| 71. Off topic, but "Terry Garcia" is an unfortunate name for a scholar. n/t |
| -'Gospel of Judas' Surfaces After 1,700 Years (Jesus asked to be betrayed) |
RamboLiberal |
Apr-06-06 12:00 PM |
#0 |
 -
This is really cool |
AngryAmish |
Apr-06-06 12:02 PM |
#1 |
 -
oh boy, the fundies are going to go nuts. first jesus on ice, now it's |
okieinpain |
Apr-06-06 12:05 PM |
#2 |
| -
There are dozens of gospels claiming weird stuff. |
Teaser |
Apr-06-06 12:12 PM |
#8 |
| -
My favorite one was when Jesus would kill his playmates. |
AngryAmish |
Apr-06-06 12:16 PM |
#14 |
 -
My favorite one is talking about Jesus and his soccer team and... |
Javaman |
Apr-06-06 01:26 PM |
#53 |
| -
I'm not certain any of the Gospels talk about Jesus' childhood |
hedgehog |
Apr-06-06 12:18 PM |
#15 |
| -
The Infancy Gospels of James and Thomas |
Teaser |
Apr-06-06 12:25 PM |
#19 |
| -
"Weird stuff" may explain why these gospels didn't make it into the |
hedgehog |
Apr-06-06 01:34 PM |
#59 |
| -
in those, Jesus was a brat and killed a kid. then he changed. I |
roguevalley |
Apr-06-06 01:51 PM |
#69 |
| -
I'm not a big believer in "pagan" influences on Christianity |
Teaser |
Apr-06-06 04:53 PM |
#108 |
| -
read these books, then consider their content. it will boggle you |
roguevalley |
Apr-06-06 05:06 PM |
#112 |
| -
It really does not matter whether one believes in influences or not. |
MaryBear |
Apr-07-06 12:49 AM |
#167 |
| -
The entire Bible is full of |
FlaGranny |
Apr-07-06 09:41 AM |
#172 |
| -
Well, Teaser, I think you have things a bit backwards. The Gnostics were |
Peace Patriot |
Apr-06-06 04:28 PM |
#106 |
| -
Gnostic Christian is an oxymoron. |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 05:26 PM |
#116 |
| -
I disagree |
DIKB |
Apr-06-06 06:25 PM |
#123 |
| -
Bible: conceived in sin |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 06:50 PM |
#128 |
| -
"We", eh? You got a mouse in your pocket? |
kestrel91316 |
Apr-06-06 10:11 PM |
#150 |
| -
What are you talking about?! |
mycritters2 |
Apr-07-06 05:25 PM |
#190 |
| -
Excuse me? |
DIKB |
Apr-07-06 07:28 PM |
#193 |
| -
Great reply; you explained Gnosticism perfectly./nt |
Roaming |
Apr-06-06 07:27 PM |
#131 |
| -
Microsoft Works |
edwardlindy |
Apr-07-06 10:21 AM |
#174 |
| -
You read, but do not understand |
The Traveler |
Apr-07-06 11:43 PM |
#197 |
| -
Thanks, PP. I value your expertise in this area. n/t |
truth2power |
Apr-06-06 11:30 PM |
#158 |
| -
Ahhhh, the pink laser! It eats my brain! |
mainegreen |
Apr-07-06 11:33 AM |
#178 |
| -
Gee, sounds exacly like today's Right-WingNut-Fundamentalists: |
Megahurtz |
Apr-07-06 03:23 PM |
#183 |
| -
Would you like to site the passage you are referring to? |
DoYouEverWonder |
Apr-06-06 05:04 PM |
#110 |
| -
huh??? n/t |
orleans |
Apr-08-06 12:47 AM |
#199 |
| -
The "Judas was on an assignment" view has been around for awhile |
greyl |
Apr-06-06 12:13 PM |
#11 |
| -
It stretches back to the Middle Ages, at least |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-06-06 12:36 PM |
#22 |
| -
I remember in "The Last Temptation of Christ" that it has at least |
coalition_unwilling |
Apr-06-06 01:40 PM |
#64 |
| -
In the book it's a very strong theme |
SheWhoMustBeObeyed |
Apr-06-06 06:14 PM |
#122 |
| -
