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Reply #85: there's nothing wrong with reframing.... [View All]

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ulTRAX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-27-05 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #77
85. there's nothing wrong with reframing....
But reframing is at best a useful TACTIC. My fear is that an emphasis on reframing will be used to repackage tired old ideas.

I believe the Democratic Party has to get back to core values. Reframing can provide the excuse NOT to engage in any serious introspection to restate those values or to uncover their internal contradictions.

That process is essential for a clear vision of where we want to take America in 50 years. That vision makes us focus on LONG-TERM strategies.

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  -WHY THE AMERICAN LEFT WILL LOSE.... ulTRAX  Jul-26-05 12:50 PM   #0 
  - It's easier to destroy than it is to create. n/t  rucky   Jul-26-05 12:51 PM   #1 
  - And that is a key concept that too many people forget  Mairead   Jul-26-05 02:37 PM   #41 
  - Look, big business founded this country and big business will run it  Imagevision   Aug-01-05 02:48 PM   #107 
  - Never  MisterLiberal   Jul-26-05 12:55 PM   #2 
  - I agree.....  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 01:11 PM   #8 
  - Nah Dems will win big in 2006.  brainshrub   Jul-26-05 12:55 PM   #3 
  - Dems will win big in 2006 -  IndyOp   Jul-26-05 01:11 PM   #7 
  - You are right.  brainshrub   Jul-26-05 01:13 PM   #10 
  - If election fraud happens again  phillinweird247   Jul-26-05 02:25 PM   #36 
     - I think banning the BBV will be enough.  brainshrub   Jul-26-05 02:30 PM   #39 
     - agreed and well put.  phillinweird247   Jul-26-05 02:33 PM   #40 
        - Welcome to DU phillinweird247  IndyOp   Jul-26-05 02:43 PM   #43 
     - and why won't election-fraud happen again?? it's a tool they know that  Imagevision   Aug-01-05 02:46 PM   #106 
  - in an anti-democratic system election reform means little  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 01:31 PM   #17 
  - star chamber called the EC??  lvx35   Jul-26-05 01:36 PM   #22 
  - the EC is a vote weighing scheme  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 10:00 PM   #63 
  - so why even vote in a red state?  flaminbats   Jul-26-05 11:14 PM   #69 
     - why vote in a red state?  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 01:24 PM   #87 
        - and the Senate represents nobody except state millionaires..  flaminbats   Jul-27-05 04:44 PM   #97 
           - we could not elect senators until 1913  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 05:09 PM   #99 
  - Also, why no voting rights for DC in all the years that we controlled  OrwellwasRight   Jul-26-05 11:34 PM   #72 
  - AMEN!  Nightjock   Jul-26-05 01:36 PM   #20 
     - Where do you get the Kerry won by 3 million votes figure from?  Hippo_Tron   Jul-26-05 10:20 PM   #66 
        - Too many facts and discrepencies  Nightjock   Jul-27-05 09:39 AM   #82 
  - Dean is great... but no substitute for VISION  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 01:13 PM   #9 
  - Framing is all about having a vision.  brainshrub   Jul-26-05 01:14 PM   #12 
  - I have read Lakoff's book n/m  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 01:19 PM   #14 
  - Forget him  Emendator   Jul-26-05 01:50 PM   #26 
     - Screw Wanniski  jmowreader   Jul-26-05 09:13 PM   #55 
     - You shouldn't  Emendator   Jul-26-05 11:31 PM   #71 
        - I know the Laffer Curve doesn't fucking work  jmowreader   Jul-27-05 07:20 AM   #79 
        - disagree  Emendator   Jul-27-05 01:41 PM   #89 
           - You have read the specs on the Laffer Curve, right?  jmowreader   Jul-27-05 08:14 PM   #100 
        - The Laffer curve is a joke.  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 03:55 PM   #93 
     - Why is Lakoff's strategy not the answer?  rman   Jul-27-05 05:01 AM   #77 
        - there's nothing wrong with reframing....  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 01:08 PM   #85 
        - Nothing's wrong  Emendator   Jul-27-05 01:30 PM   #88 
           - if fiscal responsibility isn't working, then FIND a way to make it work  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 01:51 PM   #91 
              - That's nothing new  Emendator   Jul-27-05 02:58 PM   #92 
                 - I DON'T believe people get it  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 04:04 PM   #94 
                 - You just answered your own question!  Emendator   Jul-27-05 04:30 PM   #96 
                    - No.... YOU MAKE THE ISSUE WORK FOR YOU  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 04:59 PM   #98 
                 - PATHOLOGY OF TAX CUT PSYCHOS  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 04:09 PM   #95 
  - Dean is framing his vision....  rman   Jul-27-05 04:59 AM   #76 
  - Dems win big and lose elections...Dean has head in sand.  autorank   Jul-26-05 08:21 PM   #52 
  - when they crash the economy, we'll have to bury our dead in the back yard  sam sarrha   Jul-26-05 12:55 PM   #4 
  - We'll have to hire the amish to take them  TheFarseer   Jul-26-05 12:59 PM   #5 
  - you bring up some good points  andyhappy   Jul-26-05 01:05 PM   #6 
  - Why the LEFT looses.  iconoclastNYC   Jul-26-05 01:13 PM   #11 
  - nice theory.....but it ignores history  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 01:19 PM   #13 
     - . . . and taking over the counting of the votes and the MSM! n/t  Talismom   Jul-26-05 01:27 PM   #16 
