Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

2016 Postmortem

Showing Original Post only (View all)
 

realmirage

(2,117 posts)
Sun Dec 18, 2016, 06:30 PM Dec 2016

I fear Democrats are laying the groundwork for future losses by refusing to learn from defeat [View all]

Before the election, when most people assumed Hillary would win, many Democrats were horrified when people on the right began to hint that they would not accept the results of the election, that the whole system is rigged.. We laughed at their absurd, childish responses to impending defeat. Also, we were furious when Trump lumped all Mexicans and Muslims together, reminding him that you can't judge an entire group of people by the people on the fringe.

Then we lost. I, personally, couldn't sleep at all that night. The horrible thought - a game show host and demagogue as our next president. But the next morning I snapped out of it and went into analysis mode, because that's what competitors do if they care about winning next time - they analyze what went wrong so they don't repeat mistakes. They strengthen their weak spots.

What has disappointed me almost as much as Trump victory though, has been the new strategies of many of my fellow Democrats. Many are acting just like republicans were just before the election. They're disputing the outcome of the election, adopting a strategy of "let's say it's rigged first and wait for the proof which surely will be coming." They're lumping all Republicans together as a bunch of racists, refusing to see that some of those Trump voters in the rust belt voted for Obama twice.

Then the other denials - it was Bernie's fault. Did we forget that Trump was repudiated by almost every guy who ran against him? The 2nd and 3rd place finishers went so far as to say they wouldn't or maybe wouldn't even vote for him! The Bushes said they wouldn't vote for him.. Their party was split in a million pieces, and Hillary had ONE competitor, and the vast majority of his supporters turned out for Hillary, I bet more so than the PUMAs did for Obama in 2008. So how can Trump win with such a splintered party and we cannot? No, Sanders isn't to blame.

Then it was Comey's fault. So we're supposed to believe that the weekly Trump scandals were all ineffective but this one letter from Comey convinced hundreds of thousands of people to change their vote at the last minute or stay home? Do you really think people vote on a letter like that rather than what they think a president is going to do for them? And let's look at who DID change their states from blue to red - the rust belt. MANY people in those states are still on Trade Adjustment Assistance - that means they get welfare because of the lost manufacturing jobs. You think it's just a coincidence that those are the states that flipped? Did you see the final ad Trump ran in those swing states? It was what has typically been a DEMOCRATIC message. Look it up, watch it. It's all about the poor and the middle class versus the rich and powerful. But Trump's rich! How stupid his followers are! Yeah and they also know that the Clintons are rich and part of the "establishment", so it cancels out doesn't it? Trump tapped into anti-establishment, populism... It pains me that Trump used that message against us. That has always been OUR message. What was Hillary's final ad in the swing states? The Katy Perry ad. I liked it, but I'd rather have an ad that hits at the rich and powerful - the oligarchy that is slowly strangling the 99%. The wealth of the 1% has been increasing sooo fast, while the 99% stagnate or fall further down. That's the fight we need to be having, in addition to the social causes.

And now it's "fuck the rust belt those jobs aren't coming back" and "robots are taking their jobs." That is also one of those catch phrases that happens to be bullshit -

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/the-avenue/2015/04/29/dont-blame-the-robots-for-lost-manufacturing-jobs/

When I lose, I don't make excuses. I hate losing so much, that I will painfully examine myself, ego be damned, to find out why I lost so that it never happens again. What I see from a lot of fellow Democrats, however, is "it's rigged, someone will prove it."

I really want to work and talk with fellow lefties who are interested in helping the Democratic Party learn from this defeat. We all hate those people who watch sports and blame the refs for all their losses. I really don't want that to become the Democratic Party. If this were baseball we'd be wondering what trades we need to make in the offseason to bolster our infield, or hitting, or whatever.. Instead I see a lot of doubling down on the same strategies that we just lost with. Lost to a horrible jackass. If we think there's nothing wrong with our strategy after just losing to a horrible jackass, WE ARE LAYING THE GROUNDWORK FOR THE NEXT DEFEAT