It's also a central theme in "Jesus Christ Superstar". (NT) |
Tesha |
Apr-06-06 01:49 PM |
#68 |
| -
Not really |
AngryAmish |
Apr-06-06 12:15 PM |
#12 |
| -
You are right, Bible was developed out of the Council of Nicea. |
rkc3 |
Apr-06-06 01:36 PM |
#61 |
| -
the book "the Da Vinci Code" mentions this |
TrogL |
Apr-06-06 02:05 PM |
#78 |
| -
yes, and quite a few other books/articles of same/similar subject |
katty |
Apr-06-06 04:17 PM |
#103 |
| -
And you are not suspicious of this cementing of religion with the power |
Peace Patriot |
Apr-06-06 04:54 PM |
#109 |
| -
Good Stretch, Repression of Paganism did not occur till Justinian |
happyslug |
Apr-06-06 09:47 PM |
#147 |
| -
Religion and power of the state has always existed |
AngryAmish |
Apr-07-06 08:54 AM |
#170 |
| -
The fundies should love it... |
dchill |
Apr-06-06 04:01 PM |
#99 |
| -
I'm looking forward to reading this new one. It sounds like it confirms... |
WePurrsevere |
Apr-06-06 12:20 PM |
#17 |
| -
They found The Passover Plot? |
displacedtexan |
Apr-06-06 12:05 PM |
#3 |
| -
Somewhat different plots |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-06-06 12:38 PM |
#26 |
| -
It was also about being martyred. |
displacedtexan |
Apr-06-06 01:37 PM |
#62 |
| -
I remember reading that years ago. That book said that Jesus |
BrklynLiberal |
Apr-06-06 03:31 PM |
#96 |
| -
Thanks for the link! |
xmas74 |
Apr-06-06 12:06 PM |
#4 |
| -
I smell coverup... |
Canuckistanian |
Apr-06-06 12:07 PM |
#5 |
| -
Yeah-- obviously |
TexasLawyer |
Apr-06-06 12:22 PM |
#18 |
| -
"First of all, it was forty pieces. So you understand my position." |
Inland |
Apr-06-06 12:49 PM |
#30 |
| -
I've never had much animus against Judas |
Penance |
Apr-06-06 02:16 PM |
#85 |
| -
Right, it was pre-ordained |
Canuckistanian |
Apr-06-06 06:29 PM |
#124 |
| -
The National Geographic Channel is supposed to have a special |
Connie_Corleone |
Apr-06-06 12:10 PM |
#6 |
| -
justintime for Advertising the DAVINCI CODE w Tom Hanks-playing next month |
NIGHT TRIPPER |
Apr-06-06 01:18 PM |
#50 |
| -
This kind of crap always appears around Holy Week |
mycritters2 |
Apr-07-06 05:17 PM |
#187 |
| -
It was found in the 1970's - you should change your headline. |
greyl |
Apr-06-06 12:10 PM |
#7 |
| -
See Pg. 2 of the NY Times online article. |
Roland99 |
Apr-06-06 12:58 PM |
#37 |
| -
I can't, what does it say? nt |
greyl |
Apr-06-06 01:14 PM |
#46 |
| -
Same thing...first found in 1970. |
Roland99 |
Apr-06-06 02:18 PM |
#86 |
| -
Haha, oh :) |
greyl |
Apr-06-06 02:46 PM |
#91 |
| -
"The only known text...said to be a copy...of the original" |
FiveGoodMen |
Apr-06-06 12:12 PM |
#9 |
| -
In this case, because they had references to the original from other |
jobycom |
Apr-06-06 12:38 PM |
#25 |
| -
hey thanks. I'm going to show this to my wife. she will probably make |
okieinpain |
Apr-06-06 01:52 PM |
#70 |
| -
accepted story. I have a hard time believing churches and their |
roguevalley |
Apr-06-06 02:00 PM |
#73 |
| -
Understand, just because it's old doesn't make it true. |
hedgehog |
Apr-06-06 12:13 PM |
#10 |
| -
It's interesting because it could also be what those who tossed them out |
WePurrsevere |
Apr-06-06 12:47 PM |
#29 |
| -
"Just because it's old..." That's ONE of things that historians look at, |
Peace Patriot |
