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Reply #72: No, sick would have been invading Japan. [View All]

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Walt Starr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-06-05 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #68
72. No, sick would have been invading Japan.
Which is what MacArthur and Nimitz wanted. Invasion would have meant glory for the generals and admirals.
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  -Hiroshima: What would you have done? bpilgrim  Aug-05-05 09:45 PM   #0 
  - The A-bomb was a war crime. Palestinians do commit terrorist acts. But  wurzel   Aug-05-05 09:58 PM   #1 
  - don't ask  bpilgrim   Aug-05-05 10:04 PM   #3 
  - Cooking men women and children non combatants is hard for me to deal  niallmac   Aug-05-05 11:03 PM   #10 
  - I agree, niallmac  zanne   Aug-06-05 09:00 AM   #71 
  - The problem with the demo option was, they only had two bombs  Bucky   Aug-06-05 12:23 PM   #113 
  - Hiroshima & Nagasaki did have military production facilities.  Bucky   Aug-06-05 12:19 PM   #112 
  - Okay, who voted "other" and didn't elaborate? n/t  IanDB1   Aug-05-05 09:59 PM   #2 
  - hmm  dweller   Aug-05-05 10:05 PM   #5 
  - Demo  dweller   Aug-05-05 10:04 PM   #4 
  - Demonstration  ck4829   Aug-05-05 10:17 PM   #6 
  - Hiroshima was quite a Demonstration, yet  Fescue4u   Aug-06-05 01:33 AM   #33 
  - I would have dropped it on some harmless, peaceful natives somewhere  IanDB1   Aug-05-05 10:19 PM   #7 
  - I voted for "demo"  aint_no_life_nowhere   Aug-05-05 10:30 PM   #8 
  - the US fascists didn't care about Auschwitz and didn't care about nukes  wli   Aug-05-05 10:46 PM   #9 
  - FDR and Truman were Fascists?? n/t  wrlwnd   Aug-06-05 12:49 AM   #27 
  - I would say that they themselves were not  wli   Aug-06-05 01:24 AM   #30 
     - They're are others calling the shots  libhill   Aug-06-05 07:15 AM   #37 
  - What a terribly uninformed thing to say.  Bucky   Aug-06-05 12:25 PM   #114 
  - Same damn thing - I don't go for revisionist history.  TankLV   Aug-05-05 11:14 PM   #11 
  - not everyone is gung-ho for collective guilt  MisterP   Aug-05-05 11:26 PM   #13 
  - But you all sure are for imagined innocence!  TankLV   Aug-06-05 11:53 AM   #96 
  - You cannot justify an injustice with another injustice  manic expression   Aug-05-05 11:30 PM   #16 
  - please read the information. you'll see the revisionism was the other  nofurylike   Aug-06-05 12:35 AM   #25 
     - I did, THEY are the revisionist history.  TankLV   Aug-06-05 11:54 AM   #97 
  - Without any doubt and unequivocably, precisely the same thing as was done  Walt Starr   Aug-05-05 11:23 PM   #12 
  - You'd sleep easily after murdering so many  manic expression   Aug-05-05 11:43 PM   #18 
  - I would know that the war was ended  Walt Starr   Aug-05-05 11:59 PM   #20 
  - The killing would stop...  manic expression   Aug-06-05 12:05 AM   #21 
     - The Japanese were the enemy, their deaths do not matter.  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 12:21 AM   #23 
        - Words cannot describe....  manic expression   Aug-06-05 12:36 AM   #26 
        - Hiroshima was a center of military industry  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:14 AM   #50 
           - And those 70,000 innocents  manic expression   Aug-06-05 09:39 AM   #80 
           - They don't matter a whit  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 11:04 AM   #85 
              - they were defeated and suing for peace...  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 11:08 AM   #88 
              - No, they weren't.  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 01:06 PM   #121 
              - Sueing for peace  Parche   Aug-06-05 04:29 PM   #153 
              - Deleted message  Name removed   Aug-06-05 11:56 AM   #98 
              - Ahh, now you resort to personal attacks  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 01:11 PM   #125 
                 - Deleted message  Name removed   Aug-06-05 03:24 PM   #146 
                 - Oh, and by the way...  manic expression   Aug-06-05 03:29 PM   #148 
                    - debate  Parche   Aug-06-05 04:52 PM   #157 
