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Reply #27: because he is the only person who can show a "Harm" do to this law. [View All]

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happyslug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. because he is the only person who can show a "Harm" do to this law.
Under the US Constitution the Courts can ONLY hear cases where someone has a claim. The ACLU can NOT file against the law if it has NO client that would be affected. Thus you stuck with Phelps. Other people will be affected but they have to show HOW, with Phelps he has a history of doing such protests and thus has a "Cause of Action" when it comes to this law.

Now as to why the law is restricted to Military Funerals, the courts have been more sympathetic to restrictions on the First Amendment if the restriction is narrowly written, i.e. NOT all funerals, just Military Funerals. Thus the authors of the law made an attempt to make it as constitutional as possible by making it as narrow as possible (and against a KNOWN problem, not a theoretical problem). Thus the law has an ability to be constitutional, but Funerals have ALWAYS been used for political purposes. Look at th irish wakes during the Irish Civil War of 1921-1921. Another case os that of the Chicago black child killed and mutilated by Mississippi racist (His mother insisted on an open coffin to show his injuries as a political statement). Thus funerals CAN BE political statements, as while as providing mourning. When people make anti-war or pro-war statements at a funeral is a Political Statement.

Thus the problem with this type of Statute, at what point does a funeral cease to be private and become a political statement? Except for private services, funeral are public that a continuing problem Funerals not only permit the family to mourn the loss, but Friends, and neighbors thus Funerals tend to be public. Thus the problem is where to cut off some opposing a political statement of a funeral (The problem is the most effective way to minimal such political statements in funerals is to leave it go, anything you do is worse, thus the British left the Irish do their protests during their funeral paraders, Mississippi kept quite about the death of the Chicago child).

