You are viewing an obsolete version of the DU website which is no longer supported by the Administrators. Visit The New DU.
Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Reply #117: Yes, last year. However, I re-read it. [View All]

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
phantom power Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-05 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #86
117. Yes, last year. However, I re-read it.
Apparently, it's true that E1 = (EO + EB + EW). You really could drive the process using a portion of the product.

Even utilizing our entire waste stream, can we generate the equivalent of the 20 million barrels of oil that we use each day?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
  -Oil from Anything...And hardly anyone's writing about it. Andy_Stephenson  Apr-06-05 11:40 AM   #0 
  - Kind of like Mr. Fusion?  bryant69   Apr-06-05 11:41 AM   #1 
  - Yeah, that's the main drawback.  trotsky   Apr-06-05 11:44 AM   #3 
  - Balance that with the elimination of landfills and toxic waste dumps,  MercutioATC   Apr-06-05 11:46 AM   #4 
  - Actually, an economy based on this is carbon-neutral.  phantom power   Apr-06-05 11:48 AM   #5 
  - You're right.  trotsky   Apr-06-05 12:38 PM   #18 
  - No, the energy source is the sun. Nuclear not needed.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 01:50 PM   #29 
     - Since that heat isn't produced by a radioactive process,  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 01:55 PM   #32 
     - I think you're not accounting for the required heat energy  phantom power   Apr-06-05 02:01 PM   #36 
        - Is that necessarily a bad thing?  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:15 PM   #46 
        - Personally, I'm in favor of nuclear power.  phantom power   Apr-06-05 02:23 PM   #51 
           - well, okay, so could the recyclable spent rods you mentioned  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:26 PM   #54 
           - NO !!! TDP can't handle radioactives. NT  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:33 PM   #58 
           - It doesn't have to handle any radiation.  phantom power   Apr-06-05 02:40 PM   #66 
           - Needless. TDP produces it's own fuel.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:45 PM   #70 
              - yep, it's a perpetuum mobile  rman   Apr-06-05 03:28 PM   #94 
                 - Not perpetuum mobile. Just a way of harvesting solar energy.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 03:48 PM   #98 
           - Okay. I'd wondered. n/t  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:56 PM   #74 
           - Spent fuel has to be processed.  phantom power   Apr-06-05 02:38 PM   #64 
           - the spent nuclear fuel from a pebble-bed reactor is not as dangerous-  LiberallyInclined   Apr-06-05 02:34 PM   #60 
           - Right. We recycle it in places like Iraq.  leesa   Apr-07-05 07:45 AM   #113 
        - Actually you are wrong on this point....  Andy_Stephenson   Apr-06-05 02:19 PM   #49 
        - You have just described a system that...  phantom power   Apr-06-05 02:24 PM   #52 
        - No, he didn't. You did not understand.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:31 PM   #57 
           - Correct. The point I'm making is...  phantom power   Apr-06-05 02:42 PM   #67 
              - Yes, you can. It produces OIL. Oil is used as a fuel. NT  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:47 PM   #71 
                 - Maybe we're talking past each other.  phantom power   Apr-06-05 03:10 PM   #81 
                    - Have you even read the article?  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 03:18 PM   #86 
                    - Yes, last year. However, I re-read it.  phantom power   Apr-07-05 09:33 AM   #117 
                       - I am not qualified to answer that.  Silverhair   Apr-07-05 10:27 PM   #138 
