| 185. Your definition of fearmongering is comical. |
|
First, I never guaranteed anything. I said I think a specific type of scenario will happen. I hope I'm wrong, but I have worked with investors/developers, including sitting in an office while local pols are called to get them in line to vote on an issue, and think it's a strong possibility. So I put up a friendly donation challenge to DU that we see something like it by year-end. And you didn't like it so you called me a fear monger.
I could just as easily say you are being an apologist for things you are posting out here. I won't, because I think you have the right to think and express yourself.
(The irony here is it turns out you don't even disagree that it can happen, you just don't like it being said.)
You have a huge "last word" thing going on that I see wasn't reserved only for me last night -- it's through this entire thread, so I am dropping this now, regardless of what you post afterward.
This is just silly, and maybe we'll be in agreement on the next issue.
|
| -Why I *DON'T* disagree with the Supreme Court |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 03:58 PM |
#0 |
 -
You know, that's an excellent point you have there. I didn't think about |
acmavm |
Jun-23-05 04:00 PM |
#1 |
  -
Thanks for making me feel a little better about this. n/t |
bribri16 |
Jun-23-05 05:37 PM |
#60 |
| -
You May Be Right |
atreides1 |
Jun-23-05 04:00 PM |
#2 |
| -
I believe they will get the fair market value for the home |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 04:05 PM |
#9 |
| -
Paid over years |
Tux |
Jun-23-05 04:10 PM |
#11 |
| -
What is your evidence of this? Here's a link that implies the contrary: |
spooky3 |
Jun-24-05 10:58 AM |
#157 |
| -
No, they get market price. Also, in most states you don't have to |
Feles Mala |
Jun-23-05 04:18 PM |
#17 |
| -
I read further. The homes were condemned but there is nothing to stop |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 04:24 PM |
#19 |
| -
That's not what my Dad got........... |
converted_democrat |
Jun-23-05 04:34 PM |
#28 |
| -
no, you get what the government decides is "just compensation |
unblock |
Jun-24-05 03:36 PM |
#187 |
| -
What's the "market value" |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 04:51 PM |
#35 |
| -
Most of the rest of the neighborhood sold and did quite well |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 05:01 PM |
#41 |
| -
self-deleted. n/t |
girl gone mad |
Jun-24-05 12:32 PM |
#167 |
| -
Negotiate the selling price |
CityDem |
Jun-25-05 04:34 PM |
#194 |
| -
Really? Read Begala's book about Bush and Arlington Stadium... |
OneTwentyoNine |
Jun-23-05 05:01 PM |
#43 |
| -
and he won that lawsuit...so much for your argument |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 05:14 PM |
#44 |
| -
And..so much for your argument about fair compensation... |
OneTwentyoNine |
Jun-23-05 06:22 PM |
#77 |
| -
Um...lawsuits happen all the time. My point was he had a remedy and |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 06:31 PM |
#79 |
| -
That family happened to.. |
girl gone mad |
Jun-24-05 12:33 PM |
#168 |
| -
I Believe! |
smb |
Jun-24-05 09:27 AM |
#130 |
| -
I think Nina Totenberg on NPR said they were offered $1.6 million |
spooky3 |
Jun-24-05 10:53 AM |
#153 |
| -
Ah, you're on old-style Republican |
wtmusic |
Jun-23-05 04:02 PM |
#3 |
| -
This ruling gives new meaning to "All politics is local." |
barbaraann |
Jun-23-05 04:02 PM |
#4 |
| -
Bless your heart |
OldLeftieLawyer |
Jun-23-05 04:02 PM |
#5 |
| -
I've had similar thoughts. |
sadiesworld |
Jun-23-05 05:26 PM |
#51 |
| -
Here's the opinion |
OldLeftieLawyer |
Jun-23-05 05:35 PM |
#56 |
| -
Thanks for the link. |
sadiesworld |
Jun-23-05 05:44 PM |
#63 |
| -
Yeah, I was appalled, too |
Synnical |
Jun-23-05 06:23 PM |
#78 |
| -
I fully concur. |
jmaier |
Jun-23-05 04:02 PM |
#6 |
| -
I agree. |
Kraklen |
Jun-23-05 04:03 PM |
#7 |
| -
It's always been a touch subject |
zipplewrath |
Jun-23-05 04:04 PM |
#8 |
| -
Sports stadiums are crap!!! |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 04:55 PM |
#37 |
| -
My one and only comment on this very long argument. |
SteppingRazor |
Jun-23-05 04:07 PM |
