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Religion

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cbayer

(146,218 posts)
Tue Oct 28, 2014, 03:11 PM Oct 2014

Pope Francis says evolution is real and God is no wizard [View all]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/10/28/pope-francis-backs-theory-of-evolution-says-god-is-no-wizard/

By Ishaan Tharoor October 28 at 12:36 PM

Delivering an address to the Pontifical Academy of Sciences, Pope Francis continued his habit of making provocative, seemingly progressive statements. The pontiff appeared to endorse the theory of the Big Bang and told the gathering at the Vatican that there was no contradiction between believing in God as well as the prevailing scientific theories regarding the expansion of our universe.

“When we read about creation in Genesis, we run the risk of imagining God was a magician, with a magic wand able to do everything. But that is not so,” Francis said. “He created human beings and let them develop according to the internal laws that he gave to each one so they would reach their fulfillment.”

The pope avoids gesturing at the thorny issue (at least for some Christians) of whether humans descended from apes. Atheists argue, moreover, that understanding the Big Bang and what emerged from that cosmic moment obviates a need to believe in a deity. On that count, Francis obviously disagrees. He repeated the idea of God not being a “magician,” an entity that conjured all into being.

“God is not a divine being or a magician, but the Creator who brought everything to life,” Francis said. “Evolution in nature is not inconsistent with the notion of creation, because evolution requires the creation of beings that evolve.”

