Environment & Energy

kristopher

(29,798 posts)

70. Please research "Feed In Tariffs" FiTs

Sat Apr 14, 2012, 01:52 AM

Apr 2012

If you don't know about the contracts you are not able to follow the discussion. The place to start is with the policy tool "FiTs"

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136 replies

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Why (baseload) generators are terrified of solar [View all] kristopher Apr 2012 OP

If by "terrified" you mean "rolling around laughing," sure. TheWraith Apr 2012 #1

Then why do you spend so much time trying to undermine it? kristopher Apr 2012 #2

So Solar PV needs to be PV + Conservation programs + ? to meet/beat AND reduce demand? patrice Apr 2012 #3

You didn't get the memo? DCKit Apr 2012 #4

This message was self-deleted by its author joshcryer Apr 2012 #11

re Kazzzzon Apr 2012 #5

That must be why so many of their stock prices are down 90% FBaggins Apr 2012 #6

How does the current explosion in manufacturing capacity disprove the OP's thesis? kristopher Apr 2012 #7

That's an odd use of the word "current". FBaggins Apr 2012 #8

How does the current explosion in manufacturing capacity disprove the OP's thesis? kristopher Apr 2012 #9

Which "new entrants into the solar market" are you thinking of? FBaggins Apr 2012 #10

I'm sure that's the story ... kristopher Apr 2012 #12

Hey, That's a neat trick.... Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #13

Yes the homeowners and the local communities who are getting that money are pretty happy kristopher Apr 2012 #14

And the majority who aren't? Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #15

You think it is the rich in Germany that are buying the solar? kristopher Apr 2012 #16

This message was self-deleted by its author joshcryer Apr 2012 #17

I'm FOR nuclear in the way that I'm FOR abortion. XemaSab Apr 2012 #18

Nuclear is a lesser evil than renewables? kristopher Apr 2012 #20

Keeping our existing nuclear open XemaSab Apr 2012 #22

That is a fairly tale scenario kristopher Apr 2012 #24

How many years do you think it will take XemaSab Apr 2012 #25

So you think people should be forced to live around nuclear plants they believe are unsafe? kristopher Apr 2012 #28

I'd much rather live near a nuclear plant than a coal plant XemaSab Apr 2012 #30

Less radiation near a nuclear plant than coal. joshcryer Apr 2012 #31

And how much lead, mercury, Sox, and Nox do the nuclear plants put out? XemaSab Apr 2012 #32

A standard false choice favored by the nuclear industry. kristopher Apr 2012 #36

You didn't answer my question XemaSab Apr 2012 #38

If you actually cared you'd have already looked for the report yourself. kristopher Apr 2012 #41

I did some googling for a few minutes XemaSab Apr 2012 #48

Google Vermont PIRG, vt yankee energy plan kristopher Apr 2012 #52

In 2004, this is what they visualized happening by 2025: XemaSab Apr 2012 #54

try this fm 2011 kristopher Apr 2012 #58

It's certainly an ambitious goal for 20 years from now XemaSab Apr 2012 #62

Yeah, to you everything is too bad except nuclear. kristopher Apr 2012 #65

I hate fossil fuels XemaSab Apr 2012 #68

Yeah, sure you do. kristopher Apr 2012 #69

See, I think you come off as someone who is more motivated by being anti-nuclear XemaSab Apr 2012 #72

Telling the truth about nuclear is "bashing"? kristopher Apr 2012 #76

I've been on a crusade to run you off the forum? XemaSab Apr 2012 #79

Sure it is - tell that to the Kea. kristopher Apr 2012 #81

If I had been trying to run you off the forum XemaSab Apr 2012 #90

Don't feed the Kea... kristopher Apr 2012 #92

Good call. XemaSab Apr 2012 #93

Got a link to the actual study? joshcryer Apr 2012 #19

Can you access google on your computer? kristopher Apr 2012 #21

The fucking report is $500. joshcryer Apr 2012 #23

Yes kris Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #26

I totally deleted my other post because I fell for it hook line and sinker. joshcryer Apr 2012 #27

Don't worry, I missed it. Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #29

I didn't change the subject. kristopher Apr 2012 #35

Fell for what? kristopher Apr 2012 #34

No, merely exaggerating. joshcryer Apr 2012 #37

Are you saying they are lying? kristopher Apr 2012 #39

I was referring to the OP. joshcryer Apr 2012 #42

Your posts lack specificity, don't blame me for your sloppy communication skills. kristopher Apr 2012 #44

Perhaps you didn't see my post to TheWraith where I derided them... joshcryer Apr 2012 #45

What do you mean "general pricing in Germany" kristopher Apr 2012 #46

Their claim "what is happening now" is not the graphic I see on any given day today. joshcryer Apr 2012 #47

And your proof of that is... kristopher Apr 2012 #49

Post #13. joshcryer Apr 2012 #53

In other words you have no proof kristopher Apr 2012 #56

The graphic appears to have a lower overall price than the 2008 graphic. joshcryer Apr 2012 #57

You are comparing apples to oranges - you know it and... kristopher Apr 2012 #59

No, I am not. If that graphic was representive of overall pricing between 2008 and 2012... joshcryer Apr 2012 #61

Like I said, another version will be coming within a few minutes. kristopher Apr 2012 #64