#10 |
| -
My comment on that- |
Lexingtonian |
Jun-23-05 04:14 PM |
#14 |
| -
Life, health, liberty and possessions - Locke |
Zensea |
Jun-23-05 04:45 PM |
#32 |
| -
I don't like that argument. Pollution should be regulable on grounds.... |
eallen |
Jun-23-05 04:11 PM |
#12 |
| -
How many "polluters" have been removed by Eminent Domain? |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 04:56 PM |
#39 |
| -
The courts HAVE ruled that some regulatory laws are takings |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 05:15 PM |
#45 |
| -
The problem is |
Nederland |
Jun-23-05 04:13 PM |
#13 |
| -
You can get another house with the money you are paid |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 04:25 PM |
#20 |
| -
What if you don't want one? |
SteppingRazor |
Jun-23-05 04:29 PM |
#23 |
| -
Nobody owns anything in perpetuity and that has ALWAYS been the law |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 04:32 PM |
#27 |
| -
Since When? |
Nederland |
Jun-23-05 05:16 PM |
#46 |
| -
The rule against perpetuities goes back to English common law and is |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 05:34 PM |
#55 |
| -
Sorry NSM |
Nederland |
Jun-24-05 10:43 AM |
#150 |
| -
bullshit buddy...... |
OneTwentyoNine |
Jun-23-05 05:26 PM |
#52 |
| -
What law? n/t |
Phoebe Loosinhouse |
Jun-23-05 05:29 PM |
#53 |
| -
Umm, this is a capitalistic society, right? |
high density |
Jun-23-05 10:47 PM |
#109 |
| -
Wrong |
guardian |
Jun-24-05 10:31 AM |
#143 |
| -
And I disagree with your not disagreeing |
Phoebe Loosinhouse |
Jun-23-05 04:15 PM |
#15 |
| -
Jobs are a public interest..no? |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 04:26 PM |
#21 |
| -
"Jobs" is the Trojan Horse. Wake up and smell the Starbucks!! |
Phoebe Loosinhouse |
Jun-23-05 05:24 PM |
#50 |
| -
consider these two cases re: public versus private distinctions |
welshTerrier2 |
Jun-23-05 05:36 PM |
#59 |
| -
Okey-dokey, here's my answer |
Phoebe Loosinhouse |
Jun-23-05 05:57 PM |
#69 |
| -
well, OK but ... |
welshTerrier2 |
Jun-23-05 06:18 PM |
#76 |
| -
You got it exactly right: I accept the idea of eminent domain for |
Phoebe Loosinhouse |
Jun-23-05 06:55 PM |
#80 |
| -
In this case the public good is legitimately being served |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 12:47 AM |
#120 |
| -
In this case, it appears that the public good is being served BUT |
Phoebe Loosinhouse |
Jun-24-05 07:18 AM |
#128 |
| -
It's no less consistent with the 5th amendment than using eminent |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 10:42 AM |
#147 |
| -
The Difference Is As Follows |
smb |
Jun-24-05 09:55 AM |
#138 |
| -
Yep |
smb |
Jun-24-05 09:32 AM |
#132 |
| -
Yea the assholes are not the ones getting their home ripped out from them |
nolabels |
Jun-23-05 04:16 PM |
#16 |
| -
Actually in this case if you read his decision he left LOTS for local |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 04:29 PM |
#22 |
| -
Monetary compensation is all well and good but some people......... |
nolabels |
Jun-24-05 03:05 AM |
#127 |
| -
I think you're all trying to put lipstick on a pig. |
zanne |
Jun-23-05 04:18 PM |
#18 |
| -
Nope. I'm trying to point out who the real pig is |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 04:29 PM |
#25 |
| -
i totally agree ... |
welshTerrier2 |
Jun-23-05 04:29 PM |
#24 |
| -
I agree with that technical interpretation of the ruling, but... |
TreasonousBastard |
Jun-23-05 04:31 PM |
#26 |
| -
Oh I completely agree with your first statement |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 04:35 PM |
#29 |
| -
OK, I am going to have to spend more time reading the decision... |
TreasonousBastard |
Jun-23-05 04:40 PM |
#30 |
| -
BUT IT'S FOR |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 08:16 PM |
#84 |
| -
That is not accurate. |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 11:36 PM |
#112 |
| -
Sorry |
smb |
Jun-24-05 09:38 AM |
#133 |
| -
Many small ponds are run by a few big fish |
Phoebe Loosinhouse |
Jun-23-05 04:42 PM |
#31 |
| -
I'm sorry but |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 04:50 PM |
#33 |
| -
