Reply #11: I think you give Bin Laden far too much credit

[theboss]

First of all, the war in Afghanistan did not bring on the fall of the Soviet Union. The war in Afghanistan probably sped up the fall of the Soviet Union because it helped expose the weaknesses that were already there. Bin Laden may believe that he erased a "western" nation from the history books but I don't believe he necessarily deserves the credit.

However, I completely agree that it is important to poin out that he thinks this, because his perception of the world is the driving force behind his movement.

The second point I have an issue with is your claim that Bin Laden was filled with rage at the Israeli's due to the situation in the West Bank. My understanding of Bin Laden is that he is/was filled with rage at the very fact that Israel exists in the first place. If I am wrong in this perception, tell me.

I don't think Bin Laden particulary cares about the Palestinians as a political movement. I think he cares that Jews rule over Muslims. But under his worldview, the notion of Palestinians or Saudis or Jordanians would be secondary to the idea of a Fundamentalist Muslim Pan-Arab empire. By that, I mean, if Israel suddenly stopped oppressing Palestinians and gave them a state, Bin Laden would not become friendly to Israel. Their presence in the Middle East is offensive.

In short, I think in a lot of ways you are painting as cartoonish a portrait of Bin Laden as the Bush Administration does, albeit in a different direction. He wasn't "created" in a lab by a mad CIA operative in 1981. His worldview was partially formed before he got to Afghanistan, came into full bloom there, was given the fuel by the US to grow his movement, but consistently found other outrages along the way to keep his philosophy alive.

And I don't necessarily buy the notion that we created "millions" like him. Few Iraquis have his intelligence, skill, and resources. We may have created many who would like to be like him, but I don't think we need to parallel the Administration is using him as our own bogeyman.

In short, the Bush Administration says, "If we don't kill people, Bin Laden will get you." You are essentially arguing, "If we kill people, a new Bin Laden will get you."