Thus while I am torn by this statute, I tend to oppose it. First Phelps will die of old age sooner or later and with him his protest movement (Unless he decides it no longer pays to protest and cut out his protest before then), second the HARM such a statute will do LONG after Phelps is gone outlast the good such a statute will do while he is protesting (The statute could be used in any funeral situation even if no body is present, to stop protest against someone like Bush).
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  -Kansas Church to Fight Mo. Law in Court AnOhioan  Jul-21-06 11:11 PM   #0 
  - Here's how I look at it...  IanDB1   Jul-21-06 11:19 PM   #1 
  - The ACLU doesn't charge its clients  proud2Blib   Jul-21-06 11:44 PM   #8 
  - Well just keep in mind that popular speech has no need of being  Freedom_from_Chains   Jul-21-06 11:22 PM   #2 
  - I say no grounds for religious freedom only for free speech  LiberalFighter   Jul-21-06 11:22 PM   #3 
  - Good point!  proud2Blib   Jul-21-06 11:45 PM   #9 
  - I agree  KansDem   Jul-22-06 11:29 AM   #22 
     - Hopefully nobody shows up for his funeral  LiberalFighter   Jul-22-06 10:44 PM   #40 
     - Here, use this one  krispos42   Jul-23-06 11:53 PM   #70 
  - Free Speech is Free for everyone  atreides1   Jul-21-06 11:23 PM   #4 
  - I agree with you  AnOhioan   Jul-21-06 11:26 PM   #5 
  - Does he actually have a "church"? A building where he  annabanana   Jul-22-06 06:18 AM   #12 
  - he has a church.  xchrom   Jul-22-06 06:30 AM   #13 
  - Then he should DEFinately be picketed!. . . . . .n/t  annabanana   Jul-22-06 10:53 AM   #16 
  - He is  MuseRider   Jul-23-06 08:30 AM   #49 
  - need protest contingent to show up there  kineneb   Jul-22-06 11:19 AM   #18 
     - i wish we'd protest more than phelps.  xchrom   Jul-22-06 02:09 PM   #26 
  - The "church" is in his compound, in downtown Topeka!  nealmhughes   Jul-22-06 03:58 PM   #32 
  - I live nearby  proud2Blib   Jul-22-06 11:23 AM   #19 
  - agreed--even the repulsive little jerk we call phrooty phred has a right  niyad   Jul-21-06 11:41 PM   #7 
  - Let me ask you a question:  kgfnally   Jul-22-06 11:30 PM   #43 
     - Well you have to think of it like this.  PansophicOne   Jul-23-06 10:31 PM   #69 
  - Free speech is free speech  proud2Blib   Jul-21-06 11:38 PM   #6 
  - yes, well said.  rodeodance   Jul-22-06 02:58 AM   #10 
  - I spoke to Mr. Phelps and watched him protest me. I lived.  keopeli   Jul-22-06 06:05 AM   #11 
  - When Phelps trekked across the country protesting "gay" funerals  Solly Mack   Jul-22-06 06:31 AM   #14 
  - Minnesota did  krispos42   Jul-24-06 12:17 AM   #71 
  - speech is regulated -- contrary to what i'm seeing in this thread.  xchrom   Jul-22-06 06:33 AM   #15 
  - You're correct n/t  LostinVA   Jul-22-06 11:24 AM   #20 
  - My speech today, your speech tomorrow.  Tesha   Jul-22-06 03:37 PM   #28 
  - what i understand is that your notion of free speech lowers the bar  xchrom   Jul-22-06 06:14 PM   #35 
     - When you are gagged in the future, ...  Tesha   Jul-22-06 06:42 PM   #36 
     - all societies regulate speech -- even the most  xchrom   Jul-22-06 06:48 PM   #37 
        - Political speech in this country is essentially unregulated.  Tesha   Jul-23-06 05:03 PM   #68 
     - Some years ago, I had exactly this argument with a good friend ...  struggle4progress   Jul-23-06 02:20 AM   #46 
  - Precisely  Telly Savalas   Jul-22-06 11:17 PM   #42 
     - no one is arguing that speech is "unregulated"  Charlie Brown   Jul-23-06 03:54 AM   #47 
        - Local law enforcement could easily and quickly  dogfacedboy   Jul-23-06 11:48 AM   #64 
  - I am utterly amazed  DiverDave   Jul-22-06 11:02 AM   #17 
  - Yes I am amazed by that as well  proud2Blib   Jul-22-06 11:26 AM   #21 
  - because phelps and his ilk are just DYING for  Blue_Tires   Jul-22-06 03:44 PM   #29 
  - They'll have to be careful with this.  MGKrebs   Jul-22-06 11:37 AM   #23 
  - a law barring demonstrations around schools would be equally unconst'l  Charlie Brown   Jul-22-06 01:21 PM   #24 
     - I don't agree. There are limitations.  MGKrebs   Jul-22-06 09:24 PM   #38 
        - this is speech we're talking about, not lewd behavior  Charlie Brown   Jul-23-06 01:05 AM   #45 
           - I'm not saying we don't have free speech. I'm just saying it's tricky.  MGKrebs   Jul-23-06 07:31 AM   #48 
  - The ACLU is so clueless  bluestateguy   Jul-22-06 01:32 PM   #25 
  - because he is the only person who can show a "Harm" do to this law.  happyslug   Jul-22-06 03:36 PM   #27 
  - I would love to shoot Fred Phelps.  The Blue Knight   Jul-22-06 03:51 PM   #30 
     - He isn't worth it.  happyslug   Jul-22-06 10:54 PM   #41 
  - The way I look at it  me b zola   Jul-22-06 03:54 PM   #31 
  - The Repugs have already linked ACLU with 'liberals'  Danieljay   Jul-23-06 04:17 PM   #66 
  - Uh..... oh, my God. I can't believe what you are saying.  Rabrrrrrr   Jul-24-06 07:18 PM   #72 
  - But, but, but the ACLU is a communist organization! It's anti-christian!  54anickel   Jul-22-06 04:11 PM   #33 
  - I must admit this is ironic  insleeforprez   Jul-22-06 04:27 PM   #34 
  - ACLU does a healthy side business in irony  FredScuttle   Jul-22-06 09:29 PM   #39 
     - Wouldn't that be something? If the Democratic party had as much integrity  Rabrrrrrr   Jul-24-06 07:20 PM   #73 
        - I started giving in '92  FredScuttle   Jul-24-06 07:59 PM   #74 
  - i think this law is a travesty  HuffleClaw   Jul-22-06 11:44 PM   #44 
  - I may not always agree with what you have to say, but I will defend your  CornField   Jul-23-06 09:15 AM   #50 
  - kick to combine duplicate.  Pithlet   Jul-23-06 11:02 AM   #51 
  - ACLU Sues for Anti-Gay Group That Pickets at Troops' Burials  Biernuts   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #52 
  - As well they should.  asthmaticeog   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #53 
  - You are absolutly correct.  Freedom_from_Chains   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #56 
  - yup. the only reason this is happening now is because they  jonnyblitz   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #57 
  - That long? Wow.  asthmaticeog   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #61 
     - Randy Shilts, gay author of AIDs epic "And the Band Played On"  jonnyblitz   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #62 
  - I personally favor a very tough federal law that anyone killing  Biernuts   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #59 
  - This shows that the ACLU  ayeshahaqqiqa   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #54 
  - Well...  MrPrax   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #55 
  - Biernuts  Pithlet   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #58 
  - OK - consider it done n/t  Biernuts   Jul-23-06 11:03 AM   #60 
     - Thanks.  Pithlet   Jul-23-06 11:04 AM   #63 
  - This is just stupid.  Placebo   Jul-23-06 03:26 PM   #65 
  - This will be a huge campaign issue for the Republicans. They have already  Danieljay   Jul-23-06 04:21 PM   #67 
     - Only if we let it so...  FredScuttle   Jul-24-06 08:03 PM   #75 
 

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