Again read the decision. This area has had problems providing jobs |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 04:52 PM |
#36 |
| -
The whole damn country |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 04:59 PM |
#40 |
| -
You keep talking like every neighborhood will be like this one... |
OneTwentyoNine |
Jun-23-05 05:23 PM |
#49 |
| -
Actually you can pass that law locally with this decision |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 05:32 PM |
#54 |
| -
You don't need to walk all the way though a chicken coop... |
OneTwentyoNine |
Jun-23-05 06:07 PM |
#73 |
| -
The case does not provide for any precedent that was not there before |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 06:13 PM |
#75 |
| -
You're WRONG
|
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 08:19 PM |
#85 |
| -
Exactly! n/t |
Phoebe Loosinhouse |
Jun-23-05 08:32 PM |
#91 |
| -
Nope. In every section, Stevens carefully referenced the prior decision |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 10:29 PM |
#106 |
| -
Local BIG money elects local governments |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 08:23 PM |
#87 |
| -
In California, communities are passing laws against allowing Wal Mart |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 12:00 AM |
#114 |
| -
I love you, NSMA |
ComerPerro |
Jun-23-05 04:50 PM |
#34 |
| -
"public use" has long been interpreted to mean "public interest" |
welshTerrier2 |
Jun-23-05 04:55 PM |
#38 |
| -
And the public interest is served by another Wal-Mart?? |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 05:01 PM |
#42 |
| -
well, meeting the "test" is another matter ... |
welshTerrier2 |
Jun-23-05 05:17 PM |
#47 |
| -
Uh, your case one is what this ruling was about |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 08:20 PM |
#86 |
| -
Why I DO disagree |
DuaneBidoux |
Jun-23-05 05:19 PM |
#48 |
| -
Again, reread the decision |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 05:41 PM |
#61 |
| -
Just because it's been easy to exploit the poor in the past |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 08:24 PM |
#88 |
| -
So What? |
smb |
Jun-24-05 09:43 AM |
#134 |
| -
My point is simply that with it easier to do it through private than |
DuaneBidoux |
Jun-24-05 03:13 PM |
#183 |
| -
So prove it NMSA |
mongo |
Jun-25-05 03:47 PM |
#190 |
| -
The "Public Good"... |
hughee99 |
Jun-24-05 02:01 PM |
#176 |
| -
I completely agree with you |
pmbryant |
Jun-23-05 05:35 PM |
#57 |
| -
Thanks Peter..I've said the same thing numerous times today |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 05:43 PM |
#62 |
| -
The REASON that poor people can have their homes seized |
mongo |
Jun-25-05 04:07 PM |
#192 |
| -
I keep explaining it; Mongo keeps explaining it -- When Will It Sink In? |
smb |
Jun-28-05 09:55 AM |
#195 |
| -
I was born & raised in New London, so this hits home to me. |
Sparkly |
Jun-23-05 05:36 PM |
#58 |
| -
And I can definitely see your point..but consider this Sparkly |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 05:46 PM |
#64 |
| -
I see that point too, but... |
Sparkly |
Jun-23-05 05:56 PM |
#68 |
| -
The real NIMBY going on is that the middle class saw no problem |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 06:01 PM |
#71 |
| -
BLIGHT? Bogus!!! |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 08:27 PM |
#89 |
| -
And where were you when they did that? They didn't need this ruling to do |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 10:04 PM |
#101 |
| -
with the sub base closing this is even more critical |
NewYorkerfromMass |
Jun-23-05 05:50 PM |
#65 |
| -
thanks for the back-up in explaining this |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 05:56 PM |
#67 |
| -
Okay, I don't get that part. |
Sparkly |
Jun-23-05 05:58 PM |
#70 |
| -
It only limits Feds by reaffirming a prior case that said Feds didn't know |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 06:10 PM |
#74 |
| -
That Doesn't Require Eminent Domain |
smb |
Jun-24-05 09:46 AM |
#135 |
| -
And here is the crux of that biscuit |
mongo |
Jun-25-05 04:20 PM |
#193 |
| -
So ... states rights won out? |
Eastside Blue |
Jun-23-05 05:55 PM |
#66 |
| -
