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Gun Control & RKBA

In reply to the discussion: 2A and "Infringement" [View all]

Glaug-Eldare

(1,089 posts)
36. 3 might survive,
Sat Jan 26, 2013, 01:11 AM
Jan 2013

but remember that new restrictions are generally held to "intermediate scrutiny." That is, the government has to prove that a restriction substantially advances a legitimate government interest. Imaginary, hypothetical, or trivial gains won't justify a law, and "legitimate government interest" doesn't include soothing its conscience, ending private gun ownership, or making people feel safe. For instance, if the government defends a magazine capacity ban on the grounds that it improves public safety, they're going to have to show evidence that it actually works, or a credible argument that it will work. I don't believe the evidence is, or ever will be there.

I don't believe #1 would pass the "common use" test, and the problem with #2 is that it would be so pointless (sales would simply shift to other similar models) that it couldn't possibly be seen as "substantial." I was thinking about that earlier today -- if you had an individual ban on every single rifle model, each one would be narrow in scope and not an extreme burden on the right. Taken together, they would constitute a total rifle ban. If they're all unconstitutional together, how can they be constitutional separately?

Depending on how it's implemented, #3 might qualify as advancing the general welfare so long as it creates no severe barriers to ownership or carry. I don't see much chance of #4 actually having any effect whatsoever on public safety, so I believe it would fail the intermediate scrutiny test.

2A and "Infringement" [View all] tortoise1956 Jan 2013 OP
I think we're about to find out just what is and isn't considered infringement bubbayugga Jan 2013 #1
most accurate description I have seen. gejohnston Jan 2013 #2
How about a different tact? rightsideout Jan 2013 #3
Well-regulated doesn't mean controlled by government regulations in this clause... tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #4
If the governments weren't regulating the militias, who was? nt jmg257 Jan 2013 #9
They generally regulated themselves. Clames Jan 2013 #21
Not really. That is what musters were for...training under the authority of the state, jmg257 Jan 2013 #23
So, do you want me drilling? Glaug-Eldare Jan 2013 #28
Sure why not? That is why the right was secured after all. The Guard jmg257 Jan 2013 #31
What does the Guard have to do with anything? Glaug-Eldare Jan 2013 #49
I'm talking about the well regulated Militia - the reason for the 2nd amendment. jmg257 Jan 2013 #51
Ummmm....wrong. Clames Jan 2013 #32
Surely....And THAT is why the Constitution and the federal Militia Acts jmg257 Jan 2013 #38
The meaning of "well-regulated" was different tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #24
Again...someone was doing all that regulating...the militias were trained by jmg257 Jan 2013 #25
Yep, that would do it tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #27
Not really. The debates from those assembled when coming up with the 2nd had VERY jmg257 Jan 2013 #30
It seems the debates are singularly unhelpful on this subject tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #33
There are numerous mentions of 'personal rights' in letters (Ames I think), and jmg257 Jan 2013 #40
"Well regulated" means whatever the Supreme Court says it means. nt ZombieHorde Jan 2013 #26
more harsh than some countries gejohnston Jan 2013 #5
My take Berserker Jan 2013 #6
Not the point of this post tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #7
Not sure I Berserker Jan 2013 #10
Gotcha - sorry about that! tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #14
Yes Berserker Jan 2013 #19
I learned to debate, not argue tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #22
multi-prong approach required iiibbb Jan 2013 #8
Interesting approach, but still off topic tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #11
okay iiibbb Jan 2013 #15
I'm curious... tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #17
I'm just going by "shall not be infringed" iiibbb Jan 2013 #34
8) citizen access to background checks free of charge Berserker Jan 2013 #13
May be worthwhile to review the "common use" standard Glaug-Eldare Jan 2013 #12
By this standard, tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #16
Well, I'm no Constitutional scholar, and setting aside whether I like any of those things petronius Jan 2013 #18
I agree on infringement... tortoise1956 Jan 2013 #20
Whether it's long-standing law or not doesn't mean much Glaug-Eldare Jan 2013 #29
You're right of course - I was assuming that challenges would have arisen by petronius Jan 2013 #35
3 might survive, Glaug-Eldare Jan 2013 #36
I think #4 would help prevent straw purchases iiibbb Jan 2013 #53
When considering the original intent of the 2A and what actions may or my not run afoul... OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #37
A couple things... jmg257 Jan 2013 #41
Sorry for the misunderstanding. When I said the phrase "bearing arms" was vauge I was referring to OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #44
Cheers - my apologies then on my long-winded reply! nt jmg257 Jan 2013 #46
there 'were' standing armies jimmy the one Jan 2013 #47
On the militias and the people's role in them.. jmg257 Jan 2013 #42
miller 1939 a militia based interpretation jimmy the one Jan 2013 #39
you buy a gun, you just signed up for the militia. Report for duty. lastlib Jan 2013 #43
No need to even buy the gun. People of military fighting age are ALREADY ascribed to the militia. OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #45
old time militias & war of 1812 jimmy the one Jan 2013 #48
When has "well-regulated" ever been a litmus test? Glaug-Eldare Jan 2013 #50
good basis for a discussion samsingh Jan 2013 #52
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