Reply #113: Lordy...

[pnb]

"Prove it! I know of no material the tobaccofreekids left out."

Well, hows about the information specific to bars? (see below) Why not separate the data? I'm sure they've collected it (if you answer with your "the critics didn't separate" drivel, see below).


"The actual examples of data they use are for restaurants or lump bars in with restaurants.

No, it includes INFORMATION about bars. The info is not seperated from restaurants, but there is info about bars in there."

If you want to play silly little semantics games to avoid the point, fine. The info about the bars is kind of useless (assuming I merely take your word for the fact that it is there) if THEY DON'T TELL US WHAT IT IS!!!


"I mentioned specific info about bars alone.

The critics have never made the criticism dependent on splitting bars from restaurants. If you want to claim that bars are being hurt, you need to provide some evidence. So far, I see none coming from you."

Actually many of critics HAVE indeed said that bars would have been affected more so than restaurants and I happen to be one of them so don't base your answers on what you think I might believe. I would be very interested in seeing that data.

And no, I don't need to provide a thing to you. YOU are the one claimed this post was proof. That onus is on you. I can point out that they don't seem to be telling the entire story without having to show you anything else. Regardless of anything I showed you, it would not change what this post says or doesn't say.


"No, you are VERY confused. This wasn't a poll. It was a study of NYS Dept of Labor records. Not a poll.

You do know what a poll is, and what a study is, don't you?"

OK, let's start from the beginning...in your original post, you said...
"The 2004 Zagat New York City Restaurant Survey provides additional evidence that New York City’s smoke-free law is not hurting business. The survey of nearly 30,000 New York restaurant-goers..."

I said..."I don't know how their particular poll was conducted (they don't seem to mention it)..."

You said..."You are confusing the Zagat's poll with the study conducted by NYC Dept of Health and Mental Hygiene."

Evidently you don't seem to realize that the Zagat's Survey is what I was referring to. If you want to base your dispute on the fact that I said "poll" instead of "survey," that's the best you're gonna get here.

I then said..."Well actually I was aware of who conducted this poll but your comment does not remotely address what I said. Deciding I confused something by mentioning that no methodology was written about shows me that either you are confused or would prefer not deal with the actual comment."

You said..."No, you are VERY confused. This wasn't a poll. It was a study of NYS Dept of Labor records. Not a poll.

You do know what a poll is, and what a study is, don't you?"

Seeing as I was referring to the Zagat's survey and not the other studies, I still say you are a very confused person because NYS Dept of Labor records had nothing to do with the survey (also known as a poll).


"Either way, no one has any right in the matter (except of course for the business owner) so no rights are being infringed upon then either (except of course for the business owner). If no one is being infringed upon in the first place, what is the point of enacting a law on the subject?

Again, VERY confused.

1) People DO too have rights in the matter. People (in this, the employees) have the right to not be harmed by other people's (the customers) actions (smoke)

2)The business owner has no right to allow his employees to be harmed by smoke."

You know, you calling me confused doesn't seem to have much bite seeing as what you consider confusing anyway.

1) Where did we get this right from? It's amazing how people decide they like the idea of something and that makes it a right. We can go back and forth on this one for hours because neither of us can really prove this as fact...although you seem to think your declaration makes it so.

2) What, is the owner the parent of a bunch of mentally challenged children or something? The business owner has no obligation to protect adults from it in a place they voluntarily go. Choice...what a concept.