                       - I am not attacking,  manic expression   Aug-06-05 05:03 PM   #158 
              - Sure didn't stop the Germans and Japanese from doing it!  TankLV   Aug-06-05 11:56 AM   #99 
              - Take 2...  manic expression   Aug-06-05 03:27 PM   #147 
           - Hey Walt  Parche   Aug-06-05 04:17 PM   #151 
        - The Japanese had their enemies.  tuckessee   Aug-06-05 12:51 AM   #28 
        - Sometimes it takes evil to stop evil.  ovidsen   Aug-06-05 07:45 AM   #40 
        - That's not genocide  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:09 AM   #47 
        - Genocide  Parche   Aug-06-05 04:26 PM   #152 
        - How is that stance any different than the current U.S. position on Iraq?  SemiCharmedQuark   Aug-06-05 08:07 AM   #43 
        - Excuse me, when did the Iraqis bomb Pearl Harbor? n/t  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:08 AM   #44 
           - Ok, Afghanistan then?  SemiCharmedQuark   Aug-06-05 08:09 AM   #46 
              - Whendid the Taliban bomb anything? n./t  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:10 AM   #48 
                 - You're dodging the point purposely.  SemiCharmedQuark   Aug-06-05 08:12 AM   #49 
                    - No, I'm not. Youre comparing apples to kangaroos. n/t  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:15 AM   #51 
                    - How? How is killing civilians different in one case than in the other?  SemiCharmedQuark   Aug-06-05 08:16 AM   #52 
                       - #1, Civilians are killed in ALL wars. There is one way to end that -  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:22 AM   #55 
                          - This wasn't a few civilians caught in the crosshairs of war.  SemiCharmedQuark   Aug-06-05 08:47 AM   #60 
                             - What do you figure was the civilian to soldier ratio in a ball bearing  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:57 AM   #69 
                                - Why does the fact that they killed more people in another bombing excuse  SemiCharmedQuark   Aug-06-05 11:35 AM   #92 
                                   - It proves that civilian casualties when targeting a legitimate military  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 01:48 PM   #131 
                    - Enemy  Parche   Aug-06-05 04:31 PM   #154 
        - sounds like the SAME thing UBL would say  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 08:20 AM   #54 
           - Don't like the realities of war?  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:35 AM   #58 
              - that tired cartoon PROPAGANDA is clearly affecting your judgment on this  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 08:50 AM   #61 
                 - I will go with the opinion of the TOP military advisers that it WAS  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:54 AM   #67 
                    - the facts are japan was defeated and suing for peace  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 09:06 AM   #75 
                       - The facts are, there were two factions in Japan at the time  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 09:10 AM   #76 
                       - they had 1 condition, that we finally agreed to, then it ended  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 09:40 AM   #81 
                          - But those suing for peace with that one condition could not back it up  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 11:06 AM   #86 
                             - our military leaders backed it up...  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 11:22 AM   #90 
                             - But the Japanese military WOULD NOT HAVE ACCEPTED IT!!!!!  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 01:08 PM   #122 
                                - they did accept, though, as history records, once their 1 condition w/met  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 01:48 PM   #130 
                                   - Tojo was not prepared to accept it and it was only accepted AFTER  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 01:51 PM   #133 
                             - And the apologists conveniently igonore the FACT that the  TankLV   Aug-06-05 12:02 PM   #103 