Apr-06-06 05:41 PM |
#118 |
| -
Jerry Garcia? I thought he was dead! |
endarkenment |
Apr-06-06 12:15 PM |
#13 |
| -
Of course they'll say that its just another |
LouisianaLiberal |
Apr-06-06 12:18 PM |
#16 |
| -
Concerning the "Betrayal of Judas"... |
w13rd0 |
Apr-06-06 12:27 PM |
#20 |
| -
speaking of Saul of Tarsus |
newspeak |
Apr-06-06 12:41 PM |
#27 |
| -
and, just because some male bishops |
newspeak |
Apr-06-06 12:30 PM |
#21 |
| -
This codex is a copy of an original believed written in 200 AD? |
Old Crusoe |
Apr-06-06 12:36 PM |
#23 |
| -
Textual analysis and contemporary references |
jobycom |
Apr-06-06 12:55 PM |
#35 |
| -
jobycom, thank you very much for that response. It puts me in the |
Old Crusoe |
Apr-06-06 01:26 PM |
#54 |
| -
Well, I was trained as an historian |
jobycom |
Apr-06-06 01:59 PM |
#72 |
| -
Well I say you get a raise. |
Old Crusoe |
Apr-06-06 02:02 PM |
#77 |
| -
Thanks! You can be my new best friend!! |
jobycom |
Apr-06-06 02:30 PM |
#88 |
| -
Because... |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-06-06 01:01 PM |
#38 |
| -
Hi, TechBear. I hear you on that. I would concede to a selfish response |
Old Crusoe |
Apr-06-06 01:29 PM |
#56 |
| -
One text I have |
newspeak |
Apr-06-06 01:06 PM |
#42 |
| -
Any confirmation of my suspicions of Bishop Iraneous is welcome, |
Old Crusoe |
Apr-06-06 01:35 PM |
#60 |
| -
I gave the book to my brother-in-law |
newspeak |
Apr-06-06 02:07 PM |
#79 |
| -
Old Crusoe |
newspeak |
Apr-06-06 02:20 PM |
#87 |
| -
Old Crusoe, sorry I'm late |
newspeak |
Apr-06-06 09:38 PM |
#142 |
| -
OK, this raises a serious common sense question................... |
Minnesota Libra |
Apr-06-06 12:37 PM |
#24 |
| -
Not if Jesus believed he was "the son of god" and going to his glory. |
lindisfarne |
Apr-06-06 12:53 PM |
#33 |
| -
Martyrdom. Jesus wasn't a messiah but he knew he could be made into one |
Roland99 |
Apr-06-06 12:56 PM |
#36 |
| -
Jesus didn't "want" to be betrayed |
hedgehog |
Apr-06-06 01:10 PM |
#44 |
| -
Human nature never changes |
AngryAmish |
Apr-06-06 01:34 PM |
#58 |
| -
Jesus evolved past the petty ego & lived to do the Universal Will |
cryingshame |
Apr-06-06 01:32 PM |
#57 |
| -
I like the way |
there-s a |
Apr-06-06 01:39 PM |
#63 |
| -
Reading the bible closely... |
Chemical Bill |
Apr-06-06 02:02 PM |
#74 |
| -
Actually, it's not the bleeding from the broken legs |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Apr-06-06 10:27 PM |
#152 |
| -
Have to disagreewith your first sentence |
FlaGranny |
Apr-07-06 10:11 AM |
#173 |
| -
Thank you, ma'm. n/t |
Chemical Bill |
Apr-07-06 07:43 PM |
#195 |
| -
Point by point... |
Chemical Bill |
Apr-07-06 07:40 PM |
#194 |
| -
The medical accounts of crucifixions were worked out by a French |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Apr-08-06 05:09 PM |
#204 |
| -
Forgive me for being illiterate... |
brooklynite |
Apr-06-06 12:43 PM |
#28 |
| -
Histories are often passed down for generations by oral tradition then |
lindisfarne |
Apr-06-06 12:52 PM |
#32 |
| -
well, because |
newspeak |
Apr-06-06 12:54 PM |
#34 |
| -
It has less historical significance for Jesus than for the early Church. |
jobycom |
Apr-06-06 01:06 PM |
#41 |
| -
It doesn't have any authenticity, nor significance |
mycritters2 |
