proud2BlibKansan
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Sat Jan-28-06 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #140 |
| 143. Because the playing field is not even and never will be |
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What is unfair is comparing kids in the first place. A kindergartener from a poor and uneducated family who has never been read to is going to have a much harder time learning to read than one who comes from a well to do family that reads to him daily. The latter kid most likely already has a college fund in his name by the time he starts school while the first kid's parents are struggling to pay rent and keep the electricity turned on.
The playing field is not level from birth - even pre-birth. So how fair is it to compare these kids' test scores? I can save you a lot of trouble and tell you straight up that the kid from the well to do family is going to perform better. So why don't we move away from testing and comparing to actually providing both kids what they need? But if the PTB insist on testing and comparing, then I will advocate for the poor kids and insist that scores be adjusted.
That is the purpose of the fairness.
|
| -I knew it! Study shows public schools perform better than private schools. |
milkyway |
Jan-28-06 08:46 AM |
#0 |
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I am from Florida and Jebbie made sure |
wakeme2008 |
Jan-28-06 08:49 AM |
#1 |
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You got that right. |
The Backlash Cometh |
Jan-28-06 09:12 AM |
#6 |
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That is wrong |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 09:30 AM |
#11 |
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Here is |
wakeme2008 |
Jan-28-06 10:13 AM |
#30 |
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I didn't mean you were wrong |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:21 AM |
#32 |
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No problem |
wakeme2008 |
Jan-28-06 10:24 AM |
#33 |
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The ex-Catholic school mom I spoke with here in NY tried to find out |
milkyway |
Jan-28-06 11:14 AM |
#62 |
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Math was what I was behind in when I made my escape |
Warpy |
Jan-28-06 08:55 AM |
#2 |
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My sister moved her boys to private school |
malaise |
Jan-28-06 09:02 AM |
#4 |
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I have two kids; both went to public schools in elementary grades |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 09:37 AM |
#13 |
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Two sides to every story. |
FlaGranny |
Jan-28-06 09:40 AM |
#15 |
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What we need is a national standard |
free4now |
Jan-28-06 08:57 AM |
#3 |
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That is a huge debate in education right now |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 09:42 AM |
#16 |
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I disagree. |
LWolf |
Jan-28-06 08:00 PM |
#179 |
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If we are going to have nationally certified teachers |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:13 PM |
#182 |
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This is a sticky point for me. |
LWolf |
Jan-29-06 09:25 AM |
#190 |
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Oh that is TOO funny |
proud2Blib |
Jan-30-06 09:38 AM |
#197 |
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Are private religious schools TRYING to hire good math teachers? |
Boojatta |
Jan-28-06 09:05 AM |
#5 |
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I understand your point but technically they are the same thing |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 09:45 AM |
#17 |
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pay does not a good math teacher make! nt |
MassDemm |
Jan-28-06 10:02 AM |
#26 |
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Well as soon as we teachers get discounts on mortgages and groceries |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:25 AM |
#34 |
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Pay and benefits are not competitive with public schools |
rucky |
Jan-28-06 09:47 AM |
#19 |
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I doubled my salary |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:27 AM |
#35 |
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Yes, catholic schools and independent schools |
mirandapriestly |
Jan-28-06 05:20 PM |
#171 |
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I don't understand... |
Dorian Gray |
Jan-28-06 09:12 AM |
#7 |
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in essence (and i'm NOT vouching for the methodology of this study)... |
ret5hd |
Jan-28-06 09:18 AM |
#8 |
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Jan-28-06 09:32 AM |
#12 |
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You need to move beyond a personal level and look at the big picture |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:33 AM |
#36 |
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Jan-28-06 10:53 AM |
#47 |
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No one here is shrugging and saying 'oh well' |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 11:02 AM |
#50 |
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What is the purpose of your fairness? |
hack89 |
Jan-28-06 01:51 PM |
#140 |
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Because the playing field is not even and never will be |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 02:07 PM |
#143 |
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Excellent post! n/t |
countingbluecars |
Jan-28-06 02:54 PM |
#153 |
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Gracias |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 02:55 PM |
#154 |
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I don't know why I didn't think of this before. |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 03:43 PM |
#159 |
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Providing adjusted scores IS straight talk and honesty |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 10:41 AM |
#39 |
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They are probably referring to ethnic and socioeconomic groups |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 09:46 AM |
#18 |
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Jan-28-06 09:52 AM |
#23 |
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It's not the same thing at all and I can't believe you are that obtuse |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:35 AM |
#37 |
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You're missing the point. |
Sparkly |
Jan-28-06 10:44 AM |
#41 |
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Jan-28-06 10:51 AM |
#45 |
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No -- and you're still missing the point. |
Sparkly |
Jan-28-06 11:12 AM |
#59 |
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Jan-28-06 11:20 AM |
#67 |