                       - Yeah - suing for peace so much that they didn't surrender after the FIRST  TankLV   Aug-06-05 12:00 PM   #102 
  - I agree  libhill   Aug-06-05 07:24 AM   #38 
  - so you would not have opted to SAVE LIVES? and ignored all your militarily  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 08:17 AM   #53 
  - No, I would have followed the advise of the TOP TWO military advisers  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:50 AM   #62 
  - that is fucking sick..  jonnyblitz   Aug-06-05 08:55 AM   #68 
     - No, sick would have been invading Japan.  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 09:00 AM   #72 
        - That's crap...  manic expression   Aug-06-05 12:11 PM   #110 
           - WRONG, a new cabinet was offering peace with NO AUTHORITY  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 01:11 PM   #124 
              - Then accept the peace  manic expression   Aug-06-05 02:50 PM   #142 
  - the way things were back then  Skypilot 18   Aug-05-05 11:27 PM   #14 
  - BINGO! Ding! Ding! Ding!  TankLV   Aug-06-05 12:04 PM   #106 
  - 20/20 Hindsight is one thing, but in the context of the times, I would  rasputin1952   Aug-05-05 11:29 PM   #15 
  - Exactly What Was Done, Mr. Pilgrim  The Magistrate   Aug-05-05 11:35 PM   #17 
  - exactly what was done, sssssssssir? a quarter of a million humans were  nofurylike   Aug-06-05 01:11 AM   #29 
  - Your Grasp Of The History Involved, Ma'am  The Magistrate   Aug-06-05 01:29 AM   #31 
     - do not call me ma'am. now, you do need more study, if you wish to  nofurylike   Aug-06-05 01:35 AM   #34 
  - I would have opted to accept my military leaders advice to SAVE LIVES  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 08:33 AM   #57 
     - That's what Truman did.  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 09:02 AM   #74 
        - the military leaders in theater advised accepting japans 1 condition  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 09:28 AM   #79 
           - The people who made that one condition didn't have the guns  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 11:07 AM   #87 
  - No need for 2 bombs.  Xap   Aug-05-05 11:49 PM   #19 
  - And that wasn't the end -  libhill   Aug-06-05 07:41 AM   #39 
  - Bomb #1 didn't convince them to surrender.  TankLV   Aug-06-05 12:09 PM   #107 
     - True. But neither did Bomb #2. Fear of Russian occupation ended the war  Bucky   Aug-06-05 12:38 PM   #120 
  - A-Bombing Japan, twice, was the appropriate response...  Jack_DeLeon   Aug-06-05 12:13 AM   #22 
  - thank you for this thread, bpilgrim. and for the links. devastating....  nofurylike   Aug-06-05 12:22 AM   #24 
  - thank you for participating and pass'n the word  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 08:52 AM   #65 
  - Bomb them till they stop killing Americans  Fescue4u   Aug-06-05 01:32 AM   #32 
  - such as accepting the terms of surrender tendered BEFORE the bombs,  nofurylike   Aug-06-05 04:52 AM   #36 
     - There was no valid reason to accept  Fescue4u   Aug-06-05 12:02 PM   #105 
     - Again - that is BULLSHIT!  TankLV   Aug-06-05 12:10 PM   #108 
  - I've always thought this debate itself was misguided  Oak2004   Aug-06-05 01:58 AM   #35 
  - One thing is certain  libhill   Aug-06-05 08:09 AM   #45 
  - 60 years of "relative" peace is something...  Jack_DeLeon   Aug-06-05 02:27 PM   #137 
     - When you total the cost in blood  libhill   Aug-06-05 02:40 PM   #140 
  - no military leader in theater AT THAT TIME agree with you...  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 08:30 AM   #56 
     - The TOP military advisers said drop the bomb!  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:52 AM   #64 
  - I don't think I could have brought myself to use nukes  Raiden   Aug-06-05 07:48 AM   #41 
  - Should of dropped it right on the Emperors Palace  Freedomfried   Aug-06-05 07:57 AM   #42 
  - They were crimes against humanity.  Tierra_y_Libertad   Aug-06-05 08:46 AM   #59 
  - exactly, pure fucking evil. nt  jonnyblitz   Aug-06-05 08:58 AM   #70 
  - 150 Chicago Scientists who worked on the bomb were polled in 1945...  Junkdrawer   Aug-06-05 08:51 AM   #63 
