |
| -
Perhaps some may find your statement that "what they want is inconsequential..." offensive.... |
charles t |
Jan-15-07 01:31 AM |
#164 |
| -
White Man's Burden? |
Jacobin |
Jan-14-07 05:42 PM |
#148 |
| -
I guess the fact that... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 05:56 PM |
#151 |
| -
hmm |
Jacobin |
Jan-14-07 08:04 PM |
#161 |
| -
How is it any different than... |
Meldread |
Jan-14-07 08:34 PM |
#162 |
| -
Problem is those death squads are American. |
dailykoff |
Jan-14-07 11:13 PM |
#163 |
| -
"the height of arrogance" |
lwfern |
Jan-14-07 06:29 PM |
#157 |
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