YvonneCa
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Sat Jan-03-09 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #76 |
| 80. Perception. That's the problem. I am a teacher. Most districts in most ... |
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...states have an early day. Parents may think it's for religious instruction...or sports...or something else. Schools may have even told them that, so they wouldn't complain about the early day. But those days were set up for STAFF TRAINING. Period. BTW, teachers hate it too.
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| -School sued over religious ed |
douglas9 |
Jan-02-09 06:55 AM |
#0 |
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Neither advances or inhibits? Bullshit. That's why it's aimed at such young |
acmavm |
Jan-02-09 07:16 AM |
#1 |
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Here is the real tragedy |
MajorChode |
Jan-04-09 07:48 AM |
#89 |
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They may be hoping for a stupider America . . . and/or another Bush . . . ??? |
defendandprotect |
Jan-04-09 10:24 PM |
#132 |
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To be "fair and balanced" |
MajorChode |
Jan-05-09 07:01 AM |
#143 |
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Scalia, Thomas, Roberts and Alito were not on the SCOTUS 60 years ago. They may think |
No Elephants |
Jan-05-09 03:45 PM |
#147 |
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Right . . . brainwashing has to start early -- |
defendandprotect |
Jan-04-09 10:22 PM |
#131 |
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This is why we have to pull back from the slippery slope of faith based initiatives and the |
No Elephants |
Jan-05-09 03:48 PM |
#148 |
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Agree --- let's get our money back . . . Unconstitutional -- |
defendandprotect |
Jan-06-09 12:06 AM |
#158 |
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K&R |
Soilent Brice |
Jan-02-09 07:29 AM |
#2 |
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Oh, they understand the separation of church and state, all right |
silverojo |
Jan-03-09 12:02 AM |
#73 |
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Well, what's left of it. |
No Elephants |
Jan-05-09 03:50 PM |
#149 |
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As an elementary public school teacher, I would be very upset. |
livvy |
Jan-02-09 07:40 AM |
#3 |
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You're a teacher? |
ALiberalSailor |
Jan-02-09 08:04 AM |
#4 |
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Not at all! I'll look for your message. n/t |
livvy |
Jan-02-09 09:06 AM |
#15 |
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Excellent comment and I totally agree. |
Hepburn |
Jan-02-09 08:46 AM |
#8 |
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There was a "release" program in my 1950s grammar |
MineralMan |
Jan-02-09 08:47 AM |
#9 |
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So true... |
Hepburn |
Jan-02-09 08:49 AM |
#11 |
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That was California...and now, even living in Minnesota, |
MineralMan |
Jan-02-09 08:51 AM |
#12 |
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I spoke Romanian at home as a child... |
Hepburn |
Jan-02-09 08:56 AM |
#13 |
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It's cold, but you get used to it. |
MineralMan |
Jan-02-09 09:37 AM |
#20 |
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I was in NYC public schools in the 50's |
sunnystarr |
Jan-02-09 11:05 AM |
#26 |
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CDD was great for me as a catholic kid, because |
Book Lover |
Jan-06-09 05:47 PM |
#163 |
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The courage of this parent must be admired . . .. |
defendandprotect |
Jan-04-09 10:29 PM |
#133 |
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When the kids in my class got released to go to the Catholic Church for religious retreats, the kids |
No Elephants |
Jan-05-09 03:52 PM |
#150 |
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I would have been enraged over this |
Marrah_G |
Jan-02-09 08:31 AM |
#5 |
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the trailer is on the school grounds, using the school's electricity, etc. |
Donnachaidh |
Jan-02-09 08:32 AM |
#6 |
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Exactly. I have no problem with release programs, but there's no "release" here. |
Xithras |
Jan-05-09 09:39 PM |
#154 |
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Simple solution - proceed with regular class instruction. If the children whose |
T Wolf |
Jan-02-09 08:32 AM |
#7 |
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I do understand the sentiment you have.... |
Hepburn |
Jan-02-09 08:48 AM |
#10 |
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These "innocent" children will grow up to be the GOPers of the future. Fuck them.... |
T Wolf |
Jan-02-09 09:04 AM |
#14 |
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Really? Cuz my parents made me do that shit and I sure didn't grow up to be a GOPer. |
JTFrog |
Jan-02-09 09:26 AM |
#19 |
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Me too - my sister and cousins all went - and we're almost all dems now... |
TankLV |
Jan-03-09 03:49 PM |
#85 |
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Nice, even third-graders are the enemy now? (nt) |
Posteritatis |
Jan-02-09 10:20 AM |
#23 |
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Marilyn Manson went to Christian Schools. He turned out fine. |
alfredo |
Jan-02-09 05:41 PM |
#67 |
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If you think |
Dorian Gray |
Jan-05-09 06:45 AM |
#141 |
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These kids are in public schools, at taxpayer expense, though. And the trailers are on school |
No Elephants |
Jan-05-09 03:58 PM |
#151 |
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I just couldn't do that. |
livvy |
Jan-02-09 09:14 AM |
#18 |
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The only problem with that is that it opens |
Ilsa |
Jan-02-09 08:59 PM |
#69 |
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How could it not? |
JerseygirlCT |
Jan-02-09 09:07 AM |
#16 |
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Does it have to be on a weekday? |
moggie |
Jan-02-09 09:12 AM |
#17 |
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Or after school. |
Dorian Gray |
Jan-05-09 06:46 AM |
#142 |
