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Reply #29: Manieri's critique on the elemental aluminum topic looks pretty weak. [View All]

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eomer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-19-10 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Manieri's critique on the elemental aluminum topic looks pretty weak.
He's a forensic ballistics expert, not a chemist, and it looks like he has based his conclusion on a product warning label that he found by googling, basically.

And the statement he found does not really support his conclusion, does it? Does MEK really separate aluminum out of alumino-silicate? Manieri takes a generic statement about potential reactivity between MEK and aluminum (under unspecified conditions) and stops there without considering whether MEK will actually separate out aluminum when it is chemically bound in a specific compound and under the specific conditions of the test. He found the answer he liked, essentially, so that was the point at which he chose to stop.

In response Prof. Jones says that, no, MEK will not separate aluminum from alumino-silicate:

More responses... Tuesday morning 7 April 2009


2. In the section of MEK results in the paper, we state:
" Focusing the electron beam on a region rich in silicon,
located in Fig. (15e), we find silicon and oxygen and very
little else (Fig. 16). Evidently the solvent has disrupted the
matrix holding the various particles, allowing some migra-
tion and separation of the components. This is a significant
result for it means that the aluminum and silicon are not
bound chemically."

In kaolin and other substances which incorporate Al and Si, the Al and Si are bound chemically -- that is, they will NOT separate under the action of a solvent such as MEK. That is why these MEK tests are so significant! WE thought of the possibility of an alumino-silicate early on of course, but then we did the MEK tests and were observed a separation of Al from other elements with this solvent - and this test RULES OUT strictly the notion that the aluminum which migrated is bound in an aluminosilicate.

I've looked and couldn't find (so far) any paper that answers the question specifically. Do you have any?

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  -DNA is to rape as Active Thermitic Material is to _______?________. Stanchetalarooni  Sep-14-10 09:21 AM   #0 
  - Another try to sneak a 9/11 CT post into the Science Forum?  MineralMan   Sep-14-10 09:31 AM   #1 
  - It all depends  deconstruct911   Sep-14-10 09:48 AM   #2 
  - Really?  William Seger   Sep-14-10 10:10 AM   #3 
     - Over 1000 architects and engineers are asking questions that weren't asked or considered in the past  Stanchetalarooni   Sep-14-10 10:44 AM   #4 
     - That is a patently false claim  SDuderstadt   Sep-14-10 10:50 AM   #5 
     - 1297 verified Architectural and Engineering professionals  Stanchetalarooni   Sep-14-10 11:00 AM   #6 
        - key word being "professionals"  KDLarsen   Sep-14-10 11:02 AM   #7 
        - Which is not the same thing as...  SDuderstadt   Sep-14-10 11:06 AM   #8 
     - Richard Gage isn't "asking questions"  William Seger   Sep-15-10 09:05 AM   #11 
     - A testable prediction or theory.  Stanchetalarooni   Sep-14-10 11:16 AM   #9 
        - You are overlooking a third possibility. ( n/t )  Make7   Sep-14-10 11:50 AM   #10 
        - to amplify Make7, you're assuming evidence of "thermate"  OnTheOtherHand   Sep-15-10 09:50 AM   #13 
           - A lot like paint but distinguished from paint by the elemental aluminum.  eomer   Sep-19-10 09:27 AM   #25 
              - Harrit & Co. didn't do the necessary tests to determine that there was elemental aluminum  William Seger   Sep-19-10 12:01 PM   #26 
              - Can you point to a specific paper or post that demostrates what you say about aluminum? n/t  eomer   Sep-19-10 12:32 PM   #27 
                 - Since I'm sure you would doubt what any JREF'ers say...  William Seger   Sep-19-10 01:04 PM   #28 
                    - Manieri's critique on the elemental aluminum topic looks pretty weak.  eomer   Sep-19-10 04:32 PM   #29 
                       - You're allowing Jones to misrepresent Manieri's point  William Seger   Sep-19-10 10:47 PM   #30 
                          - The XEDS maps show that silicon is concentrated in the same areas as aluminum in the red layer.  eomer   Sep-20-10 07:37 AM   #32 
                             - So they claim, but fail to prove  William Seger   Sep-20-10 10:56 PM   #37 
                                - That's interesting.  eomer   Sep-21-10 03:58 AM   #38 
              - for what it's worth  OnTheOtherHand   Sep-20-10 06:41 AM   #31 
                 - Yes, I'm outside my expertise too (as you know).  eomer   Sep-20-10 01:54 PM   #34 
                    - no worries, no snark taken  OnTheOtherHand   Sep-20-10 04:04 PM   #35 
  - woo? n/t  OnTheOtherHand   Sep-15-10 09:30 AM   #12 
  - So far the most correct answer. nt  LARED   Sep-18-10 06:27 AM   #18 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-17-10 09:17 PM   #14 
  - This is a hard question  LARED   Sep-17-10 10:06 PM   #15 
     - So why don't you contact the authors of the paper and ask them?  tetedur   Sep-18-10 12:17 AM   #16 
     - I don't need to contact them because I already  LARED   Sep-18-10 04:57 AM   #17 
        - So when Kevin Maloney states that QuantumSphere produces  tetedur   Sep-18-10 08:16 AM   #19 
           - Active catalytic materials are different materials than  LARED   Sep-18-10 09:44 AM   #20 
              - No, I don't think I'll be contacting Niels Harrit for you  tetedur   Sep-18-10 05:44 PM   #21 
                 - Translation -  LARED   Sep-18-10 06:57 PM   #22 
     - I do.  eomer   Sep-19-10 06:52 AM   #23 
        - Not sure I buy that explanation  LARED   Sep-19-10 07:24 AM   #24 
           - What then is nanotechnology and is it new?  Stanchetalarooni   Sep-20-10 01:38 PM   #33 
              - If Jones et al established that Nanotechnolgy was used  LARED   Sep-20-10 06:49 PM   #36 

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