                    - no - E1 = (EO + EB + EW)  Poor Richard Lex   Apr-07-05 09:00 AM   #116 
                    - TDP Produces OIL + Fuel-gas + solid Carbon + Minerals + Water!!  suziedemocrat   Apr-07-05 06:32 PM   #133 
                       - I think lots of people don't want TDP to succeed.  Silverhair   Apr-07-05 10:30 PM   #139 
                          - I think you are right!  suziedemocrat   Apr-08-05 06:21 AM   #144 
                          - I know no such people  raccoon   Apr-08-05 07:59 AM   #147 
                             - I said that because...  Silverhair   Apr-08-05 08:51 PM   #148 
        - So, there's *no* net 'loss' of energy? n/t  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:25 PM   #53 
        - There ARE problems. 1) It stinks. 2) Animals guts aren't free in U.S.  suziedemocrat   Apr-07-05 06:43 PM   #134 
           - Not terribly expensive to build the plants.  Silverhair   Apr-07-05 10:34 PM   #140 
        - You're talking about producing more energy than goes in  Selatius   Apr-06-05 02:29 PM   #56 
           - You are forgetting where the plants get their energy from.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:35 PM   #61 
              - Now I understand, but...  Selatius   Apr-06-05 03:12 PM   #82 
                 - The thing about the system is  Andy_Stephenson   Apr-06-05 03:16 PM   #85 
                 - Even so, it doesn't negate the common sense to reduce consumption  Selatius   Apr-06-05 03:24 PM   #90 
                    - Agreed. NT  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 03:25 PM   #93 
                 - Yes, we need to be looking at multiple sources.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 03:20 PM   #87 
        - One of the outputs of TDP is fuel-gas - which they use as fuel for TDP  suziedemocrat   Apr-07-05 06:09 PM   #132 
  - Combined with conservation measures  Frederik   Apr-06-05 11:55 AM   #8 
  - No. TDP helps with global warming.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 01:48 PM   #28 
  - Wrong!  BillyDoc   Apr-07-05 12:27 PM   #127 
  - maybe not as bad as...  webDude   Apr-06-05 11:56 AM   #9 
  - I thought the TDP oil was cleaner since solid carbon is a separate output.  suziedemocrat   Apr-07-05 06:01 PM   #130 
  - Wow! That sounds like the perfect solution. Wonder how cheap  Vinca   Apr-06-05 11:43 AM   #2 
  - Supposedly It's $85 a Barrel Now  ribofunk   Apr-06-05 12:22 PM   #14 
  - Changing World Technology says they can produce TDP oil for $15/ barrel.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 01:52 PM   #30 
  - this technology has been discussed many times at DU  Cocoa   Apr-06-05 11:50 AM   #6 
  - Ah cocoa as usual  Andy_Stephenson   Apr-06-05 12:24 PM   #15 
  - isn't Woolsey's involvement interesting to you?  Cocoa   Apr-06-05 12:39 PM   #19 
     - Yes his involvement is eyebrow raising...to say the least  Andy_Stephenson   Apr-06-05 12:53 PM   #22 
     - I'd tend to agree.  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:00 PM   #34 
     - Hitler's Germany invented several things that we use today.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 03:25 PM   #91 
        - and you'll notice  Cocoa   Apr-06-05 03:33 PM   #97 
           - I am talking about the process itself.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 03:52 PM   #99 
  - It is interesting that he should be involved. Kind of makes me give more  bunny planet   Apr-07-05 10:32 AM   #118 
  - I'm still undecided on this.  Discord   Apr-06-05 11:53 AM   #7 
  - lets empty our land fills into it.  Options Remain   Apr-06-05 12:01 PM   #10 
     - sure. thats ONE of the pro's for it.  Discord   Apr-06-05 12:06 PM   #12 
        - There is a great article in  Andy_Stephenson   Apr-06-05 12:25 PM   #16 
           - cool. thanks for the info.  Discord   Apr-06-05 12:27 PM   #17 
           - That article is very informative, BTW  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:07 PM   #43 
