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Reply #61: Have you looked into the "math" when boomers start retiring? [View All]

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googly Donating Member (801 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #13
61. Have you looked into the "math" when boomers start retiring?
The treasury will need hundreds of BILLIONS to repay all those
T-Bonds cluttering drawers in Social Security Admin. Where will
all of that cash suddenly materialize? Borrow more? Huge tax
increases? You know very well both will be very difficult.

And IMO, internal default of Treasury to repay SSA will not
hugely affect external sales of T-bonds so long as no default
occurs there. As an example, if one division of GM defaults
to another division, GM corporates still sell very well in the
market place.

So, what is wrong with stopping the spending of current SS surplus
and channel it into an arrangement exactly similar to the current
federal employees retirement fund, which has been returning far
better returns than the Social Security?
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  -The ONLY correct fix for Social Security googly  Feb-10-05 03:30 PM   #0 
  - The so called crisis is because there are fewer working Americans  Vincardog   Feb-10-05 03:34 PM   #1 
  - There are NOT fewer Americans paying in Vs taking out AT THIS TIME  googly   Feb-10-05 03:42 PM   #4 
  - I agree :-) But the only real result of selling the bonds now is to remove  papau   Feb-11-05 05:03 AM   #37 
  - Bull.  Warpy   Feb-10-05 03:44 PM   #5 
     - If we TRIPLED the payroll taxes on the rich, it still won't work  googly   Feb-10-05 04:03 PM   #6 
     - The fact is there is already a 2 Trillion dollar surplus in the SS Trust  Vincardog   Feb-10-05 04:22 PM   #7 
     - That "surplus" has ALREADY BEEN SPENT!  googly   Feb-10-05 08:55 PM   #9 
     - It has been 'spent' on T Bills. T Bills mature and are paid off.  Vincardog   Feb-10-05 09:29 PM   #13 
     - Have you looked into the "math" when boomers start retiring?  googly   Feb-11-05 02:13 PM   #61 
        - I believe we can start by rolling back the trillions in tax cuts for the  Vincardog   Feb-11-05 04:49 PM   #73 
           - Excuse me for being blunt, but you are missing my whole point  googly   Feb-11-05 08:09 PM   #79 
              - excuse me Googly but YOU miss the point  Vincardog   Feb-11-05 08:23 PM   #82 
                 - If we can spend $500 billion per year on defense...  kentuck   Feb-11-05 08:26 PM   #83 
                    - Well Kentucky it looks that way. I believe some folks are  Vincardog   Feb-11-05 08:30 PM   #85 
     - The money borrowed on the other Treasury notes has been spent also !  kentuck   Feb-11-05 12:00 AM   #23 
     - My basic point------------------> when the boomers are at peak of  googly   Feb-12-05 06:01 PM   #93 
     - That is right wing SPIN  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 01:57 AM   #29 
        - Are they going to tell the Japanese and the Chinese the same...  kentuck   Feb-11-05 02:03 AM   #30 
        - I agree  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 02:06 AM   #31 
        - You are correct...  kentuck   Feb-11-05 02:08 AM   #32 
        - BIG BIG difference between external IOU's such as the Japanese  googly   Feb-11-05 08:29 PM   #84 
           - That assumes there is more danger in external default than  kentuck   Feb-12-05 08:08 AM   #89 
              - From social impact perspective you are right, but from practicality  googly   Feb-12-05 05:55 PM   #92 
        - Social Security has given EVERY SURPLUS DOLLAR since 1940's  googly   Feb-11-05 08:17 PM   #81 
     - Yes, they stole it fair and square and they don't want to pay it back.  SharonAnn   Feb-10-05 10:06 PM   #17 
     - Raising the payroll tax ends the last GOP talking point - but without  papau   Feb-11-05 05:08 AM   #38 
     - How about this idea to fix SS?  Mich Otter   Feb-12-05 06:20 PM   #95 
     - That's a helluva interesting comment, Warpy....  kentuck   Feb-10-05 11:58 PM   #22 
     - It worked for 70 years - and the tax rates that it took to  qwghlmian   Feb-11-05 12:22 AM   #24 
     - payroll rates were last raised fifteen years ago!  flaminbats   Feb-11-05 01:29 AM   #25 
     - small correction  Warren Stupidity   Feb-12-05 07:05 AM   #88 
     - I think it's been a pretty damn good bargain...  kentuck   Feb-11-05 01:46 AM   #26 
     - How much have wages fallen?  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 02:09 AM   #33 
     - Let's see -  qwghlmian   Feb-11-05 11:34 AM   #47 
        - Constant 1982 dollars  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 12:43 PM   #53 
           - According to your .gov link, the average  qwghlmian   Feb-11-05 01:06 PM   #56 
              - Not to be dense  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 03:51 PM   #70 
                 - From your link -  qwghlmian   Feb-11-05 04:35 PM   #72 
                    - Ooooh  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 08:08 PM   #78 
     - They rates do NOT continue to rise, and do not need to rise  papau   Feb-11-05 05:12 AM   #39 
     - RE: Sustainable tax rate.  cattleman22   Feb-11-05 12:34 PM   #50 
     - Now compare that to income level raises, please. What would  DebJ   Feb-11-05 06:26 AM   #43 