On medical marijuana they cited the commerce clause rightfully so |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 06:04 PM |
#72 |
| -
The law is an ASS |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 08:32 PM |
#90 |
| -
Really , he said "The law is a ass" |
Phoebe Loosinhouse |
Jun-23-05 08:40 PM |
#95 |
| -
Thanks |
ProudDad |
Jun-24-05 12:40 AM |
#118 |
| -
There is no cmmerce in a sick woman |
Eric J in MN |
Jun-23-05 08:38 PM |
#94 |
| -
It would help to have some legal training before you make such comments |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 10:10 PM |
#102 |
| -
A workplace is commerce. |
Eric J in MN |
Jun-23-05 10:42 PM |
#108 |
| -
Sorry my pet parrot is busy so I will respond to this with a new idea. |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 11:51 PM |
#113 |
| -
There is a difference |
Eric J in MN |
Jun-24-05 01:27 AM |
#124 |
| -
Congress has the power to regulate INTERSTATE commerce |
Hippo_Tron |
Jun-23-05 10:54 PM |
#110 |
| -
And that is not the issue and it is late and I am lazy |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 12:09 AM |
#115 |
| -
Why am I unsurprised? |
Walt Starr |
Jun-23-05 06:56 PM |
#81 |
| -
But the "taking" was legal..I thought all your arguments rested |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 07:35 PM |
#82 |
| -
This decision was bad law. It borders on what the Stalinists did in |
Walt Starr |
Jun-23-05 07:56 PM |
#83 |
| -
Bullshit. This decision was based on prior precedent. |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 09:57 PM |
#99 |
| -
Only legal because 5 pro-capitalist |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 08:35 PM |
#92 |
| -
This ruling doesn't stop federal laws passed by Congress for over-riding |
Eric J in MN |
Jun-23-05 08:35 PM |
#93 |
| -
Great reply on your blog |
ProudDad |
Jun-23-05 08:44 PM |
#96 |
| -
Thank you (nt) |
Eric J in MN |
Jun-23-05 08:47 PM |
#97 |
| -
Big problem with your essay here |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 10:15 PM |
#103 |
| -
Answer |
smb |
Jun-24-05 09:49 AM |
#136 |
| -
More from the dissent opinion which I totally concur with |
Phoebe Loosinhouse |
Jun-23-05 09:03 PM |
#98 |
| -
Funny..two judges who repeatedly rule against labor right invoking |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 10:03 PM |
#100 |
| -
That's what I thought |
ismnotwasm |
Jun-23-05 10:17 PM |
#104 |
| -
It distinguishes public use in a different manner than in the past |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 10:22 PM |
#105 |
| -
Ok, I think I get it |
ismnotwasm |
Jun-23-05 10:39 PM |
#107 |
| -
No. If someone wants you to get out of your house so they could |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-23-05 11:34 PM |
#111 |
| -
How Naive ARE You? |
smb |
Jun-24-05 09:51 AM |
#137 |
| -
I am not naive ..I can read..I read the decision |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 11:09 AM |
#160 |
| -
"Local" government in our western state already thinks it's groovy |
Sugarbleus |
Jun-24-05 12:23 AM |
#116 |
| -
And that was done under the law as it stood prior to the USSC |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 12:39 AM |
#117 |
| -
I love your plan |
ProudDad |
Jun-24-05 12:44 AM |
#119 |
| -
And this community will be better off with hundreds of jobs |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 12:49 AM |
#121 |
| -
Haven't been down on K street in awhile but last I was in Sacto |
Sugarbleus |
Jun-24-05 01:29 AM |
#125 |
| -
Local governments are easily bribed and easily impressed--please read! |
Nikki Stone 1 |
Jun-24-05 12:52 AM |
#122 |
| -
Anyone can be bribed. The court expanded PUBLIC USE to |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 01:42 AM |
#126 |
| -
Interesting way of looking at it |
Tinoire |
Jun-24-05 12:55 AM |
#123 |
| -
Nonsense |
smb |
Jun-24-05 09:26 AM |
#129 |
| -
And if their property were taken without compensation, you'd have a point |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 10:43 AM |
#149 |
| -
Who decides---compensation? |
TnDem |
Jun-24-05 07:01 PM |
#188 |
| -
Thank you, for some reason this whole case perplexed me |
LynneSin |
Jun-24-05 09:30 AM |
