Reply #15: why do you say you're not a progressive, that you're a left winger?

[shira]

I've read yr constant attacks on other DUers where you label them RW, extreme, annd where you try to hide yr ultra-nationalistic and quite bigoted views behind other DUers like pelsar and LB, who are nothing at all like you.

When your views are not significantly different than Pat Buchanon's on I/P, I'd say your views are extreme and RW. He couldn't give a shit about Hamas on Fatah violence, Hamas using children as combatants and human shields, Hamas treatment of women and gays, etc....all he knows is to demonize Israel. But Pat has an excuse. He's a filthy rightwing piece of shit. What's your excuse?

I'm not "ultra-nationalistic" or bigoted. And I won't allow you to smear me in order to stifle debate.

You want to know, so here it is. There are some who have posted in this forum who hold views that are conservative sounding and not the slightest bit left-wing.

I know what you mean, see above WRT Buchanon.

They don't support a meaningful peaceful two-state solution, because to them *peace* is something where Israel is the dominant victor over a people who are obligated to live forever after in submission to them, doing menial tasks and being grateful for being allowed to stay in their homes.

Who here believes this crap? I supported Barak's offer in 2000 and I'd have no problem with Palestinians ending the conflict by agreeing to Olmert's 2008 offer. So WTF are you spewing about? And what more should Olmert have reasonably offered - that Israeli leadership still deserves your vitriol while you cannot bring yourself to criticize Abbas for turning down a very reasonable and fair offer? On this and almost all other things I/P, you're completely irrational and totally one-sided in your 'criticism'.

They claim because they agree on something with someone who is considered LW, that rubs off on them. Bullshit...

Ironic, b/c that's how I see you guys. You claim to be leftwing and for progressive principles but you couldn't give a shit what happens within Palestinian society regarding Hamas on civilian brutality. If it were left to you, Gaza would turn into another Iran or Afghanistan with zero human rights. It's pretty fuked up for you to claim you're for Palestinian human rights but not really against perpetual Hamas rule. And let's say you do really care....are you sad to see that none of your fellow radical leftwing comrades and organizations are working to ensure a civil society in Gaza, instill democracy and human rights, etc? Point me to some leftwing organizations you admire who are really stepping up for Palestinian HR's against Hamas oppression. How about just one?

You are one of the very few participants in this forum who has never expressed any political views on other issues outside of the I/P issue. I'd like to know what yr views are on things like the environment, women's rights, unionism, and a whole barrage of other things where I see others in this forum posting about upstairs.

I'm with the liberal democrats here in the USA on all the issues you mentioned, whether socially, economically, domestically, or internationally. Now what is your view on almost ALL congressional liberal democrats being against the Goldstone Report? Why hasn't Obama fulfilled your wet dreams on I/P yet? Oh yeah, they must all be "rightwingers". The Lobby got them!

What you said to Shaay in that other thread where you justified citing extreme RW sites by saying you don't read it for opinion but facts was so incredibly silly considering you've sat here in this forum and tried to paint other DUers with a nasty brush because they merely say something that you decide some RWer somewhere has said.

I explained that particular instance. I googled "settlements with legality" and came up with an article that looked credible to me. I have no idea what else is on that site, nor do I care.

What you do that none of them do is regularly defend posters who end up being tombstoned because of their blatant bigotry against Arabs, post links to really stinky extremist sites and then feign ignorance when someone points it out to you...

Who have I defended that's been tombstoned? And I defend blatant bigotry? GTFOH! Also, who are you to point out blatant bigotry against Arabs? Why doesn't your hyper-sensitivity to racism and bigotry against Arabs apply to Jews? You damned well know the difference (or think you know the difference) between rational criticism and irrational demonization when it comes to Arabs or Arab/Muslim societies. Why not against Jews and Israel?