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Not exactly. trotsky Oct 2014 #1
Sorry--sounds to me like he's buying off on BIG BANG. That's the Big Picture. No Jesus riding Dino! MADem Oct 2014 #3
He's not saying anything new at all, as the article points out muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #39
Why are people getting so angry about it, I wonder? MADem Oct 2014 #102
Are people 'angry'? I thought the general DU atheist response has been 'same old BS' muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #103
No, not here, necessarily--in some of the links I've seen on the topic, the rhetoric is strident. nt MADem Oct 2014 #104
They're upset that Francis fails to conform to their favorite okasha Oct 2014 #107
It's the tradition of "double-talk." immoderate Oct 2014 #2
How so? cbayer Oct 2014 #4
Natural selection is god's will. immoderate Oct 2014 #6
I'm not sure they are contradictory cbayer Oct 2014 #7
It depends on whether you see a difference between "natural" and "super-natural." immoderate Oct 2014 #9
I most definitely see a difference, cbayer Oct 2014 #11
In the same way, "fantasy" and "reality" are also compatible. immoderate Oct 2014 #17
Of course! trotsky Oct 2014 #19
Do you have no use for fantasy? cbayer Oct 2014 #22
Fantasy has a place, but not as substitute for reality. immoderate Oct 2014 #30
I would't make the claim that fantasy should substitute for reality, cbayer Oct 2014 #32
when fantasy substitutes for reality what one has is delusional behavior. Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #53
And then there's your own fantasy. okasha Oct 2014 #55
That seems to be a common and growing sentiment in some circles. cbayer Oct 2014 #56
I think it's just another variant okasha Oct 2014 #58
That describes it very well. cbayer Oct 2014 #59
Those "scientific minds" did not embrace religion while they were doing science. immoderate Oct 2014 #71
That is completely inaccurate. cbayer Oct 2014 #73
Copernicus, eh? immoderate Oct 2014 #81
I wasn't bringing him up as someone funded by the church, cbayer Oct 2014 #83
The church made no conscious contributions to science that I am aware of. immoderate Oct 2014 #84
I just pointed out that the church funded the first universities. cbayer Oct 2014 #86
Religious institutions have done good things. Religion, not so much. immoderate Oct 2014 #87
What is the difference between religious institutions and religion? cbayer Oct 2014 #88
Religious institutions include schools, hospitals, shelters, lobbyists, etc. Religions are faith. immoderate Oct 2014 #90
It doesn't escape as many as it haunts. Gore1FL Oct 2014 #95
Lol, you are hilarious. But I do love me some NDT. cbayer Oct 2014 #96
Since they mean different things, I, for one, do not equate them. immoderate Oct 2014 #67
Who said you did? okasha Oct 2014 #70
I somehow got the thought that it was you who said... immoderate Oct 2014 #74
My bad. I thought your post was made by a different person. okasha Oct 2014 #79
I made no such implication. You made an inference. immoderate Oct 2014 #82
Heh... gcomeau Oct 2014 #13
Heh…. cbayer Oct 2014 #15
Oh really? gcomeau Oct 2014 #16
One thing you need to remember here... trotsky Oct 2014 #18
that's a disingenuous as when one does weaken/distort/misrepresent another's words. rug Oct 2014 #75
I don't really care if they say "because god" cbayer Oct 2014 #21
"I don't care if they say '2+2 = purple banana'"... gcomeau Oct 2014 #25
No, they are not the same at all. cbayer Oct 2014 #26
They are precisely the same gcomeau Oct 2014 #27
The position he appears to take, and that religious scientists in general take, cbayer Oct 2014 #28
If that is the position he takes then his position is nonsensical. gcomeau Oct 2014 #31
Something which is unfalsifiable now may not be later. cbayer Oct 2014 #34
"Unfalsifiable" does not mean... gcomeau Oct 2014 #45
No it means it can't be proven false.. cbayer Oct 2014 #46
Not in science it doesn't. gcomeau Oct 2014 #47
That doesn't say what you said, though. cbayer Oct 2014 #48
Please review the meaning of "logical possibility" gcomeau Oct 2014 #49
I reviewed it. Logical possibilities can change with time. cbayer Oct 2014 #50
No they cannot. gcomeau Oct 2014 #60
You are obviously using some strict definitions that are probably unique cbayer Oct 2014 #61
no he is using the words as they are defined. Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #63
Stunning gcomeau Oct 2014 #97
Some of us here? Who in the world do you represent? cbayer Oct 2014 #98
There are several in this thread, please don't play stupid. gcomeau Oct 2014 #99
Play stupid? I wouldn't dare. cbayer Oct 2014 #100
And yet there you go again. gcomeau Oct 2014 #101
Well at least it's clear to everyone but her that she conceded the point. trotsky Oct 2014 #106
I'm not sure why I bother engaging honestly. gcomeau Oct 2014 #110
Words have meanings Alittleliberal Oct 2014 #105
Depends on your frame of reference. okasha Oct 2014 #65
No, it doesn't. gcomeau Oct 2014 #89
Please note quote marks. okasha Oct 2014 #108
Ok, noted. gcomeau Oct 2014 #109
Nothing illogical happens in any geometry as all geometries rely on logic to build theorums from Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #91
Only in the absurd apologists dictionary of obfuscations. Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #52
Is that where you got the notion to insert LGBT issues in a discussion about evolution? rug Oct 2014 #76
As far as his teaching on evolution TexasProgresive Oct 2014 #5
I do think the evolution position is pretty standard, particularly in catholic schools. cbayer Oct 2014 #8
+1 HockeyMom Oct 2014 #10
Did they take this position on the big bang? cbayer Oct 2014 #12
Now that you let on to your age, HockeyMom TexasProgresive Oct 2014 #14
My Grandson is only 5 months old HockeyMom Oct 2014 #24
+2 okasha Oct 2014 #54
Interesting character, this pope. pinto Oct 2014 #20
Yes, his approach on this matter is definitely Jesuit. cbayer Oct 2014 #23
Pius XII said it in 1950. rug Oct 2014 #29
God is not a divine being" Lordquinton Oct 2014 #33
That is confusing and I am wondering if there might be a translation problem here. cbayer Oct 2014 #35
You certailny need it if you're relying on truncated quotes. rug Oct 2014 #37
"not a demiurge" is a more accurate translation muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #41
That's very helpful. cbayer Oct 2014 #43
Thank you. okasha Oct 2014 #57
that clears a lot up Lordquinton Oct 2014 #69
So? beam me up scottie Oct 2014 #36
Probably because antitheists tend to conflate religion with fundamentalist literalism. rug Oct 2014 #38
Is cbayer an antitheist who tends "to conflate religion with fundamentalist literalism" too? beam me up scottie Oct 2014 #40
You're imputing things to another member that may or may not be there. rug Oct 2014 #72
I seriously wonder if the Vatican PR drew attention to this to avoid the exorcist story muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #42
That would explain it. beam me up scottie Oct 2014 #44
So Blank Frank is an ID obfuscator rather than an outright creationist. Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #51
Not until it explains ex nihilo. rug Oct 2014 #77
BUT-- xfundy Oct 2014 #62
God saves white people from Ebola but lets black people die. Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #64
That was rancid. okasha Oct 2014 #66
At least he's not using raped children again to make a missed point. rug Oct 2014 #78
There is that. okasha Oct 2014 #80
Really? I am sure that you don't actually believe any of that, so cbayer Oct 2014 #68
You mean mocking like openly bragging about laughing at someone's holy book? trotsky Oct 2014 #93
This is just Pope Francis being Pope Francis goldent Oct 2014 #85
I really thought people at DU could recognize a PR stunt when they saw one. Goblinmonger Oct 2014 #92
After having read more about this, I agree with you. cbayer Oct 2014 #111
This is not a new thing Prophet 451 Oct 2014 #94
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