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They need to go back to Philosophy Courses |
glinda |
Jan-02-09 10:00 AM |
#21 |
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For Cryin' Out Loud - There's a church every 5 blocks |
askeptic |
Jan-02-09 10:02 AM |
#22 |
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All y'all heathens are missing the point. |
progressoid |
Jan-02-09 10:37 AM |
#24 |
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The school should have never implemented, but a lawsuit? |
newtothegame |
Jan-02-09 10:42 AM |
#25 |
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Yeah, a lawsuit - kind of like the one that brought us Brown v. Board of Ed. |
northernsoul |
Jan-02-09 11:51 AM |
#27 |
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Yeah I understand your argument... |
newtothegame |
Jan-02-09 11:54 AM |
#29 |
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Prayer in schools...is what this is about. It has ALWAYS... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-03-09 11:15 AM |
#77 |
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I'll say GOOD for the school, it SHOULD BE allowed. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 11:52 AM |
#28 |
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It should NOTbe allowed... |
and-justice-for-all |
Jan-02-09 12:19 PM |
#31 |
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It SHOULD be. Don't take student's time away from them. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 12:37 PM |
#36 |
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The students are having time taken away from them, from subjects like science and literature... |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 12:42 PM |
#37 |
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Well, you must then insist there is not enough time in a day. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 12:57 PM |
#43 |
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Schools have limited budgets, and limited time, yes... |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 01:07 PM |
#46 |
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Not so limited that they cannot find time for the parents and students. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 01:21 PM |
#48 |
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"good atheistic judge" where do you come up with these fascinating misconceptions... |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 01:25 PM |
#50 |
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A little dull minded today? That was meant as a judge on your side. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 01:36 PM |
#53 |
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On whose side? n/t |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 03:08 PM |
#60 |
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Hmmm. Am I dealing with someone with multiple personalities? /nt |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 08:56 PM |
#68 |
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Unless it's education of world religions- no |
TEmperorHasNoClothes |
Jan-02-09 01:38 PM |
#54 |
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No, it's freedom of religion, not religions. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 01:47 PM |
#56 |
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Not in Public Schools - with compulsory school attendance laws |
askeptic |
Jan-02-09 03:12 PM |
#61 |
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Students are only compelled to attend basic courses. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 10:54 AM |
#94 |
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What about elementary school classes, where... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 11:42 AM |
#97 |
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Are you suggesting the students cannot move themselves? |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 02:33 PM |
#107 |
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I'm talking about what the California Education Code defines... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 02:39 PM |
#108 |
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Does that mean that students cannot move? |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 03:45 PM |
#117 |
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Not without teacher decision and... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 03:55 PM |
#118 |
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That makes no sense. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 04:17 PM |
#121 |
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You used the term, 'stuck'... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 04:45 PM |
#122 |
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Perhaps the California Education Code has us stuck. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 08:28 PM |
#125 |
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And how will non-Christian children be free to make that choice... |
KevinJ |
Jan-03-09 05:20 PM |
#87 |
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Simple, they don't attend that room at that time. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 11:03 AM |
#95 |
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Not that simple |
KevinJ |
Jan-04-09 03:41 PM |
#116 |
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Not that complicated either. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 03:55 PM |
#119 |
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Not unfair, just the way life is |
KevinJ |
Jan-04-09 09:46 PM |
#127 |
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Being unfair is not necessary. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 10:30 PM |
#134 |
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You've been given several compelling reasons... |
KevinJ |
Jan-04-09 11:45 PM |
#138 |
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You might try to reread your own signature line. |
Festivito |
Jan-05-09 05:42 AM |
#140 |
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As long as there are hard-atheists who go beyond lack, and deny god, you'd be wrong. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 12:46 PM |
# |
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And that applies to this lawsuit how? n/t |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 12:52 PM |
#40 |