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"As long as we treat them like objects..." |
Sparkly |
Jan-28-06 11:24 AM |
#71 |
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Jan-28-06 11:35 AM |
#78 |
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It's wrongly centered if it blames schools and teachers |
Sparkly |
Jan-28-06 11:48 AM |
#86 |
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what if we focus on other people's kids |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 11:26 AM |
#72 |
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Jan-28-06 11:50 AM |
#90 |
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Time to explain a few things |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 12:00 PM |
#99 |
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Jan-28-06 12:08 PM |
#105 |
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So just because we make twice what private school teachers make, |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 12:16 PM |
#108 |
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there you go comparing apples to oranges again |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 12:25 PM |
#116 |
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that has nothing to do with what's being discussed here |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 11:20 AM |
#68 |
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IN the real world you r achievement is measured from where you start |
Generic Other |
Jan-28-06 11:47 AM |
#85 |
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One of my student's parents also works a 12 hour day 6-7 days a week |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 11:49 AM |
#89 |
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Jan-28-06 11:58 AM |
#95 |
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You are actually comparing raising a pet to raising kids? |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 12:03 PM |
#100 |
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Jan-28-06 12:18 PM |
#111 |
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You are the one not arguing facts |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 12:25 PM |
#115 |
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sometimes people with kids lose their jobs |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 12:48 PM |
#127 |
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Well that wouldn't happen if they were more RESPONSIBLE!!! |
Telly Savalas |
Jan-28-06 01:44 PM |
#139 |
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LOL well said, my friend, well said |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 02:18 PM |
#146 |
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The only way that bank argument would work is if |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 11:17 AM |
#64 |
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Jan-28-06 11:22 AM |
#69 |
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So now you are saying that the dollar in the inner city is worth less? |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 11:33 AM |
#76 |
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the bank argument is still invalid. Here's a bank analogy that actually |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 11:53 AM |
#93 |
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Good analogy!! |
Sparkly |
Jan-28-06 12:16 PM |
#109 |
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Great analogy |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 12:27 PM |
#118 |
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It is an odd conclusion |
Yupster |
Jan-28-06 11:41 AM |
#82 |
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Yeah don't read all the explanations posted here |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 12:29 PM |
#121 |
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I Guess This is the Reason: |
ribofunk |
Jan-28-06 09:23 AM |
#9 |
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We have Montessori schools in our public schools here |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 09:48 AM |
#20 |
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Montessori schools ROCK!! |
loudsue |
Jan-28-06 11:10 AM |
#57 |
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Yes they do |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 11:38 AM |
#79 |
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Wouldn't it be wonderful if half the public schools in America were |
loudsue |
Jan-28-06 11:41 AM |
#81 |
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Yes that would be awesome |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 11:44 AM |
#83 |
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My friend has a kid in Montessori |
AngryAmish |
Jan-28-06 02:39 PM |
#150 |
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"Only"??? LOL |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 03:54 PM |
#162 |
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Another friend of mine is paying over $13k for second grade |
AngryAmish |
Jan-28-06 04:04 PM |
#166 |
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The highest priced private schools here |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 04:06 PM |
#167 |
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Conservative Christian schools are the worst |
Seagull |
Jan-28-06 01:28 PM |
#136 |
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Have you seen the movie 'SAVED"? |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 02:25 PM |
#147 |
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that is a great movie |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 04:41 PM |
#170 |
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In order to have a self-discovery model in public ed, |
LWolf |
Jan-29-06 07:26 PM |
#194 |
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Well it's about time! |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 09:26 AM |
#10 |
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Jan-28-06 09:38 AM |
#14 |
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You bet that RW agenda is destroying public education!! |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 09:56 AM |
#24 |
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Jan-28-06 10:04 AM |
#27 |
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You have literally no control over the agenda of the public schools |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:13 AM |
#29 |
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Jan-28-06 10:57 AM |
#49 |
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So, like I said, I want to move to Beverly Hills |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 11:15 AM |
#63 |
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Jan-28-06 11:53 AM |
#94 |
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You are arguing with yourself now |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 12:06 PM |
#103 |
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schools are a resource, yes, and a resource that the right has been trying |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 10:52 AM |
#46 |
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Jan-28-06 11:03 AM |
#51 |