Apr-07-06 05:18 PM |
#188 |
| -
Deleted message |
Name removed |
Apr-06-06 12:50 PM |
#31 |
| -
Thanks for positng.... |
RedEarth |
Apr-06-06 01:01 PM |
#39 |
| -
Looking for a recently published book |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-06-06 01:05 PM |
#40 |
| -
Not sure, but Robin Lane Fox writes about it, too |
jobycom |
Apr-06-06 01:12 PM |
#45 |
| -
Are you talking about "Misquoting Jesus" |
supernova |
Apr-06-06 01:14 PM |
#47 |
| -
That's the very book! |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-06-06 02:02 PM |
#76 |
| -
My only problem with "Misquoting Jesus" is... |
Chemical Bill |
Apr-06-06 02:09 PM |
#81 |
| -
He was on The Daily Show recently. |
BrklynLiberal |
Apr-06-06 03:38 PM |
#97 |
| -
why do you need a recently published book? |
theobscure |
Apr-06-06 02:16 PM |
#84 |
| -
Because... |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-06-06 04:03 PM |
#100 |
| -
ok, but since the Bible has been exposed as a fraud so long ago |
theobscure |
Apr-06-06 04:49 PM |
#107 |
| -
Who/When/Where exposed the Bible as a fraud? |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 05:11 PM |
#113 |
| -
Thomas Paine... "Age of Reason" ...200+ years ago...France..n/t |
theobscure |
Apr-06-06 05:22 PM |
#115 |
| -
I'll take Paul over Thomas Paine any day of the week |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 05:39 PM |
#117 |
| -
Wow, almost nobody likes Paul. Especially Christians. |
superconnected |
Apr-06-06 05:49 PM |
#120 |
| -
Actually... |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-06-06 09:26 PM |
#137 |
| -
Have you read it? It systematically debunks the Bible book by.. |
theobscure |
Apr-06-06 06:04 PM |
#121 |
| -
haven't read Paine's debunking |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 06:44 PM |
#125 |
| -
Paine also actually, again using the Bible itself, shows that it was |
theobscure |
Apr-06-06 07:19 PM |
#130 |
| -
couple of points to ponder |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 09:33 PM |
#140 |
| -
response |
theobscure |
Apr-06-06 10:52 PM |
#154 |
| -
I believe this stuff and I tend to be a skeptic about everything |
CreekDog |
Apr-07-06 12:01 AM |
#162 |
| -
Paine offered a critique and an explanation on why he did not believe |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-06-06 09:02 PM |
#135 |
| -
minimize it all you want.... |
theobscure |
Apr-06-06 09:32 PM |
#139 |
| -
it is not inconsistent |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 09:41 PM |
#143 |
| -
well I'm not going to spend too much time banging my head... |
theobscure |
Apr-06-06 10:59 PM |
#155 |
| -
You insisting on reason in spiritual matters |
CreekDog |
Apr-07-06 12:05 AM |
#163 |
| -
forgot to answer your question |
CreekDog |
Apr-07-06 12:10 AM |
#164 |
| -
If faith could be restricted to the spiritual side, there wouldn't be a |
theobscure |
Apr-07-06 12:44 AM |
#166 |
| -
Pretty much Gnosticism |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 02:56 PM |
#93 |
| -
Except that.... |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-06-06 03:59 PM |
#98 |
| -
But that answer is too clever for me |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 04:20 PM |
#104 |
| -
I'm not going to argue theology |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-06-06 09:28 PM |