217 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
You might like WhiteTara Dec 2016 #1
keep laying that groundwork. Maybe you like defeat. I don't realmirage Dec 2016 #2
Well, join the Party WhiteTara Dec 2016 #3
Again, address the OP or don't bother replying realmirage Dec 2016 #8
Yes, Sir! WhiteTara Dec 2016 #15
address the OP or stop replying, this is my last to you realmirage Dec 2016 #16
Obeisances to you My Overlord! WhiteTara Dec 2016 #17
lol. n/t. okieinpain Dec 2016 #200
This message was self-deleted by its author emulatorloo Dec 2016 #204
Some of us did derby378 Dec 2016 #137
Because one can't participate in an online forum AND engage with their local party, too. CrispyQ Dec 2016 #158
agreed. n/t. okieinpain Dec 2016 #201
Maybe you like defeat? did you vote for bernie? because she beat the shit of bernie and his bro's! stonecutter357 Dec 2016 #56
I voted for Hillary, who got beat as well realmirage Dec 2016 #62
Yet she lost to trump.. in the election that really counts, the general election. dionysus Dec 2016 #71
And then she got beat by Trump and his Bros in the electoral college where it counts Feeling the Bern Dec 2016 #81
+1...nt SidDithers Dec 2016 #5
Really? Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #23
True WhiteTara Dec 2016 #26
The candidate just lost the election to Donald Trump. Kentonio Dec 2016 #171
Well, if you discount FBI, Russian hackers, WhiteTara Dec 2016 #190
We lost to Donald Trump for gods sake! Kentonio Dec 2016 #192
Okay. How would you solve this WhiteTara Dec 2016 #194
A few steps to get us started.. Kentonio Dec 2016 #195
Good ideas WhiteTara Dec 2016 #196
Number 2, the platform. Kentonio Dec 2016 #197
How do you plan to acheive your goals? WhiteTara Dec 2016 #198
Hopefully by getting people to stop fighting each other and rally around a common set of goals. Kentonio Dec 2016 #199
Worthy goals, but how WhiteTara Dec 2016 #210
Thank You So Very Much Sherman A1 Dec 2016 #92
Back at you! WhiteTara Dec 2016 #131
YES! 'If this were baseball we'd be wondering what trades we need to make elleng Dec 2016 #4
+10101 golfguru Dec 2016 #33
"If we think there's nothing wrong with our strategy after just losing to a horrible jackass..." CrispyQ Dec 2016 #159
Yes indeed! elleng Dec 2016 #163
That would be awesome but so many are claiming it was the TPP and jobs bettyellen Dec 2016 #6
yup feingold and strickland did worse than Clinton JI7 Dec 2016 #12
Wrong again! KPN Dec 2016 #14
Clinton won voters concerned about economy, Trump won voters concerned about terrorism emulatorloo Dec 2016 #216
there probably won't be anymore elections. putitinD Dec 2016 #7
It's sad how divided this board and the Dems are True Dough Dec 2016 #9
Yes. Thanks. elleng Dec 2016 #10
Definitely! If dems sit and argue, then Putin and Trump are the victors now and into the RKP5637 Dec 2016 #13
I think a lot of people are in the middle realmirage Dec 2016 #11
No new message will cure the problem unless... golfguru Dec 2016 #44
So trump officially snagged the Orange Man (tm) crown from boehner? dionysus Dec 2016 #77
To my eyes, Boehner was color of over-ripe tomato going bad golfguru Dec 2016 #114
those 94 million Americans who think they reached the end of the road elmac Dec 2016 #89
That is correct UNLESS....the orange man golfguru Dec 2016 #110
I agree wholeheartedly realmirage Dec 2016 #183
Orange man conflated trade balance with trade policy all year.. JHan Dec 2016 #123
I do not think you are anywhere near the truth golfguru Dec 2016 #132
I am very much speaking the truth. JHan Dec 2016 #135
You simply can not ignore the direct linkage golfguru Dec 2016 #138
but I never denied outsourcing. JHan Dec 2016 #143
You are under a basic mis-conception that robots will take over golfguru Dec 2016 #146
How many millions of jobs are we going to pretend didn't disappear? JHan Dec 2016 #153
A lot of Democrats are automation deniers. immoderate Dec 2016 #185
Stop saying technology is to blame for lost jobs realmirage Dec 2016 #205