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so just to clarify, you think we shouldn't bother w/ public education? n/t |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 11:04 AM |
#52 |
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Jan-28-06 11:09 AM |
#54 |
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The point is that it's not entirely the schools' fault |
Sparkly |
Jan-28-06 11:13 AM |
#61 |
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Jan-28-06 11:32 AM |
#75 |
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Not necessarily |
Sparkly |
Jan-28-06 11:38 AM |
#80 |
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Jan-28-06 12:04 PM |
#101 |
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Whose "fault" is that? It's NOT the kids' fault!! |
Sparkly |
Jan-28-06 12:14 PM |
#107 |
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Jan-28-06 12:38 PM |
#125 |
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To me, your arguments on this thread |
countingbluecars |
Jan-28-06 12:42 PM |
#126 |
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And we in education have certainly NEVER heard |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 02:32 PM |
#148 |
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who is accepting a failing product? |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 11:22 AM |
#70 |
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there is nothing wrong with an agenda of excellence |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 10:48 AM |
#44 |
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Jan-28-06 11:13 AM |
#60 |
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but the system isn't failing |
fishwax |
Jan-28-06 01:01 PM |
#131 |
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Probably the most highly regarded public school in Chelsea is named Lab. |
milkyway |
Jan-28-06 11:59 AM |
#96 |
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No they were both elementary schools |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 02:34 PM |
#149 |
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I went to private school most of my life. |
Ladyhawk |
Jan-28-06 09:48 AM |
#21 |
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I went all through private school too |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:05 AM |
#28 |
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Interesting that you say the fundie school tried to disprove evolution. |
milkyway |
Jan-28-06 11:30 AM |
#73 |
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It was quite awhile ago, but I bet the same thing goes on today. |
Ladyhawk |
Jan-28-06 02:09 PM |
#144 |
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As an aside, my music teacher (college level) is a creationist. |
Ladyhawk |
Jan-28-06 07:35 PM |
#176 |
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In my experience as an elementary teacher, |
countingbluecars |
Jan-28-06 09:50 AM |
#22 |
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Jan-28-06 09:58 AM |
#25 |
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The politicians are indeed responsible |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:19 AM |
#31 |
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Jan-28-06 10:47 AM |
#42 |
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Great!! I want to live in Beverly Hills. |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:56 AM |
#48 |
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Jan-28-06 11:07 AM |
#53 |
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This is a progressive website |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 11:12 AM |
#58 |
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Ritalin argument is a red flag to teachers? |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 11:18 AM |
#65 |
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Yes it is a red flag |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 11:31 AM |
#74 |
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Yet there are too many boys |
Yupster |
Jan-28-06 11:49 AM |
#88 |
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And you are basing that conclusion on which longitudinal study? |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 11:51 AM |
#92 |
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Just the study of my Little League team I coached |
Yupster |
Jan-28-06 01:38 PM |
#137 |
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That is what they call anecdotal experience |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 01:56 PM |
#142 |
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Oh how I agree with you on this. |
TriMetFan |
Jan-28-06 01:13 PM |
#133 |
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just because something is illegal |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 12:00 PM |
#98 |
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So sue her |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 12:05 PM |
#102 |
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It's been 8 years |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 12:08 PM |
#104 |
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So you are going to allow her to continue to do this to other families? |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 12:18 PM |
#110 |
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oh for crying out loud |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 12:20 PM |
#112 |
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I wil say it again - teachers cannot diagnose medical conditions |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 12:32 PM |
#123 |
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self-deleted |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 07:09 PM |
#173 |
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If it hadn't happened |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 07:24 PM |
#174 |
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And as I stated earlier, |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:04 PM |
#181 |
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yes shame on me |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 10:20 PM |
#184 |
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The real victim here is public education |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:36 PM |
#186 |
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Jan-28-06 12:23 PM |
#114 |
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I was stating my observations |
countingbluecars |
Jan-28-06 10:47 AM |
#43 |
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I've read your posts throughout this thread, and I think you're missing |
milkyway |
Jan-28-06 11:10 AM |
#56 |
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Thanks for This Info (nt) |
stepnw1f |
Jan-28-06 12:26 PM |
#117 |
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thanks for the welcome |
bricktop |
Jan-28-06 12:29 PM |
#120 |
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Yeah Surrre... Whatever this means |
stepnw1f |
Jan-28-06 12:54 PM |
#128 |
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"the new study used advanced statistical techniques" |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 10:35 AM |