#138 |
| -
"The Fortunate Fall" |
okasha |
Apr-08-06 12:45 AM |
#198 |
| -
How could it be so? |
FlaGranny |
Apr-07-06 10:31 AM |
#175 |
| -
Bart Ehrman: maybe Lost Christianities and another called Lost Scriptures |
Supersedeas |
Apr-07-06 01:02 PM |
#180 |
| -
I will have to track those down, thanks. n/t |
TechBear_Seattle |
Apr-07-06 01:18 PM |
#181 |
| -
I thought this was a parody news post |
The Witch |
Apr-06-06 01:08 PM |
#43 |
| -
I like the way you think. |
Chemical Bill |
Apr-06-06 02:11 PM |
#82 |
| -
I like the "Jesus Christ Super Star" story better. |
0007 |
Apr-06-06 01:15 PM |
#48 |
| -
All Christians, bar none, ignore certain parts of the bible and other |
kiraboo |
Apr-06-06 01:17 PM |
#49 |
| -
many like to interpret the Bible as an "expert"-with no research/training |
NIGHT TRIPPER |
Apr-06-06 01:40 PM |
#65 |
| -
So, if there is significance of numbers in the text |
newspeak |
Apr-06-06 02:33 PM |
#89 |
| -
sure--it's pretty easy-- |
NIGHT TRIPPER |
Apr-06-06 08:29 PM |
#134 |
| -
Newspeak, you might want to check out |
truth2power |
Apr-06-06 11:27 PM |
#156 |
| -
Glory Glory Halli 'burton...no one's ever learned anything from history.. |
jus_the_facts |
Apr-06-06 01:21 PM |
#51 |
| -
Who? |
fshrink |
Apr-06-06 01:22 PM |
#52 |
| -
want to really have your mind blown |
newspeak |
Apr-06-06 01:27 PM |
#55 |
| -
This is all pretty interesting |
mycritters2 |
Apr-06-06 02:37 PM |
#90 |
| -
Debunked by whom? And for what reasons? |
MrMonk |
Apr-06-06 05:05 PM |
#111 |
| -
Most effectively by James Robinson, one of the best NT scholars |
mycritters2 |
Apr-07-06 05:11 PM |
#185 |
| -
LOL....anti-religious = tin foil hat? interesting n/t |
theobscure |
Apr-07-06 05:16 PM |
#186 |
| -
You know, the "Council of Ncaea was a conspiracy |
mycritters2 |
Apr-07-06 05:29 PM |
#192 |
| -
The Zoroastrians are not "John the Baptist believers" |
Lydia Leftcoast |
Apr-06-06 10:31 PM |
#153 |
| -
answer:Mandeans |
kineneb |
Apr-06-06 11:49 PM |
#161 |
| -
thank you all for the information |
newspeak |
Apr-07-06 11:13 AM |
#177 |
| -
That's interesting, because there's another tradition |
MrMonk |
Apr-07-06 05:29 PM |
#191 |
| -
That's the Mandaeans, newspeak. |
okasha |
Apr-08-06 12:54 AM |
#200 |
| -
I agree with the test Jesus knew Judas was going to betray him |
lovuian |
Apr-06-06 01:44 PM |
#66 |
| -
you know I like this thread, alot of info here, that's why I like DU. |
okieinpain |
Apr-06-06 01:46 PM |
#67 |
| -
Off topic, but "Terry Garcia" is an unfortunate name for a scholar. n/t |
FSogol |
Apr-06-06 01:55 PM |
#71 |
| -
Combination of Jerry Garcia and Terry Garr. I think it's perfect. |
Bucky |
Apr-06-06 04:05 PM |
#101 |
| -
Have these findings been tested scientifically? |
AuntiBush |
Apr-06-06 02:02 PM |
#75 |
| -
That's what the story's about |
jobycom |
Apr-06-06 02:12 PM |
#83 |
| -
so Jesus had a Jesus complex n/t |
theobscure |
Apr-06-06 02:07 PM |
#80 |
| -
Misquoting Jesus -- Excellent layman's book on NT textual criticism |
evworldeditor |
Apr-06-06 02:55 PM |
#92 |
| -
Also check out The Jesus Legend and The Jesus Myth by G.A. Wells |
Barrett808 |
Apr-06-06 04:21 PM |
#105 |
| -
From Jesus to Christianity - L. Michael White |
Roland99 |
Apr-06-06 11:30 PM |
#157 |