lol, no I won't stop saying it..You did share a great link and the study looks interesting but.. JHan Dec 2016 #211
Sadly, i think returning focus to the middle class IS a major overhaul these days... dionysus Dec 2016 #74
The Democrats need to remember the middle class realmirage Dec 2016 #184
Hillary WAS the middle NCDem777 Dec 2016 #217
Exactly! But there's a cohort here that KPN Dec 2016 #19
Exactly, why is FDR a bad word here? FDR is who we are realmirage Dec 2016 #186
FDR is not a "bad word" here. Total strawman. emulatorloo Dec 2016 #206
I don't understand the people that think nothing has to change. Ace Rothstein Dec 2016 #35
You'd think that was common sense. Apparently not for many realmirage Dec 2016 #187
Yup. This Arazi Dec 2016 #57
Even if cheating was exposed though, it doesn't mean our dionysus Dec 2016 #73
I agree, we need to do both. OnionPatch Dec 2016 #117
Logically there's no middle ground to hacking, this post on its face makes little sense IMHO uponit7771 Dec 2016 #118
We need to abandon the lie that those manufacturing jobs can come back to the rust belt. LonePirate Dec 2016 #18
The links you posted are filled with bad science realmirage Dec 2016 #22
THIS!!!! KPN Dec 2016 #27
You're the one being conned if you don't know the difference between good science and bad science. LonePirate Dec 2016 #28
You didn't read the link n my OP did you? realmirage Dec 2016 #30
I read it and dismissed it because of the numerous gaping holes in it. LonePirate Dec 2016 #39
Your response indicates you need to look again realmirage Dec 2016 #46
You do understand that mechanization is more than just robots, don't you? Because the Squinch Dec 2016 #208
Yup. sfwriter Dec 2016 #31
Who the hell here is saying those jobs are coming back? KPN Dec 2016 #24
This is EXACTLY right realmirage Dec 2016 #29
"all those sources are wrong" does not address any of the points in the links provided by L. Pirate JHan Dec 2016 #32
Read #44 golfguru Dec 2016 #45
Every ESTABLISHMENT, INCUMBENT, republican won against the Democrats running for Senate in those still_one Dec 2016 #20
++++++++ I agree. skylucy Dec 2016 #34
How will we turn it around sarisataka Dec 2016 #53
Excellent post. LenaBaby61 Dec 2016 #84
"In Wisconsin, Russ Feingold lost by a greater percentage than Hillary. Wisconsin reelected Scott Cha Dec 2016 #141
+1 betsuni Dec 2016 #148
Well said. If we are going to improve our party we need to be fact-based emulatorloo Dec 2016 #207
"If this were baseball..." oasis Dec 2016 #21
The ones who want to win ARE putting the team first realmirage Dec 2016 #25
When a player joins a team he's required to listen to the leadership. oasis Dec 2016 #49
Ask the biggest losers in baseball if they're "team players" realmirage Dec 2016 #51
Democrats needed everyone on board to win. Didn't have it. oasis Dec 2016 #61
The leaders we have now aren't getting the job done. realmirage Dec 2016 #63
Again: Team play is they key to success. nt oasis Dec 2016 #66
So you'd keep a manager that kept losing? realmirage Dec 2016 #69
Nah, let's keep going down the same road. TheCowsCameHome Dec 2016 #36
Those who want the Party to change look at our losses and ask why? jalan48 Dec 2016 #37
Does that explain why Russ Feingold and Zypher Teachout lost? Does that explain why every still_one Dec 2016 #40
Those in power never want change realmirage Dec 2016 #41
People were looking for change... kentuck Dec 2016 #38
And we'd better have the right message by then realmirage Dec 2016 #42
That doesn't hold water when every establishment, republican, incumbent, won against those still_one Dec 2016 #43
Unless they voted down ticket. kentuck Dec 2016 #100
I wasn't referring to the trump supporters. I was referring to the self-identified progressives who still_one Dec 2016 #122
Lessons Learned Pabz Dec 2016 #47
Can you be less cryptic and more direct realmirage Dec 2016 #50
She has 3 million votes MFM008 Dec 2016 #55