           - I read it Andy. It certainly seems encouraging, especially considering  bunny planet   Apr-07-05 11:10 AM   #119 
  - Is that part of energy independence?  whistle   Apr-06-05 12:02 PM   #11 
  - OMG - a positive solution! We need more of this on DU. Thanks Andy!!!  BigBearJohn   Apr-06-05 12:12 PM   #13 
  - It's already under attack  Warpy   Apr-06-05 12:44 PM   #20 
  - Big Agriculture is for TDP.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 01:58 PM   #33 
  - How about using it near a sewage plant too...  slor   Apr-06-05 02:00 PM   #35 
  - Exactly! Philadelphia was supposed to try this, don't know if they have.  satya   Apr-07-05 05:01 AM   #111 
  - From what I understood about Big Oil's initial reaction,  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:02 PM   #38 
  - Big Oil will have to wait for the patents to expire.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:38 PM   #63 
  - Yes, you are exactly right  slaveplanet   Apr-07-05 08:39 AM   #114 
  - I say  Squeech   Apr-06-05 12:49 PM   #21 
  - exactly. it has been very hard to find any accurate and  Discord   Apr-06-05 12:56 PM   #23 
  - Well everything that comes out at the end  Andy_Stephenson   Apr-06-05 01:02 PM   #24 
  - Links for the articles that you want:  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:01 PM   #37 
  - Point: that water is pure, as I understand the process. n/t  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:08 PM   #44 
  - Agree. I Hope It Pans Out. I Really Do. But . .  loindelrio   Apr-06-05 01:15 PM   #25 
  - I couldn't agree more  Squeech   Apr-06-05 01:27 PM   #26 
  - Perhaps it is being sat on until the current oil economy is milked dry.  tasteblind   Apr-06-05 03:32 PM   #96 
  - Take off the tinfoil hat.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 05:20 PM   #101 
  - Nothing tinfoil about milking current technology.  tasteblind   Apr-07-05 07:22 AM   #112 
  - Yeah, that works  Squeech   Apr-06-05 05:29 PM   #103 
  - Here's an article from Yesterday - two more from 1/2005 & 12/2004  suziedemocrat   Apr-07-05 07:01 PM   #136 
  - From anything, but not for free.  rman   Apr-06-05 01:45 PM   #27 
  - think nuke-u-lar.  LiberallyInclined   Apr-06-05 01:54 PM   #31 
  - how many new nuclear power plants would we need to produce  rman   Apr-06-05 02:04 PM   #40 
     - the technology will NEVER produce that much oil-  LiberallyInclined   Apr-06-05 02:16 PM   #47 
        - Hemp oil would be more expensive than TDP.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:28 PM   #55 
           - is there a link to the discover article you refer to?  LiberallyInclined   Apr-06-05 02:35 PM   #62 
              - Yes. I posted it above, but here it is again:  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:39 PM   #65 
  - The TDP energy comes from the sun.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:06 PM   #41 
  - All energy comes from the sun.  rman   Apr-06-05 02:34 PM   #59 
  - TDP uses more than just turkeys.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:43 PM   #68 
     - We do need fertilizer to grow food - *at the scale that we do*  rman   Apr-06-05 02:58 PM   #76 
        - The energy source is the sun.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 03:14 PM   #84 
           - You know plants need fertilizer don't you?  rman   Apr-06-05 03:25 PM   #92 
              - Weeds don't.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 03:31 PM   #95 
              - You do know that organic farmers grow crops without fertilizer don't you.  bunny planet   Apr-07-05 11:44 AM   #125 
  - Yes but even weeds are pretty inefficient  drm604   Apr-07-05 04:35 PM   #129 
     - Keep up the research. That may yield something too. NT  Silverhair   Apr-07-05 11:10 PM   #142 
  - Well it was explained this way  Andy_Stephenson   Apr-06-05 02:15 PM   #45 
     - perpetuum mobile  rman   Apr-06-05 02:48 PM   #72 