     - election reform is important.... but don't delude yourself  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 06:02 PM   #46 
        - Clinton won 43% in a 3 way election  Hippo_Tron   Jul-26-05 10:18 PM   #65 
           - it's EASY to get over 50% in a three-way race  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 01:41 PM   #90 
     - I actually think it is a combination of both.  OrwellwasRight   Jul-26-05 11:42 PM   #73 
  - I disagree with some parts.  bvar22   Jul-26-05 01:27 PM   #15 
  - PDA is still limited by mushy party politics  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 01:43 PM   #23 
  - I must agree that some of their stuff  bvar22   Jul-26-05 02:30 PM   #38 
  - I second this post - PDA is our last hope - n/t  pberq   Jul-26-05 09:03 PM   #53 
  - Its the republicans who don't have a vision  lvx35   Jul-26-05 01:32 PM   #18 
  - vision need not be Progressive  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 01:46 PM   #24 
  - I don't see it as the "American Left"...I see it as the American People.  fooj   Jul-26-05 01:33 PM   #19 
  - That said, aggressive war is a heinous crime  sweetheart   Jul-26-05 02:24 PM   #35 
  - Is this you Falwell? I mean, you said something almost exactly  frankly_fedup2   Jul-26-05 01:36 PM   #21 
  - you confuse diagnosing the problem with defeatism  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 01:52 PM   #27 
     - Diagnosing is not the same as predicting  Humor_In_Cuneiform   Jul-26-05 01:55 PM   #28 
        - if we don't get our act together....  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 02:01 PM   #30 
  - This sounds like immediate post election doubt etc  Humor_In_Cuneiform   Jul-26-05 01:48 PM   #25 
  - I don't believe Kerry Won......SUE ME  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 01:56 PM   #29 
  - I disagree of course  Humor_In_Cuneiform   Jul-26-05 02:03 PM   #31 
  - Well, if there is no hope . . . don't bother to vote . . . like the  frankly_fedup2   Jul-26-05 02:23 PM   #34 
  - The one that controls the counting of the votes is the one that wins.  frankly_fedup2   Jul-26-05 02:17 PM   #33 
  - I know where I want the Democratic Party to go.  tasteblind   Jul-26-05 02:05 PM   #32 
  - promising to maintain our safety net isn't enough to counter the Right  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 09:53 PM   #62 
  - That's not what I said.  tasteblind   Jul-27-05 09:02 AM   #81 
  - Plus we need to prepare the people for the aftereffects of Peak Oil  Gay Green   Jul-26-05 11:15 PM   #70 
  - Actually, the Dems are getting their act together in a big way...  McCamy Taylor   Jul-26-05 02:26 PM   #37 
  - I disagree. We won the culture war a long time ago, and we will prevail  noonwitch   Jul-26-05 02:43 PM   #42 
  - I don't believe we MUST lose  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 06:14 PM   #47 
  - We need to stay on message  ernstbass   Jul-26-05 02:52 PM   #44 
  - being "on message" is no substitute for true VISION  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 09:22 PM   #56 
  - I think you're missing the forest for all the trees  Lexingtonian   Jul-26-05 03:06 PM   #45 
  - how is a rush to abstract theory more useful than dealing with specifics?  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 09:34 PM   #59 
     - Again, do you even understand the phrase  Lexingtonian   Jul-26-05 10:55 PM   #68 
        - your approach is not useful  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 12:56 PM   #84 
  - Very true....probably effecting the demise of the AFL-cio  formernaderite   Jul-26-05 07:09 PM   #48 
  - there IS NO LEFT left. its the american CENTER you're referring to  maxsolomon   Jul-26-05 07:29 PM   #49 
  - Just like Greece and Rome  aspberger   Jul-26-05 08:05 PM   #50 
  - Actually, the Greeks were conquered by Philip of Macedon.  Bridget Burke   Aug-01-05 02:39 PM   #105 
  - Why the Left will WIN  autorank   Jul-26-05 08:18 PM   #51 
  - history is not certainty... it's a tug of war  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 09:13 PM   #54 
     - We agree  autorank   Jul-27-05 02:03 AM   #75 
  - hey Lakoff's strategy re: "framing the debate" is brilliant ....  ElsewheresDaughter   Jul-26-05 09:28 PM   #57 
  - have I read Lakoff?  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 09:39 PM   #60 
  - You seem to think this is all inadvertent, just incompetence or bad luck.  bemildred   Jul-26-05 09:29 PM   #58 
  - so then what?  ulTRAX   Jul-26-05 09:44 PM   #61 
     - Collusion between the parties. nt  bemildred   Jul-26-05 10:01 PM   #64 
  - The Left's only chance is to embrace the DLC....  kentuck   Jul-26-05 10:33 PM   #67 
  - the DLC is not a political action committee..  flaminbats   Jul-27-05 12:44 AM   #74 
  - the problem with the DLC is........  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 01:16 PM   #86 
  - It's the difference between being proactive and being reactive.  elperromagico   Jul-27-05 06:19 AM   #78 
  - Democrats MUST be the Party of Honesty  ulTRAX   Jul-27-05 08:59 AM   #80 
  - The Repukes have raised TWICE as much as Dems in '05  hnsez   Jul-27-05 10:53 AM   #83 
  - But more than we had at this time in the last election cycle  LittleClarkie   Jul-27-05 08:16 PM   #101 
     - All I know is I am pissed and will remain so until I c 1 neocon in chains  hnsez   Jul-27-05 10:48 PM   #102 
  - I wish I could say "told you so"  AmericanLiberal   Jul-27-05 10:52 PM   #103 
     - Democratic activism has to be targeted to the threats  ulTRAX   Jul-28-05 09:53 AM   #104 
 

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