It doesn't matter. Pabz Dec 2016 #58
Oh no MFM008 Dec 2016 #76
Really? Why did Russ Feingold and Zyper Teachout Lose? Why did every swing state Democrat running still_one Dec 2016 #78
Every Senate race voted the same as President. Hassan and Hillary both won NH by a hair. jfern Dec 2016 #209
That is where the narriative breaks down. Those that won the Senate races in still_one Dec 2016 #212
2 Minnesota members of congress who endorsed Bernie won in heavily Trump districts jfern Dec 2016 #214
I was primarily talking about the Senate races in the swing states. The still_one Dec 2016 #215
Tell us the "story", or continue to cower behind implication LanternWaste Dec 2016 #162
Cleveland Indians scored more runs than Chicago Cubs in WS golfguru Dec 2016 #213
What defeat? sarisataka Dec 2016 #48
"Saddest of all" realmirage Dec 2016 #54
I keep saying that & i get accused of not taking things "seriously" 7962 Dec 2016 #104
I really don't want us to become Alex Jones realmirage Dec 2016 #105
"If you hate somethin, don't you do it too?" E. Vedder. dionysus Dec 2016 #79
I will not just lay down MFM008 Dec 2016 #52
As long as we use the electoral college, than yes, we lost. dionysus Dec 2016 #82
I cant help it if YOU werent inspired MFM008 Dec 2016 #147
You're confusing me with a trump voter, for some reason. dionysus Dec 2016 #150
I fear we are wasting valuable time paying attention to concern trolls, too. Just sayin'... n/t TygrBright Dec 2016 #59
Address the OP and quit trolling realmirage Dec 2016 #64
LOL bravenak Dec 2016 #67
Who are you calling a troll? sheshe2 Dec 2016 #125
I'm calling a troll the person who came into my thread and insulted me. That's a troll. realmirage Dec 2016 #126
Ouch. sheshe2 Dec 2016 #133
Unbelievable. Kentonio Dec 2016 #172
Exactly. Thanks kentonio. Hypocrites are everywhere these days realmirage Dec 2016 #191
I don't need your permission to stand up for myself realmirage Dec 2016 #193
So you know, the person was insinuating that my OP was concern trolling. Hence, my response realmirage Dec 2016 #130
I just answered your last response, I am done. sheshe2 Dec 2016 #134
I second this! bravenak Dec 2016 #68
Yes, I'm concerned that we lost because I prefer winning to losing. Perhaps you don't realmirage Dec 2016 #72
Yes yes yes. I know. The team that gets three million more votes loses. The team that does not wins. bravenak Dec 2016 #75
You can win in a fantasy election, and lose in the real election realmirage Dec 2016 #87
Ok. So who are you willing to lose to get those rural voters? bravenak Dec 2016 #102
We don't have to lose anybody! We strengthen our economic message to the middle class realmirage Dec 2016 #108
They believe that blacks are taking their jobs. That offends me. bravenak Dec 2016 #113
Hmmm sheshe2 Dec 2016 #127
Well, damn! bravenak Dec 2016 #129
Would you be kind enough to point out in that article who exactly it is who believes that? Kentonio Dec 2016 #173
Google it. I did and I found many people saying it on actual video bravenak Dec 2016 #178
Many people? Enought to account for the entire Trump and non-voting groups? Kentonio Dec 2016 #189
You see what happens when you try to take away the excuses. HassleCat Dec 2016 #60
Exactly. You'd think losing was painful enough to motivate realmirage Dec 2016 #65
Superb post. dionysus Dec 2016 #70
Those jobs are not coming back. joshcryer Dec 2016 #80
Check out.... zentrum Dec 2016 #83
Hopefully the next chair can clean up the DNC madville Dec 2016 #85
Orange Hitler claimed it was rigged treestar Dec 2016 #86
And they found something other than the usual errors? No? They proved it was rigged? No? realmirage Dec 2016 #98
It was worth investigating treestar Dec 2016 #99
an investigation is not proof of anything realmirage Dec 2016 #103
well it does show there is SOME evidence treestar Dec 2016 #106
Um, try yes. The Russians actually did interfere. As well as Comey. kcr Dec 2016 #156
First post in 2 years crazycatlady Dec 2016 #88