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It responded to a different post by and-justice-for-all. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 01:03 PM |
#44 |
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It looks like a church is running the instruction itself... |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 12:30 PM |
#34 |
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I would contend it is not preferential unless it displaces another religion. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 12:43 PM |
#38 |
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That makes absolutely no sense, and since when do death and incarceration enter into it? |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 12:46 PM |
#39 |
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But it does. It's called a Constitution. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 12:53 PM |
#41 |
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Actually, technically, life and liberty were NOT in the constitution originally... |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 01:04 PM |
#45 |
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And, if you elevate the Lemon test to an amendment, I'll heed it. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 01:13 PM |
#47 |
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Where would it inhibit religion? This is a fascinating interpretation you came up with... |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 01:23 PM |
#49 |
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You'll ignore the rest because of one point that did not matter? |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 01:43 PM |
#55 |
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What classroom is lying fallow in this case? Its a church owned trailer... |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 03:07 PM |
#58 |
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That would be one that is not being used. /nt |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 09:21 PM |
#71 |
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Yes, Festivito, that is consistent with your previous posts |
askeptic |
Jan-02-09 03:46 PM |
#64 |
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If compulsory, yes, this, however is not. |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 09:19 PM |
#70 |
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The school's purpose is to educate these kids in secular subjects, not make religious instruction... |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 10:23 PM |
#72 |
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Let me guess, you're the DEFINER person. |
Festivito |
Jan-03-09 12:25 AM |
#74 |
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Like I said, its outside the public school's scope to provide facilities for religious instruction. |
Solon |
Jan-03-09 01:00 PM |
#82 |
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Prohibiting use of facility is prohibiting a religious activity there. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 09:22 AM |
#90 |
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This is not a free speech argument. This post is not about... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 12:02 PM |
#99 |
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It was a PARALLEL to free speech. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 03:20 PM |
#109 |
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That's just plain... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 03:25 PM |
#111 |
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So was yours. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 03:31 PM |
#115 |
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It's about government being prevented...by law... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-03-09 11:20 AM |
#78 |
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You need to start at the beginning. /nt |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 10:40 AM |
#92 |
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Define... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 12:04 PM |
#100 |
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What version of the movie "Airplane!" are we in? |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 01:27 PM |
#102 |
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I'm sorry. I seriously did not understand... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 01:39 PM |
#104 |
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At approximately which word did you start noticing this confusion? /nt |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 02:28 PM |
# |
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At approximately which word did you start noticing this confusion? /nt |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 02:28 PM |
#106 |
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You seem not to understand that the First Amendment... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 11:54 AM |
#98 |
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Separation of church and state IS the law already |
MajorChode |
Jan-04-09 06:21 AM |
#88 |
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You're right, I should have used "right" instead of "law" |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 10:38 AM |
#91 |
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It wouldn't have made a difference if you had used "right" |
MajorChode |
Jan-04-09 03:31 PM |
#113 |
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Well, I'm not as precise with words as you seem to require. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 04:14 PM |
#120 |
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You're the one trying to make this an issue of semantics |
MajorChode |
Jan-04-09 05:02 PM |
#124 |
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Just an overview, review. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 10:03 PM |
#129 |
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A review of the overview |
MajorChode |
Jan-04-09 11:41 PM |
#137 |
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We agree. Here was my .... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-05-09 02:37 PM |
#146 |
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This is one of my favorite quotes on the subject... |
MajorChode |
Jan-05-09 08:12 PM |
#152 |
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That IS ... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-05-09 09:20 PM |