  - A "demonstration" was militarily unfeasible. n/t  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 08:53 AM   #66 
     - How so?  wuushew   Aug-06-05 09:11 AM   #77 
        - I would have done nothig to alter the war  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 01:09 PM   #123 
           - "legitimate military targest such as Hiroshima and Nagasaki."...  Junkdrawer   Aug-06-05 01:16 PM   #126 
  - One again....besides other facts of the war, if the Firestorm over Tokyo,  rasputin1952   Aug-06-05 09:02 AM   #73 
  - Red Army Invasion of Manchuria  Boreas   Aug-06-05 09:19 AM   #78 
  - EVERY military leader in theater at the time DISAGREED with decision  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 09:46 AM   #82 
  - "THE DECISION TO USE THE ATOMIC BOMB" - THE H-NET DEBATE  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 09:56 AM   #83 
  - Was bombing Hiroshima really needed? New research suggests it wasn't.  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 10:54 AM   #84 
     - Very informative. Very intriguing. But reality in Tokyo is meaningless.  Bucky   Aug-06-05 12:32 PM   #118 
  - We set a precedent -- will we regret later?  fortyfeetunder   Aug-06-05 11:11 AM   #89 
  - i believe the whole world will and has ever since  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 11:25 AM   #91 
     - No one seems to mention the killing of a teacher and students in  hayu_lol   Aug-06-05 11:57 AM   #101 
        - Why was unconditional surrender so important ?  Junkdrawer   Aug-06-05 12:31 PM   #117 
           - The condition the Japanese wanted was to keep the Emperor but  neverforget   Aug-06-05 02:49 PM   #141 
              - the Japanese Emperor has always been a figure head, especially during WWII  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 03:51 PM   #149 
  - Bombs away!  MrSlayer   Aug-06-05 11:41 AM   #93 
  - what an apt user name  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 11:43 AM   #94 
     - Nothing wrong with studying it.  MrSlayer   Aug-06-05 11:57 AM   #100 
  - I would have bombed military targets, not civilans.  McCamy Taylor   Aug-06-05 11:45 AM   #95 
  - We did. They were all intermingled. Couldn't avoid hitting civilians.  TankLV   Aug-06-05 12:14 PM   #111 
     - You need to explain that comment a little better.  Bucky   Aug-06-05 12:29 PM   #115 
  - I've read articles that Eisenhower threatened to use bomb in Korea if the  FreeStateDemocrat   Aug-06-05 12:02 PM   #104 
  - After watching "the fog of war"  Lannes   Aug-06-05 12:11 PM   #109 
  - I don't think it's possible to put yourself in the shoes of Truman  paulk   Aug-06-05 12:29 PM   #116 
  - How many times do the Japanese have to surrender?  Generic Other   Aug-06-05 12:38 PM   #119 
  - not really, Japan retained it visions of power  idlisambar   Aug-06-05 01:32 PM   #127 
  - Interesting  Walt Starr   Aug-06-05 01:44 PM   #128 
  - I think the lesson the world learned was to never use those terrible  neverforget   Aug-06-05 01:44 PM   #129 
     - they sure are building plenty of em... and our current foreign policy  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 01:50 PM   #132 
     - This day is always a grim reminder  Generic Other   Aug-06-05 02:31 PM   #138 
  - Just dropping in...  darkism   Aug-06-05 01:56 PM   #134 
  - alright, I'm coming down on the side of "take conditional surrender"  boddhi   Aug-06-05 02:06 PM   #135 
  - War is war  Baclava   Aug-06-05 02:17 PM   #136 
  - then obviously, you would vote for accepting their 1 condition  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 02:38 PM   #139 
     - I blame the aliens for all wars  Baclava   Aug-06-05 02:57 PM   #143 
  - honestly? I don't know.  ulysses   Aug-06-05 03:09 PM   #144 
  - Thank you for trying to share truth and sanity today.  Zhade   Aug-06-05 03:11 PM   #145 
  - We were reading the Japanese Diplomatic dispatches at the time  neverforget   Aug-06-05 03:52 PM   #150 
  - all of our military leaders in theater at the time, disagree with you ...  bpilgrim   Aug-06-05 04:41 PM   #155 
  - Had to  Drewskie   Aug-06-05 04:48 PM   #156 
  - Locking....  Moderator   Aug-06-05 05:46 PM   #159 
 

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