        - In 1935, the cap was set at $3,000.  qwghlmian   Feb-11-05 10:58 AM   #46 
     - Then why are the federal employees getting better returns on  googly   Feb-11-05 08:39 PM   #87 
     - "first raise the earnings cap"  Warren Stupidity   Feb-11-05 06:54 AM   #44 
     - Chapter 8 "How Social Security Taxes Subsidize the Rich" in the book  EVDebs   Feb-12-05 06:09 PM   #94 
  - I've heard only the top 1% is necessary  Cocoa   Feb-10-05 03:34 PM   #2 
  - Even better if its only the top 1% but the MOST IMPORTANT  googly   Feb-10-05 03:37 PM   #3 
  - I have a couple of links on the lockbox  BlueInRed   Feb-10-05 09:26 PM   #12 
     - The LOCKBOX needs to be implemented SOON  googly   Feb-11-05 08:35 PM   #86 
  - That's what I've heard, too.  antiwarwarrior   Feb-12-05 06:24 PM   #96 
  - it already IS invested in a retirement fund  unblock   Feb-10-05 05:15 PM   #8 
  - and where will the US Treasury get the CASH to pay it back  googly   Feb-10-05 08:59 PM   #10 
     - "us treasuries" and "iou's" are the opposite ends of the spectrum  unblock   Feb-10-05 09:59 PM   #16 
     - ROLL BACK THE TAX CUTS  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 02:09 AM   #34 
  - as the poster papau has pointed out many times  BlueInRed   Feb-10-05 09:23 PM   #11 
  - Yeah thanks, but this solution requires weaning the pols away from the  googly   Feb-10-05 09:39 PM   #14 
  - Exactly, it's just too tempting n/t  BlueInRed   Feb-10-05 09:57 PM   #15 
  - Government control of business  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 01:55 AM   #28 
  - True - tight regulations will be needed to prevent "socially targeted  papau   Feb-11-05 05:16 AM   #40 
  - You are correct BlueInRed, googly and I appear to agree that Trust selling  papau   Feb-11-05 04:54 AM   #36 
  - Thanks for clarifying :)  BlueInRed   Feb-11-05 10:51 AM   #45 
  - I don't think government should own private businesses. n/t  cattleman22   Feb-11-05 12:35 PM   #51 
  - Do you think Social Security should be privatized?  Kathy in Cambridge   Feb-11-05 01:48 PM   #59 
  - Bush's plan is the worst of both worlds. Too much government to be a  cattleman22   Feb-11-05 02:34 PM   #68 
  - It is doing it NOW in the federal employees retirement fund, and  googly   Feb-11-05 02:15 PM   #62 
     - I still don't think government agencies should be able to do this.  cattleman22   Feb-11-05 02:38 PM   #69 
        - Except when you switch into personal accounts such as 403-b, 401-k  googly   Feb-11-05 07:10 PM   #75 
  - Good point. n/t  googly   Feb-11-05 02:27 PM   #66 
  - Walla! Problen solved! That idea is a keeper!  Auntie Bush   Feb-10-05 10:14 PM   #18 
  - Can anyone answer this Libertarian SPIN and debate stopper ?  T Bone   Feb-10-05 10:20 PM   #19 
  - Roosvelt demanded mandatory taxes  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 02:12 AM   #35 
  - What SPIN - in 1935 the IRS was given the job of chosing a way to  papau   Feb-11-05 05:20 AM   #41 
     - Roosevelt approved  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 12:52 PM   #55 
        - Sorry - Roosevelt wanted everyone covered - but self employed and various  papau   Feb-11-05 01:23 PM   #57 
           - Just not following  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 03:53 PM   #71 
              - It may be past my time for my nap- as KO says - now what was the question?  papau   Feb-11-05 07:20 PM   #77 
                 - Ah, I see  sandnsea   Feb-11-05 08:10 PM   #80 
  - Medicare is what needs to be addressed, not SS  Muddy Waters Guitar   Feb-10-05 10:54 PM   #20 
  - Medicare faces greater peril because of medical inflation..  flaminbats   Feb-10-05 11:19 PM   #21 
  - "medical inflation" because of the capitalist insurance companies...  kentuck   Feb-11-05 01:48 AM   #27 
     - True - medical care should not have a profit and CEO salary cost plus  papau   Feb-11-05 05:27 AM   #42 
     - Medical Inflation is due to a variety of reasons  cattleman22   Feb-11-05 12:38 PM   #52 
  - Medicare is a whole another issue, but lets limit to SS here please  googly   Feb-11-05 02:18 PM   #63 
  - Duh!!!!! That is what we should have been doing from the beginning!  cidliz2004   Feb-11-05 11:39 AM   #48 
  - Why don't they just raise the age to 80.  sarcasmo   Feb-11-05 11:42 AM   #49 
  - hmm. i thought the only correct fix was  MsTryska   Feb-11-05 12:46 PM   #54 
  - You are overlooking the fundamental problem, which is that  googly   Feb-11-05 02:25 PM   #65 
     - well yeah, there's that too.  MsTryska   Feb-11-05 02:31 PM   #67 
        - Yeah, the rich corporations can always pay more, but there is plenty  googly   Feb-11-05 07:14 PM   #76 
  - My understanding of all this..  peterh   Feb-11-05 01:39 PM   #58 
  - I agree, and which is why my "fix" is better, it requires NO OUTFLOW  googly   Feb-11-05 02:22 PM   #64 
  - "Logan's Run"  txaslftist   Feb-11-05 01:50 PM   #60 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Feb-11-05 05:00 PM   #74 
  - NO CRISIS  flounderinginflorida   Feb-12-05 09:43 AM   #90 
  - Um - you heard wrong. n/t  qwghlmian   Feb-12-05 10:35 AM   #91 
  - Did you see Rockefeller is proposing rolling back the tax cuts?  BlueInRed   Feb-12-05 07:10 PM   #97 

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