#153 |
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Thanks for acknowledging my opinion as my opinion and arguing |
Festivito |
Jan-05-09 10:05 PM |
#155 |
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The above sums up why your opinions are irrelevant.... |
MajorChode |
Jan-05-09 11:16 PM |
#156 |
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From you, an honor. /nt |
Festivito |
Jan-06-09 12:02 AM |
#157 |
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Unbelievable. |
YvonneCa |
Jan-06-09 03:30 PM |
#160 |
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Isn't it though. /nt |
Festivito |
Jan-06-09 05:39 PM |
#162 |
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Great post. n/t |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 04:50 PM |
#123 |
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First Amendment... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 11:34 AM |
#96 |
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Thank you, well aware, so on to the rest... |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 01:00 PM |
#101 |
| -
Where to begin... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 01:33 PM |
#103 |
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Glad we can agree on at least some little part. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 02:23 PM |
#105 |
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People are entitled to their own opinion... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-04-09 03:23 PM |
#110 |
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Much of this issue boils down to the motives of organized religion |
MajorChode |
Jan-04-09 08:40 PM |
#126 |
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OMG, that's hilarious! |
KevinJ |
Jan-04-09 10:01 PM |
#128 |
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I had some help in that one |
MajorChode |
Jan-05-09 12:13 AM |
#139 |
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Not in all cases, but too true for too many cases, and funny too. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 10:13 PM |
#130 |
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I would never suggest they were all bad |
MajorChode |
Jan-04-09 10:32 PM |
#135 |
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No one should get a free pass. |
Festivito |
Jan-04-09 11:19 PM |
#136 |
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You've hit it dead on |
MountainLaurel |
Jan-05-09 10:53 AM |
#144 |
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Do Atheists have a chance to promote their views to the students? |
baldguy |
Jan-02-09 12:12 PM |
#30 |
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Atheism is not a religion...nt |
and-justice-for-all |
Jan-02-09 12:19 PM |
#32 |
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It is a belief system. |
baldguy |
Jan-02-09 12:28 PM |
#33 |
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It's a lack of belief |
Tempest |
Jan-02-09 12:54 PM |
#42 |
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Lack of belief on the God of Abraham is not an indication of a lack of ALL belief. |
baldguy |
Jan-02-09 01:28 PM |
#52 |
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In that case, they're not really atheists |
Tempest |
Jan-02-09 05:08 PM |
#65 |
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Christians are atheists with regards to the belief in Amun, Jupiter and Quetzalcoatl. |
baldguy |
Jan-02-09 05:41 PM |
#66 |
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Self-delete, attached to wrong post. /nt |
Festivito |
Jan-02-09 12:31 PM |
#35 |
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It is a religious stance and is entitled to equal standing |
askeptic |
Jan-02-09 03:26 PM |
#63 |
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IIRC, I was sent to CCD after school |
GinaMaria |
Jan-02-09 01:27 PM |
#51 |
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Well, if the program "program neither advances nor inhibits religion," then ... |
damntexdem |
Jan-02-09 02:44 PM |
#57 |
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The line was crossed when the teacher delivered the kids, and it was on school property. |
jazzjunkysue |
Jan-02-09 03:08 PM |
#59 |
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OK, I'm a little mystified here, when I went to public school, as far as I'm aware of, the school... |
Solon |
Jan-02-09 03:13 PM |
#62 |
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You have really never heard of that? |
whopis01 |
Jan-03-09 10:10 AM |
#76 |
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Perception. That's the problem. I am a teacher. Most districts in most ... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-03-09 11:27 AM |
#80 |
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Nope, never heard of it, we'd have half days, but those were for parent-teacher conferences... |
Solon |
Jan-03-09 12:49 PM |
#81 |
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Never heard of it either |
GinaMaria |
Jan-04-09 10:44 AM |
#93 |
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I completely agree. There is a huge misunderstanding... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-03-09 11:23 AM |
#79 |
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Not only that, the school is really freewheeling down a slippery slope |
MajorChode |
Jan-06-09 01:09 AM |
#159 |
| -
I know. What defines a 'church' or a 'religion'? There is no ... |
YvonneCa |
Jan-06-09 03:41 PM |
#161 |
| -
These programs have been around for a long time. |
donco6 |
Jan-03-09 12:32 AM |
#75 |
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Religion pushing it's agenda, imagine. |
sarcasmo |
Jan-03-09 01:11 PM |
#83 |
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My family did that when I was in school - every Monday. |
TankLV |
Jan-03-09 03:47 PM |
#84 |
| -
Minnesota has (had?) a law allowing released time religious instruction |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Jan-03-09 04:49 PM |
#86 |
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And the fact there is a disclaimer in the front of the book which says |
RJ Connors |
Jan-04-09 03:30 PM |
#112 |
| -
Separation of Church and State |
Torem |
Jan-04-09 03:31 PM |
#114 |
| -
i remember this type thing... |
zelta gaisma |
Jan-05-09 11:03 AM |
#145 |
| -
Best-known former Huntington, Ind. schoolchild? None other than J. Danforth Quayle. |
KamaAina |
Jan-06-09 06:23 PM |
#164 |
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