Totally agree with you, great points realmirage Dec 2016 #91
I like this list and I'll add to it. phylny Dec 2016 #124
I'll also ad spend more money on digital advertising crazycatlady Dec 2016 #128
Agreed Sherman A1 Dec 2016 #90
Glad to hear I'm not the only one realmirage Dec 2016 #95
My Pleasure Sherman A1 Dec 2016 #151
Agree 100%!!! I am sick and tired of excuses... Yurovsky Dec 2016 #93
"Losers make excuses. Winners assume power. I'll be damned if I'm going to be a victim." realmirage Dec 2016 #94
Trump scandals ineffective but one letter from Comey + a trickle of hacked/doctored emails.... CousinIT Dec 2016 #96
So how did a guy with so many flaws beat us? realmirage Dec 2016 #101
A Twitter thread has some clues. (a lot actually) CousinIT Dec 2016 #115
Since when do we blame the victims of a crime for the actions of the criminals? baldguy Dec 2016 #97
How is the messaging not a problem? Ace Rothstein Dec 2016 #144
"She wouldn't have been raped if only she hadn't been wearing that short skirt!" baldguy Dec 2016 #152
It's Management's fault shadowmayor Dec 2016 #107
Donald Trump is an ass....check. democrank Dec 2016 #109
I really agree- and we have a great chance to turn this around, if we can accept Yo_Mama Dec 2016 #111
Exactly - he won by using OUR OLD ECONOMIC PLATFORM realmirage Dec 2016 #119
Working Class Woman Will Rejoin the Party McKim Dec 2016 #112
This is exactly right realmirage Dec 2016 #120
If we go back to 1980, Democrats have lost 11 out of the 19 elections. Feeling the Bern Dec 2016 #116
I actually hear people telling me loyalty is more important than principle. It's insane realmirage Dec 2016 #121
Party over principle. Orwell would be proud to hear that shit. Feeling the Bern Dec 2016 #139
Doubling down on "deplorables" won't work any better than it did the first time BRToldschool Dec 2016 #136
Bringing in Brock and his band of internet trolls azmom Dec 2016 #140
You analyze but Democrats don't? taught_me_patience Dec 2016 #142
Oh here we go with the handwringing The Liberal Lion Dec 2016 #145
It's no secret what ails the party - the party needs to expand its appeal outside of the big cities Midwestern Democrat Dec 2016 #149
Agreed entirely, but too many seem to think anything un-city doesn't matter BRToldschool Dec 2016 #155
There are those in the The "un-city" ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #157
100% agreed hellofromreddit Dec 2016 #154
So, you want us to be better liars that Trump? Adrahil Dec 2016 #160
It can be difficult to see the difference between the analysis of after-action-reports and a "refusa LanternWaste Dec 2016 #161
K&R.. disillusioned73 Dec 2016 #164
Agree deist99 Dec 2016 #165
People should shut up about the electoral college. It's not going anywhere realmirage Dec 2016 #179
Thank you for your courage... NeoConsSuck Dec 2016 #166
Right on. Glad I'm not alone realmirage Dec 2016 #174
C-level types are destroying our country, so don't expect them to give a fuck. Rex Dec 2016 #167
The Party will have to change despite them. Or the next loss will wake them up realmirage Dec 2016 #175
I agree... Joe941 Dec 2016 #168
It would help me get over the loss if I felt more hopeful about realmirage Dec 2016 #176
I think I just need to stay off the 2016 board. Ace Rothstein Dec 2016 #182
I take long breaks and have started using the ignore button again realmirage Dec 2016 #188
Some DUers enjoy defeat IronLionZion Dec 2016 #169
I dared to point out that I don't have health insurance realmirage Dec 2016 #177
Do you live in a state that expanded Medicaid? IronLionZion Dec 2016 #181
Excellent thread, very much agree. Kentonio Dec 2016 #170
This thread reminds me of the old Spy magazine feature "Logrolling in our Time". lapucelle Dec 2016 #180
The best one is the determination to jettison the rural white males. HassleCat Dec 2016 #202
That one drives me batshit realmirage Dec 2016 #203
Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»I fear Democrats are layi...»Reply #0