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Reply #98: Backpedal, backpedal, backpedal... [View All]

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Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Guns Donate to DU
gorfle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-17-09 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #83
98. Backpedal, backpedal, backpedal...
You chose to make a statement about me.

Your statement is false.

It IS NOT what I said.


But it is exactly what you implied. Now you want to play the old "I said X but meant Y" game so that you can play the misunderstood victim once again.

We haven't forgotten you, Iverglas.

On those BARE FACTS, and on those SPECIFIC CRITERIA ALONE, I preferred one scenario over the other.

Then I think you are a fool, Iverglas. The two scenarios are nearly identical except for one important fact - in one scenario the victim was armed, and escaped physically unscathed, in in the other, the one you prefer, the victim was beaten and raped.

Your statement is false, because I HAVE NEVER SAID that I would prefer to see a woman raped than defend herself.

But clearly you have said you prefer the scenario where that is exactly what happened.

The overwhelming majority of sexual assaults do not involve any actual risk of death. Even if we consider only REPORTED assaults, the overwhelming majority are committed by people known to the victim.

Those offenders are NOT going to kill their victims.


First of all, who cares? Just breaking into my house and forcing me to retreat behind other locked doors in my house until they finally break through those is sufficient cause for me to shoot them, regardless of what their ultimate intent for me is.

I do not regard killing someone in apprehension of anything less than serious physical injury or death, or when an alternative to doing so is available, to be tolerable in a civilized society. And in civilized societies, it is not tolerated.

If you think that either of the women in either of the scenarios were not in imminent danger of serious physical injury or death, then you are almost certainly in a minority of such opinion holders.

I can't imagine anyone listening to those tapes and not coming to the conclusion that those women were in for serious physical injury or death. The only difference between them is one woman was able to resist her attacker and the other was not.

Second of all, I'm sure every victim of a rape where the perpetrator tells them they are going to kill them will feel much better knowing that they are only going to be beaten and raped.

And those victims are NOT going to use "lethal force" to defend themselves against the assault. Period.

Then I suggest you re-listen to the first recording, where what you claim is not going to happen period did happen.

Sexual assault is not punishable by death. I see absolutely no reason why killing to defend against a sexual assault -- where there are no reasonable grounds to apprehend serious physical injury or death -- should be tolerated.

Well thank dog you don't make the laws around here.

Encouraging women to kill men attempting to assault them sexually does nothing to address the many serious problems women have in such societies.

And discouraging them from defending themselves from sexual assault does nothing but leave them to scream over the phone to helpless 911 dispatchers.

All women have to do is pack heat, and pull trigger, and that whole rape thing will just go away. Women don't want to do that? Well damn, whose fault is it when they are abused and assaulted then, eh?

Let's be perfectly clear here. I do not blame the woman in the second recording for being beaten and raped - it is a travesty and a tragedy. But I do see that she clearly had plenty of time to fetch a firearm and take up a defensive position aiming at the basement door - if she had a firearm. I feel the same kind of remorse for these kinds of situations as I do when I hear about someone who died in a car accident and did not wear a seat belt. "If only, if only", and "This will never happen to me."
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