        - No, the 15% is LOST unrecoverable energy.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 02:50 PM   #73 
           - You can't both lose it and use it to power the process.  rman   Apr-06-05 03:06 PM   #80 
              - All energy is ultimately lost.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 03:12 PM   #83 
                 - I see  rman   Apr-06-05 04:22 PM   #100 
                    - Why would you fertilize weeds?  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 05:26 PM   #102 
                       - to get massive quantities of it,  rman   Apr-09-05 09:11 AM   #151 
                          - Your objection was covered in the original article.  Silverhair   Apr-09-05 09:37 AM   #152 
  - From what I've seen on DU and other sites,  amandabeech   Apr-06-05 02:04 PM   #39 
  - that last is part of why Big Ag seems to be against it  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:21 PM   #50 
     - Big Ag doesn't get much bigger than ConAgra  Cocoa   Apr-06-05 02:43 PM   #69 
        - Contradicting something above.  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:58 PM   #77 
           - I'm not following you  Cocoa   Apr-06-05 03:01 PM   #79 
  - Barking up the wrong tree (the answer to peak oil is in the Bible)...  Cooley Hurd   Apr-06-05 02:06 PM   #42 
  - the really funny part is, if you account for the TDP process we're  kgfnally   Apr-06-05 02:18 PM   #48 
  - Cheney's energy bill provided $95 million for this technology  Cocoa   Apr-06-05 02:56 PM   #75 
  - That's probably just payback to ConAgra, nothing for CWT. n/t  satya   Apr-07-05 04:33 AM   #108 
  - I've long fantasized about this...  SmokingJacket   Apr-06-05 02:58 PM   #78 
  - I know what you mean.  Silverhair   Apr-06-05 03:22 PM   #89 
  - Andy, I've been swamped and haven't had time to read  ryan_cats   Apr-06-05 03:21 PM   #88 
  - Thermal Depolymerisation is old technology  jmatthan   Apr-06-05 10:28 PM   #104 
  - Known as Kompogas? n/t  satya   Apr-07-05 04:21 AM   #105 
  - Fertilizer; Kompogas; Switzerland, Germany, Austria; kills mad cow prions  satya   Apr-07-05 04:25 AM   #106 
  - I emailed Gov. Gregoire's office about this last month, in the hopes that  satya   Apr-07-05 04:26 AM   #107 
  - I remember reading about this  TorchTheWitch   Apr-07-05 04:42 AM   #109 
  - Found link; destroys mad cow prions and breaks down dioxins and PCBs  satya   Apr-07-05 04:57 AM   #110 
  - In Theory, This Works.  ProfessorGAC   Apr-07-05 08:59 AM   #115 
  - Been done for years in Europe, & it's profitable.The rest of the world can  satya   Apr-07-05 11:25 AM   #121 
     - This Proposal Is More Chemically Involved  ProfessorGAC   Apr-07-05 11:32 AM   #122 
     - I'm sure you know more about it than I do; thanks. CWT's process is  satya   Apr-07-05 11:43 AM   #124 
     - that's entirely different  rman   Apr-09-05 09:05 AM   #150 
  - I read the Discover article Andy. It certainly was encouraging considering  bunny planet   Apr-07-05 11:13 AM   #120 
  - Fabulous! another great  MsTryska   Apr-07-05 11:35 AM   #123 
  - Who'd a thunk it, innovation on Laaaawwwng Island.  bunny planet   Apr-07-05 12:03 PM   #126 
     - oh yeah? whereabouts?  MsTryska   Apr-07-05 12:44 PM   #128 
        - Valley Stream, which had no valleys or streams.  bunny planet   Apr-08-05 07:52 AM   #146 
  - Matt Savinar says it has a negative EROEI.  robertpaulsen   Apr-07-05 06:03 PM   #131 
  - thanks for the link... incredible.. and depressing..  trekbiker   Apr-07-05 06:59 PM   #135 
  - The point is to use inputs to TDP that would normally be waste.  suziedemocrat   Apr-07-05 07:26 PM   #137 
  - There are errors in your post.  Silverhair   Apr-07-05 11:06 PM   #141 
  - Kick  Javaman   Apr-07-05 11:15 PM   #143 
  - Biomass rules!  bigtree   Apr-08-05 06:52 AM   #145 
  - Thanks for the tip  Domitan   Apr-08-05 08:59 PM   #149 
 

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC