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Response to Dog Gone at Penigma (Reply #74)

Tue Feb 5, 2013, 07:07 AM

78. holocaust needed hitler

pneigma: The assumption that without Hitler there would have been no Nazis in control, or no Holocaust is ridiculous. The rampant anti-semitism was too broad and too deep.

I agree with almost everything else you've said in this thread, penigma, but I can't agree to the above.
Without hitler, there would've been no holocaust, at least not of the magnitude of 6 millions, nothing to compare with it, down to tens of thousands perhaps. As the guncite website wrote, jewish had endured pogroms before & another pogrom is what they thought of kristallnacht. German Jewish even heiled hitler.

guncite: Jews had seen pogroms before and had survived them, though not without suffering. They would expect that this one {kristallnacht} would, as had the past ones, eventually subside and permit a return to normalcy. Many considered themselves "patriotic Germans" for their service in the first World War. These simply were not people prepared to stage violent resistance. http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcnazimyth.html

wiki: Mein Kampf has also been studied as a work on political theory. For example, Hitler announces his hatred of what he believed to be the world's twin evils: Communism and Judaism.
{mein kampf} is significant in our time because a retrospective review of the text reveals the crystallisation of Hitler's goal to completely exterminate the Jewish presence in Europe. While historians diverge on the exact date Hitler decided to exterminate the Jewish people, few place the decision before the mid 1930s. First published in 1925, Mein Kampf shows the ideas that crafted Hitler's historical grievances and ambitions for creating a New Order.

Ludendorf was not anti semitic (with hitler at beer hall putsch); Hindenburg protested a hitler law that wwI jews could not work in german govt., a proper hindenburg endorsement for chancellor would not have been so anti semitic.
Hitler hated germany's social democrats, remnants from the weimar republic which was sometimes referred to as a 'Jew Republic'; two previous anti semitic laws were passed under hitler, one in 1933 & the nurmburg law in 1935, restricting jewish employment & civil rights.
Himmlers, Streichers, & Heydriches might've cropped up as some other names, but without hitler's adoration & supreme power in germany, could'nt have gone as far.
Without hitler, there would have been no comparable holocaust.

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