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In reply to the discussion: Russ Feingold: Obama Super PAC Reversal Will Lead To 'A Legalized Abramoff System' [View all]You're really just wrong. There is no precedent for holding people indefinitely under the modern laws of war. What you are speaking of are "prisoners of war" under the Geneva Conventions. First, there is no war. The "war on terror" is nothing but a fabrication because one cannot fight a tactic. Second, "terrorism" while undefined in international law is a crime. We are not, in fact, fighting a war at all. Those who commit acts of terrorism, commit crimes. Given there is no war, there is no beginning to the war and there is no end to the war. During wars between nations, nations could hold combatants of the opposing army until the end of hostilities. Again, we have none of that. If we can define any actions against criminals as a "war," then I guess we can have a drug "war" so we can detain combatants in that "war" as long as that "war" is going on.
The Supreme Court has not, in fact, decided this.
Mr. Awlaki was, at the time of his killing, unarmed and posed no threat to the United States. He was a citizen entitled to due process.
As for this statement: "Sure, process matters, if there is uncertainty about outcome. If there is no uncertainty, it's a mere pomposity, worshiping at the altar of bureaucratic routine, paying for the paper-pushing. Hussein was brought to trial, for example."
That is, frankly, both profoundly sad and scary. According to you, trials only matter for the obviously innocent or for the questionably guilty. You seem to want to do away with the presumption of innocence. John Gotti: most likely guilty. Yet, time after time, he went free because the state could not prove him guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. Even the Rome Statute, which governs the International Criminal Court, preserves the presumption of innocence and calls for a conviction only upon a finding of guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.
By the way, warrantless wiretapping is NOT legal. Even under FISA, the government must obtain a warrant within 72 hours of the wiretap. Otherwise, they can't.
How sad is it that certain American, particularly liberals, have taken to calling due process "bureaucratic routine." I weep for this country.