For it to have been in line with my comment to TheWraith yes. joshcryer Apr 2012 #74

I'm very sure your self deleted comment to wraith is not relevant to our conversation. kristopher Apr 2012 #77

You're not following the conversation, to be sure. joshcryer Apr 2012 #80

Considering the article is about none of that kristopher Apr 2012 #83

lol, it says "electricity prices in Germany" right there in the fucking OP. joshcryer Apr 2012 #84

More *willful* confusion? kristopher Apr 2012 #88

He doesn't say "wholesale electricity prices." joshcryer Apr 2012 #94

In a discussion specifically about sources of generation being put under pricing pressure kristopher Apr 2012 #96

He doesn't say "wholesale electricity prices." joshcryer Apr 2012 #98

The article does actually weasel around consumer pricing with capitalism verbiage. joshcryer Apr 2012 #99

In a discussion about wholesale electricity. kristopher Apr 2012 #101

Which has little relevance to polluters who are still getting paid. joshcryer Apr 2012 #103

Once more let's review kristopher Apr 2012 #106

Gas ain't baseload. joshcryer Apr 2012 #107

Poor little nuclear lovers just can't catch a break... kristopher Apr 2012 #33

Wait, you always said that renewables were cheaper XemaSab Apr 2012 #40

Seriously? kristopher Apr 2012 #43

I was quoting your post XemaSab Apr 2012 #50

Your post was not "an exact quote" from me. kristopher Apr 2012 #51

You said: XemaSab Apr 2012 #55

By linking it to other statements about the long term price of renewables kristopher Apr 2012 #60

So if the bottom has fallen out for renewables XemaSab Apr 2012 #63

Because they signed 20 year contracts. kristopher Apr 2012 #66

Ok, there's an answer XemaSab Apr 2012 #67

Please research "Feed In Tariffs" FiTs kristopher Apr 2012 #70

"inane nuisance posts" - That's rich! oldhippie Apr 2012 #135

Pointing out your OP is bullshit is 'nit-picking'? Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #71

You *claimed falsely* that the OP is bullshit. kristopher Apr 2012 #73

The OP makes claims about "the impact that solar is having on electricity prices in Germany." joshcryer Apr 2012 #75

The OP supports the claims it makes as opposed to the strawman you are creating kristopher Apr 2012 #78

You're a liar when it comes to accusing me of having a "quest to protect the nuclear industry." joshcryer Apr 2012 #82

You consistently take positions that further the agenda of the nuclear industry. kristopher Apr 2012 #85

I take a position against misrepresentations in text. I take positions against being fooled. joshcryer Apr 2012 #86

Stop making up things about the information being posted. kristopher Apr 2012 #89

He doesn't say "wholesale electricity prices." joshcryer Apr 2012 #97

No, he just discusses the wholesale market. kristopher Apr 2012 #102

Which he calls "electricity prices." joshcryer Apr 2012 #104

You've gone completely off the rails. kristopher Apr 2012 #109

The OP claims renewables are reducing the cost. Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #87

No the OP claims that: kristopher Apr 2012 #91

Kris, you seem to forget I've linked to the actual end prices Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #95

That isn't a meaningful piece of information. kristopher Apr 2012 #100

Like wholesale electricity prices aren't meaningful to polluters? joshcryer Apr 2012 #105

He isn't talking about wholesale prices and their impact on polluters kristopher Apr 2012 #108

I think I can prove that 26 > 15 quite nicely, thank you Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #110

So what? It's a point with no relevance. kristopher Apr 2012 #111

Nuclear is a boondongle, and will not stop catastrophic climate change. joshcryer Apr 2012 #112

The price of electricity has no relevance to electricity prices? Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #113

kick kristopher Apr 2012 #117

What is the actual mechanism by which nuclear power shuts down a coal plant? kristopher Apr 2012 #118

Build a nuclear plant, and shut down a coal one Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #119

Because it doesn't happen. Nuclear plants DO NOT shut down coal plants. kristopher Apr 2012 #120

Nobody already burning coal has ever built a nuclear plant? Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #121

How does a nuclear plant shut down a coal plant? kristopher Apr 2012 #122

Ah, as opposed to the market contraction... Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #123

So you do not want to shut down coal plants and you want to expand energy consumption. kristopher Apr 2012 #124

You're still not answering, kris Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #125

Remarkable! You accuse me of "not answering" when I've waited 2 days for your reply. kristopher Apr 2012 #126

Still too hard? Ignorance it is, then. Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #128

A tacit admission that you don't have an answer is still an admission... kristopher Apr 2012 #129

You had your chance to talk about it like a grown-up kris. You chose the way of... Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #130

Tell that to the industrial revolution. XemaSab Apr 2012 #127

lolwut? Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #131

If every society that built coal plants XemaSab Apr 2012 #133

Unless they built them without building coal plants, grasshopper Dead_Parrot Apr 2012 #134

There is no market path for a nuclear plant to shut down a coal plant kristopher Apr 2012 #132

Just to demonstrate how long this same conversation has been going on... nt kristopher Feb 2013 #136

Reference 1 for the "merit order effect" kristopher Apr 2012 #114

Reference 2 for the "Merit Order Effect" kristopher Apr 2012 #115

Reference 3 for the "Merit Order Effect" kristopher Apr 2012 #116