| -
Stand Up For Judas! (folk song) |
0rganism |
Apr-06-06 03:11 PM |
#94 |
| -
Love it! Conveys all we need to know about which path in life to take. |
ShortnFiery |
Apr-06-06 09:43 PM |
#146 |
| -
thanks for the Luke 18:9 cite |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 10:06 PM |
#149 |
| -
You're welcome n/t |
ShortnFiery |
Apr-06-06 10:14 PM |
#151 |
| -
Cool, I love good new fiction! |
Zhade |
Apr-06-06 03:13 PM |
#95 |
| -
so this is rough draft then. Before the more dramatic re-write. n/t |
bee |
Apr-06-06 04:11 PM |
#102 |
| -
This reads like Bible fan fiction lol |
melody |
Apr-06-06 05:12 PM |
#114 |
| -
you gotta wonder why people would want a book by Judas |
superconnected |
Apr-06-06 05:42 PM |
#119 |
| -
well, actually, didn't Mark Twain |
newspeak |
Apr-06-06 09:43 PM |
#145 |
| -
How fucking boring! One group of religionists vs another. Next problem |
VegasWolf |
Apr-06-06 06:46 PM |
#126 |
| -
The story was about religion |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 06:56 PM |
#129 |
| -
Just offering my opinion!!! Actually I feel all religion is boring and I |
VegasWolf |
Apr-06-06 07:59 PM |
#133 |
| -
Okay, no problem |
CreekDog |
Apr-06-06 09:43 PM |
#144 |
| -
LOL. but actually I like drunks! |
VegasWolf |
Apr-06-06 11:46 PM |
#160 |
| -
drunks are only fun if you're drunk with them |
CreekDog |
Apr-07-06 12:14 AM |
#165 |
| -
Oh alas! |
ShortnFiery |
Apr-06-06 10:05 PM |
#148 |
| -
The Invisible Sky People are being sarcastic! nt |
VegasWolf |
Apr-07-06 12:56 PM |
#179 |
| -
Duplicate post. |
VegasWolf |
Apr-06-06 06:46 PM |
#127 |
| -
this is like sooo... whatever |
sweetheart |
Apr-06-06 07:47 PM |
#132 |
| -
He said she said my grandmother told me, is what the Bible is |
MaryBear |
Apr-07-06 12:58 AM |
#168 |
| -
So Judas was a good German - he was just following orders |
JPZenger |
Apr-06-06 09:15 PM |
#136 |
| -
The Secret to Good Show Business Is .... Timing |
Crisco |
Apr-06-06 09:36 PM |
#141 |
| -
NATIONAL GEO CHANNEL TO AIR "GOSPEL OF JUDAS" SUNDAY NIGHT. |
Maddy McCall |
Apr-06-06 11:31 PM |
#159 |
| -
I'm a history buff, I love this kind of stuff |
Raine |
Apr-07-06 02:13 AM |
#169 |
| -
A copy made in 300 A.D of the original made in 200 A.D. |
brentspeak |
Apr-07-06 09:32 AM |
#171 |
| -
Indeed, and this also applies |
FlaGranny |
Apr-07-06 10:33 AM |
#176 |
| -
Books of the New Testament were mostly written in the first and early |
Zynx |
Apr-07-06 03:34 PM |
#184 |
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The "Gospel of Judas" was written well after the canon |
mycritters2 |
Apr-07-06 05:21 PM |
#189 |
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So I guess we're all not going to Hell after all!!! |
Megahurtz |
Apr-07-06 03:07 PM |
#182 |
| -
The Existence Of Historical Christ |
phrenzy |
Apr-07-06 08:34 PM |
#196 |
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big deal... |
madrchsod |
Apr-08-06 02:04 AM |
#201 |
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Many of the twisted stories in bible are philsophical adaptations |
nolabels |
Apr-08-06 09:00 AM |
#202 |
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i know i was being cynical |
madrchsod |
Apr-08-06 03:26 PM |
#203 |
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