#131 |
| -
It's saying that the courts are not going to second guess |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 10:50 AM |
#151 |
| -
AGREE - I still say this is a sucker punch from the right |
Cell Whitman |
Jun-24-05 10:13 AM |
#139 |
| -
This is BAD and YOU should be upset. |
guardian |
Jun-24-05 10:19 AM |
#140 |
| -
So you don't believe in Eminent Domain ..period? |
Cell Whitman |
Jun-24-05 10:32 AM |
#144 |
| -
Stop with the red herring argument |
guardian |
Jun-24-05 10:36 AM |
#145 |
| -
I asked you a question |
Cell Whitman |
Jun-24-05 10:41 AM |
#146 |
| -
And I asked you a question too |
guardian |
Jun-24-05 10:51 AM |
#152 |
| -
I answered it by asking you to read my post above yours. |
Cell Whitman |
Jun-24-05 11:05 AM |
#159 |
| -
Yes I know there are horror stories..and the good people of |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 10:53 AM |
#154 |
| -
Your New Soulmates |
smb |
Jun-24-05 01:22 PM |
#173 |
| -
Your comments are complete non - sequiturs to my comments |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 01:32 PM |
#174 |
| -
They were offered far more than pennies (link inside). |
spooky3 |
Jun-24-05 11:03 AM |
#158 |
| -
Sorry, but I don't buy your arguement. |
MadHound |
Jun-24-05 10:30 AM |
#141 |
| -
I am not blindly praising bad policy |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 10:56 AM |
#155 |
| -
OK ,but there are a few other factors to take into consideration |
MadHound |
Jun-24-05 11:34 AM |
#165 |
| -
I posted this elsewhere, but I'm re-posting it here because this should be |
Czolgosz |
Jun-24-05 10:30 AM |
#142 |
| -
We need to hop on this: |
NewYorkerfromMass |
Jun-24-05 10:42 AM |
#148 |
| -
And they sued him and won |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 10:57 AM |
#156 |
| -
But did Bush and the Rangers ever re-pay the City of Arlington for |
Czolgosz |
Jun-24-05 11:10 AM |
#161 |
| -
If not I would assume there is a lien on the property |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 11:11 AM |
#162 |
| -
I live in a rural area |
Tom Rinaldo |
Jun-24-05 11:22 AM |
#163 |
| -
I agree |
guardian |
Jun-24-05 11:33 AM |
#164 |
| -
That's happening where I live in the booming Sun Belt. And it's |
KoKo01 |
Jun-24-05 03:02 PM |
#181 |
| -
What the media isn't telling you |
lwfern |
Jun-24-05 11:43 AM |
#166 |
| -
Exactly. "Fair market value" is what the government feels like paying, and |
Ron Mexico |
Jun-24-05 01:09 PM |
#172 |
| -
On point number 1: |
smartvoter |
Jun-24-05 02:33 PM |
#177 |
| -
While I can't argue all those specific facts, the courts left it open |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 02:50 PM |
#179 |
| -
Deleted message |
Name removed |
Jun-24-05 02:59 PM |
#180 |
| -
Please..you were indeed fearmongering and your post to me later on |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 03:05 PM |
#182 |
| -
Your definition of fearmongering is comical. |
smartvoter |
Jun-24-05 03:18 PM |
#185 |
| -
easier for citizens AND CORPORATIONS to change local governments |
unblock |
Jun-24-05 12:53 PM |
#169 |
| -
Clean elections are easier to legislate on the local level |
nothingshocksmeanymore |
Jun-24-05 01:05 PM |
#170 |
| -
This is exactly my view. nt |
smartvoter |
Jun-24-05 02:50 PM |
#178 |
| -
You're wrong - people are being fucked by way of "fair" compensation. |
Ron Mexico |
Jun-24-05 01:07 PM |
#171 |
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as i said, no such thing as home ownership anymore. |
unblock |
Jun-24-05 03:30 PM |
#186 |
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Thanks NSMA..... |
Old and In the Way |
Jun-24-05 01:44 PM |
#175 |
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Hear, hear |
HEIL PRESIDENT GOD |
Jun-24-05 03:18 PM |
#184 |
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So we're to believe Pfizer... |
greblc |
Jun-24-05 08:49 PM |
#189 |
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Yeah like when some local goverments |
Wabbajack |
Jun-25-05 04:04 PM |
#191 |
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That's Why "Deference" |
smb |
Jun-30-05 08:22 AM |
#196 |
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