#38 |
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The Dept of Education STRONGLY SUPPORTS private schools, vouchers |
Proud2BAmurkin |
Jan-28-06 11:09 AM |
#55 |
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no kidding |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 11:19 AM |
#66 |
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No It Does Not Say It All |
stepnw1f |
Jan-28-06 12:28 PM |
#119 |
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Well said. |
Balbus |
Jan-28-06 12:35 PM |
#124 |
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Guvmint bad. |
Telly Savalas |
Jan-28-06 01:56 PM |
#141 |
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LOL |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 04:00 PM |
#163 |
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Golly gosh gee it's sooooo funny |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 07:38 PM |
#178 |
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You can either laugh or cry |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 09:47 PM |
#180 |
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You trust BushCo's gov't? |
thinkingwoman |
Jan-28-06 07:37 PM |
#177 |
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My kids go to Catholic School here in Portland OR. for one reason.... |
TriMetFan |
Jan-28-06 10:42 AM |
#40 |
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I did not mean to imply that by my own anecdotal experience in our |
milkyway |
Jan-28-06 11:51 AM |
#91 |
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But you see I think the study is a bit wrong. |
TriMetFan |
Jan-28-06 01:02 PM |
#132 |
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I've never thought of Catholic schools as rich kids' schools. Here in NYC, |
milkyway |
Jan-28-06 01:18 PM |
#134 |
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But again I think this study is wrong. |
TriMetFan |
Jan-28-06 01:42 PM |
#138 |
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So just because you say the public schools in your area suck, |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 02:44 PM |
#151 |
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Hey proud2blib I never said that! But milkyways post did go after |
TriMetFan |
Jan-28-06 03:08 PM |
#156 |
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Yeah I understand |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 03:15 PM |
#158 |
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Well Thank You for being a Teacher. |
TriMetFan |
Jan-28-06 03:44 PM |
#160 |
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My eldest son went to an awesome Catholic high school |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 03:51 PM |
#161 |
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There you go. But I( bet you also had a lot to do with how your kid turned |
TriMetFan |
Jan-28-06 04:06 PM |
#168 |
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New England has the best public schools in the Country. |
AX10 |
Jan-28-06 11:33 AM |
#77 |
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I don't know if that's true, but they worked for me. |
Gormy Cuss |
Jan-28-06 04:02 PM |
#164 |
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On average, I think it is true |
NewJeffCT |
Jan-29-06 08:23 AM |
#188 |
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I think it's because of a deep commitment to literacy from colonial days. |
Gormy Cuss |
Jan-29-06 11:37 AM |
#192 |
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Even in super-rich towns |
NewJeffCT |
Jan-29-06 03:00 PM |
#193 |
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My kid attended private schools (non religious) until this year |
Carni |
Jan-28-06 11:45 AM |
#84 |
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i knew it too. i have done both with kids. yup |
seabeyond |
Jan-28-06 11:48 AM |
#87 |
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I went to a private elementary school-but it was quite liberal |
Lorien |
Jan-28-06 11:59 AM |
#97 |
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what an outrageously prejudiced thing to say... |
Rich Hunt |
Jan-28-06 12:14 PM |
#106 |
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Oh BooHooHoo.... Give Us All a Break |
stepnw1f |
Jan-28-06 12:31 PM |
#122 |
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You're right, it's a very subjective statement based on my own experience |
milkyway |
Jan-28-06 12:59 PM |
#130 |
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I agree with you up to the point of leaving DU. |
TriMetFan |
Jan-28-06 01:25 PM |
#135 |
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but the discovery of the study would be that it's not "their best shot" |
Baconfoot |
Jan-28-06 03:01 PM |
#155 |
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Another Right Wing Myth Goes BOOOOP! |
stepnw1f |
Jan-28-06 12:22 PM |
#113 |
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The very same sociological phenomenon... |
misanthrope |
Jan-28-06 12:56 PM |
#129 |
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Two signs we looked for |
knitter4democracy |
Jan-28-06 02:14 PM |
#145 |
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Algebra is part of our elementary curriculum |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 02:49 PM |
#152 |
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I'd like to hear some about that battle. SW MO could use some |
NoFederales |
Jan-28-06 05:57 PM |
#172 |
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The state of Missouri has brand new standards |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:19 PM |
#183 |
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No, I want the research studies: not the latest, greatest from DESE--what |
NoFederales |
Jan-29-06 07:59 AM |
#187 |
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Links to the research, please? |
NoFederales |
Jan-30-06 09:28 AM |
#195 |
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Links to the research, please. |
NoFederales |
Jan-30-06 11:27 AM |
#198 |
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Yeah! |
knitter4democracy |
Jan-28-06 07:27 PM |
#175 |
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I think they have changed the title from 'Algebra' |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 10:24 PM |
#185 |
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That's odd. |
knitter4democracy |
Jan-29-06 09:28 AM |
#191 |
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Our public school starts algebra in the early middle school years |
bleedingheart |
Jan-30-06 09:31 AM |
#196 |
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George W. Bush is a product of the best private schools in America. |
aquart |
Jan-28-06 03:10 PM |
#157 |
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LOL in all long threads like this, there is always one post |
proud2Blib |
Jan-28-06 04:03 PM |
#165 |
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They don't teach about flying monkeys and talking snakes |
springsteen4senate |
Jan-28-06 04:07 PM |
#169 |
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Everyone's experience is different; |
greiner3 |
Jan-29-06 08:27 AM |
#189 |